Spearfeather Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 21 minutes ago, Kilmer17 said: Yep. Mcauliffe knows this too. That why he hasnt come out and stated he wants them all removed. Uhh ... Yes he has. Interesting comparing Richmond Mayor's Stoney's comments now to what he said last month. Quote "Removing monuments doesn't change race relations in our city," Stoney said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedskinsFan44 Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 (edited) 1 hour ago, luckydevil said: It's incredibly bizarre that Byrd keeps being brought up by conservatives. It's not like he is some beloved figure on the left. It's an important part of their argument that Democrats are the racists, completely ignoring the flip in the parties positions on race around the 1964 civil rights act. Byrd was a member of the KKK in the 1940s, disavowed in the 50s, stated his great regret over being a member in the 90s. But while we talk about the President of the US in 2017 coming out with qualifiers of equal guilt between white supremacists and and counter protesters, and his support for monuments celebrating the Confederacy, the people on the right want to talk about the position of Democrats in the 1860s, 1920s, and 1950s. Add: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reagan's_Neshoba_County_Fair_"states'_rights"_speech Add: Some light reading for you twa http://economics.yale.edu/sites/default/files/files/Faculty/washington/south-dems.pdf Edited August 17, 2017 by RedskinsFan44 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ixcuincle Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riggo-toni Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 Heather Heyer Highway has a nice ring to it. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilmer17 Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 6 minutes ago, Spearfeather said: Uhh ... Yes he has. Interesting comparing Richmond Mayor's Stoney's comments now to what he said last month. He called on others to take them down. Thats ALMOST the same thing as issuing an exec order to take them all down, but it stops just short enough to give him a little political cover. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spearfeather Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 26 minutes ago, Kilmer17 said: He called on others to take them down. Thats ALMOST the same thing as issuing an exec order to take them all down, but it stops just short enough to give him a little political cover. He says it's not within his power. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilmer17 Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 Just now, Spearfeather said: He says it's not within his power. Really? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spearfeather Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 2 minutes ago, Kilmer17 said: Really? Yes. " The Virginia state legislature has the authority to remove the Confederate monuments. McAuliffe doesn’t have the power to act on it unilaterally. " Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nonniey Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 (edited) On 8/15/2017 at 3:50 AM, skinsmarydu said: I was a resident of the great Commonwealth of Virginia from ages 7-18. From Sterling, Manassas, Lorton, Alexandria, and beyond... way beyond out into nowhere. The Civil War was a secession for state's rights...slavery BECAME the issue, for those who are historically challenged. VA sat on the edge. It was, and still is, conflicted territory. Nope from the beginning the Civil was over slavery no matter what they taught in Virginia. In a sense you actually got this backward - It's true that states rights was the reason why some of the later states seceded (Virginia), and was the reason many (probably most fought for the south) . Additionally it was the primary reason the north fought the south (the North didn't believe they had the right of secession). But the base reason South Carolina and the other fire breathing states seceded in the first place and got the Civil War ball rolling was to protect slavery. I'll be honest I've always been a bit of an anti confederate but I'm uncomfortable with how this tearing down of statues is playing out and what it might entail. President Wilson was an unapologetic Racist, FDR set up camps for American Citizens, Jackson (and the Army for that matter) crapped all over the Indians etc etc. Will memorials to them, other Presidents, the famous, ect. be the next targets? Edited August 17, 2017 by nonniey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twa Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 37 minutes ago, RedskinsFan44 said: It's an important part of their argument that Democrats are the racists, completely ignoring the flip in the parties positions on race around the 1964 civil rights act. Ya'll should have probably changed your party name in shame for putting up all those statues and being traitors. But I guess ya'll ain't responsible for what others did and can now claim moral authority by removing them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
visionary Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 The more I read about the proper process for having these statues removed, the more appealing an angry mob tearing it down seems to be. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nonniey Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 49 minutes ago, RedskinsFan44 said: It's an important part of their argument that Democrats are the racists, completely ignoring the flip in the parties positions on race around the 1964 civil rights act. Byrd was a member of the KKK in the 1940s, disavowed in the 50s, stated his great regret over being a member in the 90s. But while we talk about the President of the US in 2017 coming out with qualifiers of equal guilt between white supremacists and and counter protesters, and his support for monuments celebrating the Confederacy, the people on the right want to talk about the position of Democrats in the 1860s, 1920s, and 1950s. Add: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reagan's_Neshoba_County_Fair_"states'_rights"_speech Add: Some light reading for you twa http://economics.yale.edu/sites/default/files/files/Faculty/washington/south-dems.pdf The positions didn't flip what flipped was what Races/Identities the Democrats would favor though policy. The white racists then left that party because it provided them no advantage Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Llevron Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 13 minutes ago, Destino said: The more I read about the proper process for having these statues removed, the more appealing an angry mob tearing it down seems to be. It does seem needlessly complicated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burgold Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan T. Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 Someone questioned the timing of the movement to remove statues so soon after the disaster in Charlottesville. I kind of like the poetic justice in it. Racist idiots march to "preserve symbols of white heritage." Result? A whole bunch of those symbols come crashing down. March again, you morons. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
visionary Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
88Comrade2000 Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 No doubt the Dems have a racist past but they overcome it. Where do you think all the racists went, after the civil rights act? Who if not directly, but overtly, courted them; the GOP. The Democratic racists of the past are your base of the GOP today. I would put the statues in graveyards of where those people are buried. I'd also put cameras up in these graveyards, to see who visit these statues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renegade7 Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 (edited) 28 minutes ago, Destino said: The more I read about the proper process for having these statues removed, the more appealing an angry mob tearing it down seems to be. There's a Confederate Statue here in Downtown Portsmouth, and they were talking on the radio this morning about how it would cost $100K to remove. It's ridiculous, we should just let us locals have at, throw a tear it down block party with an American flag moonbounce for the kiddies if its going to cost that much. Edited August 17, 2017 by Renegade7 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsburySkinsFan Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 (edited) 33 minutes ago, twa said: Ya'll should have probably changed your party name in shame for putting up all those statues and being traitors. But I guess ya'll ain't responsible for what others did and can now claim moral authority by removing them. And the Republicans should change their name in shame for their actions ever since Nixon/Goldwater began the Southern strategy which embraced the the Klan in order to win the South. The GOP embraced them to win...and apparently still do, it's just inconvenient for Republicans when their dirty little secret kicks down the closet door and demands to be heard. But I'm certain you'll have a not so clever retort that is neither on topic nor demonstrates thought. Edited August 17, 2017 by AsburySkinsFan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renegade7 Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 1 minute ago, Rdskns2000 said: I'd also put cameras up in these graveyards, to see who visit these statues. Orson Welles said what's up. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinny21 Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 25 minutes ago, nonniey said: I'll be honest I've always been a bit of an anti confederate but I'm uncomfortable with how this tearing down of statues is playing out and what it might entail. President Wilson was an unapologetic Racist, FDR set up camps for American Citizens, Jackson (and the Army for that matter) crapped all over the Indians etc etc. Will memorials to them, other Presidents, the famous, ect. be the next targets? I truly appreciate you (and some others that have echoed the same sentiments) as a poster. And so it kind of saddens me to see this point made. Predicto nailed it way back in the thread - you have to look at why people have statues, roads, schools, etc. named after them. The WH is pushing the equivalency of Lee and Washington because they were both slave holders, but that's not why they are celebrated. For Lee, it is/was due to his role as a Confederate general, for Washington it's due to his role as a Revolutionary general, Founding Father and 1st President. Nobody is perfect, but we can generally agree that people are memorialized for the good things they've done, not their flaws. The "good" thing(s) Lee did are directly related to his role as a traitor fighting to uphold slavery. I'd go into the folks you mentioned, but hopefully you get the idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twa Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 I'd be fine with a name change for both. But forgive me if I think the panderers for power that put up the things are now pandering for power by calling for their removal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 3 hours ago, AsburySkinsFan said: I'm just trying to figure out if redemption is still part of the theology of the Religious Right. It is if they're Republican. (see: Trump). 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoulSkin Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 For those interested, this is the Commission that's studying what do do in Richmond. https://www.monumentavenuecommission.org/ Mayor Stoney has always said he finds the statues offensive personally, particularly Jefferson Davis, but he's also endorsed a thorough study of, and dialog on, the issue. Because he updated his official public stance on the scope of what the commission should be doing after what happened in Charlottesville, so what. Political motives or not, this is a dialog I believe most Richmonders want. The fact that the removal/relocation option was not considered as part of the scope of the commission's work seemed odd to begin with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now