NFL.com: Wade Phillips to interview for Redskins DC job (MET)

[Commander PK]

See, we still have confusion. Do you want Mickey or do you want Donald?

 

If I'm making the decisions...Donald.  He has an intimidating look about him sometimes, and I've seen him lose his temper.  He has balls.  Mickey never gets worked up over anything and always "keeps it medium."

 

[nick_sanchize]

Wade Phillips,good DC not good HC,if the Skins are serious hire this guy immediately.

[SB17]

Interviewing an under-qualified guy already on staff is, unfortunately, a popular way to "fulfill" the Rooney Rule.

I hate to say it, but I hope that's what we're doing with Morris.

Does the Rooney Rule apply for DCs and other coaches? I thought it was only for head coaches.

[robotfire]

Again, you are the problem that exists.

You are not paying attention.  Nobody can argue that we do contracts differently now.  The contract we gave DJax would have been astronomical under Vinny.

[RedBeast]

What about Teryl Austin from Detroit? Young up and comer that turned the Lions D around with strong credentials. Money and other bene's (bigger market, more influence) could move him here. I know he is interviewing for a few HC jobs but I think he is too young to get an offer.

Thoughts?

[PCS]

Does the Rooney Rule apply for DCs and other coaches? I thought it was only for head coaches.

 

Head coaches and senior football operations positions. I don't believe coordinators are part of that rule. 

[Hersh]

You are not paying attention.  Nobody can argue that we do contracts differently now.  The contract we gave DJax would have been astronomical under Vinny.

 

They gave Hatcher a terrible contract and paid Orakpo a ton of money for one year that was totally undeserved. We'll see.

[Conn]

Head coaches and senior football operations positions. I don't believe coordinators are part of that rule. 

Thanks, PCS, wasn't aware of that.

[abdcskins]

Just from observation, I am not a fan of Wade Phillips' demeanor. He always looks disinterested. He also has a meek way of speaking.

[grantarchy]

This entire thread is hilarious. People scream for changes to the foundations of this team, the team lets go of one coach that everyone wanted gone and now all the sheep are coming back over the possible signing of Wade Phillips. As if he will magically change the culture of the organization. This reeks of just bringing in a guy who is connected to AJ Smith rather then there being a robust search.

Oh, it's ridiculous if any member of the defensive staff is retained. Not sure why anyone defends the train wreck that is Morris.

Wait, is his son really the TE coach too?

I don't know if people are sheep for liking wade Phillips. I think the foundations of this team need massive change but I still like wade Phillips as an option. I am on record saying I didn't think firing haslett would do much other than appease the mob. I think our talent on defense is, if not bottom, near the bottom. But Wade is a master defensive coach and it would be, if nothing else, interesting to see what he could do with the same guys. He has had success with a bunch of different teams. I am kind of surprised there's a guy I'm interested in to be honest.

[ThomasRoane]

me too.

i think he's just what we need.

A/ he produces. His defenses are always good, and aggressive.

B/ he's a calming presence. he has a TON of experience of living under intense media scrutiny, and he can provide Jay with the intangibles that brings in helping Gruden get his feet under him. 

it's for this reason that I would MUCH rather have Wade than the next potential young hotshot. A young hotshot needs to have time to grow into a larger role, he needs to convince players to buy into his new ideas.  We have that all over the coaching staff. we need that anchor. A guy who the players can look back and see repeated success from Wade's defenses and players.  Confidence is important, especially on a team that is as immature and spun out as this one.

 

Our defense will get better the moment he signs on. 

Let's say he comes on and stays for 3 years and retires at 70. In those three years he'd make the defense respectable, develop players, and if we decide at that point to go with the next young defensive mind, we would have ANCHOR players, seasoned and possible pro bowl caliber young vets in key positions to make that transition something that could work, rather than the desperation (and low success probability) move it could be now.

 

Chipwich mentioned above that th Ravens just played and won a great playoff game with ac hodgepodge of DBs, and this is 100% true, and it's not because they necessarily spotted amazing talent, (1 guy bounced off of 2 or 3 practice squads this year and is starting in a playoff game.) but to me the key is their secondary coach is Steve Spagnoulo.

 

You build through the draft, you fill through free agency, and no matter what, you hire quality coaches, or it doesn't matter. Wade is a top shelf defensive coordinator.

 

~Bang

 

 

Wade would also be great for Olivadotti whom many people could easily be a top shelf DC some day.  At age 41 a couple years under Wade would be just about right.  It would leave the Redskins with an OC, DC and Special teams coach all in their early 40's.  Assuming they can get it together and get some help with personnel that could set the team up for several years of success.

[DogofWar1]

I question the claim that there is a robust search actually going on and I would want to hear what each candidate said in their interviews. What are their takes on what is going on with the Redskins defense and the culture of the club? How would they help change things? etc.

 

Seriously, I can't take a search seriously that includes interviewing Morris. His unit was terrible this year.

I mean, sure, we'd all like to hear all the interviews, but we never get access to any of that for any team.  As painful as it is, we're always on the outside looking into an opaque wall.

 

Morris was always going to be included in the search.  He probably deserves one too, while his unit has been terrible he is several times removed from player selection in draft and FA, and it's been how many years since we've had a legitimate safety?  If we're doing a "robust" search, as you suggested we do, that means examining all options, which would include Raheem.

 

But the main thrust of your point is without merit, Wade Phillips is not some mere AJ Smith buddy.  In fact, in his last job, with Houston, with no connection to AJ Smith, he had top 10 defenses in both yards and points in 2 of his 3 years.  He has significant merit on his own, and would be a massive step up from Haslett and is very clearly more qualified than anyone we've thus far been given leave to interview, with maybe the exclusion of Donatell.

 

They gave Hatcher a terrible contract and paid Orakpo a ton of money for one year that was totally undeserved. We'll see.

 

Sigh...your opinions are your own but they are not particularly strong.  Orakpo's deal was certainly large, but when you've A) got cap room, B ) an impasse in trying to reach a long term contract, and C) a player in Orakpo who has, in the past, proven that he is a very competent (albeit not amazing) starting pass rusher, the franchise tag makes significant sense.

 

The Orakpo franchise tag was actually GREAT for us in the long term.  Imagine if we had reached a long term deal with him, which would likely have been expensive and carried significant dead money for several years, and then he got injured.  Many people would be complaining about the deal, and rightfully so.  Instead, we gave him a deal that, while large, carries zero liabilities outside of this year.  We can cut ties with zero consequences.

 

The old regime would have handed him a 5 year 50+ million contract.  The current regime made sure that, if he played well, we weren't losing his talent this year, but if he played poorly we would be insulated from long term damage.  A good move all around.

 

Hatcher's contract similarly is fine.  He's owed the vast majority of his money in years 3 and 4, and years 1 and 2 are relatively low impact.  His cost these first two years is about on par with mid-level starting DLinemen, nothing excessive, and on a team that had so little help at pass rusher that he and Kerrigan were able to be double teamed on every play, he managed 5.5 sacks from a position (3-4 DE) which traditionally does not see high sack numbers.

 

Seriously, if he's cut before year 3 we save around 15M off the contract over 2 years, and our cap dead money is only 2.25M across 2 years or 4.5M in one, neither of which is particularly crippling on its own.

 

It is a very well designed contract.

 

 

Seriously, I don't think you fully understand how contracts in the NFL work, neither Orakpo's nor Hatcher's contracts were crippling in any way provided we don't do any foolish.  Same thing with DJax's, we recoup the vast majority of our cap if he's cut after this year.

[chipwhich]

Hatcher's contract similarly is fine.  He's owed the vast majority of his money in years 3 and 4, and years 1 and 2 are relatively low impact.  His cost these first two years is about on par with mid-level starting DLinemen, nothing excessive, and on a team that had so little help at pass rusher that he and Kerrigan were able to be double teamed on every play, he managed 5.5 sacks from a position (3-4 DE) which traditionally does not see high sack numbers.

 

Seriously, if he's cut before year 3 we save around 15M off the contract over 2 years, and our cap dead money is only 2.25M across 2 years or 4.5M in one, neither of which is particularly crippling on its own.

 

It is a very well designed contract.

 

 

Seriously, I don't think you fully understand how contracts in the NFL work, neither Orakpo's nor Hatcher's contracts were crippling in any way provided we don't do any foolish.  Same thing with DJax's, we recoup the vast majority of our cap if he's cut after this year.

 

Nonsense.  Is that you Bruce?

 

Hatcher is a signing a team like the Ravens could make and be happy with.  A contender.

 

Hatcher to Bruce Allen is for a team a player or two away from contending.

 

When fans and the front office realize we need a REBUILD, then and only then will we fix this mess.  We kept Santana Moss and Hankerson around.  Last year we kept 4 QB's.  Yep, great choices.

 

You can't make up this silliness, you just go for the ride and enjoy getting laughed at by your friends.

[TSO]

Interviewing an under-qualified guy already on staff is, unfortunately, a popular way to "fulfill" the Rooney Rule.

I hate to say it, but I hope that's what we're doing with Morris.

 

I asked this question when it first came out we were interviewing Raheem... I was told the Rooney Rule only applies to Head Coaches, not assistants. 

 

So, according to that answer, that means we actually interviewed him because he has a legit chance to take the job.

 

Anyway, it doesn't matter much. Even if we bring the best guy for the job in, the team will struggle overall. No significant progress will be made until we have a Front Office that is properly structured and has some of the best talent evaluators in the league. Until then, every coach will come here and have issues. Same goes for players who rely on whom they're surrounded with. Some more than others, of course, but no one will thrive.  

 

By now, that should be clear enough to us. I'll be angry if they hire Raheem because it means they care more about relationships than winning, but I'll also find it hard to get excited if they don't and hire a guy like Wade, no matter how much I like him.   

 

 

 

*Edit* oops, should've read a little bit more in advance, had no idea there were that many posts after yours, sorry... PCS already clarified the Rooney Rule thing.  

[WilberMarshall]

What exactly do you consider wrong with Morris' coaching?

 

Repeated breakdown in communication in the secondary is enough reason he should be gone.   The inability of our DBs to recognize plays or what the other team is trying to do to them is a big problem.

 

They looked and played like a poorly coached secondary.  

[VCDefectors]

Wow. Tell me I'm dreaming. Maybe some you need to go dig through the archives and reread what you had to say about Wade Phillips only a few years ago. Wade Phillips is the ultimate one-year hit wonder coach, who can get players to buy into his system for a season, but all of his teams turn into a bunch of cream-puffs. 

[DogofWar1]

Nonsense.  Is that you Bruce?

 

Hatcher is a signing a team like the Ravens could make and be happy with.  A contender.

 

Hatcher to Bruce Allen is for a team a player or two away from contending.

 

When fans and the front office realize we need a REBUILD, then and only then will we fix this mess.  We kept Santana Moss and Hankerson around.  Last year we kept 4 QB's.  Yep, great choices.

 

You can't make up this silliness, you just go for the ride and enjoy getting laughed at by your friends.

 

I'm not going to contend as to whether Bruce misjudged our level of contention, I think he did.  And we can bash his choice of activity, but specifically bashing Bruce's contract structures, which are mostly team friendly, is unfair to him.

 

Remember, he engineered our exit from the cap hell Vinny left us in, and then after the NFL dropped a likely illegal (but alas with no one able or willing to bring suit on it) cap penalty on us, Bruce managed to keep us under our illegally lessened cap.

 

Within his misjudged opinion about the state of our team he still made a low harm contract for Hatcher.  Hatcher may have underperformed slightly from his top line per year $ amount this year but was not exactly handed the best situation.

 

Furthermore, the 4 year contract will not pay out even close to 27.5 million, it is, in all likelihood, going to pay out exactly 12.5M (a June 1 cut in 2016 saves us 15M over two years), for what ends up being 6.25M per year.

 

If you look at current contracts, that's tied for 32nd with Linval Joseph in terms of DLineman cost, a reasonable amount for what he brings to the table.

 

 

Listen, there is plenty we can give Bruce crap for, which he deserves.  How he's structured contracts is not one of them.

 

Your inability to give him any credit at all for anything takes you from reasonably critical observer dangerously close to hater territory.

 

 

Seriously, actually look at our cap situation.  It's good, provided we cut guys at the right time.  If nothing else, he's minimizing future damage from contracts.

 

For 2015, if we cut Bowen, Chester, Porter, Paulsen, Golston, and designate Hall a June 1 cut (all reasonable moves), he have 34 million in cap room with only around 5.5M in dead money.

 

Looking out to 2016, if we makes those 2015 cuts and if we cut Hatcher, one of Garcon or DJax, we'd have 92 million in cap room prior to this year's signings.  Cutting Cofield adds another 6M.  The total dead money, with Cofield, is only around about $7M total.

 

Then in 2017, if cut DJax and Kory, we would literally have $141M in cap room prior to signings from this year, with 4M in dead money.  We would literally have the full measure of this year's cap in room in 2017 (assuming cap moves to 160M) if only we make cuts at the right time.

 

Again, plenty of things to hate on Bruce about.  Contract structures and cap management are not one of them.  If and when he's ousted, provided he doesn't make a bunch of terrible moves in between now and then, we'll be in very good financial shape.

 

Credit where credit is due, even if it's not a lot.

___________________

 

Bruce, coupled with a DC like Phillips and a personnel guy (even someone like Smith) could actually  have a decent chance to turn this team around.  With Bruce keeping contracts team friendly and Smith and Phillips finding and subsequently coaching decent D talent, there is significant room to improve.

[grantarchy]

Nonsense.  Is that you Bruce?

 

Hatcher is a signing a team like the Ravens could make and be happy with.  A contender.

 

Hatcher to Bruce Allen is for a team a player or two away from contending.

 

When fans and the front office realize we need a REBUILD, then and only then will we fix this mess.  We kept Santana Moss and Hankerson around.  Last year we kept 4 QB's.  Yep, great choices.

 

You can't make up this silliness, you just go for the ride and enjoy getting laughed at by your friends.

I think it's more like a player or ten. Even so, I'm not quite understanding your logic specifically with regard to hatcher. Totally agree we need to rebuild, I have said that since before Gibbs came back the second time and I'm still waiting. As far as hatcher goes though I'm not getting it. Is it that the money should have gone to a different free agent? No free agent? Basically any free agent that signs with us is signing to a team years away from contending so is the objection to the amount of the contract, the position, or what? Just curious.

[Hersh]

But the main thrust of your point is without merit, Wade Phillips is not some mere AJ Smith buddy.  In fact, in his last job, with Houston, with no connection to AJ Smith, he had top 10 defenses in both yards and points in 2 of his 3 years.  He has significant merit on his own, and would be a massive step up from Haslett and is very clearly more qualified than anyone we've thus far been given leave to interview, with maybe the exclusion of Donatell.

 

 

Sigh...your opinions are your own but they are not particularly strong.  Orakpo's deal was certainly large, but when you've A) got cap room, B ) an impasse in trying to reach a long term contract, and C) a player in Orakpo who has, in the past, proven that he is a very competent (albeit not amazing) starting pass rusher, the franchise tag makes significant sense.

 

The old regime would have handed him a 5 year 50+ million contract.  The current regime made sure that, if he played well, we weren't losing his talent this year, but if he played poorly we would be insulated from long term damage.  A good move all around.

 

Hatcher's contract similarly is fine.  He's owed the vast majority of his money in years 3 and 4, and years 1 and 2 are relatively low impact.  His cost these first two years is about on par with mid-level starting DLinemen, nothing excessive, and on a team that had so little help at pass rusher that he and Kerrigan were able to be double teamed on every play, he managed 5.5 sacks from a position (3-4 DE) which traditionally does not see high sack numbers.

 

Seriously, if he's cut before year 3 we save around 15M off the contract over 2 years, and our cap dead money is only 2.25M across 2 years or 4.5M in one, neither of which is particularly crippling on its own.

 

It is a very well designed contract.

 

 

Seriously, you aren't as insightful as you think. You just said franchising a competent player makes sense. This is one of the reason the Redskins suck. You don't franchise competent players, you franchise game changing superstars. You take the money used on Orakpo and guide it toward an upgrade at another position. Seriously, you are telling people they don't understand contracts and yet you are ok with franchising a "competent player." BTW, you are aware that they still want to sign Orakpo to a long term deal?

 

Jason Hatcher...he shouldn't even have been signed let alone for $10.5 million guaranteed. He shouldn't take up over 5 million next year either. For a bad team, this is not a wise use of resources. If he was 26, maybe, but not at 32. In 2016, the year the Redskins should be showing enough improvement under competent building of a team (I know that won't happen) he will be a cap hit of $4.5 million if cut. That's brilliant long term planning...oh wait, it's not at all. That's a let's overpay for a past his prime DT that will take up valuable cap space in the future when it might actually matter.

 

As far as Wade Phillips, Houston has nothing to do with it. The fact is that he has connections here and a lot of people predicted that he would get a call as soon as it was mentioned that AJ Smith would have a bigger role. Maybe it will work out, but it just keeps the culture the same.

[chipwhich]

 

Again, plenty of things to hate on Bruce about.  Contract structures and cap management are not one of them.  If and when he's ousted, provided he doesn't make a bunch of terrible moves in between now and then, we'll be in very good financial shape.

 

Credit where credit is due, even if it's not a lot.

 

Sorry, maybe we misunderstand each other.  If Bruce is a great cap master, wonderful.  We don't need a cap master, one who BTW got us into the cap mess with Haynesworth writeoff (but lets not digress).  We need a GM that can rebuild a flawed, miserable NFL team, considered by some, and rightfully so one of the worst one or two teams in the league.

 

So if my wife balances our checkbook, but spends all our money, I should say, great job honey?

 

Please.

 

I give to charity BTW, I don't brag about it.  You don't give to charity to get brownie points from others, you do it for, I dunno charity????

 

Bruce bragged about the Redskins charitable foundation.  GREAT.  Who cares, I have my own charities and don't brag on myself.

 

Credit where credit is due is building a competent NFL team.  That's the business the Redskins are in.

[Hersh]

I think it's more like a player or ten. Even so, I'm not quite understanding your logic specifically with regard to hatcher. Totally agree we need to rebuild, I have said that since before Gibbs came back the second time and I'm still waiting. As far as hatcher goes though I'm not getting it. Is it that the money should have gone to a different free agent? No free agent? Basically any free agent that signs with us is signing to a team years away from contending so is the objection to the amount of the contract, the position, or what? Just curious.

 

I think the point is that you target a younger player or put it to upgrade a different position with a younger player. Signing a bunch of past their prime vets showed how out of touch this regime is when it comes to building a winner.

[skinny21]

Allen said Gruden would get to pick the DC. Not sure if that holds up what with AJ's "enhanced role", but I'd guess it will. Ergo, Smith's past with Wade may not mean much.

The good news is I think Wade's a good fit for Gruden. Gruden needs to show improvement both as a coach and as a team - Phillips' track record shows he produces. Wade has also shown poorly as a HC, and though you never know with Snyder, I'd doubt Wade would would pose much of a threat to Jay compared with some others (if they too fielded good D's).

Lastly, Wade is a safe pick - if he fails, I doubt most would fault Gruden's choice (again, compared to others).

[Riggo#44]

Wow. Tell me I'm dreaming. Maybe some you need to go dig through the archives and reread what you had to say about Wade Phillips only a few years ago. Wade Phillips is the ultimate one-year hit wonder coach, who can get players to buy into his system for a season, but all of his teams turn into a bunch of cream-puffs.

Maybe as a head coach, yes. I don't think anyone would doubt his defensive acumen. What's your point? He's not going to be a head coach here.

Ironically, though, there seems to be a sharp increase in Cowboy fan activity here tonight...

[grantarchy]

I think the point is that you target a younger player or put it to upgrade a different position with a younger player. Signing a bunch of past their prime vets showed how out of touch this regime is when it comes to building a winner.

That makes sense, actually. I wasn't thinking about his age. I'm not sure id characterize him as past his prime but do agree that signing free agents who will probably soon be there is not a great use of resources.

[DogofWar1]

Seriously, you are telling people they don't understand contracts and yet you are ok with franchising a "competent player." BTW, you are aware that they still want to sign Orakpo to a long term deal?

 

Jason Hatcher...he shouldn't even have been signed let alone for $10.5 million guaranteed. He shouldn't take up over 5 million next year either. For a bad team, this is not a wise use of resources. If he was 26, maybe, but not at 32. In 2016, the year the Redskins should be showing enough improvement under competent building of a team (I know that won't happen) he will be a cap hit of $4.5 million if cut. That's brilliant long term planning...oh wait, it's not at all. That's a let's overpay for a past his prime DT that will take up valuable cap space in the future when it might actually matter.

 

As far as Wade Phillips, Houston has nothing to do with it. The fact is that he has connections here and a lot of people predicted that he would get a call as soon as it was mentioned that AJ Smith would have a bigger role. Maybe it will work out, but it just keeps the culture the same.

 

I don't think you're evaluation is as good as you think.  You're still off the mark on all points.

 

Orakpo when healthy is VERY competent.  Competent is a supplemental guy who gets 6-8 sacks a year.  Amazing is mid teens sacks a year.  VERY competent fits in between, in the 8-13ish range.  Very good also works.  He's a disruptive pass rusher who can land sacks with some consistency, but isn't at that next level where he's pulling in 12+ per year.

 

Excluding 2012, his sack average was 9.6 sacks per year.  When you look at players in that tier of pass rusher and the contracts they're receiving, they're getting less than 11M/Y on average by a few million, BUT they are on long term contracts which carry forward significant costs into later years.

 

You also do realize we had cap room to spare after the franchising, right?  That's how we signed all those other guys, their merit notwithstanding.  Franchising a guy coming off a 10 sack season increased what we owed him by a couple million but gave us valuable time to evaluate his development while not adding further costs.

 

Your whole argument about Orakpo is predicated on the notion that we had someone better to franchise (we didn't), that his franchising handcuffed our cap (considering we had the money to sign DJax well after we'd made our planned FA moves, it didn't), and that Orakpo himself was undeserving (debatable, 10 sacks a year is very good and would likely merit 8-9M a year, so we overpaid by a little, but with the benefit of no long term liabilities).

 

As for us still wanting to sign him, I don't think anyone knows the current status of that.  Everyone's been pretty mum.  Allen didn't discuss future plans in his press conference, but it's very clear his injury history does not warrant a long term deal, and my suspicion is that the money will not match up between Orakpo's camp and ours.

 

 

Our decision to target Hatcher might be suspect (I too had younger targets lined up), but Hatcher's contract is fine for what it is.  As a 3-4 DE he's not supposed to sack a ton (especially since Haslett went back to 2 gap which hurts pass rushing from the DL); he underperformed slightly, but Cofield and Orakpo were both injured, meaning he had to eat double teams way more often.

 

In terms of dead money, 4.5M is not excessive, many players have that kind of cost attached to them when they're cut.  As I outlined, that dead money does screw our cap over.

 

 

As for Wade, Wade has literally been in our stands watching games the whole season.  He attended like 5 home games.  He's a self-proclaimed fan of the team who wants to watch his son work.  He was all but guaranteed to have an interview before AJ was ever discussed for an expanded role.

 

I find it funny that on the one hand I've seen fans who hate Phillips for his time in Dallas and think he's going to be a mole, and on the other hand we've got people who think his 3 years with AJ and his son being here suddenly makes him a good ol' boy in the same vein as the Tampa/Tusker crowd.

 

Ridiculous.  His threadbare connections to our team do not impact the merits of his hiring.

 

 

 

Sorry, maybe we misunderstand each other.  If Bruce is a great cap master, wonderful.  We don't need a cap master, one who BTW got us into the cap mess with Haynesworth writeoff (but lets not digress).  We need a GM that can rebuild a flawed, miserable NFL team, considered by some, and rightfully so one of the worst one or two teams in the league.

 

I'm not disagreeing that he's a bad GM, I've made it clear on numerous occasions this offseason that Bruce should, if he's retained at all, be moved to President and a true personnel GM brought in, with all the powers that entails.

 

But attacks on his contract structures and cap management are mostly lacking in legitimacy (and he did NOT get us into the cap penalty, it was about as clear a violation of antitrust law as could be, but the NFLPA signed away their rights to sue, and the Redskins and Cowboys had more to lose by suing than to gain).