mistertim Posted September 10, 2020 Share Posted September 10, 2020 7 minutes ago, Destino said: Worried he’s going to tell the world you watched Hamilton three times? And that he listens to Nickelback. 9 minutes ago, hail2skins said: After the first Woodward book on the Trump Administration came out, I remember Paul Begala, who worked on both Bill and Hillary's campaigns and I think was in Bill's WH, said "When a Woodward book on the Clinton WH would come out, I would be angry seeing my quotes in there.....but also knew that the quotes were 100 percent factual and not made up." Yeah he has a pretty much untouchable reputation for being accurate. Which makes it even wilder that they would all agree to talk with him on the record. Gotta love Trump self-owning again, though. Woodward writes a book, Trump fumes and says he should have been interviewed. Woodward agrees to interview him multiple times for a second book, Trump promptly accepts and proceeds to explain how he single-handedly ****ed up the entire COVID-19 response and then proceeds to get pissed when it comes out. Dude is such a goddamn buffoon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spaceman Spiff Posted September 10, 2020 Share Posted September 10, 2020 8 minutes ago, Destino said: Worried he’s going to tell the world you watched Hamilton three times? Precisely. Jokes, no way I'm watching that ****. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Evil Genius Posted September 10, 2020 Share Posted September 10, 2020 40 minutes ago, Destino said: Worried he’s going to tell the world you watched Hamilton three times? Tbf, Bob was in the room where it happened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BraveWarrior Posted September 10, 2020 Share Posted September 10, 2020 Very interesting, if not very one-sided, discussion of the Covid response. Just wondering though, if we all agree Trump's response led to many needless deaths, and we all agree that's a bad thing, and if Biden says he has a Covid response plan that will save thousands of lives if he's elected, then how is it okay that Biden doesn't share his plan now? Think of all the people that may die under Trump's leadership that Biden could be saving between now and Election Day, and even more between now and his 1st day in office. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Evil Genius Posted September 10, 2020 Share Posted September 10, 2020 -- 10 minutes ago, BraveWarrior said: Very interesting, if not very one-sided, discussion of the Covid response. Just wondering though, if we all agree Trump's response led to many needless deaths, and we all agree that's a bad thing, and if Biden says he has a Covid response plan that will save thousands of lives if he's elected, then how is it okay that Biden doesn't share his plan now? Think of all the people that may die under Trump's leadership that Biden could be saving between now and Election Day, and even more between now and his 1st day in office. Biden published an op ed on it back in January. Then he published a more detailed plan in March..while Trump and his MAGA asshats were still publicly dismissing Covid-19 as fake. Biden also published this in April. https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/12/opinion/joe-biden-coronavirus-reopen-america.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BraveWarrior Posted September 10, 2020 Share Posted September 10, 2020 6 minutes ago, The Evil Genius said: Biden published an op ed on it back in January. Then published a more detailed plan in March..while Trump and his MAGA asshats were still publicly dismissing Covid-19 as fake. I seem to remember Biden criticizing Trump's travel ban as "xenophobic" back then as well. I also remember Dems such as Pelosi, Cuomo and DiBlasio downplaying the threat even into March. I reviewed Biden's 5 point plan, and aside from test and trace (which is more effective in the early stages of a spread, and not so much at the pandemic level), I don't see anything very unique or anything that hasn't become a part of the overall response at this time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted September 10, 2020 Share Posted September 10, 2020 2 hours ago, Spaceman Spiff said: If Bob Woodward ever calls me I'm throwing my phone out the window and running away. Used to be an old joke. A list of "You knomw it's going to be a bad day when . . . " One of the items was "There's a 60 Minutes crew in your office." 1 hour ago, bearrock said: If that's what they're upset about, may God have mercy on their souls. Or not. IDGAF. Also, it's not tens of thousands of lives. Plenty of countries have a few thousand deaths. Exactly one other country has over 100K deaths (Brazil with their version of covid denier) and third is India with 73K. Trump's intentional deceit killed at least over 100K Americans. Yeah, I don't think it's fair to blame Trump for ALL of the COVID deaths. It's a disease, it was going to spread no matter what we did. No protection is perfect. But I figure blaming him for half of them is reasonable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cooked Crack Posted September 10, 2020 Share Posted September 10, 2020 25 minutes ago, BraveWarrior said: Very interesting, if not very one-sided, discussion of the Covid response. It probably helps that Biden isn't out pushing conspiracy theories and actually following protocol that public health officials would support. 🤷🏿♂️ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted September 10, 2020 Share Posted September 10, 2020 1 hour ago, mistertim said: Gotta love Trump self-owning again, though. Woodward writes a book, Trump fumes and says he should have been interviewed. Woodward agrees to interview him multiple times for a second book, Trump promptly accepts and proceeds to explain how he single-handedly ****ed up the entire COVID-19 response and then proceeds to get pissed when it comes out. Dude is such a goddamn buffoon. And he had to know he was on tape. Woodward doesn't get to tape inside the WH without permission. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Evil Genius Posted September 10, 2020 Share Posted September 10, 2020 There is only 1 side of the covid discussion. The mistaken notion that the Party of Trump acted properly is laughable. They waited 4+ months before they started to realize that ignoring it wouldn't make it go away. This explains that cults reaction more than anything else I could ever write. Or as his niece says... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bearrock Posted September 10, 2020 Share Posted September 10, 2020 10 minutes ago, Larry said: Yeah, I don't think it's fair to blame Trump for ALL of the COVID deaths. It's a disease, it was going to spread no matter what we did. No protection is perfect. But I figure blaming him for half of them is reasonable. Consider it "Death Over Replacement Executive" metric. One other country in the world got past 80K. Other than the Brazilian president, I think it's a reasonable bet to say any other world leader could have stepped into the office and kept the death below 80K given the resources available to the United States and given how countries without those resources did so much better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TradeTheBeal! Posted September 10, 2020 Share Posted September 10, 2020 Facts be damned! Im gonna bull**** my way outta this or die trying. CREEPYJOE...Who’s with me?!? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Evil Genius Posted September 10, 2020 Share Posted September 10, 2020 Again, 4% of the worlds population and 22%+ of the world's covid-19 deaths. All because the Party of Trump thought they could wish it away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Evil Genius Posted September 10, 2020 Share Posted September 10, 2020 At the very least, a competent president would have said in early February that the virus is real and it's potentially deadlier and more contagious than the flu. It's also airborne, so wear masks and isolate as much as possible. Also, I'm deferring to State Health Departments who will get guidance from us but will have the authority to enact health precautions that are tailored to their populations. Rather, Trump called it fake until April and still dismisses mask wearing and proper social distancing to this day. So yeah, it's a bit one-sided because that's exactly where the blame falls. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted September 10, 2020 Share Posted September 10, 2020 We saw what Trump did in regards to the corona virus play out in real time, one press conference at a time. Why are we playing this game of asking Trump about what happened? This isn’t a history book, we were all there. We saw him downplay and we saw him blame democratic governors for the virus situation in blue states rather than help. We saw him fail to provide PPE and even leave states to compete with each other and the federal government to acquire it. We saw him refuse to wear masks, which he’s still doing, and we saw him push bull**** cures. There’s no debate here. Biden and democrats shouldn’t argue, they should just replay his press conferences and quote him. At the debate Biden should show up armed with quotes and bash Trump over the head with his own words all night. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCranon21 Posted September 10, 2020 Share Posted September 10, 2020 After what happened yesterday, he still tweeted this last night. Imagine still saying it was a hit job, when ITS ON DAMN RECORD. His base will still support him no matter what. He can't STFU, there is a tweet for everything. Also I still don't think Biden will get to 400+ EV and he should. Also Lindsey told Trump he should do the interview. Damn he set him up lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goskins10 Posted September 10, 2020 Share Posted September 10, 2020 6 hours ago, BraveWarrior said: I seem to remember Biden criticizing Trump's travel ban as "xenophobic" back then as well. I also remember Dems such as Pelosi, Cuomo and DiBlasio downplaying the threat even into March. I reviewed Biden's 5 point plan, and aside from test and trace (which is more effective in the early stages of a spread, and not so much at the pandemic level), I don't see anything very unique or anything that hasn't become a part of the overall response at this time. Not sure if you are just playing devils advocate here or purposely being obtuse. Either way I will play along for a little while - None of the people you mentioned above were or are the President of the US. They do not have the same intel or powers to make change. And the view from the outside was the trump was losing the tariff/trade war with China and needed some leverage. I for one still believe it was mostly retaliatory. Trump never does anything for others unless he has no choice. More importantly, if he instituted the ban altruistically for Covid reasons then he would have also put in other measures immediately, measures outlined in the Playbook left by the Obama administration and ignored by the trump admin, not waited 6 to 8 weeks and only then doing it piecemeal while still down playing the seriousness. So while they are loosely the same plans, it was more about timing and direction. He has not been a leader through all of this. Just a POS looking for a way out and to blame someone else, lives lost be damned. Back to the playbook - Biden's plan is no secret. It is laid out in the playbook, almost verbatim from what I have read. And yes, trump has done most of those things now but again only after having no choice. And he and his admin are doing these things half assed. But let's look at Joe's plan. Joe's 7 pt plan (https://joebiden.com/covid19/) does the right things and does them completely - including more accurate and organized testing, use the DPA to make sure PPE is available to everyone, and I mean everyone, provide national guidance and help states follow them instead of picking and choosing based on perceived red or blue states, continue the investment in a vaccine but make sure when available it's affordable and available to everyone, something trump has not committed to. Also, here is one of the major differences- rebuild the infrastructure Obama built and trump tore down to respond to pandemics. And last but seriously not least - mask mandate. Most reasonable estimates say if there were a national mask mandate this thing could be brought under control in 8 to 10 weeks. Do nothing else - just wear a ****ing mask!! But this clown just will not get with the program. Instead he stokes hate and fear pitting it as an infringement of Constitutional rights. Stores have approached this wrong BTW. When I see these cupcakes whining about wearing a mask and making a scene, the stores keep stating mask laws. They need to say it's the stores policy - period. They have as right to make any policy they want. You have a right to shop there or not. Put on a mask of get the **** out! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Llevron Posted September 10, 2020 Share Posted September 10, 2020 7 hours ago, BraveWarrior said: I reviewed Biden's 5 point plan, and aside from test and trace (which is more effective in the early stages of a spread, and not so much at the pandemic level), I don't see anything very unique or anything that hasn't become a part of the overall response at this time. Dont be a loser man. Im not calling you one btw, but if you really sit here and try to say that Biden was wrong too or that his plan wouldnt have been helpful then I really dont have to. People like to talk about not being a sheep all the time. This one is as obvious as it gets, dude left hundreds of millions to die for no reason. There was no reason to be telling people not to wear a mask when he KNEW this **** could kill you through the air. There was NO reason to call it a hoax. Dont give me any of that bull****. You have the proof now. This is evolution and your brain talking. Dont be a ****ing sheep bro. You are smarter than to side with a man who tried to ****ing kill you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burgold Posted September 10, 2020 Share Posted September 10, 2020 6 hours ago, The Evil Genius said: At the very least, a competent president would have said in early February that the virus is real and it's potentially deadlier and more contagious than the flu. It's also airborne, so wear masks and isolate as much as possible. Also, I'm deferring to State Health Departments who will get guidance from us but will have the authority to enact health precautions that are tailored to their populations. Rather, Trump called it fake until April and still dismisses mask wearing and proper social distancing to this day. So yeah, it's a bit one-sided because that's exactly where the blame falls. Even if he did half of this and said, "It's airborne so wear masks, but we're Americans and we don't cower. We will keep working. We will keep fighting." It would have been better. The death toll would have been so much lower. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burgold Posted September 10, 2020 Share Posted September 10, 2020 7 hours ago, BraveWarrior said: I seem to remember Biden criticizing Trump's travel ban as "xenophobic" back then as well. I also remember Dems such as Pelosi, Cuomo and DiBlasio downplaying the threat even into March. I reviewed Biden's 5 point plan, and aside from test and trace (which is more effective in the early stages of a spread, and not so much at the pandemic level), I don't see anything very unique or anything that hasn't become a part of the overall response at this time. Not to pile on, but even Trump's China ban proved to be cosmetic and a hoax. After he imposed his "China ban" tens of thousands of Chinese freely came into the country. The thing was so full of loopholes as to be useless. The other obvious point was by the point the China ban was imposed the virus had already gone worldwide. So, blocking China was not going to do much if you didn't block Italy and pretty much every other country in the world. The metrics are pretty simple. The US did worse than pretty much every other nation in the world. We neutered our response ability and handcuffed experts and resources. We tried to ignore the problem away. We tried to lie the problem away. We tried to bully the problem away. It didn't work. If we did worse than every other nation in the world then we did something wrong. We did many things wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hail2skins Posted September 10, 2020 Share Posted September 10, 2020 7 hours ago, BraveWarrior said: Very interesting, if not very one-sided, discussion of the Covid response. Just wondering though, if we all agree Trump's response led to many needless deaths, and we all agree that's a bad thing, and if Biden says he has a Covid response plan that will save thousands of lives if he's elected, then how is it okay that Biden doesn't share his plan now? Think of all the people that may die under Trump's leadership that Biden could be saving between now and Election Day, and even more between now and his 1st day in office. "We all agree" might be "on this board." How many countless people out there still believe that covid is no big deal, that the number of people who have been recorded as dying from covid were "going to die anyway at some point?" And who thought that we shouldn't have done anything precautionary to combat this thing? I think the criticisms about Biden and other political leaders as referring to the China ban as xenophobic are fair game. Trump does deserve credit for the travel ban, and he really can't be directly blamed too much for the snafus at the CDC. But his public response was what was the most galling, to me. For a long time people have said "well, nobody knew how bad it was actually going to be." If that's the case, who were Fox News railing against in February when they were decrying "covid hysteria?" Someone was paying attention, whether it be Congressional folks like Murphy on the left or Cotton and Cheney on the right. As well, of course, of those jackasses who sold stock. But the problem is that we have a guy in charge who does absolutely nothing in general besides tweet and watch Fox News. Whatever Tucker/Sean/Laura/Lou say, he parrots, and vice versa. And after this started, his defenders say "Well, what about Obama and H1N1?" Again, according to Wiki, Obama in April 2009 "H1N1 is a cause for concern......it is not a cause for alarm." Where was something like that from this guy?? Last night I read that Frum thread that Evil Genius posted and it does really cut to the heart of the matter. What exactly did Trump think was going to happen? The ironic part is that if you listen to that snippet from the February interview, Woodward seems like the one that is being nonchalant about it ("people don't realize that tens of thousands die yearly from the flu") while Trump seems to be the one more level-headed ("yeah, but this thing is bad, Bob"). Again, hold your leaders accountable. If you don't think Biden and Pelosi's public responses were satisfactory, don't vote for them. But you can't honestly say that Trump's were either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Springfield Posted September 10, 2020 Share Posted September 10, 2020 Can you honestly sit back and say, that if Biden were president in January of 2020 and his plan were allowed to be put into action that things would have not been any better? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhead36 Posted September 10, 2020 Share Posted September 10, 2020 8 minutes ago, Springfield said: Can you honestly sit back and say, that if Biden were president in January of 2020 and his plan were allowed to be put into action that things would have not been any better? I can't imagine doing much worse than ~200k deaths. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LD0506 Posted September 10, 2020 Share Posted September 10, 2020 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burgold Posted September 10, 2020 Share Posted September 10, 2020 9 hours ago, The Evil Genius said: Tbf, Bob was in the room where it happened. Well, you didn’t waste your shot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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