TD_washingtonredskins Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 (edited) I keep seeing posts like this: https://twitter.com/mixtapeminimus1/status/1349058790587465729/photo/1 I have to ask...do we have any indication that these fools thought that they were going to overtake and occupy the Capitol? Hold hostages? To me it seemed more like a bunch of idiots who got in there and then didn't really have any idea what to do. I'm not defending anyone...just saying that I think the collective "we" are taking a lot of liberties and assigning some pretty serious motives to what the plan was. Edited January 12, 2021 by TD_washingtonredskins Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riggo-toni Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 33 minutes ago, Barry.Randolphe said: crazy woman on CNN right now just interrupted Schumer's speech and said she got sexually excited the terrorists stormed the Capitol Why can't Michelle Bachmann just go away... 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LadySkinsFan Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 Just now, TD_washingtonredskins said: I keep seeing posts like this: https://twitter.com/mixtapeminimus1/status/1349058790587465729/photo/1 I have to ask...do we have any indication that these fools thought that they were going to overtake and occupy the Capitol? Hold hostages? To me it seemed more like a bunch of idiots who got in there and then didn't really have any idea what to do. I'm not defending anyone...just saying that I think the collective "we" are taking a lot of liberties and assigning some pretty serious motives to what the plan was. Some of them knew what they were doing. Don't buy into that "as shucks, we just wanted to enter the building and walk around' nonsense. Rep. Boebert actually tweeted Pelosi's whereabouts. Punish all of the Insurgents! That should be the message. 3 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BatteredFanSyndrome Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 2 minutes ago, TD_washingtonredskins said: I'm not defending anyone...just saying that I think the collective "we" are taking a lot of liberties and assigning some pretty serious motives to what the plan was. Do you not see the zip ties, weapons, tactical gear in the photos? Or the explosives that were found? Sure, a large portion of these goobers are just followers that have no idea what they were doing. But I think it’s abundantly clear there were folks present with very, very bad intentions. 4 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry.Randolphe Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 and don't forget the QAnon factor....the people at the forefront of the lines were wearing QAnon ****. They were calling for holding congress people hostage 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCS Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 Let's not forget reports from Capitol Police saying there were people with two way radios,ear pieces,flash bangs ect.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fergasun Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 Half the country think they are fighting against the rise of Hitler. Half the country think they need are fighting against the rise of Stalin. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hooper Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 Who cares if a lot of these people didn't think they were doing anything wrong and that they weren't being violent? They still 100 percent participated in the storming of the Capitol! They must be punished. Every. Single. One. 6 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tshile Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 43 minutes ago, TD_washingtonredskins said: I keep seeing posts like this: https://twitter.com/mixtapeminimus1/status/1349058790587465729/photo/1 I have to ask...do we have any indication that these fools thought that they were going to overtake and occupy the Capitol? Hold hostages? To me it seemed more like a bunch of idiots who got in there and then didn't really have any idea what to do. I'm not defending anyone...just saying that I think the collective "we" are taking a lot of liberties and assigning some pretty serious motives to what the plan was. its not that your point doesn’t have merit. it’s that at some point games stop being games. and for the most part... for me... that point was Wednesday. for me, our ability and need to keep our country safe (both on a day to day basis, and the long term view of protecting our democracy) supersedes worrying about what moral obligation I have to sift through it all to figure out who was really there to “overthrow the government” and who was the “barking dog that caught the car and didn’t know what to do with it”. From time to time, since Wednesday, ive found myself worrying about us overreacting. I’ve made a few posts about it in various threads. Had small/short discussions with other posters about it. but 95% of me feels as I outlined above. At some point you’re responsible for your actions. Being ignorant isn’t an excuse. And while saying “I didn’t mean it” can be used at sentencing, I think the right thing to do is prosecute them like they meant it and let a judge and jury of their peers decided how much “I didn’t mean it” matters in this case. and the other thing I have to keep reminding myself of - a better thought out plan, consisting of more people that *actually wanted to overthrow the government*, would have found themselves easily entering the Capitol at a time when the entire succession to the presidency was inside the Capitol. as much as this looks like a “riot gone too far by a small group of terrorists and a large group of stupid people” it also looks like “a very clever coup attempt that almost worked and left the people responsible with plausible deniability that will save them” 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redskinss Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 13 minutes ago, Fergasun said: Half the country think they are fighting against the rise of Hitler. Half the country think they need are fighting against the rise of Stalin. Mission accomplished 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fergasun Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 Iran, Al Qaeda, etc. could easily have embedded themselves in with the right wing mob. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bcl05 Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 They literally chanted "Hang Mike Pence" and brought a gallows. They brought bombs. They brought zip ties. They killed a cop. Anyone arguing that they didn't have a plan and a purpose (no matter how outrageous or deranged), isn't paying attention. 5 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spaceman Spiff Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 55 minutes ago, TD_washingtonredskins said: I keep seeing posts like this: https://twitter.com/mixtapeminimus1/status/1349058790587465729/photo/1 I have to ask...do we have any indication that these fools thought that they were going to overtake and occupy the Capitol? Hold hostages? To me it seemed more like a bunch of idiots who got in there and then didn't really have any idea what to do. I'm not defending anyone...just saying that I think the collective "we" are taking a lot of liberties and assigning some pretty serious motives to what the plan was. I think some got caught up in the moment and decided to march in there and make asses out of themselves. But I think quite a few of them, like zip tie guy, knew exactly what they were there to do. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tshile Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 2 minutes ago, bcl05 said: They literally chanted "Hang Mike Pence" and brought a gallows. They brought bombs. They brought zip ties. They killed a cop. Anyone arguing that they didn't have a plan and a purpose (no matter how outrageous or deranged), isn't paying attention. the idea of seeing pence strung up and pelosi on her knees zip tied on the steps... it wasn’t that far away from being a reality. and “they didn’t real mean it” just doesn’t seem like a compelling argument at the moment. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 1 hour ago, TD_washingtonredskins said: I have to ask...do we have any indication that these fools thought that they were going to overtake and occupy the Capitol? Hold hostages? To me it seemed more like a bunch of idiots who got in there and then didn't really have any idea what to do. They brought zip ties in case they wanted to restrain themselves before surrendering? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cooked Crack Posted January 12, 2021 Author Share Posted January 12, 2021 Sounds about right 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JCB Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 1 hour ago, Riggo-toni said: Why can't Michelle Bachmann just go away... We lost taser-balls but we'll never lose this: 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spjunkies Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD_washingtonredskins Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 17 minutes ago, Hooper said: Who cares if a lot of these people didn't think they were doing anything wrong and that they weren't being violent? They still 100 percent participated in the storming of the Capitol! They must be punished. Every. Single. One. I'm not saying we shouldn't punish anyone - it's a crime just to break into the Capitol. I just didn't realize that it's known that the goal was to occupy the building and take hostages. Obviously that's horrifying. 6 minutes ago, tshile said: its not that your point doesn’t have merit. it’s that at some point games stop being games. and for the most part... for me... that point was Wednesday. for me, our ability and need to keep our country safe (both on a day to day basis, and the long term view of protecting our democracy) supersedes worrying about what moral obligation I have to sift through it all to figure out who was really there to “overthrow the government” and who was the “barking dog that caught the car and didn’t know what to do with it”. From time to time, since Wednesday, ive found myself worrying about us overreacting. I’ve made a few posts about it in various threads. Had small/short discussions with other posters about it. but 95% of me feels as I outlined above. At some point you’re responsible for your actions. Being ignorant isn’t an excuse. And while saying “I didn’t mean it” can be used at sentencing, I think the right thing to do is prosecute them like they meant it and let a judge and jury of their peers decided how much “I didn’t mean it” matters in this case. and the other thing I have to keep reminding myself of - a better thought out plan, consisting of more people that *actually wanted to overthrow the government*, would have found themselves easily entering the Capitol at a time when the entire succession to the presidency was inside the Capitol. as much as this looks like a “riot gone too far by a small group of terrorists and a large group of stupid people” it also looks like “a very clever coup attempt that almost worked and left the people responsible with plausible deniability that will save them” And I'm not even trying to defend anyone. Each person needs to be held accountable for whatever he or she did. I'm simply saying that it's a very serious accusation to state that the goal was to harm or take Senators hostage. 7 minutes ago, Spaceman Spiff said: I think some got caught up in the moment and decided to march in there and make asses out of themselves. But I think quite a few of them, like zip tie guy, knew exactly what they were there to do. That's fair and I'm sure plenty of them had some bad intentions...it's just the first I had heard that the belief was that there was a coordinated goal to take hostages, take control of the building, and/or demand that Trump stay in power before they left. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cooked Crack Posted January 12, 2021 Author Share Posted January 12, 2021 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BatteredFanSyndrome Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 4 minutes ago, TD_washingtonredskins said: And I'm not even trying to defend anyone. Each person needs to be held accountable for whatever he or she did. I'm simply saying that it's a very serious accusation to state that the goal was to harm or take Senators hostage. It's not really an accusation when folks are on tape, in writing, or as seen above - left voicemails, saying that's exactly what they intended to do. I get that a lot of these folks can barely tie their own shoes, making their goals lofty, and mostly fantasy. But with the help of some capitol police and the powers that be, they were very close to making it reality. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD_washingtonredskins Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 7 minutes ago, Larry said: They brought zip ties in case they wanted to restrain themselves before surrendering? But if I marched in the BLM protests this summer and brought handcuffs or zip ties, does that mean the entire movement was coordinated to capture Donald Trump? I'm simply saying that I think this was a couple individuals who had strange ideas, not the majority of the people there. But I understand that anyone trying to play Devil's Advocate is likely to be labeled a white supremist sympathizer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tshile Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 (edited) 8 minutes ago, TD_washingtonredskins said: And I'm not even trying to defend anyone. Each person needs to be held accountable for whatever he or she did. I'm simply saying that it's a very serious accusation to state that the goal was to harm or take Senators hostage. I’m with you. it wasnt everyone’s goal. It was some’s. And for the ones it wasn’t, at a minimum they were enablers. it’s... it’s interesting times. Edited January 12, 2021 by tshile 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BatteredFanSyndrome Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 1 minute ago, TD_washingtonredskins said: But if I marched in the BLM protests this summer and brought handcuffs or zip ties, does that mean the entire movement was coordinated to capture Donald Trump? I'm simply saying that I think this was a couple individuals who had strange ideas, not the majority of the people there. But I understand that anyone trying to play Devil's Advocate is likely to be labeled a white supremist sympathizer. Did BLM storm the White House? 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TradeTheBeal! Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 Just a reminder that “whataboutism” was literally invented by the KGB to derail the UN Security Council after WW2. It is the ultimate bad faith arguing point. And on a personal note, it’s absolutely ****ing pathetic. 6 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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