Redskins receiving corp is beginning to shape up

[Spaceman Spiff]

2 hours ago, mistertim said:

 

While wanting 10 times more money for a 1 year contract, and probably providing 10 times the headache. 

 

Yeah but it's only for a year 

[mistertim]

54 minutes ago, Spaceman Spiff said:

 

Yeah but it's only for a year 

 

Touche.  lol

[mistertim]

1 hour ago, Morneblade said:

 

I think this is partially it. The other issue is that Doct flat out drops balls. You can't trust him to go over the middle and hang on (we've already seen that this year) or make tough catches in traffic. He's big, but not physical, and I don't think either guy really trusts him to be clutch.

 

But, keep in mind, he was the 2nd most targeted receiver we had last year. It's just his catch rate was 45% He had chances. He just didn't convert. To put that into focus, Pryor was almost 10 points BETTER.

 

This is something that I find really weird. Doctson was targeted a metric ****-ton in college and he had an insanely low drop rate IIRC; his hands were outstanding. So I have no clue what's up with his drops nowadays. Maybe he's still overthinking too much and losing focus or something? Yes, he's in his 3rd year but this is only his second year of actual play. Usually guys' hands don't change much from college...guys with suspect hands tend to keep them and guys with great hands tend to do the same.

[JSSkinz]

PRich can play, high-end #2 WR IMO but he will never reach that potential as long as Doctson plays on the other side.  We need a grinder, put Crowder out there and Reed in the slot.

[RandyHolt]

4 hours ago, megared said:

 

 

CBS Sports: Redskins Josh Doctson Held Without Target

 

I'm guessing as well...haven't viewed the All-22 film either.  But what other explanation could there be?    

 

I can think of a few. He wasn't a focus in the game plan.  I think most can agree the game plan has largely revolved around AP. Behind him, our primary threats are CT and Reed. I think Crowder is next. So on his best day Doc is probably 5th in line to be a primary on any given play. Couple that with shutdown corners in tight man for 2 games, and the 3rd game our OL got exposed, and here we are.

 

Maybe Doctson is ailing a tiny bit, and they are letting him heal up. Who knows. Anyone that plays fantasy knows WRs can suddenly not get many targets. Defenses take WRs away and force the QB to go to other players.  It's not like Doctson RIchardson or Crowder are must adds in the fantasy leagues I play in. Its been that way for a few years. Our 3 WRs bring different strengths to the table and they will not all be featured in every game.

 

Its hard to say he wasn't targeted when he drew 2 PIs but whatevs. Not that big a deal when you realize Alex only had a paltry 12 completions in what was close to a blowout for us.

Edited September 24, 2018 by RandyHolt

[Commander -JB-]

3 hours ago, Spaceman Spiff said:

 

That an old, supposedly broken ass washed up receiver can produce just as well as the Ghost of Josh Doctson?

 

3 hours ago, mistertim said:

 

While wanting 10 times more money for a 1 year contract, and probably providing 10 times the headache. 

Precisely.

[Skinsinparadise]

I haven't given up yet on Doctson but admit its not looking hot right now.  If Floyd is anywhere near what he once was -- he should contribute.  He's also a good run blocker which arguably we don't have from any of the other receivers on the roster.  His alcohol issues though go way back even before his last run of it -- so sort of like Josh Gordon with pot -- can he stay out of trouble on that front?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited September 24, 2018 by Skinsinparadise

[RandyHolt]

30 minutes ago, JSSkinz said:

PRich can play, high-end #2 WR IMO but he will never reach that potential as long as Doctson plays on the other side.  We need a grinder, put Crowder out there and Reed in the slot.

 

High end #2.... hmmm. I am not so sure about that.  That is more like what Bruce envisioned, when signing him.

 

Last year, he had 44 catches on 80 targets in 16 games (Josh 35 on 78).  Playing with Baldwin Lockett Graham and of course Wilson. 

 

It does not seem fair to say Doctson is holding him back from being a high end #2 after playing opposite Baldwin.  He is only 15% owned out at my fantasy site, and 1% started.  #PilingOn

Edited September 24, 2018 by RandyHolt

[crabbypatty]

If doc keeps being a no show in games, I wouldn't be upset if they cut him next season and draft a replacement. I think we've seen all he's gonna become while he's here, maybe he'll catch a td or two, have a good game or two, but overall he's a huge non factor.

He's never going to become a game changer, he's not going to dictate defenses, nobody is going to game plan for him, and he's not going to put fear in anyone's heart, he's marshmallow soft. 

Waste of a high draft pick. I hope cam Sims can return in mid season and surpass doc. Hell kidsey looked pretty good as well, udfa receivers certainly can't do any worse then the guy. 

Edited September 25, 2018 by crabbypatty

[JSSkinz]

23 minutes ago, RandyHolt said:

 

High end #2.... hmmm. I am not so sure about that.  That is more like what Bruce envisioned, when signing him.

 

Last year, he had 44 catches on 80 targets in 16 games (Josh 35 on 78).  Playing with Baldwin Lockett Graham and of course Wilson. 

 

It does not seem fair to say Doctson is holding him back from being a high end #2 after playing opposite Baldwin.  He is only 15% owned out at my fantasy site, and 1% started.  #PilingOn

I'm not talking about fantasy, I'm saying as a WR#2 in terms of real football, I think he can become that guy who makes some plays downfield and gets in that 750 - 900-yard range with 5 or 6 TDs.

 

There's a lot of starting #2 WR's in the NFL that won't get you **** in a fantasy league.

[NickyJ]

5 hours ago, megared said:

CBS Sports: Redskins Josh Doctson Held Without Target

CBS Sports has very interesting writers. The article is indeed titled that Doctson was held without a target. First paragraph of said article:

Quote

Doctson was held without a catch on three targets in Sunday's 31-17 win over the Packers

 

Edited September 25, 2018 by NickyJ

[RandyHolt]

47 minutes ago, JSSkinz said:

I'm not talking about fantasy, I'm saying as a WR#2 in terms of real football, I think he can become that guy who makes some plays downfield and gets in that 750 - 900-yard range with 5 or 6 TDs.

 

There's a lot of starting #2 WR's in the NFL that won't get you **** in a fantasy league.

 

True. And this is his chance to prove he is a HIGH end #2.  Its not like Josh nor Crowder have a stranglehold on that spot, nor the #1 for that matter. 

 

If he fails, it still seems unfair to blame Doctson. I would point fingers more at himself, Alex Smith, or Jay, before Josh. With Josh a feared non factor / write off here to many, Paul should be heavily targeted and post monster numbers.

 

I am not so quick to give up on Josh as others. I dont see a better option. Dare I think Richardson is what he is, with or without Josh.  Their numbers from last year point to being equal in the grand scheme of things. But we have a new QB for both. Its far too early to panic and write off Josh, especially since the best scab out there, no one else wants either. Give Alex time.

Edited September 25, 2018 by RandyHolt

[JSSkinz]

17 minutes ago, RandyHolt said:

If he fails, it still seems unfair to blame Doctson.

You're nitpicking me a bit but that's fine, I set myself up for it.  I would not blame Doctson, but what I'm saying is having another real threat on the other side of the field helps both WR's, especially when you don't have a gun slinger type QB.

 

I don't see Doctson as that WR, this is his 3rd year and the only thing I can say about him is his blocking is now ok and no longer terrible, besides that what has he improved at, it surely isn't route running.

 

Let's hope you're right and I'm wrong.

 

 

[Morneblade]

20 minutes ago, RandyHolt said:

 

True. And this is his chance to prove he is a HIGH end #2.  Its not like Josh nor Crowder have a stranglehold on that spot, nor the #1 for that matter. 

 

If he fails, it still seems unfair to blame Doctson. I would point fingers more at himself, Alex Smith, or Jay, before Josh. With Josh a feared non factor / write off here to many, Paul should be heavily targeted and post monster numbers.

 

I am not so quick to give up on Josh as others. I dont see a better option. Dare I think Richardson is what he is, with or without Josh.  Their numbers from last year point to being equal in the grand scheme of things. But we have a new QB for both. Its far too early to panic and write off Josh, especially since the best scab out there, no one else wants either. Give Alex time.

 

I know how you feel about Dez, but honestly I think you can stay on the current roster, start Mo Harris and get more production.

 

1 hour ago, mistertim said:

 

This is something that I find really weird. Doctson was targeted a metric ****-ton in college and he had an insanely low drop rate IIRC; his hands were outstanding. So I have no clue what's up with his drops nowadays. Maybe he's still overthinking too much and losing focus or something? Yes, he's in his 3rd year but this is only his second year of actual play. Usually guys' hands don't change much from college...guys with suspect hands tend to keep them and guys with great hands tend to do the same.

 

Going back and looking at the highlights, one things kept coming up.

 

Competition.

 

He was blowing up schools like UTEP, SMU, and K. State. And he was either wide open, or it was a jump ball.  There was few, if any highlights I saw where he ran anything but a deep post or a go route, and actually had to catch a ball in traffic.

 

So, my guess would be is that he never had to really work on his craft, he could just outrun everyone. At this level, he can't. And he never had to make tough catches in traffic consistently, with guys playing close coverage. And he's finding it very difficult.

[skinny21]

Yeah, I’m not ready to give up on Doctson, but I am ready to see if Harris offers more consistency.  I’d ease Harris in at first and if he produces, I’d swap them.  

 

I’d still play him situationally though (PA on first down, in spread looks, in the RZ, RPO, etc.).  

 

I’ll add that I would not be surprised to get trade offers from teams with more gunslinger types at qb.  

Edited September 25, 2018 by skinny21

[AlvinWaltonIsMyBoy]

Our WR corp has taken shape...

[HardcoreZorn]

Doctson disappearing is certainly discouraging, but yeah not ready to pull the plug yet. His 45% catch rate from last year is not super indicative of his ability to catch the football, when you consider the types of balls he was seeing last year. Pryor for example had some really egregious drops, and I didn’t feel that was the case with Doc. This year he just hasn’t been heavily featured, but I don’t know if that’s the type of offense we even are going for. There’s a lot of mouths to feed, and AD, Thompson, and Reed are our guys right now. 

[Spaceman Spiff]

2 hours ago, -JB- said:

 

Precisely.

 

Sorry, chief.  Can't think of a bigger headache than a guy with all world talent who can't put it together.  

 

It'd only be for a year.  Not like it'd be a cap killing, multi-year deal.  If he proves himself to be a jerk, cut em.  

[Chachie]

DeAngelo Hall was on the Sports Junkies today. He was raving about Docston. Saying that the game time targets are unfortunate because people just don't know how good Josh is. He said Josh is a team player who really wants the ball more but won't speak out because he wants to be a good team member. Hall emphasized Doc's ball skills and kept repeating that the fans just don't know.

 

The Junkies were like, "Really, De? Really." ?

Edited September 25, 2018 by Chachie

[mistertim]

1 hour ago, Morneblade said:

 

Going back and looking at the highlights, one things kept coming up.

 

Competition.

 

He was blowing up schools like UTEP, SMU, and K. State. And he was either wide open, or it was a jump ball.  There was few, if any highlights I saw where he ran anything but a deep post or a go route, and actually had to catch a ball in traffic.

 

So, my guess would be is that he never had to really work on his craft, he could just outrun everyone. At this level, he can't. And he never had to make tough catches in traffic consistently, with guys playing close coverage. And he's finding it very difficult.

 

That's a good observation and I'll admit that I hadn't really thought about it but it makes sense. It sounds like something that can be improved on with work, though. I would guess that he has a hard time keeping concentration when he has close coverage or is in traffic and running a precise route since he still isn't necessarily used to catching balls in lots of those situations. He's likely still doing that with lots of thinking as opposed to feel/repetition and that can cause someone to lose focus I suppose.

 

3 minutes ago, Chachie said:

DeAngelo Hall was on the Sports Junkies today. He was raving about Docston. Saying that the game time targets are unfortunate people just don't know how good Josh is. He said Josh is a team player who really wants the ball but won't speak out because he wants to be a good team member. 

 

The Junkies were like, "Really, De? Really." ?

 

Wait, so he's a headache because he's literally the opposite of Dez and won't ask for the ball?

 

I do remember reading some rave reviews about him in camp from various people, including Gruden. But obviously those can be taken with a grain of salt. 

Edited September 25, 2018 by mistertim

[JoggingGod]

Time to cut losses with Doctson. We should have traded for Gordon.

[Warhead36]

35 minutes ago, Chachie said:

DeAngelo Hall was on the Sports Junkies today. He was raving about Docston. Saying that the game time targets are unfortunate because people just don't know how good Josh is. He said Josh is a team player who really wants the ball more but won't speak out because he wants to be a good team member. Hall emphasized Doc's ball skills and kept repeating that the fans just don't know.

 

The Junkies were like, "Really, De? Really." ?

People raved about Taylor Jacobs too.

 

Catch the ball on Sunday then get back to me.

[Commander -JB-]

2 hours ago, Spaceman Spiff said:

 

Sorry, chief.  Can't think of a bigger headache than a guy with all world talent who can't put it together.  

 

It'd only be for a year.  Not like it'd be a cap killing, multi-year deal.  If he proves himself to be a jerk, cut em.  

It has only been 3 games with a 2-1 record.  I agree Doctson has been terrible but let’s not jump the gun and sign a washed up headache.  Literally nothing good will come with the press.  Not worth the headache.  Stay away from the dudes with quick Twitter fingers.  Yuck.?

[Cooleyfan1993]

5 hours ago, mistertim said:

Wait, so he's a headache because he's literally the opposite of Dez and won't ask for the ball?

 

I do remember reading some rave reviews about him in camp from various people, including Gruden. But obviously those can be taken with a grain of salt. 

Where’d you get the “Doctson is a headache” thing from in that part about DeAngelo hall talking about him on the radio? ?

[Sandy Monk]

10 hours ago, Morneblade said:

start Mo Harris and get more production.

 

THIS THIS THIS and more of THIS.

 

Give MoMo a chance!