Let's All Get Behind Alex Smith! Or Not!! (M.E.T.) NO kirk talk---that goes in ATN forum

[tmandoug1]

22 hours ago, HTTRDynasty said:

They're about to do a replay of the 2016 Chiefs vs. Falcons game on NFL Network in 15 minutes for those interested. 

How did he look?

 

[Skinsinparadise]

Everson Griffin just on NFL Network saying Kirk looked fantastic in camp.  It's meaningless hyperbole.  But just doubling down that I think both QBs will have a honeymoon phases.

 

But man what a difference as to what the national media and ex-player talking head types think of both teams.  Vikings Superbowl threat.  And as JP Finlay summarized well today on Dukes' show -- the theory of most seems to be this is the year that the Redskins bottom out -- the rug will be pulled out and the Redskins will regress back to being one of the bottom feeder teams of the NFL again.  It was funny I was just watching Nate Burleson do a mock W-L record for the Colts.  Game #2 -- Colts on the road against the Redskins -- so he goes yeah that's a win for the Colts.  Wow.  It's relentless and from all corners even the mock draft geek types doing their 2019 mocks are in on it. 

 

We got Jay in one survey as the 5th most likely coach to be fired -- 1st in the NFC.  A lot of doom and gloom with the prognosticators about the Redskins.  The converse for the Vikings.

 

I think that oddly favors Alex Smith the expectation game.  The national media, pundits, Vegas on and on are setting the bar so low -- its making the Redskins IMO the ultimate under the radar team.  The Vikings on the other hand on a Superbowl or bust quest.     

[Alexa]

With the Caps winning The Cup I have just totally gotten away from the Redskins and it's been quite refreshing. It's going to be weird having Smith under center for us. I guess I'm still just waiting to see how it works out. I just don't have expectations because part of the o-line still sucks which hurts our running game. The wr's are ok at best. And Reed isn't reliable. My gut tells me Smith hasn't been put in the best of positions to be successful. We will just have to see. But if this doesn't work there will be a lot of heads rolling over at Redskin Park. 

[bh32]

8 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

Everson Griffin just on NFL Network saying Kirk looked fantastic in camp.  It's meaningless hyperbole.  But just doubling down that I think both QBs will have a honeymoon phases.

 

But man what a difference as to what the national media and ex-player talking head types think of both teams.  Vikings Superbowl threat.  And as JP Finlay summarized well today on Dukes' show -- the theory of most seems to be this is the year that the Redskins bottom out -- the rug will be pulled out and the Redskins will regress back to being one of the bottom feeder teams of the NFL again.  It was funny I was just watching Nate Burleson do a mock W-L record for the Colts.  Game #2 -- Colts on the road against the Redskins -- so he goes yeah that's a win for the Colts.  Wow.  It's relentless and from all corners even the mock draft geek types doing their 2019 mocks are in on it. 

 

We got Jay in one survey as the 5th most likely coach to be fired -- 1st in the NFC.  A lot of doom and gloom with the prognosticators about the Redskins.  The converse for the Vikings.

 

I think that oddly favors Alex Smith the expectation game.  The national media, pundits, Vegas on and on are setting the bar so low -- its making the Redskins IMO the ultimate under the radar team.  The Vikings on the other hand on a Superbowl or bust quest.     

There is no way the Redskins are a bottom feeder team this year..They would have to have catastrophic injuries for that to happen..

[zoony]

16 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

Everson Griffin just on NFL Network saying Kirk looked fantastic in camp.  It's meaningless hyperbole.  But just doubling down that I think both QBs will have a honeymoon phases.

 

But man what a difference as to what the national media and ex-player talking head types think of both teams.  Vikings Superbowl threat.  And as JP Finlay summarized well today on Dukes' show -- the theory of most seems to be this is the year that the Redskins bottom out -- the rug will be pulled out and the Redskins will regress back to being one of the bottom feeder teams of the NFL again.  It was funny I was just watching Nate Burleson do a mock W-L record for the Colts.  Game #2 -- Colts on the road against the Redskins -- so he goes yeah that's a win for the Colts.  Wow.  It's relentless and from all corners even the mock draft geek types doing their 2019 mocks are in on it. 

 

We got Jay in one survey as the 5th most likely coach to be fired -- 1st in the NFC.  A lot of doom and gloom with the prognosticators about the Redskins.  The converse for the Vikings.

 

I think that oddly favors Alex Smith the expectation game.  The national media, pundits, Vegas on and on are setting the bar so low -- its making the Redskins IMO the ultimate under the radar team.  The Vikings on the other hand on a Superbowl or bust quest.     

 

I actually think this roster is pretty decent.  A lot of wild cards lile how will smith adjust and imjuries, of course.  But i think this is an upper 1/3 team when healthy.  Injuries can change that quickly, and given this teams history, it most likely will

[Skinsinparadise]

23 minutes ago, zoony said:

 

I actually think this roster is pretty decent.  A lot of wild cards lile how will smith adjust and imjuries, of course.  But i think this is an upper 1/3 team when healthy.  Injuries can change that quickly, and given this teams history, it most likely will

 

Agree.  I made the same point earlier.  Health is the key.  I don't get all the doom and gloom prognosticators but its hard to miss they are ajust about everywhere in every stripe you can think of.

 

For me its about 3 things.  1. Jordan Reed being healthy.  2. O line health.  3. Guice is the stud player I think he will be.  If that happens I think they go 10-6.  

[Skinsinparadise]

38 minutes ago, bh32 said:

There is no way the Redskins are a bottom feeder team this year..They would have to have catastrophic injuries for that to happen..

 

Agree.  Not saying otherwise.  I was commenting that JP Finlay summed it up well for me today about all the doom and gloom saying much of the national media thinks this is the season that the Redskins bottom out.   

 

I disagree with all of that but its pretty wild to see how relentless it is from so many fronts.  I think TD Washington summed it up well in his post -- its just the national media types being lazy because they've been vindicated in the past at times by going to a default negative position in the past.

 

 

[joeken24]

So Alex Smith does not make the top 100 but Case Keenum and #8 does. That is total bull****.

 

Hey! but its the players voting, so I can't hate. But still.....

 

I wonder if this is new thread worthy?

[TSO]

1 hour ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Agree.  I made the same point earlier.  Health is the key.  I don't get all the doom and gloom prognosticators but its hard to miss they are ajust about everywhere in every stripe you can think of.

 

For me its about 3 things.  1. Jordan Reed being healthy.  2. O line health.  3. Guice is the stud player I think he will be.  If that happens I think they go 10-6.  

 

Agree with this list, but I’d probably add to it the Dline fulfilling its potential. 

[HTTRDynasty]

6 hours ago, tmandoug1 said:

How did he look?

 

 

I recorded it. Haven’t watched it yet. 

[Wyvern]

9 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

...

For me its about 3 things.  1. Jordan Reed being healthy.  2. O line health.  3. Guice is the stud player I think he will be.  If that happens I think they go 10-6.  

I'd suggest a 4th 'thing.'

 

 4.  That either Doctson or Richardson pan out as a reliable (and healthy!) WR deep threat, that can punish defenses for routinely stacking the box. 

[skinsmania123]

10 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Agree.  I made the same point earlier.  Health is the key.  I don't get all the doom and gloom prognosticators but its hard to miss they are ajust about everywhere in every stripe you can think of.

 

For me its about 3 things.  1. Jordan Reed being healthy.  2. O line health.  3. Guice is the stud player I think he will be.  If that happens I think they go 10-6.  

I agree with points 2 and 3. But the biggest factor for me is our D up front. If our D gets consistent pressure up front,  our secondary doesn't get torched. Our secondary remains a concern for me.

 

Our offense, with or without Reed, simply has more depth this year, something we have lacked for years along with the no "plug" upfront on our D line, which  allowed teams to run the hell all over our D.

 

On O we have a burner in Richardson, a guy who can really stretch the field, who similar to Doctson, had unhealthy years and was healthy last year. Doctson, now healthy and comfortable, Smith is not going to have concerns throwing to him because he is healthy this year.  Last year was like....ahhhhh, the rookie and you saw that.   Last year Crowder was not as good but that was an anomaly.  I am excited about Harris, and our Mr. Irrelevant pick. and look forward to seeing both in the preseason.   I think we have some stud receivers.  With Reed, we can be dynamic, but I think we are pretty stacked on the O right now.  

 

 With Smith's experience in being with so many teams, he is going read the coverages easily and get rid of the ball quickly.  I mean Thompson and Guice, let loose, with a few quick releases...wow!  I mean that in itself opens things up for Richardson and Doctson.

 

We stay healthy and we are competing with everyone because of the depth across the board on the roster.

[NoCalMike]

National media never seems to take a pro-active positive take on this franchise.  They are too inconsistent, and also they are in a division where the other three teams always seem to manage to bounce back from bad seasons. (More so in the case of NYG/Philly than Dallas, but lately Dallas has at least maintained being middle of the pack).  The 'Skins on the other hand seem to mix in a single winning season among mediocrity.   

 

Now, from a roster perspective.  Whether the QB was Cousins or now Smith, I don't see how anyone could claim it isn't a better roster than last season.

[TD_washingtonredskins]

10 minutes ago, NoCalMike said:

Now, from a roster perspective.  Whether the QB was Cousins or now Smith, I don't see how anyone could claim it isn't a better roster than last season.

 

That's why I classify the national analysis as lazy...but I also understand it. 

 

Last year we finished with 7 wins despite being decimated by injuries and playing a very tough schedule (not sure how tough it ended up because we played some bad teams in the final quarter of the season, but it was THE TOUGHEST as of week 10-11). 

 

We've added talent to our two biggest weaknesses (front 7 and running game). We've retained some of the bright spots from last year by keeping our ILBs together. We made, what many in the national media believe is, a lateral move at QB so we shouldn't necessarily expect to go from 4,000 to 3,000 passing yards. 

 

It makes no sense to look at the Redskins and suddenly expect them to win 3 fewer games. Could I see us going 6-10? I don't expect it, but sure. Could I see us truly being a top-5 pick next April? I really don't. Put it this way...assuming our 80/20 Bell Curve has us most likely to finish somewhere between 6-10 and 10-6...I think it's more likely we finish with 11 wins than it is we finish with 11 losses. 

[goskins10]

54 minutes ago, TD_washingtonredskins said:

 

That's why I classify the national analysis as lazy...but I also understand it. 

 

Last year we finished with 7 wins despite being decimated by injuries and playing a very tough schedule (not sure how tough it ended up because we played some bad teams in the final quarter of the season, but it was THE TOUGHEST as of week 10-11). 

 

We've added talent to our two biggest weaknesses (front 7 and running game). We've retained some of the bright spots from last year by keeping our ILBs together. We made, what many in the national media believe is, a lateral move at QB so we shouldn't necessarily expect to go from 4,000 to 3,000 passing yards. 

 

It makes no sense to look at the Redskins and suddenly expect them to win 3 fewer games. Could I see us going 6-10? I don't expect it, but sure. Could I see us truly being a top-5 pick next April? I really don't. Put it this way...assuming our 80/20 Bell Curve has us most likely to finish somewhere between 6-10 and 10-6...I think it's more likely we finish with 11 wins than it is we finish with 11 losses. 

 

A couple of different measures here. Straight SOS based on opposition winning % - 5th at 0.539

 

Football Outsiders also compiles the rankings against for both offense and defense. 

Offense played against the 8 toughest defensive schedule
Defense played against the 4 toughest defensive schedule

 

The schedule is what it is. And some of the rating is due to playing us. Having said that, when you combine the crazy number injuries (309 starter games lost due to injury!) it's not a huge stretch to project the redskins as at least being equal if not somewhat better. 

 

The problem is they are all on the NYG hype machine, the Eagles just won the SB and they can't ever count dallast out because they provide too many ratings. So I am pretty sure we being considered last mostly out of someone has to be last. And i can see that argument. Where they lose me is when they say we will be really bad. I could understand them saying the East is going to be a tough division and out of those 4 the redskins look the least talented and someone has to be last. I do not agree with them, but I can seethe argument. 

 

But what they seem to be saying is that we are just bad - period. We will see. I like this roster more than any in recent memory (the last say 10+ yrs). 

 

I will say this - I believe anything less than a winning record and there will likely be a complete clean house implemented. But I really do not see that happening. I may be falling to my typical off season optimism, but I like our chances to be at least competitive if not make a solid run. 

 

 

[TD_washingtonredskins]

2 minutes ago, goskins10 said:

 

The problem is they are all on the NYG hype machine, the Eagles just won the SB and they can't ever count dallast out because they provide too many ratings. So I am pretty sure we being considered last mostly out of someone has to be last. And i can see that argument. Where they lose me is when they say we will be really bad. I could understand them saying the East is going to be a tough division and out of those 4 the redskins look the least talented and someone has to be last. I do not agree with them, but I can seethe argument. 

 

But what they seem to be saying is that we are just bad - period. We will see. I like this roster more than any in recent memory (the last say 10+ yrs). 

 

I will say this - I believe anything less than a winning record and there will likely be a complete clean house implemented. But I really do not see that happening. I may be falling to my typical off season optimism, but I like our chances to be at least competitive if not make a solid run. 

 

 

 

Exactly...that's what confuses me. If they said "The Redskins are OK, but it'll be tough to find more than one win in the divisional schedule" then I could buy that. Like you, I don't necessarily agree, but we've validated that line of thinking so many times over the past two decades that I couldn't blame them for using it. 

[skinny21]

There’s a lot to like about this roster.  

 

We have a pretty good group of:

 

Talented vets - Williams, Scherff, Kerrigan, Norman, Alex and Preston Smith, Brown, Thompson, Reed, Crowder, Moses, Swearinger 

 

Fairly solid vets - Dunbar, McGee, McPhee, Foster, Davis

 

Young guys that have flashed legitimate talent - Nicholson, Allen, Ioannidas, Doctson, Roullier

 

Young guys that could/should make a difference - Payne, Guice, Moreau, and maybe Anderson/Quinn/Settle

 

There are quite a few guys I didn’t slot into those categories, but I’m looking forward to seeing - JHC, SDH, Robert Davis and Harris, Holsey and Stroman, Kalis and Catalina, etc.

 

 

Maybe you break it down a bit differently, but my overarching point is that we have a good amount of talent in every unit and it’s a good mix of veterans and youth.  The potential (this time around) isn’t focused on guys that are longshots - either players that we hope will outperform their draft stock or older ones that we hope will produce as they did when younger and healthier.  What I’m saying is that the potential is reasonable, not a case of, “who knows, maybe we get lucky here”.  

 

With that all said, I have some concerns that will nag at me until proven otherwise.  Our LG and slot corner positions, our run game struggles (on both sides of the ball), our receivers aren’t proven really, and of course, health.  

 

As others have said, I don’t see this as a bottom feeder type of roster by a long shot, but I think we’ll need some (positive) answers to the above questions if we want a good season.  

[Tarpon75]

16 hours ago, zoony said:

 

I actually think this roster is pretty decent.There is a good mix of expand youth.A lot of wild cards lile how will smith adjust and imjuries, of course.  But i think this is an upper 1/3 team when healthy.  Injuries can change that quickly, and given this teams history, it most likely will

 I think it is the best roster that has been in Washington in a long time. There is a very good mix of experience and youth,as well as a good amount of depth. I also believe that Gruden and his staff will provide continuity. I just  don’t know if they can beat the injury thing that has plagued this team for some time. I know every team has injuries but not many teams,if any, deal with them to this extent season after season. The schedule isn’t very favourable either,don’t care for the early by week.Conversely,the  Eagles have their bye week nine and don’t play a  division game until week 10 coming off their bye. I believe if the Skins can stay relatively healthy they can win 9 or 10 games.

[veteranskinsfan]

Injuries were awful last year for our team.  Alex Smith is going to have to play well for us to be better than 8-8 this year.  I want to see how Cousins does against the Eagles in game 1 of this season.  Also our defense has to be much better for us to do well this year.

[TD_washingtonredskins]

22 minutes ago, veteranskinsfan said:

Injuries were awful last year for our team.  Alex Smith is going to have to play well for us to be better than 8-8 this year.  I want to see how Cousins does against the Eagles in game 1 of this season.  Also our defense has to be much better for us to do well this year.

 

Injuries were bad, but you mentioned a team that sustained some big injuries and won the Super Bowl. So, even though we should do better with more health, it demonstrates how far we were from being good enough to mitigate those injuries. 

[HTTRDynasty]

1 hour ago, veteranskinsfan said:

 I want to see how Cousins does against the Eagles in game 1 of this season.

 

Vikings play the 9ers Week 1, which should be interesting because the Shanahans always seemed to do well Week 1. 

 

Eagles play the Falcons. 

[TD_washingtonredskins]

23 minutes ago, HTTRDynasty said:

 

Vikings play the 9ers Week 1, which should be interesting because the Shanahans always seemed to do well Week 1. 

 

Eagles play the Falcons. 

Kyle will lay down for Kirk...the love runs too deep. 

[MisterPinstripe]

21 hours ago, TD_washingtonredskins said:

 

Injuries were bad, but you mentioned a team that sustained some big injuries and won the Super Bowl. So, even though we should do better with more health, it demonstrates how far we were from being good enough to mitigate those injuries. 

We had a lot more injuries than the Eagles and over the whole season. Eagles lost Wentz which was big but Foles had a bunch of good games through the playoffs. You can't compare the two. Eagles losing a player like Wentz is a lot to overcome, but I guarantee you if they lost all of the players we did and kept Wentz they don't win the super bowl.

[Skinsinparadise]

23 hours ago, goskins10 said:

 

 

The problem is they are all on the NYG hype machine, the Eagles just won the SB and they can't ever count dallast out because they provide too many ratings. So I am pretty sure we being considered last mostly out of someone has to be last. And i can see that argument. Where they lose me is when they say we will be really bad. I could understand them saying the East is going to be a tough division and out of those 4 the redskins look the least talented and someone has to be last. I do not agree with them, but I can seethe argument. 

 

Yeah of I had to think of the underpinning of this marrying different arguments I see and read.  This seems to be the gist of the national guys.

 

1. Eagles -- Superbowl champs, the most loaded roster.  Hands down. 

2. Cowboys -- Dak on the rebound.  Elliot back for a full season.  The season before they were great.  They got the best O line, etc. 

3.  Giants -- the Giants don't mess around when they come off a bad season.  They get very aggressive and turn it around fast and aren't shy about using FA.  They did it in 2016. They will do it again.  Beckham and Barkley = excitement.

4.  Redskins -- Depending on the source, Redskins ho hum off season will keep them mediocre or they are bound to find their way back to a bottom level team.  Some additions, some subtractions, no sex appeal, boring team, boring off season -- yawn -- at best mediocre.

 

There is major dichotomy from the local talking heads (local being more upbeat) and national ones.  To most of the national ones (with some vocal exceptions on either side of the argument), Alex is a lateral move.  Jordan Reed is still injury prone. Da'Ron Payne is sort of a mixed bag with draft geeks -- some liking it, some not liking it, few loving it -- so its not like the buzz for Jonathan Allen.  Guice getting a lot of local buzz but almost no national buzz, yet.  Whereas you'd think the Giants drafting Barkley amidst their other moves just secured a Super Bowl for them.  Barkley is like the Andrew Luck of RBs -- in theory perfect, headed straight to the Hall of Fame.   It's nauseating.    I typically help lead the NY Giants hate in the week leading up to that game -- this year it would be double for me. 

 

[wit33]

 

 

Excited to see what Jay brings out in Smith. It appears they align personality wise very well. I like the idea of both having a lot to prove and a chip on their respective shoulders moving forward. The previous statement it would seem is true, but both appear to have tremendous self perceived value and have great life balance/perspective (Yes, I don’t believe Kirk had this and was incredibly insecure). 

 

These factors will hopefully make a difference in and off the field for the entire team.