Will Cousins Play For The Skins In 2018

[skinny21]

35 minutes ago, Rufus T Firefly said:

Yes, Practice Squad players count against the cap.

 

The player we can/should move which would save some cap is Reed. Though to save space from 2019 forward we should really dump at least one of McClain and McGee. The fact that we have Allen, Ioannidis and Lanier and yet people talk about how desperately we need a DL tells you all you need to know about what we're getting for 10 mil+ from the Mcs.

Interesting to know re. the PS. 

 

I’m all for dumping McClain, but only if we draft an early round dlineman or if they’re ready to move on.  I only say that because I think it’s possible he’s better than we’ve seen on the field, and that injuries (and the transition to DE) hampered him this season.  Not saying I have any faith in the guy, but I won’t blame them if they hold on to him for now.  

 

Reed is a tough one.  I’d be ok with cutting him... it would be a bit cold blooded, but we could really use that cap space going forward.  I think I’d lean toward making do this offseason though and essentially using him as a receiver, hope he stays healthy most of the year, draft his replacement (this year) and then trade/release him next year.  I’m worried that the FO looks at Reed and Davis and think they have the best TE tandem in the game (and so avoid drafting a TE).  Meanwhile, the pair continue to be a liability for the ground game.  

 

Of course, I’m even more worried the FO thinks the best way they can save money (to re-sign our guys and bring in additional FAs) is to let Cousins walk.  

 

 

 

[HigSkin]

11 minutes ago, NoCalMike said:

 

If there has been one big criticism of Kirk from Gruden over his time as coach it's been that Kirk is reluctant to throw the deep ball unless the WR is miles apart from the corner.  Maybe it was coming up under Shanahan that made Cousins petrified of making a mistake.  

 

Yea maybe, I remember after a game this season when Kirk said something like, "I felt a strip sack coming" but looking at that play he had time.  It was a weird comment but some insight in to how he thinks.  We all know KC is super intelligent, Finley seemed to point to how he sometimes just over thinks something going wrong.

[Fat Stupid Loser]

11 hours ago, RWJ said:

One of Bridgewater or Keenum will be available and I would take either one on a 3 year vet deal while drafting a QB in Rd. 1 this upcoming draft to sit and learn behind.

Teddy looked ok for a young QB on a stacked team.  Case looks solid as an experienced back up QB on a stacked team.  He will revert to his norm on our team. Teddy at this point is still quite an unknown.

8 hours ago, Wildbunny said:

If Kirk leaves our next FA QB will be on a one year prove it deal. Especially if we go after Keenum.

Love one year prove it deals.  Work out well. Lets get rid of the guy we know can do it for a guy we don't believe can do it, cause he is cheaper. This team is so screwed.

[NoCalMike]

Brady and to a lesser extent, Big Ben (I know technically Eli too, but let's be real, it was the defense) are the only elite QB's to have won multiple superbowls in their careers so far in the modern era right?  So even having an elite QB that is paid a ton, isn't a guarantee.  Those caliber of QB's (Top 5) seem to at least guarantee a baseline for the team, because they elevate other players, but you take a guy like Brees who is great, always fun to watch, but it doesn't always translate into the team being very good for multiple reasons.  

 

I am starting to think the fanbase are pinning their hopes too much on this issue on both sides.  Cousins re-signing here for a lot of money guarantees nothing really. Letting him walk also doesn't necessarily mean something better is walking through the door in the next few offseasons either. 

 

I would agree that the best case scenario for a Super Bowl is to have an elite franchise QB, because it makes it more likely that everything else on the team will fall into place once or twice over their 10-15 year career, I am just also saying that at the same time there are plenty of elite franchise QB's that either have zero super bowls wins, or one, or in the case of guys like Eli & Russel Wilson.....very much relied on a dominant defense (We can even throw Manning's 2nd Super Bowl into that category).   

[Reaper Skins]

At what point does what the Broncos are doing in regards to Kirk Cousins become tampering?

 

Is it that other players are allowed to say they want him publicly but coaches are not?  or you just can't discuss specific numbers?

 

Honestly curious what the rules do and do not allow, because if he does end up going there, it sure looks like everyone in the Broncos was in on it for quite some time.  I doubt we'd see any follow up about it from the league though.

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

6 minutes ago, Reaper Skins said:

At what point does what the Broncos are doing in regards to Kirk Cousins become tampering?

 

Is it that other players are allowed to say they want him publicly but coaches are not?  or you just can't discuss specific numbers?

 

Honestly curious what the rules do and do not allow, because if he does end up going there, it sure looks like everyone in the Broncos was in on it for quite some time.  I doubt we'd see any follow up about it from the league though.

Brandon Marshall disguised it with "a guy we played in week 16 is pretty good" followed by a smirk.  Not sure the details on tampering but I'd imagine that's violating the 'spirit' of the rule at minimum.

 

I do find it interesting that Bronco's defensive players that had to play Kirk have a higher opinion of him than some of our fans.

9 minutes ago, NoCalMike said:

I am starting to think the fanbase are pinning their hopes too much on this issue on both sides.  Cousins re-signing here for a lot of money guarantees nothing really. Letting him walk also doesn't necessarily mean something better is walking through the door in the next few offseasons either. 

Nothing guarantees a Super Bowl, but having a QB gives you a better chance than not.  I don't think any of the ProKirk folks are under the impression that signing him guarantees anything.  I like our chances to be fun to watch much better with him at the helm.

[purbeast]

7 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

I do find it interesting that Bronco's defensive players that had to play Kirk have a higher opinion of him than some of our fans.

Nothing guarantees a Super Bowl, but having a QB gives you a better chance than not.  I don't think any of the ProKirk folks are under the impression that signing him guarantees anything.  I like our chances to be fun to watch much better with him at the helm.

It's because our fanbase as a whole is probably the dumbest in the NFL.

 

As for the 2nd comment, it's because with Cousins at the helm, before every single game, you go into watching the game knowing we have an actual realistic chance of winning the game.  He can actually move the ball in the air and I don't get nervous when he throws the ball.  He gives us confidence as fans.  

 

Whereas before him, other than RG3's fluke rookie year, pretty much every game I went into I was concerned about our chances of winning.  If it was against a good team, then I had no confidence.  If it was against a crappy team, it was like 'at least we have a chance' then we'd eek out a win against the Browns or something.

 

I remember watching the Redskins/Rams game in NYC on my 1 year wedding anniversary in 2009.  We were at a Redskins bar and the game was absolutely boring as ****.  We won 9-7 and I believe it was a fieldgoal at the buzzer or right near the end to get that 9.  So for 59 minutes of football, it was basically a 6-7 game.

[PF Chang]

3 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

 

I do find it interesting that Bronco's defensive players that had to play Kirk have a higher opinion of him than some of our fans.

 

It's amazing. I feel like I'm not watching the same team as the people who want Cousins gone. Denver has a better defense, better receivers, and their OL is as good as the JV line we had to start by the end of the season. The only difference is one thing - we had a good QB, so we crushed them. 

[ThomasRoane]

13 hours ago, XtremeFan55 said:

 

Ummm... Joe Namath played for Bear Bryant whom I pretty sure coached at Alabama.  He was pretty good

 

I meant to say the "Nick Saban" Alabama era.

[Reaper Skins]

2 hours ago, HigSkin said:

 

It just sounded like Gruden wants more of a "gunslinger" at QB.  

 

There was that whole post game soundbite of him saying he wanted Kirk to take more chances.  And Kirk saying "if i made all the throws Jay wanted me too I'd have like 50 interceptions".  Seems like Kirk was worried about his stats and wasn't ready to take as many chances if he was trying to make himself look good for free agency.

 

Speaking of gunslingers, if you could choose one of the two, for the same price, would you rather take Alex Smith, or Patrick Mahomes? 

 

I realize the Chiefs gave up too much to trade him away, but for the sake of argument, let's say they liked what they saw in Smith this season and want to resign him long term because he overperformed and convinced the franchise that they can win with him.   They decide to  regain draft picks by shopping Mahomes.  Would Skins fans be interested?  I would.  I'd certainly rather have him and McCoy than Smith and McCoy next season if Kirk leaves.

[KDawg]

@NoCalMike

 

agreed with everything. Paying Kirk/keeping him guarantees nothing. Absolutely nothing. 

 

Letting him walk also guarantees absolutely nothing. It comes down to building a football team. Either way. 

 

Hold me. I’m scared.

[MartinC]

8 minutes ago, Reaper Skins said:

I realize the Chiefs gave up too much to trade him away, but for the sake of argument, let's say they liked what they saw in Smith this season and want to resign him long term because he overperformed and convinced the franchise that they can win with him.   They decide to  regain draft picks by shopping Mahomes.  Would Skins fans be interested?  I would.  I'd certainly rather have him and McCoy than Smith and McCoy next season if Kirk leaves.

 

Smith is already on the trade block. Mahomes is the Chiefs starter for day one next year already (baring injury).

 

There is a chance Smith could be the bridge QB we trade for if Cousins walks. 

[goskins10]

13 minutes ago, MartinC said:

 

Smith is already on the trade block. Mahomes is the Chiefs starter for day one next year already (baring injury).

 

There is a chance Smith could be the bridge QB we trade for if Cousins walks. 

 

I am not a fan of trading away any resources if they let Kirk walk. If they do let him walk, then just live with what you have. Roll with Colt (yes, I know he is a disaster, that's kind of the point.). Draft someone this year or/and next to be the long term. 2019 we should have a pretty high draft pick. 

 

I just do not see the logic in replacing Kirk with Alex Smith who is older and not as talented but will cost not just at least 1 draft pick but considerable CAP space also. His salary and roster bonuses are $17M. Colt is $3.6M. 

[Reaper Skins]

14 minutes ago, MartinC said:

 

Smith is already on the trade block. Mahomes is the Chiefs starter for day one next year already (baring injury).

 

There is a chance Smith could be the bridge QB we trade for if Cousins walks. 

I realize this.  Just using those 2 QBs as an example of the two different types of replacements we might have to look for..

 

The question I was asking is, IF both were an option, do you think the Skins would have more success with another proven game manager like Smith, or an unproven gunslinger type with upside like Mahomes.  Mahomes isn't proven but it seems like he has the type of play style Gruden wants from his QB.  Both would have to learn his system so this might give the edge to a player with more long term potential in Gruden's eyes.

 

If we move on from Kirk, how much say will Gruden have in picking his replacement?  Will he want a low risk option?  Would he rather go for the high upside gamble?  Smith and Dalton seem like the former categories, while Keenum, Mayfield, or another draft pick seems like more of a high risk gamble.

 

If Gruden is only going to be here for one more year, does he play it safe and try to recapture the type of system success he had with Kirk, or does he believe he needs to go all in and find a true gamechanger in order to gain further job security?

 

His gameday playcalling makes me think he would tend towards the safe, lower risk options, trying to maintain the status quo of our offense.   But on the other hand, his comments about wishing Kirk took more chances makes me wonder if he is more of a risk taker than the fans give him credit for.  Maybe Kirk just wasn't confident enough to take the shots Gruden was calling on the sidelines.  Maybe Gruden wants someone who isn't afraid to throw the occasional pick and gives players like Doctson and Pryor chances on gamedays even if they aren't running their routes with robotic like accuracy.

 

 

[HigSkin]

I get the sense that if it isn't KC here, it'll be McCoy since Jay seems very loyal to him and he knows the offense.  I don't believe they trade for vet QB instead picking from the FA market.  A lot of media keep mentioning Bradford who has a good long ball but I don't see any of them starting unless Colt goes down.

[Paul Cumberland]

5 minutes ago, goskins10 said:

I am not a fan of trading away any resources if they let Kirk walk. If they do let him walk, then just live with what you have. Roll with Colt (yes, I know he is a disaster, that's kind of the point.). Draft someone this year or/and next to be the long term. 2019 we should have a pretty high draft pick. 

 

I just do not see the logic in replacing Kirk with Alex Smith who is older and not as talented but will cost not just at least 1 draft pick but considerable CAP space also. His salary and roster bonuses are $17M. Colt is $3.6M. 

 

I'm totally on board with this.  And let's not forget we recently signed Stephen Morris to a futures deal.  If his Colts preseason highlights are anything legit, he appears he could be something more than just a camp arm.  Certainly looked better to me than Sudfeld did this past preseason.

[zoony]

Maybe we could sign Case Keenum as a free agent

[MassSkinsFan]

1 hour ago, Reaper Skins said:

Speaking of gunslingers, if you could choose one of the two, for the same price, would you rather take Alex Smith, or Patrick Mahomes? 

 

Rex Grossman

[Fat Stupid Loser]

5 minutes ago, zoony said:

Maybe we could sign Case Keenum as a free agent

I just heard Kellen Moore retired to go in to coaching.  Maybe Bruce could lure him in for el cheapo. As long as we are now all looking for below average NFL QBs/ and guys other teams are willing to give up to replace Kirk. We could really stud up this team with the two players we could get with the saved money.

 

You guys let me know if I'm coming off too bitter. 

[JSSkinz]

I would rather give Leveon Bell $14M, use our 1st rounder for more D line, and roll with Colt next year than sign any of these jag QB's like Keenum.

 

I think we could win just as many games in this scenario than the one we are currently in.

 

The antidote to having noodle arm is limit his passes and be a beast in the run game.

 

 

[Bang]

So, without 20+ guys on IR, we can win the same amount of games.

 

Sounds promising.

 

~Bang

[zoony]

8 minutes ago, jschuck12001 said:

I would rather give Leveon Bell $14M, use our 1st rounder for more D line, and roll with Colt next year than sign any of these jag QB's like Keenum.

 

I think we could win just as many games in this scenario than the one we are currently in.

 

The antidote to having noodle arm is limit his passes and be a beast in the run game.

 

 

 

There is no possible way our front office will be strategic or brilliant in what they do

 

They will try to maintain the status quo at all costs.  Conservative in free agency, bpa in draft, and try to put duct tape on the qb position.  

 

You can set your watch to that

[fordranger76]

4 hours ago, Rufus T Firefly said:

The player we can/should move which would save some cap is Reed. Though to save space from 2019 forward we should really dump at least one of McClain and McGee. The fact that we have Allen, Ioannidis and Lanier and yet people talk about how desperately we need a DL tells you all you need to know about what we're getting for 10 mil+ from the Mcs.

If we cut Terrell McClain it will be a cap hit of -2,312,500 if its pre June 1st. After June 1st its a dead cap of 4,500,500 for 2018 and 2,500,000 for 2019. Only get a savings of 187,500 dollars. That is one guy we should not cut because he is going to ding the cap. At least not this year. We need every dollar of it if resigning Cousins.

[markmills67]

1 hour ago, goskins10 said:

 

I am not a fan of trading away any resources if they let Kirk walk. If they do let him walk, then just live with what you have. Roll with Colt (yes, I know he is a disaster, that's kind of the point.). Draft someone this year or/and next to be the long term. 2019 we should have a pretty high draft pick. 

 

I just do not see the logic in replacing Kirk with Alex Smith who is older and not as talented but will cost not just at least 1 draft pick but considerable CAP space also. His salary and roster bonuses are $17M. Colt is $3.6M. 

We should have Traded cousin's last year if he wasn't signing a LTD, we could have gone with McCoy and probably got a top 5 draft pick this year and draft a QB, I said last year that we would end up with between 7-9 wins and a mid 1st round pick were all the best QB's will be gone. This FO are useless, I wouldn't trust them to run me a bath never mind an NFL team. 

 

HTTR 

[Est.1974]

I've said for a long time that Alex Smith will be our QB if Cousins is gone.

 

However, I'd add that the Browns are actually well placed to go for Smith. Trade a couple of picks for him from the second/third round, trade back from one of their firsts to acquire some picks back. Draft a QB to take over in a couple of years, and still have enough ammo left to purge both the draft and FA.