Presidential Election: 11/3/20 ---Now the President Elect Joe Biden Thread

[goskins10]

2 minutes ago, LD0506 said:

 

But don't tell men to wear a mask!! It's their body!! Their choice! Un-****ing believable!  

[Burgold]

13 minutes ago, Springfield said:

Can you honestly sit back and say, that if Biden were president in January of 2020 and his plan were allowed to be put into action that things would have not been any better?

Yes. 
 

because every ****ing country did better than we are doing. 
 

edit: I think I read this backwards. We both agree that situation would have been better under any other leadership. 

[Springfield]

I do wonder though, due to the outrageous amount of obesity in the US, if we were bound to be hit harder with deaths.

[goskins10]

Just now, Burgold said:

Yes. 
 

because every ****ing country did better than we are doing. 

 

You may have misread the statement. Key part you may have skipped over - would have not been any better - Might want to read it again and amend your comment 🙂     

[bearrock]

8 hours ago, BraveWarrior said:

 

I seem to remember Biden criticizing Trump's travel ban as "xenophobic" back then as well. I also remember Dems such as Pelosi, Cuomo and DiBlasio downplaying the threat even into March. 

 

I reviewed Biden's 5 point plan, and aside from test and trace (which is more effective in the early stages of a spread, and not so much at the pandemic level), I don't see anything very unique or anything that hasn't become a part of the overall response at this time.     

 

The lifesaving measures are not some super secret brilliance that is being kept hidden in a locked safe.  Pretty much every other advanced nations do the mask, distance, test, trace, shut down as necessary, all based on sound advice of experts and to great success.  If Trump needs ideas on what to do, all he has to do is ask experts on what will contain the virus and follow it without consideration for optics, reelection, and the stock market.

 

Instead Trump decided the most expedient course of action for his self interest is to ignore the severity of the threat, encourage people to lead a normal life to protect the market and optics, and then hope to buy time until a miracle arrives in the form of a vaccine.  Well, the problem with that of course is the staggering death count.

 

Biden's plan is not important for the actual mechanics of the plans.  Those are well known and practiced all across the world.  His plan is important because he is saying he will cast aside political and self interest and follow the advice of experts.  That's it.  That's the list. 

 

So if Trump wants to saves lives between now and January, he can go to his experts and ask them what should I do to save American lives.  I would imagine one of the advice would be to stop having gatherings at the White House with over a thousand attendees without social distancing or masks.

[Burgold]

Retraction added. Sorry @Springfield

[Die Hard]

Is there any example in the world, where the country’s leadership took the threat serious, and shared the information with the public.... and the citizens of that country subsequently went into a frenzied panic, which exacerbated the effects of virus?
 

Who was Trump trying to prevent panic from? We know he doesn’t give a **** about Democratic cities/states. And we know Republicans aren’t afraid of anything — because they have guns and wouldnt comply with any measures/rules anyways.

[NoCalMike]

Trump's plan, downplay threat publicly, while admitting behind closed doors it is much more severe.  Also, muzzle medical professionals who also won't repeat that everything is fine.

 

This re-writing of history is pretty bold considering this all happened within the same calendar year that we are still in. 

 

The guy failed at what his own base would likely call the number one job of the President, keeping America safe.

[Springfield]

14 minutes ago, Die Hard said:

Is there any example in the world, where the country’s leadership took the threat serious, and shared the information with the public.... and the citizens of that country subsequently went into a frenzied panic, which exacerbated the effects of virus?
 

Who was Trump trying to prevent panic from? We know he doesn’t give a **** about Democratic cities/states. And we know Republicans aren’t afraid of anything — because they have guns and wouldnt comply with any measures/rules anyways.

 

It's quite clearly bull****. His whole mantra has been to work people up into a frenzy.

[No Excuses]

 

From the man who spends his free time fear mongering about caravans of migrants and antifa burning down cities comes the excuse "I didn't want to scare people".

 

Beyond parody

[GibbsGreen11]

[mistertim]

28 minutes ago, Die Hard said:

Is there any example in the world, where the country’s leadership took the threat serious, and shared the information with the public.... and the citizens of that country subsequently went into a frenzied panic, which exacerbated the effects of virus?
 

Who was Trump trying to prevent panic from? We know he doesn’t give a **** about Democratic cities/states. And we know Republicans aren’t afraid of anything — because they have guns and wouldnt comply with any measures/rules anyways.

 

Trump wasn't trying to prevent people from panicking, as he couldn't give a rat's ass about any other human beings. He was trying to prevent the stock market from panicking. Which it did anyway. 

 

Either way, David Frum pretty much nailed it in the previously posted tweet thread. Trump lied about it because it's literally all he knows how to do. When a problem comes up in pretty much any situation he doesn't have the competence to actually fix it, and he's too lazy and stupid to learn, so he just tries to bluster, talk, and lie it out of existence. Or at least until the noise of his talking and lies overshadows the actual problem.

 

And it generally seemed to work for him for a long ass time, but a virus and pandemic is a completely different animal...it doesn't care about what you say or if you call it names on twitter or if you deny or confirm its existence. Trump has no idea how to deal with something like that so he fell back into the only pattern he knows and it completely failed him.

[Die Hard]

They’re going to take over your suburbs! Theyre going to destroy and steal your property! They’re going to kill your unborn babies! They’re going to rape your wives!  And execute every last one if you on the streets in cold blood. These godless heathens and anarchists!

 

But I don’t want to cause a panic! 
 

I got a plan for that. Covid, not so much.

[goskins10]

4 minutes ago, Die Hard said:

They’re going to take over your suburbs! Theyre going to destroy and steal your property! They’re going to kill your unborn babies! They’re going to rape your wives!  And execute every last one if you on the streets in cold blood. These godless heathens and anarchists!

 

But I don’t want to cause a panic! 
 

I got a plan for that. Covid, not so much.

 

 

Here is a little to add onto the - they are coming to your neighborhoods - and it's not just people of color. Warning - there is considerable language in this. 

 

 

[Die Hard]

6 minutes ago, mistertim said:

 

Trump wasn't trying to prevent people from panicking, as he couldn't give a rat's ass about any other human beings. He was trying to prevent the stock market from panicking. Which it did anyway. 

 

Either way, David Frum pretty much nailed it in the previously posted tweet thread. Trump lied about it because it's literally all he knows how to do. When a problem comes up in pretty much any situation he doesn't have the competence to actually fix it, and he's too lazy and stupid to learn, so he just tries to bluster, talk, and lie it out of existence. Or at least until the noise of his talking and lies overshadows the actual problem.

 

And it generally seemed to work for him for a long ass time, but a virus and pandemic is a completely different animal...it doesn't care about what you say or if you call it names on twitter or if you deny or confirm its existence. Trump has no idea how to deal with something like that so he fell back into the only pattern he knows and it completely failed him.

Yes, it was an interesting read. Seems on point.

 

I wish any of this mattered, but it doesn’t. 

[tshile]

The question is not really “how dumb is the logic in justifying what trump did?”

 

the only questions that matter are:

”where are we on expected voter turnout with respect to people who will vote against trump and how does this improve/hurt having more of these people show up to vote?”

and

”are trump supporters having their worldview shook, even if just a little, by this?”

 

Arguing whether trumps logic justify his actions is a silly game. We all know the answer. It’s the same pattern of behavior over and over and over. 
 

all that matters is whether this one causes his supporters to stop and think instead of blindly defending him, and where we are with expected turnout for people who will vote for Biden. 
 

the rest of it is pointless noise. 

[Jumbo]

 

trump to his ****-eating ****head supporters: don't panic over the real and existing threat of the pandemic...do panic over the tens of thousandth of criminal rapist brown people in caravans invading your country from the south and panic over the heavily armed antifa hordes from the north who control the big cities and are working their way to mayberry to turn it into a hellscape too...or hell-ish.....

[Larry]

12 minutes ago, mistertim said:

Either way, David Frum pretty much nailed it in the previously posted tweet thread. Trump lied about it because it's literally all he knows how to do. When a problem comes up in pretty much any situation he doesn't have the competence to actually fix it, and he's too lazy and stupid to learn, so he just tries to bluster, talk, and lie it out of existence. Or at least until the noise of his talking and lies overshadows the actual problem.

 

Just pointing out, This isn't a Trump phenomenon.  It's a GOP et al problem.  Just like, when the only tool you've got is a hammer, then the whole world looks like a nail, well, when your only tool is the "lie your ass off machine" you've created, then your response to everything is to lie your ass off.  

 

This has been going on far longer than Trump.  Trump isn't even the mastermind behind it.  He's just the beneficiary of it.  

[Jumbo]

dupe post

[Spaceman Spiff]

2 minutes ago, Larry said:

 

Just pointing out, This isn't a Trump phenomenon.  It's a GOP et al problem.  Just like, when the only tool you've got is a hammer, then the whole world looks like a nail, well, when your only tool is the "lie your ass off machine" you've created, then your response to everything is to lie your ass off.  

 

This has been going on far longer than Trump.  Trump isn't even the mastermind behind it.  He's just the beneficiary of it.  

 

https://www.amazon.com/Was-All-Lie-Republican-Became/dp/0525658459#ace-9766277718 

 

I read this last weekend, I'd recommend it.  

[LadySkinsFan]

1 hour ago, Springfield said:

Can you honestly sit back and say, that if Biden were president in January of 2020 and his plan were allowed to be put into action that things would have not been any better?

 

Things would have been better: less people sick and less people dying! 

 

I am so sad since last night, that this creep we have as a president knew and decided that it was in his best interest to hide the truth and not do everything possible to lessen sickness and dying. HE ****ING CHOSE TO LIE TO WE THE PEOPLE!

 

He needs to be prosecuted and convicted and imprisoned for his dereliction of duty. HE'S NOT THE ****ING KING!

 

We need to elect Biden and bring back sense to our government!

[Larry]

And a further riff on my theme that this is much bigger than Trump.  

 

OK, it's on tape.  When Donald Trump found out that COVID was killing Americans, his response was to look at which Americans it was killing, saw that they were Democrats, and decided that this disease helped him and the Party politically, so we shouldn't fight it.  

 

Shocking.  We should all be outraged, shouldn't we.  How terrible Trump is.  

 

Anybody remember the Reagan administration's response to AIDS?  Cause I sure as **** do.  

 

This isn't a Trump problem.  And it's not new.  

[PleaseBlitz]

The devastating part about the two main concurrent* Trump scandals is that they are entirely concordant with everything we know about the man.  Attacks on a politician don't move the needle when those attacks don't line up with the already established public perception of someone.  These two, saying dead soldiers are losers and lying about the coronavirus, line up perfectly with what everyone outside of the hardcore MAGA base (and probably a lot of them**) think.  (1) Trump is only about himself and doesn't understand public service (remember in 2016 when he was asked what he's sacrificed for his country, and his only response was that he's worked very hard, denigrating McCain, fighting with the Khans) and (2) he's lied about literally everything to make up facts more appealing for his political prospects than the reality on the ground (this literally started on his first day with the crowd-size fiasco and has never stopped).  

 

*It's sort of crazy that at any given moment Trump has like a dozen scandals happening, so one must add multiple qualifiers to their descriptions in order to specify.

 

**I suspect that may Trump supporters cannot accomplish the mental gymnastics to convince themselves that neither of these things happened given that a lot of it is on tape/film.  They just don't care enough to rethink their support.  It's sort of like how, if Joe Biden directed Antifa to burn down the entire city of Portland and eat any survivors, I would still vote for him over Trump.  

[Spaceman Spiff]

13 minutes ago, LadySkinsFan said:

 

Things would have been better: less people sick and less people dying! 

 

 

 

I think things would have been better.  But there's still a contingent of people out there that don't give a **** about anyone else and will do what they want.

 

Trump's bootlickers, the people who've supported him blindly, weren't going to take the coronavirus seriously no matter what.  Trump lies, they believe him.  There's no way they'd pay attention to what Hillary/Biden or any Democrat would have to say, no matter how dire their message was.

 

Trump is a big part of the issue, make no mistake.  But there's a personal responsibility problem in this country that's alarming to say the least.  Looking out for your fellow citizens, etc.  There's a large contingent of people who don't give a **** about how they can affect others, which is sad.  

[Jumbo]

1 minute ago, PleaseBlitz said:

It's sort of like how, if Joe Biden directed Antifa to burn down the entire city of Portland and eat any survivors, I would still vote for him over Trump.  

 

you're going to make a comment supporting cannibalism as part of a political position without even addressing the key matters of side dishes and condiments ?