Welcome to the Redskins Antonio Gibson, RB/WR Memphis

[PartyPosse]

5 minutes ago, Mr. Sinister said:

But I believe that over the home stretch,  we are a worse team offensively without him in the lineup.

I think we are, but at this point in time I don't think JD is that much of a dropoff in terms of versatile back. The difference is AG was getting way more carries hence the significant lead in TDs between the two. But with the development of Logan Thomas I don't think we'll be as handcuffed in the red zone.

[Darth Tater]

46 minutes ago, Mr. Sinister said:

 

We sure did. I do not doubt that many things are possible in a single game scenario, sort of like when the backup QB comes in and all of a sudden things open up a bit. 

 

But I believe that over the home stretch,  we are a worse team offensively without him in the lineup.

Well, yeah, assuming he is healthy, he is the primary RB for a reason.  We also lose the ability to go 0, 1 and 2 backs with no personnel change.  Of course, if he is not playing, that means given his injury, we'd be worse on offense. 

 

Half our passing game looks like sort of the run game anyway, so maybe we just expand on that.

[wit33]

 

58 minutes ago, PartyPosse said:

I think we are, but at this point in time I don't think JD is that much of a dropoff in terms of versatile back. The difference is AG was getting way more carries hence the significant lead in TDs between the two. But with the development of Logan Thomas I don't think we'll be as handcuffed in the red zone.

Size and power matters, especially early in downs when the priority is to keep the defense honest. I grew to really appreciate Gibson’s ability to provide a power style of running to the Shotgun set— his ability to churn his legs and get 2-4 yards consistently was huge to creating and sustaining positive momentum on early downs. Obviously, he seemed to be on the cusp of adding a consistent big play ability, which is truly unique. 
 

I believe Mckissic will have some success, but worry there may be more 2nd and 9, 10, or 11s  with him. My guess is they give Barber 80% or so of Gibson’s role and let Mckissic continue to do his thing. 

[PartyPosse]

1 minute ago, wit33 said:

 

Size and power matters, especially early in downs when the priority is to keep the defense honest. I grew to really appreciate Gibson’s ability to provide a power style of running to the Shotgun set— his ability to churn his legs and get 2-4 yards consistently was huge to creating and sustaining positive momentum on early downs. Obviously, he seemed to be on the cusp of adding a consistent big play ability, which is truly unique. 
 

I believe Mckissic will have some success, but worry there may be more 2nd and 9, 10, or 11s  with him. My guess is they give Barber 80% or so of Gibson’s role and let Mckissic continue to do his thing. 

My guess is we're throwing screens and short passes 95% of first downs.

[wit33]

4 minutes ago, PartyPosse said:

My guess is we're throwing screens and short passes 95% of first downs.

They may have unlocked something with empty sets and Alex Smith. I can envision some early down empty set motions from Mckissic with Smith having some choice to motion and audible in and out of run or pass. 

Edited December 11, 2020 by wit33

[PartyPosse]

59 minutes ago, wit33 said:

They may have unlocked something with empty sets and Alex Smith. I can envision some early down empty set motions from Mckissic with Smith having some choice to motion and audible in and out of run or pass. 

I haven’t done the research but have we ever run a 21 personnel? If so how often?

[FootballZombie]

18 hours ago, Malapropismic Depository said:

It's amazing how much that a small body part, like a toe, can greatly impact a player's ability to perform.

But I hope he gets healthy soon, from head to toe, because when he's in there, he can really 'toe the line'.

 

Could always go with the Ronnie Lott method.

 

Zombie can go for some toe-fu (Zombie Pun)

[Burgold]

2 hours ago, PartyPosse said:

I think we are, but at this point in time I don't think JD is that much of a dropoff in terms of versatile back. The difference is AG was getting way more carries hence the significant lead in TDs between the two. But with the development of Logan Thomas I don't think we'll be as handcuffed in the red zone.

I think the other difference is that Gibson is more explosive and has more homerun potential. I think his ability to break tackles and run away from the defense is not a small thing. McKissic has been very good though. Not a homerun hitter, but a guy who can hit a double pretty easily.

[NoCalMike]

I assume this week, as opposed to last week, they have been game planning the entire time assuming Gibson would be out.  If so, I wonder if they are planning on throwing more on 1st down, even if it is short passes.  If you can connect on a high percentage of those at a 3-4 yards per pass than it leaves you on 2nd down where you would be a lot of the time when running the ball anyway, then it gives you the option to run, pass, play action on 2nd down.  I think if you are Turner you modify the game plan and scheme according to the personnel available, I am so over the "the system works" mindset that was around with Gruden.  JD is a playmaker but he tends to be more explosive catching the ball and being able to work in space rather than being handed the ball behind the line.  Doesn't mean he shouldn't get some carries to keep the defense honest, but get the guy the ball on screen passes and in the flat and in motion and let the man go to work.   

 

Also, considering how much production we got from JD, Logan Thomas, & Cam Sims last week, it will be interesting to see if it changes the way the 49ers defense plays coverage or if it will be another week of using extra resources on every play to shadow McLaurin and dare Alex Smith to find other guys.  Luckily, as we've seen, Smith will happily oblige.

Edited December 11, 2020 by NoCalMike

[CommanderInTheRye]

Javon Leake ran a disappointing 4.65 forty at the combine. Because of covid he never got another opportunity to run for scouts. His 40 time was a major factor in why he wasn’t drafted.

 

Looking at his highlights he doesn’t seem like a 4.7 guy to my eyes. In the open field he rarely gets caught from behind and he occasionally outruns angles.

 

Should be interesting to see what he can do, particularly as a returner, if he gets the rock tomorrow.

 

 

 

Edited December 12, 2020 by TrancesWithWolves

[TheShredder]

I never saw anything about AG being seen in a walking boot.  That's a big deal in how you treat turf toe.  Essentially it leads to a less than Grade 2 injury.  The healing window then moves to 2-4 week period.  I expect the Ortho Doc to have planned for practicing or testing after 2 weeks.  Treatment might look something like early testing on like a Tuesday, then reassess Wed.  If healing and inflammation are within normal limits at the follow-up, they could limit him the rest of the week and game plan him in vs Seattle.  Since you can't have impressionable pain as a RB, they could do another MRI on Saturday and give him cortisone and tordal pre-game and he'd play pretty much pain free.  Problem is that Monday, following that game, he'd need another follow-up MRI and if his pain and inflammation is back to square one, he's done for the year.  Think of it as you'd be burning too much rubber on the tires to take more than 1 cortisone injection to a big toe.  Each injection is highly corrosive to the joint.  Pro athletes routinely decline these treatments because it significantly decreases your career length.  Sometimes they will take the shot because it's a very important game, like a playoff game or championship game.  The thought being it's a once in a lifetime opportunity.  That's definitely not the situation here.  If I were AG and WFT then you just wait until he can go full speed and go with what you've got.  You're going to want this guy to reach his potential.

[RandyHolt]

Turf toes come in different flavors. I am fearing this is a more severe grade injury. If it was a minor toe they would have taped him up and had him trot out for a practice.  This sucks ass.  The score will dictate if we get to see Barber or McKissic more.

[sjinhan]

1 hour ago, RandyHolt said:

Turf toes come in different flavors. I am fearing this is a more severe grade injury. If it was a minor toe they would have taped him up and had him trot out for a practice.  This sucks ass.  The score will dictate if we get to see Barber or McKissic more.

everytime I read turf toe.... i have flashbacks of L Coles who was an awesome WR pickup for us until he got that turf toe and he was never the same...

[method man]

15 hours ago, TrancesWithWolves said:

Javon Leake ran a disappointing 4.65 forty at the combine. Because of covid he never got another opportunity to run for scouts. His 40 time was a major factor in why he wasn’t drafted.

 

Looking at his highlights he doesn’t seem like a 4.7 guy to my eyes. In the open field he rarely gets caught from behind and he occasionally outruns angles.

 

Should be interesting to see what he can do, particularly as a returner, if he gets the rock tomorrow.

 

 

 

I am not a MD fan but you can tell by the numbers he is a home run hitter. I hope they can find ways to use him in the return game and on offense

[Xameil]

10 hours ago, sjinhan said:

everytime I read turf toe.... i have flashbacks of L Coles who was an awesome WR pickup for us until he got that turf toe and he was never the same...

Then we sent him back to the Jets, got Santana Moss from them, and had the first Monday Night Miracle...

[Voice_of_Reason]

10 hours ago, sjinhan said:

everytime I read turf toe.... i have flashbacks of L Coles who was an awesome WR pickup for us until he got that turf toe and he was never the same...

Deion had turf toe seemingly every year at some point and ended up ok.  

 

I think it depends on the guy and how they recover.

[NoVaSkins21]

I hope Gibson can come back soon.  He and McLaurin are 1 and 1a as far as the best players on offense.  If he had played the entire  game, vs Pittsburgh, the game might not have been as close as it was IMO.

[XxSpearheadxX]

13 hours ago, sjinhan said:

everytime I read turf toe.... i have flashbacks of L Coles who was an awesome WR pickup for us until he got that turf toe and he was never the same...

turf toe was a bummer in Garcons first year with Washington. His seasons after getting it were much much better

[BRAVEONAWARPATH]

21 hours ago, TrancesWithWolves said:

Javon Leake ran a disappointing 4.65 forty at the combine. Because of covid he never got another opportunity to run for scouts. His 40 time was a major factor in why he wasn’t drafted.

 

Looking at his highlights he doesn’t seem like a 4.7 guy to my eyes. In the open field he rarely gets caught from behind and he occasionally outruns angles.

 

Should be interesting to see what he can do, particularly as a returner, if he gets the rock tomorrow.

 

 

 

Terp fan here and yeah, Javon is not a 4.7 guy on the field.

Edited December 13, 2020 by BRAVEONAWARPATH

[Silvernon]

21 hours ago, TrancesWithWolves said:

Javon Leake ran a disappointing 4.65 forty at the combine. Because of covid he never got another opportunity to run for scouts. His 40 time was a major factor in why he wasn’t drafted.

 

Looking at his highlights he doesn’t seem like a 4.7 guy to my eyes. In the open field he rarely gets caught from behind and he occasionally outruns angles.

 

Should be interesting to see what he can do, particularly as a returner, if he gets the rock tomorrow.

 

 

 

 

There were a couple of moments of an extra gear, but looks like a 4.7 guy to me. 

[Darth Tater]

15 hours ago, sjinhan said:

everytime I read turf toe.... i have flashbacks of L Coles who was an awesome WR pickup for us until he got that turf toe and he was never the same...

Coles had issues with the turf toe but he was pretty much who he was after as who he was before.

[wit33]

Clear to me Gibson is the X factor on offense and he’s needed back desperately. The offense has lost physicality out of the shotgun set. 
 

I understand it’s easy to jump on this point after the effort today, but you can see that the offense is working with a more limited playbook with him out. 

[Est.1974]

Gibson definitely a miss. Another week off. Maybe along with Alex Smith, bypass the Seahawks game, Panthers games the critical one.

[TheShredder]

On 12/13/2020 at 10:46 AM, RandyHolt said:

Turf toes come in different flavors. I am fearing this is a more severe grade injury. If it was a minor toe they would have taped him up and had him trot out for a practice.  This sucks ass.  The score will dictate if we get to see Barber or McKissic more.

I've seen nothing about him ever being in a walking boot.  That would indicate a less than Grade 2 turf toe.  This means a Less severe grade injury.

On 12/14/2020 at 5:32 PM, UK SKINS FAN 74 said:

Gibson definitely a miss. Another week off. Maybe along with Alex Smith, bypass the Seahawks game, Panthers games the critical one.

I wouldn't put it past RR to do that.  He's been extremely conservative in preserving players and when leading at the end of games.  Clearly he is playing the long game to finish first. 

However, AG as well as Alex could very well play Sunday.  They could all but lock it up with a win vs Seattle and losses by NY and PHI. 

Someone asked so I'd guess AG to be 50/50 shot at playing on 2 weeks rehab.  If he practices limited and it's not worse the next day it will be more optimistic. 

Edited December 16, 2020 by TheShredder

[bakedtater1]

On 12/14/2020 at 3:32 AM, UK SKINS FAN 74 said:

Gibson definitely a miss. Another week off. Maybe along with Alex Smith, bypass the Seahawks game, Panthers games the critical one.

Excellent point here..I seen someone else say something along the same lines...dont push Gibson's return or alex playing..rest this game and take the division week 16.

On 12/13/2020 at 8:51 AM, Xameil said:

Then we sent him back to the Jets, got Santana Moss from them, and had the first Monday Night Miracle...

Every time I think of Coles I think of ray Lewis on Monday night...the Coles moss trade was my favorite of all time because of the monday night miracle.