Next Day Thread: Falcons Fiendishly Feathered

[FootballZombie]

Usually when my D gives up over 400 yards and my O only puts up 120 passing yards I'd be going full scorched earth and actively be trying to hurt feelings. Maybe I feel better than I should since I have not seen a win in a month...

 

I'll probably sour on it as time goes on.

 

 

I liked the D gameplan. Sell out to stop the run and forcing Ridder to beat you is a good plan. It sucks that there were holes everywhere and that a bad QB put up 3-hundy, but the plan worked. The D certainly was not good (400+ yards again) and a better O would have shredded them w/o the mistakes Ridder was making, but they were in fact playing a bad QB and banked on the idea he would not get it done.

 

 

The O was a mess the entire game. We could not sustain a drive at any point, it was simply masked early by multiple sort fields.

We were 20% on 3rd down conversions.

We had 121 passing yards

We had 72 Rushing yards

That's... worthy of description not fit to be heard around people's mamas.

 

 

Small victories like a good D gameplan and an actual attempt at balance on O were encouraging signs of improvement, but it feels like small potatoes in the face of our larger problems. There was more bad than good, and that was simply enough to beat another mid team that did some very bad things out there.

 

At the end of the day I'm still left w/ the idea that my D can't stop any O out there from having a monster game and my O can't be productive unless were in the process of getting actively destroyed and the opponents give us our weekly allowance. A win should offer relief that you have answers and solutions to your issues but instead this one only gave me more confirmation that our problems remain unresolved.

[Warhead36]

In fairness, the Falcons D is actually quite good, especially the back-end. Their secondary with Terrell, Okudah(who has been revitalized after leaving Detroit) and Bates is top notch. I think just about everyone that has played against them has put up a season low in points and production.

 

If they swapped Ridder for Howell they run away with their division.

[Thinking Skins]

This is the most points ANYBODY has scored against them (sure we were helped by a turnover and a punt return) but GB is the only other team to score 24. And it was a similar type game that they lost (400+ yards of offense gave up about 200 yards on defense). The difference is we got three turnovers (GB got 1 and lost by 1, similarly thats what I think Smith was trying to do when he went for 2). 

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

The lack of offense, predominantly in the second half, obviously gets the largest share of the blame pie.  
 

The frustration with the defense is a carryover from the entire season and expectations moving forward.  They’ve shown the ability to stop nobody, constantly give up 3rd and long, and allow career days.  
 

Even though they were the better unit yesterday and forced turnovers the offense desperately needed, it was depressing to see them give up 300 to Ridder, let Pitts in the end zone in the first time in forever, etc.  The realization that this is who they are going to be I think is what is prompting all the defensive chatter today, even when the offense was worse.

[Skinsinparadise]

3 hours ago, Warhead36 said:

Lucas needs to start over Wylie full time. He's so much better.

 

I noticed the same the one day I watched camp this summer.  Among other things Lucas looks so much bigger -- height-length that it looks like the dude can swallow Wylie.  I mentioned that after seeing the two standing next to each other in camp.

 

some fight back on the idea by saying Wylie can move better in the running game.  Maybe so but they hardly run the ball anyway.  Pass protection is a much bigger needed with this offense.

[Skinsinparadise]

 

 

[NewCliche21]

Just now, Skinsinparadise said:

 

 

 

Barton? What?

 

No Toohill? Maybe it's a snap count thing, I don't get it.

[Koolblue13]

17 minutes ago, NewCliche21 said:

 

Barton? What?

 

No Toohill? Maybe it's a snap count thing, I don't get it.

He got one sack off a boot and his only assignment is QB, not run and his other was because Chase and Allen flushed him into Toohills arms. He didn't really have much impact and is bad against the run.

[Skinsinparadise]

30 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

He got one sack off a boot and his only assignment is QB, not run and his other was because Chase and Allen flushed him into Toohills arms. He didn't really have much impact and is bad against the run.

 

Keim likes to say the coaching staff sees Toohill as one of their better run stoppers on the D line.  But don't like him as much as a pass rusher. PFF scores seem to back that up even though yesterday he had his sacks.  

Edited October 16, 2023 by Skinsinparadise

[Silvernon]

1 hour ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Keim likes to say the coaching staff sees Toohill as one of their better run stoppers on the D line.  But don't like him as much as a pass rusher. PFF scores seem to back that up even though yesterday he had his sacks.  

Yeah, Toohill is a good fit as a run-stopping LE and almost assuredly the 2024 starter. 

 

Whoever they keep at DE between Young and Sweat will play RE. They'll see what they have for subs with Jones Jr and Henry + a '24 pick. 

[MartinC]

2 hours ago, NewCliche21 said:

 

Barton? What?

 

No Toohill? Maybe it's a snap count thing, I don't get it.

 

Barton was around the ball Sunday - 14 tackles which was clearly the most on the game. I thought he played pretty well just on the eye test.

1 hour ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Keim likes to say the coaching staff sees Toohill as one of their better run stoppers on the D line.  But don't like him as much as a pass rusher. PFF scores seem to back that up even though yesterday he had his sacks.  

 

He played contain well on those play action roll outs. That was clearly something we saw on film and prepared for. Those two sacks he just stayed at home backside and waited for Ridder to come to him. 

 

If I had been Atlanta I would have run that more to Young's side and tested his discipline.

[petey hodge]

Rewatched the entire game again s

last night. 
 

with nothing better to do watching the Falcons offense, I watched each of CY99’s snaps.  
 

It was surprising how much a non factor is he has was.  Not sure if they were running plays away from this side of the field.  Didn’t really see the all “the double teams” the O Line devoted to him.

 

he appeared to be a non factor.

 

am I missing something?

 

 

[KDawg]

37 minutes ago, petey hodge said:

Rewatched the entire game again s

last night. 
 

with nothing better to do watching the Falcons offense, I watched each of CY99’s snaps.  
 

It was surprising how much a non factor is he has was.  Not sure if they were running plays away from this side of the field.  Didn’t really see the all “the double teams” the O Line devoted to him.

 

he appeared to be a non factor.

 

am I missing something?

 

 

I dont think he’s necessarily a non factor…his playing style is kind of boom or bust, but quarterbacks will always know where he is. 
 

I don’t agree with the takes that he is a must keep DL, he’s a game changer and Toohill isn’t very good. I think Chase is a good defensive end who will make plays and burn you at an equal rate. I also think he isn’t really a finisher. But he’s going to make the quarterback think about where he is for four quarters.

 

Toohill is a “do your job” end. He plays his responsibility and makes the plays that come to him. 
 

I think Toohill opposite either Sweat or Young is a net positive for the defense.

 

As for who I keep between Sweat and Young? Whichever gives us a better deal.

 

But I wouldn’t mind if it was CY at all.

Edited October 16, 2023 by KDawg

[lovemaskins]

I think we poorly manage Chase Young. I’d like to see us use him more like Dallas uses Paraons. Line him up everywhere and let him create havoc, and let the rest of the defense clean up after him. He doesn’t fit the rush in your lane to stop the run to the quarterback mentality. He’s a gamewrecker. JDR system is a disciplined system predicated on people being in place, gap responsibility.

 

That's not Chase at this point, and I think he’d be unblockable if you coach the defense that way. But his talent and ability jump off the screen weekly, and I’d hate to see a better coach use him correctly and he develop into the all pro we’ve been expecting. He’s the best athlete on the field most weeks…

[Warhead36]

1 minute ago, lovemaskins said:

I think we poorly manage Chase Young. I’d like to see us use him more like Dallas uses Paraons. Line him up everywhere and let him create havoc, and let the rest of the defense clean up after him. He doesn’t fit the rush in your lane to stop the run to the quarterback mentality. He’s a gamewrecker. JDR system is a disciplined system predicated on people being in place, gap responsibility.

 

That's not Chase at this point, and I think he’d be unblockable if you coach the defense that way. But his talent and ability jump off the screen weekly, and I’d hate to see a better coach use him correctly and he develop into the all pro we’ve been expecting. He’s the best athlete on the field most weeks…

He's not that kind of player. Parsons is a freak of nature. Dude runs a 4.3 40 and has experience playing every position. Young is a pure DE. 

[lovemaskins]

7 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

He's not that kind of player. Parsons is a freak of nature. Dude runs a 4.3 40 and has experience playing every position. Young is a pure DE. 

Dude, Chase young is a monster, it’s why he went 2nd overall. He’s 6’5” 270 and quick as a cat. But JDR wants him to play in a phone booth. That’s not his game, doesn’t mean he sucks, just not using him to his skill set.

 

I’d love to see him used like Couglin used Strahan and Osi Umenyiora in New York. NASCAR lineup, they lined those guys up all over the field. They were unblockable. JDR could learn a thing or two from that defense instead of “Do you job”🤨

Edited October 17, 2023 by lovemaskins

[Skinsinparadise]

 

 

[Voice_of_Reason]

4 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

 

If Leno comes back, the really need to try Lucas at RT. 

[Voice_of_Reason]

7 hours ago, Warhead36 said:

If they swapped Ridder for Howell they run away with their division

Well, they might swap Ridder with Hallock, and he might make fewer mistakes and that might do it.  As long as Hallock doesn’t get visions of grandeur and sticks to an handing off the ball and throwing passes behind the LOS, he’s be an upgrade to Ridder.  

[NoCalMike]

One thing I've been a little (maybe more than a little now that we are almost done with second month of the season?) is that we aren't seeing the short crossing routes that take advantage of the route running of Terry & Dotson.  One of Dotson's best attributes as a rookie was his ability to create space off the line of scrimmage immediately with his first couple of steps.  It seems like so far, so much of the short passing game has been to stationary targets just sitting in a zone waiting on their 4-5 yard completion with zero opportunity for YAC.  When they have ran some crossing routes deeper on the field, they've worked.  The one Dotson dropped against the Falcons is likely a TD if he catches it.

 

I want to see more plays where they are designed to get the ball to the WR's while running in stride and not just on deep passes.

[Warhead36]

14 minutes ago, NoCalMike said:

One thing I've been a little (maybe more than a little now that we are almost done with second month of the season?) is that we aren't seeing the short crossing routes that take advantage of the route running of Terry & Dotson.  One of Dotson's best attributes as a rookie was his ability to create space off the line of scrimmage immediately with his first couple of steps.  It seems like so far, so much of the short passing game has been to stationary targets just sitting in a zone waiting on their 4-5 yard completion with zero opportunity for YAC.  When they have ran some crossing routes deeper on the field, they've worked.  The one Dotson dropped against the Falcons is likely a TD if he catches it.

 

I want to see more plays where they are designed to get the ball to the WR's while running in stride and not just on deep passes.

I agree but everytime we run them it seems like we have two receivers running in the same spot causing a traffic mess.

 

I'd work the seems too. Some of Howell's best throws have been right down the middle(the McLaurin TD in the Denver game, the Thomas TD or maybe near TD can't remember against Philly among others).

[RVAskins]

4 hours ago, NewCliche21 said:

 

Barton? What?

 

No Toohill? Maybe it's a snap count thing, I don't get it.

Barton actually had a decent game.

[MrJL]

If we do put Lucas at RT do we move Wylie to LG?

 

While out RBs didn't do much taking hand offs each of them got one or two good runs and contributed in the passing game.  We only ran the ball 17 times

 

Also, seen some talk about getting away with a penalty at the end.  Well, the Falcons got away with some to.  There was an offensive hold where someone, I think JSW got by the Allanta OL, and was pulled back in a way that had to be a hold.  And the reason Dyami Brown had to try and fail to pull in a one handed catch was because the defender was holding his other arm

[Warhead36]

8 minutes ago, MrJL said:

If we do put Lucas at RT do we move Wylie to LG?

 

Charles has been pretty good at LG by all counts.

 

You move Wylie to the bench.

[MrJL]

1 minute ago, Warhead36 said:

Charles has been pretty good at LG by all counts.

 

You move Wylie to the bench.

19 pressures allowed