Idaho fan

Is this the worst Redskins team in the last 20 years?

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18 hours ago, dicksogj said:

 

Yep. In a league where all of the rules favor the offense & where huge scores happen frequently how is it even possible to go three complete games without a TD?  

 

Tough to take advantage of those rules when your play calling is 2 yards and a cloud of dust on 1st and 2nd downs. 

 

Sadly, this is far from the worst team in terms of talent on the field..... It's an INCREDIBLE low in the worst coaching job I've ever seen in my lifetime.  Just my opinion. 

 

Hail. 

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12 hours ago, Idaho fan said:

 

I actually think it’s safe to say that if in some parallel universe you took every decision dan/Bruce has made and did the opposite that the skins would be in better shape.  
 

 

 

This is a very interesting take & would like to see what other folks believe could have resulted in much better results if say the Redskins operated like the Pats or Eagles & drafted well, made carefully thought out trades & FA moves & got rid of players just after they peak (& as a result spend money wisely).

 

Let me start with a few moves that would have been done differently if say Snyder hired a truly effective GM - not named Bruce Allen - & in a parallel universe was 100% hands off.  Here are a few moves that would not have been made & their potential long term effect:

 

1. RG3 trade is never made.  Team goes with Cousins or some other QB from 2012 on.  Yes you don't experience the great 2012 season, but you also have 3 additional 1st rd picks & a 2nd.  As a result you are able to build other parts of the team & miss out on some of the related drama.

 

2. Cousins is not tagged for loads of money for 2 seasons & subsequently kicked to the curb.  Drama is again reduced & you build consistency at QB either with Cousins long term or someone else & as a result you likely also use your money more wisely.  You also save the tons of money being spent on Alex Smith (who while somewhat effective did not warrant that excessive extension).

 

The Williams situation is also a debacle (with both sides to blame).  Perhaps a different GM would either work things out privately to satisfy Williams or at least trade him during the offseason when it was obvious that this marriage was over.  Interested to see if anyone has other examples.  I realize that no GM or owner is perfect, but this organization just makes an excessive amt of mistakes.

 

 

Edited by dicksogj

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The real problem with this GM (also known as the Prince of Darkness by Thom Loverro) is that he never learns from his mistakes.

He keeps repeating his mistakes with different players, different trades, etc.   Not getting good value when you can.

The definition of insanity is repeating the same mistakes over and over again and THEN expecting a different RESULT.

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3 hours ago, veteranskinsfan said:

.

The definition of insanity is repeating the same mistakes over and over again and THEN expecting a different RESULT.

No it isnt and einstein didnt say it was. Let that ism die.

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33 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

No it isnt and einstein didnt say it was. Let that ism die.

 

Jane Fulton, 1983 - fictional character from a Rita Mae Brown book.

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Yeah but I'm sorta wondering if its true in this case.  This team hasn't won more than 11 games since 1991. Even the Browns (pre-moving) and Bengals have managed to win 11+ games at some point during that span. I can understand it during the Petitbone/Norv years while the team actually did try (and ultimately fail) to rebuild but after that? You're not supposed to be this consistently mediocre in the modern NFL over such a long period of time. 

 

Maybe this isn't insanity but this isn't normal.

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Id like to apologize to Ryan Anderson.  I really didn’t understand what people saw in him, and I didn’t believe he had much to contribute.  But after really watching him more.  There are people here that were right.  He hustles and plays the run very well.  I’m not sure if we’re still going to use him as a fullback anymore, because teams have scouted this.  But he was good at that also.

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Yes, absolutely yes. This is the worst Redskins team of the Super Bowl era.

 

Seasons since 1967 I'm not considering for this assessment:

 

1993--Beginning of the FA era. Petitbon as HC (finished 4-13). 

1994--Norv's first season. The Shuler Mistake. A dramatic change from the Gibbs era. (3-13)

 

Seasons I'm considering for this assessment:

 

- 2003--The end of the Spurrier era. A complete failure. Coach basically trolled the owner and the entire fanbase at the end of the season. (5-11) 

- 2006--A Gibbs 2.0 anomaly. I have no rational description for this terrible season by Gibbs other than the Brunell-Campbell situation. (5-11)

- 2009--End of the Zorn era. Again, the coach basically trolled the owner and the entire fanbase at the end of the season. (4-12) 

- 2013--End of the Shanny era. Again, the coach basically trolled the owner and the entire fanbase at the end of the season. Detecting a pattern here (4-12) 

- 2014--First year under Gruden. Bleh. (4-12)

 

Now having checked the records and digging through my memories, I honestly cannot remember a more pathetic

way of handling a team by the FO at the half of the season. Like most of you have said, the players seem to be mailing in the entire season.

 

No coach, not even if Vince Lombardi came back from the dead, could correct this ship. I'm sure he wouldn't even take the offer seriously.

So stop with the ridiculous Callahan bashing. Dude actually made the SuperBowl in the modern era. That Raiders team passed a ton.

He's just trying to make this team not appear like a total, utter, pathetic, mess.

 

1-15 is almost a given. But you know what? Bruce will not go. Not until he delivers the new stadium in DC.

The team, therefore, is of little or no importance.

 

That's why THIS is the worst Redskins teams since 1967.

 

 

 

 

 

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6 minutes ago, El Mexican said:

2013--End of the Shanny era. Again, the coach basically trolled the owner and the entire fanbase at the end of the season. Detecting a pattern here (4-12)

 

Small error, but we were actually 3-13 in 2013, not 4-12. That team was putrid.

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13 minutes ago, ExoDus84 said:

 

Small error, but we were actually 3-13 in 2013, not 4-12. That team was putrid.

That season started out with a couple of ugly losses to Philly and Green Bay, but the Skins had clawed back to 3-5 with some exciting home wins against the Bears and Chargers. Then we were in Minnesota on a Thursday night (I was in Vegas watching the game) where the team was rolling on offense and looked poised to move to 4-5, but then fell apart in the second half of that game and the team just seemed to collapse after that. There have been a few of those seasons in the Snyder era where there at least seemed to be some promise mid-season, but then the final record reflects lousy.

 

Aside from that first quarter in Philly, 2019 has been the absolute pits.  I see it more like 1993 than anything, and don't see anything happening to give us at least a respectable, if not good, 6-10 that we clawed to in 1998. 3-13 is my best guess for this group. 

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16 hours ago, ExoDus84 said:

 

Small error, but we were actually 3-13 in 2013, not 4-12. That team was putrid.

 

Thank you. I mixed up the numbers between 2014-2014.

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On 11/5/2019 at 8:49 AM, dicksogj said:

1. RG3 trade is never made.  Team goes with Cousins or some other QB from 2012 on.  Yes you don't experience the great 2012 season, but you also have 3 additional 1st rd picks & a 2nd.  As a result you are able to build other parts of the team & miss out on some of the related drama.

Simply draft Russell Wilson & everything else falls into place.  Hell (Hail)

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Saw this on Yahoo Sports:

 

Before the Washington Redskins' game with the New York Giants on 29 September, they partnered with a charity called United Way, and agreed to donate 100 meals to needy children for every touchdown they scored. They scored... zero touchdowns.

Yep that's right folks, the Redskins are so bad they are literally depriving hungry children of food. Only this godforsaken franchise, honestly.

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I’ve been thinking about this team and it’s iteration under Snyder for a while and I always come back to something Shanahan said, that no one talks about. I think most people took it as a side comment but I think it was far more significant. I think it truly spoke to who Snyder is as an owner beyond his clear lack of business acumen. He said all Dan Snyder cares about is the quarterback. I think this comment had a double meaning, both things that go against the grain of perception about this team and Snyder as an owner.

 

1. I think Dan is directly behind most if not all of our significant QB moves. I think he wants that superstar QB because that by far, is the most marketable aspect of a football team, i.e. it makes the most money. I also think beyond that, he really doesn’t get involved in day to day affairs of running the team. He’s not a micromanager, he’d rather spend time on his yacht or in his mansion living the billionaire highlife. It’s the only explanation for the constant fiascos this team goes through with no repercussions.

 

2. The Dan Snyder is a life long fan narrative we were told is complete BS. The belt buckle, the he just wants to win, the Dan feels every pain that true fans feel is complete BS. He may be a fan, but he’s not a true fan. There’s no way. You don’t run this team into the ground the way he has if you really care about winning. He cares about making money. We don’t have to be good for him to make money. I think Dan wants a franchise QB that will stay for life, be highly marketable, win a few games, but really, if we don’t win a Super Bowl, that’s okay because jersey sales and Nike deals are through the roof.

 

Theres really no other explanation for how much time we spend outright sucking under Daniel Snyder.

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38 minutes ago, Birdlives said:

2. The Dan Snyder is a life long fan narrative we were told is complete BS. The belt buckle, the he just wants to win, the Dan feels every pain that true fans feel is complete BS. He may be a fan, but he’s not a true fan. There’s no way. You don’t run this team into the ground the way he has if you really care about winning. He cares about making money. We don’t have to be good for him to make money. I think Dan wants a franchise QB that will stay for life, be highly marketable, win a few games, but really, if we don’t win a Super Bowl, that’s okay because jersey sales and Nike deals are through the roof.

Jersey sales and Nike deals won't remain through the roof for long if we keep on being such a circus. At some points, partners will distance themselves from the team because it's not good PR for them.

 

That being said, Dan is a fan, a real true fan. Proof of it is that he's running this team like a fan would do on Madden. I'm pretty sure he'd love to win, he just doesn't know how and since he's socially weird he's screwed with Bruce because every other competent guy is staying away of this fool. Damn, even Gruden got lured here because they overpaid for him, guy wanted the Titans' job...

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4 hours ago, Wildbunny said:

Proof of it is that he's running this team like a fan would do on Madden. 

False. I play Madden and i run my franchise a COMPLETELY different way. 

 

That is, i also take control of all the other teams, and i trade the star players all to my team, and i set the skills for my team to 100, and the AI skills to 0. 

 

Try telling me Dan does that. Go ahead. Try :P 

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8 hours ago, Birdlives said:

I’ve been thinking about this team and it’s iteration under Snyder for a while and I always come back to something Shanahan said, that no one talks about. I think most people took it as a side comment but I think it was far more significant. I think it truly spoke to who Snyder is as an owner beyond his clear lack of business acumen. He said all Dan Snyder cares about is the quarterback. I think this comment had a double meaning, both things that go against the grain of perception about this team and Snyder as an owner.

 

I think there is some truth to this, particularly if you look beyond that first year or so when he brought in the all-pro, pre-retired team. After that you mostly hear his name with QBs, but I do wonder about the different style of FAs, like trading draft picks, going after RFAs, and the famous liking of Moss over Gardner. 

 

Honestly I can see Snyder as being a probably pretty smart guy. I look at a lot of the recommendations that are made at the owners meetings every year as coming from the Skins and for the most part I'm generally nodding my head saying, yeah why don't we do that. Even with the above things, I can remember thinking that FA was such a new concept that maybe there was a better way to do it and Snyder could be onto something. And I think ultimately that's part of his problem. 

 

I think he wants to be responsible for fixing this franchise. Not in the sense of a Robert Kraft was the owner when the Patriots did it and not in the Jerry Jones was the GM in they Cowboys prime days in the 90s, but in the sense that either (a) he can say "that was my guy" who led us to that championship, or (b) that he can say something like "I was poppin Crystal / I was on that when all yal thought it was beer and ****". Like Phillyis using analytics a lot more than us right now and I'm sure Snyder is mad as all get out that he couldn't change the game like that. RG3 gave him a chance to do the Read Option which changed the league, but then RG3 got hurt. 

 

He bought the team when he was ?34? so I don't think this type of thinking is crazy. Heck even in his 50s, he's not too far away from where a lot of coordinators and coaches are in age. And I think somebody like Marty or Cal just drive him crazy because its the least innovative form of football. Its effective and it can win games, but nobody gets  remembered for iit and I think thats what he wants. 

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5 hours ago, Cooleyfan1993 said:

False. I play Madden and i run my franchise a COMPLETELY different way. 

 

That is, i also take control of all the other teams, and i trade the star players all to my team, and i set the skills for my team to 100, and the AI skills to 0. 

 

Try telling me Dan does that. Go ahead. Try :P 

Well, just like you he's not playing within the rules... :P

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On 11/4/2019 at 1:31 PM, JCB said:

It's not just the dearth of talent, the lack of effort, the prehistoric coaching scheme, the front office ineptitude, and absolute disregard for the fan experience, there's something that feels just kinda gross about the team at this point.

yup, i said it earlier. snyder/allen has managed to make it completely uncool to be a skins fan.

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I have a 7-month-old and am seriously contemplating not raising him as a Skins fan... I don't know how to say it any other way than Dan Snyder is young and it'll be a long time before there's a light at the end of the tunnel.

 

I've turned a blind eye and discounted plenty of the FO's missteps, but the handling of this TW situation has brought my fandom to an all-time low. There is nothing to be proud of here and even my craziest dream of us winning the super bowl is ruined by the idea of Dan Snyder being a winner.

 

This dream would also involve 2001 Jennifer Love Hewitt.

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48 minutes ago, CTskin said:

I have a 7-month-old and am seriously contemplating not raising him as a Skins fan... I don't know how to say it any other way than Dan Snyder is young and it'll be a long time before there's a light at the end of the tunnel.

 

 

If it makes you feel better, my dad didnt raise me to be a Redskins fan.  He was a good man who didnt get a lot of days off when I was younger and that was my way of spending time with him.

 

Connecticut, right?  Theres no guarantee they'll be a Pat's fan because theres no promise what they will be after Brady and Belicheck leave.  If anything you may want them to go through that high and sudden crash to keep in mind every team is susceptible to that, in context of where the Pat's were before they completely took over.  We went through that after Gibbs left, it was fast, life is like that, Redskins helped prepared me for life, lolz.

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On 11/9/2019 at 5:53 PM, Wildbunny said:

Jersey sales and Nike deals won't remain through the roof for long if we keep on being such a circus. At some points, partners will distance themselves from the team because it's not good PR for them.

 

That being said, Dan is a fan, a real true fan. Proof of it is that he's running this team like a fan would do on Madden. I'm pretty sure he'd love to win, he just doesn't know how and since he's socially weird he's screwed with Bruce because every other competent guy is staying away of this fool. Damn, even Gruden got lured here because they overpaid for him, guy wanted the Titans' job...

 

Sorry for not getting back sooner but I live a lot less of my life in the context of this team than I used to. You deserve a response nevertheless. 

 

I think you you misunderstood about my point with the jersey sales. A star QB is by far the most marketable thing in sports. It’s why Kyler Murray picks the bloodbath that is the NFL over a likely very productive, longer, and more lucrative (salary wise) career in the MLB. If Dan picks an Aaron Rodgers it doesn’t matter if we suck. Dan is okay with us sucking. Money comes in either way. The added income stream of a superstar is a bonus that keeps on giving. That follows into Dan being a fan. He’s not a fan; he’s a fan of money. No rational person could go 20 years, look back on this performance as owner and keep running this team into the ground the way Dan has unless they flat out don’t care. Dan Snyder doesn’t care. It’s a bull**** narrative that’s clearly not true. 20 years of suck is the action. “All Dan wants to do is win!” Are the words. Choose what you want to believe, the actions or the words.

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