Let's All Get Behind Alex Smith! Or Not!! (M.E.T.) NO kirk talk---that goes in ATN forum

[HOF44]

28 minutes ago, Burgold said:

I agree with that. I also think the invisible play of the game was Alex Smith tackling the Giants linebacker after Peterson's fumble. Smith was the last man. If he doesn't hustle New York scores a touchdown. Instead, the defense stiffened and NY punts.

 

That was a huge play Alex made on defense.

Maybe he would be more effective on Defense!!

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

2 minutes ago, Llevron said:

 

You saw me say that some place? 

 

I do just like to **** with you cause your still so obviously hurt about the Kirk thing. But I really did want you to provide links of "all the professionals" saying we are winning in spite of our horrible QB play. Most I ever see is he needs to play better. 

 

Or anyone saying we should bench him. 

 

Also I never watch the Skins post game show. That's really all you needed to say and I can look that up immediately. 

 

That only took 13 posts to get out of you lol. 

 

I still think it’s cute when the only card you can pull is that you think I’m a Kirk Stan.  I’ve been over this on numerous occasions.  I find Kirk to be corny, a bit extra with the religion, and shameful on the grill.  I actually used to post on this site about how much he sucked prior to mid season 2015.  I never thought he would get out of his own way.  However he won me over with his play and I ate a lot of crow about it.  I’m willing to eat deserved crow but I am firm and confident that I will never eat any crow in relation this whole FO/Kirk/Alex ordeal.  

 

 

[Skinsinparadise]

Jay's quote below summarizes it for me.  Grateful they can win games without much passing offense.  I am sort of in between the two prevailing views on this thread -- i am not in the group of we are winning because of Alex, we just can't appreciate it (granted that's a very small group and they make their point mostly in a subtle way of late) nor in the group that the dude stinks and we just have to get used to that reality.  I don't think he's played well.  I don't think the FO thinks he's played well or Jay and the coaching staff thinks he's played well -- but there is some hope that better play is on the horizon.  

 

At the moment this team feels like its the 2007 version all over again. 

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/redskins-are-cruising-along-in-first-place-but-it-doesnt-always-look-like-it/2018/10/28/0afcf24c-dadb-11e8-b732-3c72cbf131f2_story.html?utm_term=.fd771c24572d

“Until we get going offensively, we have to win games like this,” Gruden said

[dckey]

Here is Deion and others saying we can win with Alex

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/2018/10/23/deion-sanders-defends-alex-smith-predicts-redskins-will-win-nfc-east/

[clskinsfan]

34 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

That deep ball to Richardson was atrocious.  Alex admitted the one long completed pass he had to Richardson this year was off target but Richardson adjusted.

 

I get those who say give him more time.  But the ones who are trying to sell this like Alex is an acquired taste and we will learn to see this as why he's a winner -- to me that's 100% BS.  This isn't 2017 style Alex Smith.  I get those who think he's going to eventually play better.   But the kicker to me about how he's not playing hot is there is enough evidence for me that the FO and coaching staff don't think he's played well -- and they would be the ones most vested on selling his play. 

 

i dont think many of us are going to disagree with what you are saying. But he will get better this year with more time in the system. Simply because he cant really play much worse. He is doing what he does. Just not as good as he has done it elsewhere.  

 

His accuracy issues are something I didnt think we would see from Smith. he is a career 63% passer. And is right at that number here so far. But he has missed the long ball BADLY so far this year. He also isnt using his legs like I thought he would. i expected to see a lot more read option and bootleg stuff than we have. And maybe they break that out later in the season?

[Destino]

47 minutes ago, Llevron said:

Again I don't think anyone is denying he's not playing well. I haven't seen anyone do that yet. 

A lot of people around here said Case Keenum was the truth too.  Way better than Cousins.  I’m good with Alex Smith if the choice is between him and Keenum.  8 touchdowns to 9 picks midway through the season is all kinds of ugly.  

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

5 minutes ago, dckey said:

Here is Deion and others saying we can win with Alex

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/2018/10/23/deion-sanders-defends-alex-smith-predicts-redskins-will-win-nfc-east/

Post won’t let me see it, who are the others?

 

Deion I’ve heard on NFLN, literally the only personality I’ve heard praise Smith this season.

 

edit: I just went into private mode to read the article in the Post.  Who are the others defending him? I didn’t see it.

 

Interesting enough when I googled Deion Sanders Alex Smith, I found several articles of Deion loving Smith back when he was with the Chiefs.

[Llevron]

10 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

 

I still think it’s cute when the only card you can pull is that you think I’m a Kirk Stan.  I’ve been over this on numerous occasions.  I find Kirk to be corny, a bit extra with the religion, and shameful on the grill.  I actually used to post on this site about how much he sucked prior to mid season 2015.  I never thought he would get out of his own way.  However he won me over with his play and I ate a lot of crow about it.  I’m willing to eat deserved crow but I am firm and confident that I will never eat any crow in relation this whole FO/Kirk/Alex ordeal.  

 

All I really wanted from you was for you to give me links for real. Seriously lol. I said of rip that I may even agree with you if you could provide me some. I wasnt really trying to make this about you and Kirk. If I did I would bring up your old posts where we were on the opposite sides of the argument than we are now. (You made many QB wins stat arguments just a few years ago) 

 

Man really I dont care about you or Kirk I'm just talking **** half the time. You make it fun lol

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

2 minutes ago, Llevron said:

 If I did I would bring up your old posts where we were on the opposite sides of the argument than we are now. (You made many QB wins stat arguments just a few years ago) 

Simply not true.  I’ve always said Kirk needed a semblance of a running game and decent defense to stack wins.  I may have said he himself carried the team to wins which is true.  But definitely not good enough to do that regularly.

[Skinsinparadise]

15 minutes ago, clskinsfan said:

 

i dont think many of us are going to disagree with what you are saying. But he will get better this year with more time in the system. Simply because he cant really play much worse. He is doing what he does. Just not as good as he has done it elsewhere.  

 

 

I agree with this point.

 

15 minutes ago, clskinsfan said:

 

His accuracy issues are something I didnt think we would see from Smith. he is a career 63% passer. And is right at that number here so far. But he has missed the long ball BADLY so far this year. He also isnt using his legs like I thought he would. i expected to see a lot more read option and bootleg stuff than we have. And maybe they break that out later in the season?

 

Agree with this, too.

 

My point is as a a media junkie when it comes to the insider stuff, it really got my attention when Finlay or Keim or whomever starts saying here's what their sources are telling them about Alex.  They aren't always right but they often are.   At the moment, I find it interesting that i am getting the overriding impression that there is some serious concern and frustration behind the scenes about Alex.  There seems to be some hope he will get better -- but I don't get the vibe its with 100% confidence.   the vibe I get is they are surprised that he has played as poorly as he has thus far.

 

I also have heard plenty of times that Jay loves himself Colt.  This season thus far has a weird deja vu vibe from the McNabb year where people were also touting him "a leader" and to be patient with him and the better play is coming.  Actually McNabb had a killer game early which Alex really hasn't had yet.    we heard behind the scenes that Kyle liked Rex and by the end of the year what seemed shocking earlier in the season came to fruition when McNabb was benched for Rex.

 

That year we also heard that McNabb thought Shanny didn't know how to use him the way Andy Reid did.  A similar story has gone a little below the radar but there is a little element of that here too -- Finlay said a couple of weeks ago that Alex has been imploring the coaching staff to use more RPO-RO.  

 

I am not saying it ends up the same way as McNabb.  But it does have some weird parallels thus far.  I think the main difference though is this team has a good running game and defense and can win in spite of the QB.  That wasn't the case with McNabb. 

 

I don't really have a good feel for how this ends up but I do find it interesting that the same coaching staff and FO who was willing to leak to beat guys that Alex was an upgrade in the off season are also willing to leak that they are now concerned.   If I recall one of the beat guys, maybe it was Finlay who said Jay is VERY frustrated by his play thus far.

 

[dckey]

15 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

Post won’t let me see it, who are the others?

 

Deion I’ve heard on NFLN, literally the only personality I’ve heard praise Smith this season.

 

edit: I just went into private mode to read the article in the Post.  Who are the others defending him? I didn’t see it.

 

Interesting enough when I googled Deion Sanders Alex Smith, I found several articles of Deion loving Smith back when he was with the Chiefs.

Smoot stated you can win with Alex not turning the ball over and running

[Llevron]

4 minutes ago, Destino said:

A lot of people around here said Case Keenum was the truth too.  Way better than Cousins.  I’m good with Alex Smith if the choice is between him and Keenum.  8 touchdowns to 9 picks midway through the season is all kinds of ugly.  

 

I dont remember people being on the Case Keenum at all. But I was pretty down by the end of last season since I knew we were getting worse at QB anyway and I thought the rest of the teams as trash. I was pretty signed out by the time we got Alex so I wasnt in the stadium at all until we started playing. 

34 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

Simply not true.  I’ve always said Kirk needed a semblance of a running game and decent defense to stack wins.  I may have said he himself carried the team to wins which is true.  But definitely not good enough to do that regularly.

 

We ain't about to sit here and redo the Kirk thing. You got it. 

 

All I wanted was for you to make this everyone hates Alex thing easier for me to digest and you have sorta done that I guess. 

[Gibbs828791]

Smith has been horrible for the most part. But a couple of points. Are you sure we win the Dallas game with Kirk. Smith and Dak for the most part played to a stalemate but Alex didnt make the turnovers Dak did, would Kirk of turned it over? Past history says yes! One thing QB ratings dont show and something never mentioned is how often Kirk fumbles. Second, would our D be as good with Kirk here? Would we have Zack Brown? How about Preston Smith? And any other future FA's

[SkinsHokieFan]

Alex Smith is a disaster at the moment. I am hopeful he can get to average, and this team has a chance at 12 wins

[ThomasRoane]

3 hours ago, Llevron said:

 

Ok so Cooley. That it? We supposed to bench him cause Cooley doesn’t like him? 

 

And im giving you that one. Not even asking for proof. 

 

Yes I want links so we can discuss all the professionals that think we should bench him for McCoy at 5-2

 

Adrian Peterson, first time hall of famer most likely, thought so much of Cooley's film break down and criticism of a few of his runs that he came down to Cooley and asked him to show him on film so he could get better.  That's pretty high praise.

[ExoDus84]

2 hours ago, clskinsfan said:

And he will not LOSE you a game either.

 

I mean, passing for less than 180 yards, averaging barely 1 TD per game, and not making any big plays will lose you quite a few games. Unless, of course, your defense and running game prop you up. 

 

Smith is getting away with his crap performances because the running game and defense are holding us together. If he doesn't improve significantly, we stand no chance against the better teams in the league. We are winning, but he has not been good. He's been Dak Prescott. 

[skins island connection]

2 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

That deep ball to Richardson was atrocious.  Alex admitted the one long completed pass he had to Richardson this year was off target but Richardson adjusted.

 

I get those who say give him more time.  But the ones who are trying to sell this like Alex is an acquired taste and we will learn to see this as why he's a winner -- to me that's 100% BS.  This isn't 2017 style Alex Smith.  I get those who think he's going to eventually play better.   But the kicker to me about how he's not playing hot is there is enough evidence for me that the FO and coaching staff don't think he's played well -- and they would be the ones most vested on selling his play. 

 

 The 2017 Alex Smith was all about his supporting cast. The 2018 Smith is all about the defense, which is the ONLY  reason they are 5-2.

 The idea that Gruden begging him to throw more deep balls concerns me, because for the most part the Redskins led in the games they won this year, but there will be teams with better QBs and better offenses in general which will take an early lead and force Smith's hand, and that's the spot where the rubber meets the road.

When he's under pressure to perform in a comeback its the mirror image of playing with a lead; its his 'comfort level' to tone it down and play a normal style like the game would be close, but when the pressure of the 2nd half builds and he KNOWS he has to start airing it out and trusting WRs, that's when he breaks down on accuracy. Its bad enough that we don't have a top notch WR who he COULD build trust in, but even IF they were to snag some big name guy before the deadline, it would be the 'he needs to become familiar with the guy', he needs time, he doesn't know the WR, etc etc.

 

Would this team be better with a Ftizpatrick-type QB? I don't know that, but I do know that Fitz would give his WRs a CHANCE, and that's one of the things holding back Doctson from being a top tier WR. Sure, he will throw a few picks here and there, but it loosens defenses, and it gives WRs a chance, and he doesn't need a year to get familiar with his receivers.

[SkinsFTW]

36 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

At the moment, I find it interesting that i am getting the overriding impression that there is some serious concern and frustration behind the scenes about Alex.  There seems to be some hope they he will get better -- but I don't get the vibe its with 100% confidence.   the vibe I get is they are surprised that he has played as poorly as he has thus far.

 

 

 

Are they REALLY surprised? Is anyone surprised? Seriously.

 

Seriously?

 

Anybody making decisions for the team who actually seriously thought that AS was an upgrade should be reassigned to the hot dog stand. Oh yeah just wait, he'll get better... It takes time... You'll see later!!! Did they actually watch the 13 years of AS in the NFL?  Or did they mean like 2% better than a turd sandwich? Or when we get the best WRs in the league some other year? Which would cost more to have less production. We already have better players on offense. We don't need DJax what Alex needs is Peterson + Faulk +  the actual Hogs +  85 Bears defense. And a time machine.

 

I listened and laughed at the Chiefs fans calling in to Seriusxm for years about AS. Even in 2017. It was funny to me because it reminded me of the Candle debates on here. And naturally, Polian actually defended Smith usually but others like Miller and Kirwin agreed that he was playing not to lose which would eventually guarantee losing. Usually with the same BS thrown in that we hear now about him possibly getting better and not turning the ball over at least.  (Which is the only thing keeping him from being 100% trash).  Like Jason Campbell is going to get better just be patient. In fact right now I bet we could have him for very cheap with similar results. No where near 20M a year for 1 read, deer in the headlights, **** I'm gonna bail out bro, AS.

 

Chiefs fans waited for 5 years for Smith to finally surpass 20tds in a season (most of his were under 20).  After the scared for his job Smith showed up in 2017 and had a career year most of the Chiefs fans were ecstatic to see him traded and even we're so sure that they'd seen enough to be 100% sure that they decided to troll him here. Which is kind of similar to how Redskins fans "tried to warn" Raiders fans about Campbell.  This dude is the same thing and it was even more obvious, even just looking at his stats for all those seasons.

 

Throws very few TDs. Avoids WRs and dumps it off religiously. Takes a sack on like 8% of his dropbacks even though he isn't asked to pass alot, usually has the threat of a good running game, and very rarely goes for anything remotely deep. But also doesn't throw what fans call dumb picks. Because he doesn't do timing offense he does hey my first read is covered but that rb is standing there looking lonely, lets dump it off. After 14 years. Still. When the first option is "covered" either (A) run for your life despite no pressure or (B) check down to the dude who is near the LOS with 5 guys who will stop him from getting a first down.

 

But just wait until he gets better! Championship!!!

 

 

 

[Skinsinparadise]

14 minutes ago, skins island connection said:

 

 The 2017 Alex Smith was all about his supporting cast. The 2018 Smith is all about the defense, which is the ONLY  reason they are 5-2.

 The idea that Gruden begging him to throw more deep balls concerns me, because for the most part the Redskins led in the games they won this year, but there will be teams with better QBs and better offenses in general which will take an early lead and force Smith's hand, and that's the spot where the rubber meets the road.

When he's under pressure to perform in a comeback its the mirror image of playing with a lead; its his 'comfort level' to tone it down and play a normal style like the game would be close, but when the pressure of the 2nd half builds and he KNOWS he has to start airing it out and trusting WRs, that's when he breaks down on accuracy. Its bad enough that we don't have a top notch WR who he COULD build trust in, but even IF they were to snag some big name guy before the deadline, it would be the 'he needs to become familiar with the guy', he needs time, he doesn't know the WR, etc etc.

 

Would this team be better with a Ftizpatrick-type QB? I don't know that, but I do know that Fitz would give his WRs a CHANCE, and that's one of the things holding back Doctson from being a top tier WR. Sure, he will throw a few picks here and there, but it loosens defenses, and it gives WRs a chance, and he doesn't need a year to get familiar with his receivers.

 

Alex ranked 24th right now in QBR.  McNabb was 25th in 2010.  They have almost the same QBR rating.   Both Andy Reid Qbs.  Both about 34.  Both seem to have lost some of their athleticism at the time -- maybe premature to say that about Alex.  Both with an undercurrent story about Andy's system perhaps suiting them better.

 

How this turns out?  I don't know.  Difference though is they are locked in contract wise with Alex and they can survive his play for the moment because the other units are strong.  Can this change? I don't know.  Maybe.  It seems like he should improve at least some but as to what degree -- don't know. 

 

5 minutes ago, SkinsFTW said:

 

Are they REALLY surprised? Is anyone surprised? Seriously.

 

Seriously?

 

Anybody making decisions for the team who actually seriously thought that AS was an upgrade should be reassigned to the hot dog stand. Oh yeah just wait, he'll get better... It takes time... You'll see later!!! Did they actually watch the 13 years of AS in the NFL?  Or did they mean like 2% better than a turd sandwich? Or when we get the best WRs in the league some other year? Which would cost more to have less production. We already have better players on offense. We don't need DJax what Alex needs is Peterson + Faulk +  the actual Hogs +  85 Bears defense. And a time machine.

 

 

 

I hated the trade.  But I admit I am surprised he's been this bad.  I think part of it was the leaks from the FO and Jay's statements where they were gushing about Alex.  Others got into it too Polian, L. Reddick, etc.   I disagree on the D-Jax front.  I want some speed.  We remember the deep passing with D-Jax but he could also on occasion take a quick hitch and go to the house.  I think you need guys like that with the quick passing game.  Plus they seem to like to run sweeps -- D. Jax's speed I think would be a plus.  

[Ray2844]

Does anyone agree that Colt Could run Our offense better than Smith?I do.

[dckey]

This Min NO game just shows how much turnovers matter and can affect the game.  Min has 2 turnovers which counted for 14 points.  No matter how good your defense is if your offense turns it over more than likely teams will score 

[bobandweave]

Lol style points gets you nothing. Said it a long time ago, all Alex does is win. If that means it’s not the prettiest passes or the best fantasy stats it shouldn’t matter. Fans of the results is where I always was all along. 

 

Through 7 games Alex has thrown only two picks. The team 5 wins and rolling. Not turning the ball over is the difference between results of Kirk and Alex records imo. Not turning the ball over is so key in this game.

 

http://www.footballperspective.com/winning-the-turnover-battle/

 

If the team wins and is 5-2 I refuse to make a big deal about a guy who’s got a plus 90% QBR, an 8-2 TD to INT record. But I assure you that after everything we have seen so far that wouldn’t be the case with Kirk or Colt running the show. As long as Alex wins and doesnt throw pick sixes like Kirk did tonight I’m his biggest fan. Peace

[Burgold]

Kirk Cousins handed a Super Bowl ready team is producing beautiful stats, but his team is 4-3-1.

Alex Smith is handed a 7-9 team and produces ugly stats, but his team is 5-2.

 

Questions?

[Morneblade]

3 minutes ago, Burgold said:

Kirk Cousins handed a Super Bowl ready team is producing beautiful stats, but his team is 4-3-1.

Alex Smith is handed a 7-9 team and produces ugly stats, but his team is 5-2.

 

Questions?

 

Not really. One team has a better Defense and running game. funny that how that works in a team sport. You know better Burg.

[CjSuAvE22]

24 minutes ago, bobandweave said:

Lol style points gets you nothing. Said it a long time ago, all Alex does is win. If that means it’s not the prettiest passes or the best fantasy stats it shouldn’t matter. Fans of the results is where I always was all along. 

 

Through 7 games Alex has thrown only two picks. The team 5 wins and rolling. Not turning the ball over is the difference between results of Kirk and Alex records imo. Not turning the ball over is so key in this game.

 

http://www.footballperspective.com/winning-the-turnover-battle/

 

If the team wins and is 5-2 I refuse to make a big deal about a guy who’s got a plus 90% QBR, an 8-2 TD to INT record. But I assure you that after everything we have seen so far that wouldn’t be the case with Kirk or Colt running the show. As long as Alex wins and doesnt throw pick sixes like Kirk did tonight I’m his biggest fan. Peace

Yeah he wins you are right but I don’t want this team to be a bunch of in season hero’s I want a team built that can win a super bowl and unfortunately we will never win a super bowl with Alex Smith vs any good teams we don’t stand a chance period meaning yeah we will make the playoffs but lose in the first round...I hope they draft a qb next year and let him learn the offense before taking over for smith midway through smiths third year....you can’t win Super Bowls with qb production on par with Alex Smith in today’s nfl.