FAREWELL to the NFL Dwayne Haskins QB Ohio State

[philibusters]

1 hour ago, UK SKINS FAN '74 said:

 

Yes it's pretty clear Dan has a close relationship with Haskins, implying that any FO and coaching changes will include the adoption of Haskins as starting QB.

 

Outside/Marginal chance that the fact we could be picking #2 in the draft may influence that. I mean, before Haskins showed improvement of late we did have a Arizona/Rosen situation bubbling away. 

 

Im also in the minority thinking the Bungles likely take Chase Young at #1. 

 

Hopefully we get a wild offseason staring with the axe falling early January.

 

Even if Haskins had continued to play like he did against Detroit, Carolina, and Green Bay I would have wanted to give him next year.   He came in very green so he wasn't going to hit the ground running.   A lot of the fanbase doesn't understand.   When Haskins arrived at Ohio St, Joe Burrow had already been at Ohio St for a year.  Haskins was at Ohio St for 3 seasons but really only played for one.  And during that season he played in a fairly straightforward spread offense that simplifies the reads for a QB to an extent.

 

To me the Murray/Rosen thing was partly about fit in Arizona's offensive system.   Haskins and Burrow are both pocket passers with some mobility.

 

I also just don't see Burrow has a great prospect.  First Round yeah.   But nothing special by first round standards.

[Burgold]

1 minute ago, bearrock said:

 

Come on Burgold!  I know he strung out the final days of he's career in DC to get that sack record, but do you have to be so mean to him? 

lol. Morning brain for the loss!

[Skinsinparadise]

 

I'd like to keep O'Connell if possible

 

 

 

 

 

[Skinsinparadise]

The Kirk/Colt arm strength stuff.  Seeing both throw in camp throw back to back it wasn't even close.  Kirk's arm strength >>>>>>>>Colt.  They were like from two different planets.  I said that at the time.  It's easy to see in camp when you see them throw back to back.   Colt's balls typically have a float to them, very little mustard. Heck Sudfeld's arm was distinctly stronger than Colt, too.

 

I haven't seen Haskins and Kirk throw back to back but I said this during camp, Haskins' arm looked stronger from what I recall from Kirk.  I've never had any concerns about Haskins arm strength, it looks special.  But his accuracy was all over the place in the practices I watched.  Similar to how he looked early on when he played.  But he's improved night and day.  Dramatic difference.    He had one practice of the 6 I watched in camp where he was lights out.   That's how Haskins has looked in the last 2 games.  

 

I got no problem with him not starting the beginning of the season.   They played it the way I wanted them to.  Don't start him right away, let him watch but then play him around mid season.  I don't think it was just a Jay thing.  I recall the reports at the time that everyone in the FO and all the coaches didn't think Haskins was ready.  Dan, too.😀

 

[Burgold]

1 minute ago, Skinsinparadise said:

  

 

I got no problem with him not starting the beginning of the season.   They played it the way I wanted them to.  Don't start him right away, let him watch but then play him around mid season.  I don't think it was just a Jay thing.  I recall the reports at the time that everyone in the FO and all the coaches didn't think Haskins was ready.  Dan, too.😀

 

I really suspect a large part of it is confidence. Haskins has faux confidence and real confidence. Faux confidence is what you project into the world and you try to fool yourself into believing. Real confidence relates to that athletic arrogance and calm we all have when we know we can do it. Someone who's actually confident doesn't need to call themselves "the closer" they just close. If they do call themselves "the closer" it's to pump themselves up or to put a mask out into the world.

 

The Haskins we saw yesterday who celebrated with Case when Keenum through the touchdown or who was bouncing on the balls of his feet like a little kid for Hentges. That's what confidence looks like.  There was something that happened early in training camp that robbed Haskins of his mojo. He's finally getting it back.

[KDawg]

Just now, Burgold said:

I really suspect a large part of it is confidence. Haskins has faux confidence and real confidence. Faux confidence is what you project into the world and you try to fool yourself into believing. Real confidence relates to that athletic arrogance and calm we all have when we know we can do it. Someone who's actually confident doesn't need to call themselves "the closer" they just close. If they do call themselves "the closer" it's to pump themselves up or to put a mask out into the world.

 

The Haskins we saw yesterday who celebrated with Case when Keenum through the touchdown or who was bouncing on the balls of his feet like a little kid for Hentges. That's what confidence looks like.  There was something that happened early in training camp that robbed Haskins of his mojo. He's finally getting it back.

 

I think you nailed this one, Burg. Haskins was, to be blunt, a phoney at the start of the season. He acted like he had all of this swagger, but really he seemed scared and nervous. The last 2-3 weeks, though, that's changed. You can see it. He's no longer taking selfies in the stands with fans. He's talking to his teammates. And the Keenum moment stood out to me, too. Both guys had big grins on their face. Do you see that 8 weeks ago? Probably not. Haskins has REAL confidence now and to be honest, he's fun to watch. I've flipped on Haskins. Completely. I see a different attitude in him that makes me think he can do it. One he definitely did NOT have even 4 weeks ago. I like this Haskins. 

[Skinsinparadise]

8 minutes ago, Burgold said:

I really suspect a large part of it is confidence. Haskins has faux confidence and real confidence. Faux confidence is what you project into the world and you try to fool yourself into believing. Real confidence relates to that athletic arrogance and calm we all have when we know we can do it. Someone who's actually confident doesn't need to call themselves "the closer" they just close. If they do call themselves "the closer" it's to pump themselves up or to put a mask out into the world.

 

The Haskins we saw yesterday who celebrated with Case when Keenum through the touchdown or who was bouncing on the balls of his feet like a little kid for Hentges. That's what confidence looks like.  There was something that happened early in training camp that robbed Haskins of his mojo. He's finally getting it back.

 

Could be.  As I said during training camp, he had 5 practices which I watched out of 6 which were shaky and that's been generous.  And one practice where he looked like Dan Marino.   So I don't know if that's about getting his mechanics more consistent?  

 

Confidence clearly looks higher.  I also do think the reports that Callahan has allowed of late O'Connell to run the offense more to his liking if so helped.  Hoffman hinted at tension between Callahan and O'Connell previously as to the offense.  But the last two weeks they are throwing more on first down, throwing more period, quick game, etc. 

 

It does help to play two defenses in a row with horrendous secondaries.  Just like it helped Daniel Jones yesterday for the same reason.  But clearly, he's finding a nice rhythm.  I've liked his pocket presence the whole time since camp but his accuracy concerned me a lot.  He's looked accurate of late and that's awesome. 

[bearrock]

And in that vein, O'Connell looks like a keeper.  I know the next HC has to make that call, but I hope he looks very hard at keeping KOC around

[KDawg]

38 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

I'd like to keep O'Connell if possible

 

Eh.

 

I'm not sold on him.

 

If it wasn't for Lafleur, McVay and Shanahan (who wasn't going to stick around after the whole fiasco with his Dad and the FO) would we be latching onto O'Connell as hard? I think a lot of the desire to keep him stems from a fear that we could be losing out on the next talented young head coach. But I think it's an irrational fear. 

 

Even though I am a fan of Haskins as of late, I stick to my earlier points. This team needs a new GM/HC combo. I don't care if the HC is the one in charge or the GM is. They need to be on the same page. That's the important part. And they need to pick their own groceries. If they are genuinely fine with Dwayne Haskins at quarterback, great. If they are forced to keep him there is no change in this team's MO. 

 

O'Connell falls in the same batch as the rest of the Redskins FO and coaching staff. If they fit with the new GM/HC's vision - fine. If not, good luck and I hope you find success.

 

 

 

[redskinss]

What's this name drop thing with haskins and why does it seem to be ruffling people's feathers?

[Skinsinparadise]

33 minutes ago, KDawg said:

 

 

O'Connell falls in the same batch as the rest of the Redskins FO and coaching staff. If they fit with the new GM/HC's vision - fine. If not, good luck and I hope you find success.

 

 

 

 

I agree with this part.  I am not force feeding a coach on anybody. 

[YourWish is MyCommanders]

I love the fact that in one of the post game interviews Haskins talked of him and the receivers working on Routes and coverages. Where to expect the ball to go, and where to be as a receiver in certain defensive looks. They are working on these thing before, during, and after practice. These are the things that I feel will really translate to the field and make this offense pop.

(I think it was Haskins....maybe it was Terry??? My memory sucks....)

[profusion]

It really sucks that the ankle thing happened yesterday, because Haskins was having a nice game. He only made one questionable throw that I saw, and I couldn't tell whether that was actually the WR's fault.

 

Haskins had nice zip on the ball, and the downgrade was noticeable when Keenum came in (even though Case had a couple really nice throws, too).

[joeken24]

I'm speculating, but I have a feeling Haskins' ankle issues will be a normal part of his career if he doesn't tackle it now. If you haven't noticed, Dwayne has got some foot pronation going on. i'm not sure if he has flat feet. But based on my own experience, having flat feet and pronation made me susceptible to ankle sprains most of my sports life. Haskins mentioned having an ankle injury in high school. I suppose the question would be how many. Fact is, once a ankle ligament is pulled or slightly torn, its pretty much a wrap without surgery. There are exercises to treat over pronation, but IMO, Haskins may want to seek out Steph Curry's doctor to get this thing corrected. Right now, it seems that he is under estimating it.

 

 

[Riggo-toni]

1 hour ago, KDawg said:

 

1 hour ago, KDawg said:

I'm not sold on him.

 

If it wasn't for Lafleur, McVay and Shanahan (who wasn't going to stick around after the whole fiasco with his Dad and the FO) would we be latching onto O'Connell as hard? I think a lot of the desire to keep him stems from a fear that we could be losing out on the next talented young head coach. But I think it's an irrational fear. 

Same. People who want O'Connell as HC are suffering from the same syndrome that convinced the Browns to hire Kitchens over Gregg Williams.

[joeken24]

Man I hope what McClaurin said about Haskins is true. He said a while back that Haskins gets into Jordan/Kobe like zones. Haskins mentioned that once he gets into a rhythm he's pretty much unstoppable. No confidence lost which i like. I actually think Haskins can be that kind of QB. Lets hope.  

[Snagletooth]

Its a small sample size.  Maybe an illusion.  But whomever is responsible for the success, of our rookie quartet,  I would like to keep that dynamic in place.

 

[goskins10]

50 minutes ago, KDawg said:

Eh.

 

I'm not sold on him.

 

If it wasn't for Lafleur, McVay and Shanahan (who wasn't going to stick around after the whole fiasco with his Dad and the FO) would we be latching onto O'Connell as hard? I think a lot of the desire to keep him stems from a fear that we could be losing out on the next talented young head coach. But I think it's an irrational fear. 

 

Even though I am a fan of Haskins as of late, I stick to my earlier points. This team needs a new GM/HC combo. I don't care if the HC is the one in charge or the GM is. They need to be on the same page. That's the important part. And they need to pick their own groceries. If they are genuinely fine with Dwayne Haskins at quarterback, great. If they are forced to keep him there is no change in this team's MO. 

 

O'Connell falls in the same batch as the rest of the Redskins FO and coaching staff. If they fit with the new GM/HC's vision - fine. If not, good luck and I hope you find success.

 

 

 

this 100%!!  I don’t want holdovers unless the incoming GM/HC want to keep them.  Let them make up thier own minds. 

[DJHJR86]

I am more convinced now than ever that he's our franchise quarterback.  And he should not play in the final game if he's not 100% healthy.  

[Momma There Goes That Man]

He's played very well the last few weeks. Hopefully, it is a trend and not an outlier. I'm excited and happy to have been proven wrong about him at this point. Looking forward to seeing how he looks after another offseason under his belt. 

[KDawg]

4 minutes ago, DJHJR86 said:

I am more convinced now than ever that he's our franchise quarterback.  And he should not play in the final game if he's not 100% healthy.  

 

I mean...

 

I'd pump the brakes on the franchise quarterback stuff.

 

He's shown enough that he deserves the opportunity to be that guy. But he sure as **** isn't yet.

[MisterPinstripe]

2 minutes ago, Momma There Goes That Man said:

He's played very well the last few weeks. Hopefully, it is a trend and not an outlier. I'm excited and happy to have been proven wrong about him at this point. Looking forward to seeing how he looks after another offseason under his belt. 

It's especially encouraging to me since it wasn't his first couple of games, but rather after a bunch of games that showed growth he's started looking very good.

[skinny21]

2 hours ago, KDawg said:

 

I think you nailed this one, Burg. Haskins was, to be blunt, a phoney at the start of the season. He acted like he had all of this swagger, but really he seemed scared and nervous. The last 2-3 weeks, though, that's changed. You can see it. He's no longer taking selfies in the stands with fans. He's talking to his teammates. And the Keenum moment stood out to me, too. Both guys had big grins on their face. Do you see that 8 weeks ago? Probably not. Haskins has REAL confidence now and to be honest, he's fun to watch. I've flipped on Haskins. Completely. I see a different attitude in him that makes me think he can do it. One he definitely did NOT have even 4 weeks ago. I like this Haskins. 

I really get the sense that O’Connell’s remarks about getting into the “why’s” is strongly connected to this confidence we’re seeing.  Haskins is getting the ball out quicker, taking fewer sacks/hits, converting 3rd downs, etc.  Probably helps that he’s faced lesser corners the past two weeks, but still... he’s shown a lot of growth.  

I think he went from real confidence (he absolutely believed in his ability), to faux confidence (from press reports - including not being ‘wanted’ - through to his his spot duty play), to regaining his confidence from the Carolina game on.  Was a bit painful to watch him at times, on and off the field, but I’m digging the turnaround.  Kudos to @Burgold for making this point.  

Related, but still kind of random... Haskins “the league done messed up” I took as just another way of saying “I’ve got a chip on my shoulder” - which is a pretty standard attitude for guys drafted a little later than many expected.  So that one never bothered me.  Other stuff did though, but given the changes we’ve seen, I can look past that stuff now... for the most part.  

 

 

 

@SkinsinparadiseI like the idea of keeping O’Connell as the OC as long as he’s not forced on a new HC.  Haskins (and our receivers) could really benefit from some schematic continuity.

As HC, I don’t hate the idea, but it seems like quite a leap.  He does have some prerequisites I’d look for in a HC as far as temperament/character/intellect, but there’s a lot we don’t know about him. 

 

[NoCalMike]

I'll say the same thing now that I said before, after his bad performances.  Haskins is extremely inexperienced.  I don't expect his trajectory to be a straight line of improvement every single week.  I still think that as he grows and learns to play the position he is going to have games where half the fan base is back to being ready to throw in the towel on the guy.   I am very happy with his last couple of performances I just don't want it to cloud our minds into thinking it's "only up from here" when it comes to the guy's development.

[DJHJR86]

39 minutes ago, KDawg said:

I mean...

 

I'd pump the brakes on the franchise quarterback stuff.

 

He's shown enough that he deserves the opportunity to be that guy. But he sure as **** isn't yet.

 

What I meant was that I am fully prepared to go through the next 2-3 seasons with him as the starter.  Obviously, he needs to continue to produce and grow, but there isn't any real argument for pulling a Rosen on him.