Rookie QB or Veteran QB for "Next Season"??? (I didn't bump this, but I ended up being wrong anyway....)

[skinny21]

2 1sts

1 3rd (our eventual comp pick for Scherff)

Settle and Moses 

 

[Bifflog]

No ****ing thanks.

 

I'm flabbergasted anyone thinks two 1's are still in play.

Edited May 19, 2021 by Bifflog

[Burgundy Yoda]

Matt Lombardo clearly doesn't have any inside information on this team and is talking out of his ass.

 

I also don't think Rivera would be against bringing in Deshaun Watson at all if he's somehow found not guilty. This whole culture thing is more about finding the right players for the locker room than anything IMO. This is a guy who, if we're being honest, kind of brushed aside the huge scandal that the team was involved in and seems to have an admiration for one of the scummiest owners in the league. Rivera is definitely capable of turning a blind eye. 

Edited May 19, 2021 by Burgundy Yoda

[RWJ]

2 minutes ago, Burgundy Yoda said:

Matt Lombardo clearly doesn't have any inside information on this team and is talking out of his ass.

 

I also don't think Rivera would be against bringing in Deshaun Watson at all if he's somehow found not guilty. This whole culture thing is more about finding the right players for the locker room than anything. This is a guy who, if we're being honest, kind of brushed aside the huge scandal that the team was involved in and seems to have an admiration for one of the scummiest owners in the league. Rivera is definitely capable of turning a blind eye. 

Part about Matt I agree with.  We have our starting QB on the roster.  

[Bifflog]

11 minutes ago, Burgundy Yoda said:

I also don't think Rivera would be against bringing in Deshaun Watson at all if he's somehow found not guilty. This whole culture thing is more about finding the right players for the locker room than anything IMO. This is a guy who, if we're being honest, kind of brushed aside the huge scandal that the team was involved in and seems to have an admiration for one of the scummiest owners in the league. Rivera is definitely capable of turning a blind eye. 

 

Dunno about this, he's barely retained anyone from the previous regime(s), I'm not sure what else he was supposed to do in light of said scandal besides, I guess, quit?  He can't control his boss (other than I guess he could have never signed a contract here), but he can control the people that work under him. 

[Burgundy Yoda]

42 minutes ago, Bifflog said:

 

Dunno about this, he's barely retained anyone from the previous regime(s), I'm not sure what else he was supposed to do in light of said scandal besides, I guess, quit?  He can't control his boss (other than I guess he could have never signed a contract here), but he can control the people that work under him. 

There's a wide gap between quitting and how I thought Rivera handled that. Anyways, it's all water under the bridge now, my point is, it seems silly to rule out a Watson trade if he's found not guilty. I would never underestimate a coach's desire to win, especially with how difficult it is to find a star QB in the NFL these days. 

[TheGreek1973]

5 hours ago, Burgundy Yoda said:

https://fansided.com/2021/05/19/nfl-executives-project-potential-deshaun-watson-trade/

 

This article suggests we do this trade for Deshaun Watson:

2022 First Rounder

2023 First Rounder

Montez Sweat

Terry McLaurin

 

😂

why not also throw Chase while you at it.  LOL

[Warhead36]

laugh and hang up the phone

[COWBOY-KILLA-]

11 hours ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

While the price will be less, there is still risk involved.  If anything, it's rather clear that Watson has a problem.  Perhaps it's not to the extent the allegations make it out to be, but a problem none the less.  What is to say those issues don't follow him to DC, and we are marred in drama, and out several premium draft picks and a $40M/yr salary to boot?

 

I get it - I'd love to have his play on the field, as it would be unlike anything we've known since pretty much ever.  But personally, I'm a bit apprehensive on who he is after reading into all these lawsuits and the consistencies among them.  I'd imagine Ron would feel the same.

I understand all the pros and cons and absolutely agree there is risk and depending how it shakes out, a big risk. Apprehensive? Yes. But it doesn’t mean I wouldn’t look under every rock and investigate it myself and then decide. I’d imagine Ron will assess it in detail. And go from there. I’m fine if he chooses to pass.  I'd imagine if the city attorney's decide he won't be charged criminally and this ends at the settlement, we'd seriously consider making a move.  I could also be totally wrong, I'm really just talking for myself, I'd seriously consider trading for him. Like, the bad PR wouldn't stop me, only the criminal or continued litigation would. 

 

Edited May 20, 2021 by COWBOY-KILLA-

[Anselmheifer]

6 hours ago, Bifflog said:

 

I'm flabbergasted anyone thinks two 1's are still in play.

 

Two 1sts for a 25 yo top 5 QB in the league? He has HOF potential. Three 1sts are in play. Minimum. Just not necessarily from us. 

[LetMeSeeYourWarFace21]

8 hours ago, Bifflog said:

No ****ing thanks.

 

I'm flabbergasted anyone thinks two 1's are still in play.

 

 

IDGAF about them 1st Round pix....**** it, give em 3. We get Deshawn, those would be low pix. Its not the pix, but the players we would possibly have to give up that scares me. Before I wouldve gave ANYONE on the roster if thats what it took. But now, Id give up anyone but Young or McLaurin.....If a deal can be done, DO IT..............This franchise has been trash for too long.....last season included.....ELITE QBs under 27 dont grow on trees. Get er done........

Edited May 20, 2021 by LetMeSeeYourWarFace21

[Skinsinparadise]

PFF ranks the QBs

 

11. MATTHEW STAFFORD, LOS ANGELES RAMS

Sean McVay must be the happiest coach of the offseason. He can finally dial up the deep passing game he's probably always dreamt of. The addition of Matthew Stafford makes this offense that much more dangerous.

Stafford offers the same steady stream of passing on intermediate-level throws, but he will excel on passing plays of 20 or more yards downfield. But let’s not take for granted what Tom Brady accomplished in a first-year offense; it does take some time to get new terminology down. That will be the biggest hurdle for Stafford, but if the transition is smooth, the Rams could be taking another trip to the Super Bowl.

12. RYAN TANNEHILL, TENNESSEE TITANS

Tannehill has been spectacular thus far in Tennessee, so it’s hard not to acknowledge his recent play. He is viewed as a very good NFL starter now, but the departure of offensive coordinator Arthur Smith may impact his progression going forward.

He is certainly a product of an offensive scheme that gave him the second-most non-RPO play-action pass attempts in the 2020 regular season, but he still grades at a very good or borderline elite level on straight dropbacks, as well. Tannehill has also done a great job utilizing his legs in key situations, which makes it hard on defenses on third downs when he takes off. With his athletic ability and consistency as a Titan, Tannehill can be counted on to continue playing at a high level.

13. DEREK CARR, LAS VEGAS RAIDERS

Derek Carr finished 2020 with the eighth-best PFF passing grade and more than doubled his big-time throws from the previous season. He also engineered the only meaningful loss the Chiefs experienced during the regular season. Carr and the Raiders finished that game with 265 yards on six explosive (15-plus yard) pass plays.

That being said: Why are there still lingering questions every offseason about Carr and his future with the Raiders? He continues to prove himself as a pure passer from the pocket and also showed the ability to be more aggressive downfield, but the game is changing. There comes a time when a QB must tuck it and run for a first down or make a play in a key situation. Sometimes Carr gets careless with the football in the pocket, and he's prone to sack fumbles. Carr has yet to get the Raiders over the hump, and they are not a contender in the playoff picture.

14. KIRK COUSINS, MINNESOTA VIKINGS

Cousins operates very well when the conditions around him are good. The Vikings hit on replacing Stefon Diggs with Justin Jefferson in the draft, and they have a top-five rushing attack and a great offensive scheme that fits what Cousins excels at.

Minnesota has to clean up its offensive line play, though. The unit ranked 29th in combined pass-blocking grade in 2020. One of these years, Cousins will fulfill the prophecy and be the most unlikely NFL MVP of all time, but last year wasn’t that year. The clock is ticking to make that happen. With the addition of Kellen Mond, the pressure rises, forcing Cousins to find a way to get the Vikings back to the playoffs.

15. JUSTIN HERBERT, LOS ANGELES CHARGERS

Herbert exploded onto the scene in 2020, setting the rookie touchdown record. He was the king of high-variance and high-leverage situations, producing a better passer rating when hurried than he did when kept clean. This is a concern because Herbert will have more opportunities to execute from a clean pocket rather than always under pressure, especially with what the Chargers did this offseason to help build up their offensive line.

Herbert did more than impress during his rookie campaign, but the consistency with his accuracy is going to be the big question mark going forward. Will we see a slump in Year 2, or will Herbert continue to make big plays with more protection upfront?

 

16. BEN ROETHLISBERGER, PITTSBURGH STEELERS

Ben Roethlisberger proved his toughness by coming back at 38 years old after elbow surgery and helping the Steelers to an 11-0 start. But something just didn’t seem right during that hot streak, and Pittsburgh finished the year 1-5 in its last six games.

New offensive coordinator Matt Canada has a tall task in trying to figure out what will make this offense tick. Roethlisberger ranked last out of 36 qualifying quarterbacks on play-action attempts last season. He subsequently led the league in shotgun pass attempts (640) and pass attempts under 10 yards. He did a decent job of getting the ball out of his hand quickly, but it didn’t translate into many explosive plays, as the Steelers ranked 26th in explosive pass-play percentage (11.7%).

17. KYLER MURRAY, ARIZONA CARDINALS

Murray took a nice step forward in Year 2, raising his passing grade by over 16 points and adding 822 yards on the ground. The Cardinals did well to utilize his skill set, as his rushing stats were a mix of designed quarterback runs and scrambles.

With the NFC West being as competitive as ever, Arizona continues to do a good job building around Murray. However, the signal-caller has to show more development in the intermediate passing (10-19 yards) game, where he ranked 24th while in rhythm. It's an area where he can raise his level of play and make the players around him better.

18. JOE BURROW, CINCINNATI BENGALS

Burrow had the fifth-best passing grade (92.5) when targeting throws 10-19 yards downfield, but he ranked 32nd out of 36 qualifying quarterbacks on 20-plus yard throws. He had a passer rating of just 50.8 on those 20-plus yard passes. But the good news is that deep passing can fluctuate from year to year.

The Bengals added some key weapons outside with the addition of Burrow’s former teammate Ja’Marr Chase, who should help with the downfield attack. We still need to see Burrow fully healthy, and the Bengals need to do a better job of protecting him. He showed a lot of promise as a rookie based on the number of snaps he took and the volume of the playbook he was executing.

19. RYAN FITZPATRICK, WASHINGTON FOOTBALL TEAM

Fitzpatrick continues to play his best football the longer he stays in the league — the veteran ranks 15th in PFF passing grade since 2018. Last year in Miami, he had the team rolling until Brian Flores took the QB room for a rollercoaster ride. It's rare for a veteran quarterback “placeholder” to join a solid football team, but this will be the best team Fitzpatrick has been on in quite some time. Fitzpatrick brings energy, leadership and a wealth of knowledge to a locker room, but his Achilles heel is protecting the football. If he is able to play smart and deliver on explosive plays, Washington will be a playoff contender.

20. DANIEL JONES, NEW YORK GIANTS

This is a big year for Daniel Jones to establish himself as a franchise quarterback, and the Giants are doing everything in their power to surround him with help. Last year, the team had the lowest pass-blocking grade in the league and the eighth-worst receiving grade, but new additions from free agency and the draft should help.

This is the first offseason Jones will be in the same offense, which will offer more familiarity going into his third season. Jones must eliminate the boneheaded decisions and turnover-worthy plays that hold the team back. With his toughness and ability to make plays with his legs, Jones can make a big leap forward.

 

https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-quarterback-rankings-all-32-starters-ahead-of-the-2021-nfl-season

[samy316]

15 hours ago, RWJ said:

Part about Matt I agree with.  We have our starting QB on the roster.  

No we don’t.  We’re either going to trade for Rodgers/Watson, or we’re going to trade up next year and get a rookie.  We don’t have our franchise QB on the roster right now.  Once we have a franchise QB, then our contending window officially opens.

[mistertim]

6 minutes ago, samy316 said:

No we don’t.  We’re either going to trade for Rodgers/Watson, or we’re going to trade up next year and get a rookie.  We don’t have our franchise QB on the roster right now.  Once we have a franchise QB, then our contending window officially opens.

 

He didn't say franchise QB though...he said starting QB. We do have that.

[RWJ]

1 hour ago, samy316 said:

No we don’t.  We’re either going to trade for Rodgers/Watson, or we’re going to trade up next year and get a rookie.  We don’t have our franchise QB on the roster right now.  Once we have a franchise QB, then our contending window officially opens.

We agree to disagree.

[samy316]

2 hours ago, mistertim said:

 

He didn't say franchise QB though...he said starting QB. We do have that.

Sure, we have a starting QB (this year).  I think Fitz is a pretty good placeholder for this coming year.  My point is that this Fitz experiment will only be 1-2 years at best since he’s 38.  We need to plan for the future if we’re not doing so already.  QB is going to be the biggest question mark until we either draft one or trade for one.

 

My guess is we’ll probably try to trade for one, either before the season starts, or when FA begins after next year.  Who knows, if Watson settles his lawsuits, he might be had for 2 1sts and Ion.  If the price is too rich for us, then we’ll need to trade up into the top 5 for next year’s QB class.  But make no mistake about it, I have a feeling that we’ll make a significant move at QB sooner rather than later.  Our future SB hopes depend on it.

Edited May 20, 2021 by samy316

[CommDownMan]

On 5/7/2021 at 11:32 AM, NickyJ said:

When Rodgers was still hosting, I figured that the best voice to try out would be a commentator, like Al Michaels or Joe Buck. A few weeks later, Jeopardy announced that Joe Buck will host a couple weeks in the summer. I'm tuning in for that. Joe's grown on me a lot. I think he'd be loose enough for it, considering his covid commentating videos.

 

I'm worried about you.  I think you should consider seeing a doctor.

[Thinking Skins]

3 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

19. RYAN FITZPATRICK, WASHINGTON FOOTBALL TEAM

Fitzpatrick continues to play his best football the longer he stays in the league — the veteran ranks 15th in PFF passing grade since 2018. Last year in Miami, he had the team rolling until Brian Flores took the QB room for a rollercoaster ride. It's rare for a veteran quarterback “placeholder” to join a solid football team, but this will be the best team Fitzpatrick has been on in quite some time. Fitzpatrick brings energy, leadership and a wealth of knowledge to a locker room, but his Achilles heel is protecting the football. If he is able to play smart and deliver on explosive plays, Washington will be a playoff contender.

This gets into the whole conversation about what a good/top/elite QB is though. Like, I could easily see some of the QBs who are listed above Fitzpatrick being sexier names and being guys who are better over the long run, but if we're talking this year over the next 17-20 games, I'd think Fitz would be better and have better stats than half the QBs on that list (Tannehill, Carr, Cousins, Roethlisberger, Burrow). Not saying he's an elite or really that much better QB, but I think it goes both ways and none of those QBs have really shown that they're better than Fitz (other than Ben but he's old and has to show he still has it). You could argue Cousins and Carr have, but there's the whole debate about them not taking their teams to the playoffs. When Fitz does this year, it will be a clear argument that he's better than everybody in this pack except maybe Tannehill. 

[Anselmheifer]

I bet we see the Watson trade rumors heat up after 6/1.

[88Comrade2000]

We aren’t going after Watson or Rodgers. We could’ve traded for Fields; which we didn’t.

 

The most this team will part with for a veteran; is what we offered for Stafford.

 

If this team gives up picks, like it would be required to get those 2; they would only do it for a rookie.

 

Considering the team’s sexual harassment issue; the last thing they are going to do is sign a sexual pervert to be their starting QB.

Edited May 21, 2021 by Rdskns2000

[skinny21]

17 hours ago, Rdskns2000 said:

We aren’t going after Watson or Rodgers. We could’ve traded for Fields; which we didn’t.

 

The most this team will part with for a veteran; is what we offered for Stafford.

 

If this team gives up picks, like it would be required to get those 2; they would only do it for a rookie.

 

Considering the team’s sexual harassment issue; the last thing they are going to do is sign a sexual pervert to be their starting QB.

Sure seems the team wasn’t too high on Fields though based on the reports they would have tried to trade up for Lance and of course the fact they didn’t move up to the 7-10 range for him (after reports they’d be willing to do so to get their guy).

 

I don’t see them going after Watson either, but if for some reason they got over the off field stuff, they’d almost surely be willing to go higher than what they offered for Stafford IMO.  I agree though that considering Watson’s cap numbers, and the high priced guys we’re going to want to re-sign over the next 2-4 years, going after a rookie makes more sense (not exactly what you were saying I guess).

Edited May 21, 2021 by skinny21

[KDawg]

You know what would suck? If a QB (generic, so I don’t pass judgement or come across like I’m alleging guilt... I’m not):

 

A QB is in a legal scandal involving a plethora of women. He settles. No charges come of it. 
 

Your favorite team trades 3 firsts and a player for him.

 

The guy is a total stud. One of the best in the league. His new team has an incredible season 13-4, good run that ends in the NFC Title game. The new QB has been a model citizen.

 

Then in early April of 2022, out of nowhere, a new report surfaces similar to the previous ones from the years prior. 
 

Then another. 
 

Now the QB is involved in legal issues again and this time the plaintiff doesn’t want to settle and your QB is damaged goods and can’t be traded, costs 30ish mil against the cap for years and is unplayable. 
 

Now, it’s also entirely possible that someone with a clean record has the same/different but similarly serious issues randomly... or this generic QB is a model citizen and never has another issue.

 

But... 

 

Gotta play the percentages. 

Edited May 21, 2021 by KDawg

[SonnySideUp]

On 5/20/2021 at 10:42 AM, samy316 said:

Sure, we have a starting QB (this year).  I think Fitz is a pretty good placeholder for this coming year.  My point is that this Fitz experiment will only be 1-2 years at best since he’s 38.  

Aaron Rodgers is 38 also. Would he be worth the price the WFT would have to pay to just have him play another 1-2 years? 

[88Comrade2000]

2 hours ago, skinny21 said:

Sure seems the team wasn’t too high on Fields though based on the reports they would have tried to trade up for Lance and of course the fact they didn’t move up to the 7-10 range for him (after reports they’d be willing to do so to get their guy).

 

I don’t see them going after Watson either, but if for some reason they got over the off field stuff, they’d almost surely be willing to go higher than what they offered for Stafford IMO.  I agree though that considering Watson’s cap numbers, and the high priced guys we’re going to want to re-sign over the next 2-4 years, going after a rookie makes more sense (not exactly what you were saying I guess).

The strength of the team under Rivera will be defense. I don't him giving up capitol unless the right QB is there.  How long that takes, who knows. He wants to follow the Chiefs model. If he's winning, he will get the time; but if he isn't Synder will can him.

 

Honestly, it wouldn't shock me, if the highlight of the Rivera era was last year and he's gone after 22. It depends on Dan and past history says Ron will end up like all other of Dan's coaches.

[86 Snyder]

2 hours ago, KDawg said:

You know what would suck? If a QB (generic, so I don’t pass judgement or come across like I’m alleging guilt... I’m not):

 

A QB is in a legal scandal involving a plethora of women. He settles. No charges come of it. 
 

Your favorite team trades 3 firsts and a player for him.

 

The guy is a total stud. One of the best in the league. His new team has an incredible season 13-4, good run that ends in the NFC Title game. The new QB has been a model citizen.

 

Then in early April of 2022, out of nowhere, a new report surfaces similar to the previous ones from the years prior. 
 

Then another. 
 

Now the QB is involved in legal issues again and this time the plaintiff doesn’t want to settle and your QB is damaged goods and can’t be traded, costs 30ish mil against the cap for years and is unplayable. 
 

Now, it’s also entirely possible that someone with a clean record has the same/different but similarly serious issues randomly... or this generic QB is a model citizen and never has another issue.

 

But... 

 

Gotta play the percentages. 

 

Yeah, I was a big advocate for Watson, but that was before any of this stuff came out.  I'm all the way off that bandwagon for sure.

 

Even if you could guarantee me he settles and will face no further issues after he gets out of the woods, I dont want any part.

 

Its a shame because he was one of my favorite players in the league and nows hes just completely radioactive.