CNN.com: Trump believes millions voted illegally, WH says -- but provides no proof (and other stories not supported by the facts advanced by the Trump administration)

[Busch1724]

9 hours ago, jschuck12001 said:

The sad thing is if you watched the entire press briefing there was some good content but you won't hear about it if you use certain media sources.

 

Good point, but the point you're missing is that they (Trump team) created the mess by addressing it over the weekend and  then talking about illegal votes. If they shut their mouths, they can talk about policy. It works both ways.

[Larry]

45 minutes ago, No Excuses said:

 

A narcissistic nutjob who is still pissed that he lost the popular vote. Now he's going to waste tax payer money to soothe his ego by finding "voter fraud" in NY and CA.

 

This is a larger pretext to more voter suppression efforts led by the GOP. 

 

Well, no doubt that's part of the motive.  

 

But I'd suspect that the major motive is that an "investigation" allows the GOP to manage the narrative.  

 

Same reason Grahm wants to investigate Russian hacking.  He's not upset about the tampered election - his side won.  But he knows that the story is going to get reported on.  And he'd prefer it if the reporting consisted of the media talking about Republican press releases.  

 

And one of the things the GOP is really good at, is managing "investigations" to control the news cycle.  

 

[Springfield]

59 minutes ago, LD0506 said:

"Newspeak"............ color me surprised

 

‘1984’ sales soar after Trump claims, ‘alternative facts’

https://www.washingtonpost.com/entertainment/books/1984-sales-soar-after-alternative-facts-trump-claims/2017/01/24/fc5d47f4-e2a3-11e6-a419-eefe8eff0835_story.html?tid=pm_entertainment_pop&utm_term=.d2fe7baa8d3d

 

Of course this is lost since the shrinking demographic that might actually read is vastly outnumbered by the trogs whose only connection to 1984 is the truck they're still driving (but the Trump stickers and Confederate flags decals are brand new!)

 

I purchased it last night for my Kindle.  Started reading it.  Funny...

[LD0506]

25 minutes ago, DogofWar1 said:

While this is true, grassroots efforts to overcome barriers aren't really all that easy.

 

Consider what they did down in 'Bama, with passing strict laws and then closing DMVs in high minority population areas.  To get IDs to everyone who should have had them, it would take thousands of people volunteering a minimum of several hours of their time.  At least.  That can get done, but it's hard to do, the coordination needed is not nothing, and coordination takes time, and time costs money.

 

In the end, there will be thousands of communities nationwide that would need lots of coordinated help, and there are simply not enough human resources to go around to all of them.  Some will get left behind.  And that's the point.  For every community that gets on the news and gets back to pre-suppression "normal" rates of registration, another 10 will suffer in silence.

 

While I agree with this, I'm not sure I would second your opinion that it is too big to handle. It does not require millions traveling and acting in concert a la the weekend protest marches. Yes, it would take time and coordination but most of all it requires the will to act instead of people telling themselves that sitting on their ass and ****ing helps.

 

Their are immense resources out there. not all together or all in one place but millions of people have computer/internet access, social media accounts, and transportation. Assume they are all in different hands and what is needed? Contact, conversation, compassion and communication. Southern black churches are VERY well connected, very well organized, and might afford a framework to mobilize these disparate elements to work together. You only need one or two decent attorneys to give you access to the legal requirements and explanations, a couple church vans can haul a lot of people, crowdfund gas/expenses, get the grandkids to connect their folks, etc., etc., it IS work, no one says it isn't but it is not impossible or insurmountable and mostly it does not have to be a hugely connected/financed/managed/overmanaged effort. A few people could organize something and get it rolling in a week and get what, two dozen people registered? Talk it up, offer advice, get your pat on the back and the process repeats itself in another county, another state, whatever.

 

You plant seeds in abundance not in the expectation that every one germinates and grows, but moreso that enough do so that there are seeds for the next year's crop. Sowing seeds is in itself an expression of hope, that small efforts now can have worthwhile returns later.

 

 

[Larry]

47 minutes ago, mikered30 said:

Trump tweeted that an investigation into voter fraud will occur with how dead people can vote.

 

Now, I've actually read news articles about umpty-ump dead people voting, in a recent election.  

 

You look a little deeper, and the story falls apart.  

 

A good chunk of the "dead people who voted" are legitimate voters who accidentally signed their name on the wrong line in the book.  Others were people who have the same name as somebody who died.  And there were like three cases of people who voted early, and then died before election day.  

 

Which doesn't in any way stop people from using the talking point, anyway.  

 

Because it's a fact in politics today that there is no penalty for getting caught lying, any more.  At least, not if you're a Republican.  

 

 

---

 

45 minutes ago, No Excuses said:

 

I dont know what the long term effects of this will be but I can't imagine it is good for our society overall. 

 

President Trump is the long term effect.  This is the result of 30 years of brainwashing.  

 

And you're right, it's not good for the country.  (But it's great for the Republican Party.)  

 

[skinny21]

Believe it was reported that the author of the Pew study in the OP tweeted that "his" study does not give any indication of voter fraud.  

 

Is there a count/record of the number of complaints about voter suppression - i.e. numbers of people wrongly turned away (or at least those that registered a complaint)?

 

 

[visionary]

 

[Hersh]

Look guys, a shiny object. 

 

Democrats would be foolish not to introduce legislation ordering an investigation into voter fraud. It will make Trump look ridiculous once it's over. Play the game while focusing on more important issues. 

[PeterMP]

 

2 minutes ago, visionary said:

 

 

I honestly don't think there is going to be an investigation.  I suspect that they will make this announcement, let it die down, and then ignore it.

 

I suspect they know they aren't going to find millions of votes, and he will just look foolish for saying it.

[Larry]

7 minutes ago, PeterMP said:

 

 

I honestly don't think there is going to be an investigation.  I suspect that they will make this announcement, let it die down, and then ignore it.

 

I suspect they know they aren't going to find millions of votes, and he will just look foolish for saying it.

 

They knew they weren't going to find any incriminating Bengazi emails, too. Didn't stop them from spending four years generating a string of bombastic press releases about all the incredible amounts of scandal they were finding. 

 

If you think the purpose of the investigation is to actually find fraud, then no, it's guaranteed to fail. But if you think it's purpose is to generate years of unsupported claims?  Heck, they already have an automated factory for producing that. 

[Bang]

4 minutes ago, PeterMP said:

 

 

I honestly don't think there is going to be an investigation.  I suspect that they will make this announcement, let it die down, and then ignore it.

 

I suspect they know they aren't going to find millions of votes, and he will just look foolish for saying it.

Of course there won't

but they will keep telling us there is until they tell us their investigation has turned up exactly what they said all along that it would, and create a false mandate.

And they will only release their findings through their own mouthpieces, and it will not be made readily available for anyone not on their list to nail it down and study it  and any attempts to do so will be met with shouts  of "it's there, deal with it" by both the administration and it's lockstep followers. Their 'findings' will foster anger and resentment towards the opposition, and it will be painted as if they have had their country stolen from them all along.

 

Major distraction tactic with a goal of power consolidation and threatening the opposition. (both figuratively and literally as they continue to sow division.)

Where have i read about this sot of thing before?

 

Oh yeah.

 

The differences are getting smaller.

 

~Bang

[Dan T.]

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[visionary]

 

 

 

 

[The Evil Genius]

Honestly, they'll find about a half dozen cases of voter fraud and then either use that a case to prove the 3-5mil total..or more likely, they will claim victory and bury the story (the same way that Twitler has with the birther cause he led).

[justice98]

11 hours ago, Zazzaro703 said:

This is exactly what I said in a different thread earlier. There are so many topics of substance to be discussing but they are in a frenzy about crowd sizes and voter fraud. It's sad but not surprising at all.

 

On the topic of voter fraud, you're the president Don, either prove it or let it go. Whining about it isn't accomplishing anything.

 

Lying from the President/White House IS substantive.  

[No Excuses]

2 minutes ago, justice98 said:

 

Lying from the President/White House IS substantive.  

 

Yup, this describes why:

 

 

[visionary]

 

[The Evil Genius]

Of course he is. Anything to prohibit or make it harder for people to vote is a major platform issue for the GOP.  

[NoCalMike]

This is classic "create a problem that doesn't exist, then come up with solution to said fake problem."  In this case, voter ID laws.   This is the new birtherism.  There is no truth to it, but the goal will be to just keep throwing everything against the wall, create a false perception, run with it, run with it....and by the time it is exposed as false, the damage is done and it's too late.  

 

Right now it seems like most people on the right, left, center etc etc....are laughing at Trump over this, but in 6 months, 12 months, 18 months of the "3-5 million...." lie being repeated, and likely getting aided by the usual media outlets, let's re-visit the amount of people who believe it.

[PeterMP]

I will say, I do think this is where maybe we should do something not because a problem exist, but because the potential for a problem exist.  It is better to fix an issue that could be a problem before it becomes a problem, then to worry about it after the fact (the old closing the barn door after the horse escaped).

 

I know I was registered to vote in at least 2 states for about a decade.  I was called to jury duty in MD about a decade after I had moved out of MD and in the mean time I had moved to, had a drivers license, and registered to vote in 3 other states.  MD's response was, we still you have you as a registered voter in MD.  I never actually voted in more than one state, but it seems like I could have.

 

The key limitation currently seems to me that you are registered to vote by states and essentially by name so for common names, it is likely you will have more than one person registered to vote in multiple states.

 

John Barry Smith might be registered to vote in more than one state, but that might be because John Barry Smith is registered to vote in more than one state or there might be more than one John Barry Smith.

 

An easy thing to do would seem to be establish some sort of federal system where you register to vote by your SS#.  You could still register at a DMV when getting your license (who doesn't use their SS# as one of their "points" for an ID), but it would be easy  for states to cross check if you were registered in another state.

 

(I generally support the idea of moving to a federal ID.)

[Jumbo]

Can you imagine how thrilled they must be in Putin's Pool Parlor? They get to watch the ****-show-in-chief call out American democracy as a broken farce.

 

Imagine you got the leader of the nation, regularly ****ting on the legitimacy of the process with broad and deep condemnations and accusations of its corruption.

 

Please do not respond to this post with anything about "but look at these instances of voter fraud." Just move on.

[@DCGoldPants]

somebody probably already posted this. But if there was massive fraud at that level, why didn't they do in swing states?

[PeterMP]

Just now, @SkinsGoldPants said:

somebody probably already posted this. But if there was massive fraud at that level, why didn't they do in swing states?

 

Because liburls are stoopid!

[The Evil Genius]

4 minutes ago, @SkinsGoldPants said:

somebody probably already posted this. But if there was massive fraud at that level, why didn't they do in swing states?

 

3 minutes ago, PeterMP said:

 

Because liburls are stoopid!

 

Because tired Hillary focused on the wrong states!

 

Duh.

[Bang]

9 minutes ago, Jumbo said:

Can you imagine how thrilled they must be in Putin's Pool Parlor? They get to watch the ****-show-in-chief call out American democracy as a broken farce.

 

Imagine you got the leader of the nation, regularly ****ting on the legitimacy of the process with broad and deep condemnations and accusations of its corruption.

 

Please do not respond to this post with anything about "but look at these instances of voter fraud." Just move on.

It would be almost as if they'd had some sort of diabolical plan for world domination for most of the last 75 years, and one of their strongest KGB guys that is now in charge of their country was running the plan to fruition.

 

~Dang