Welcome to the Redskins Chase Young DE Ohio State

[nonniey]

2 hours ago, dyst said:

Was Rueban Foster even good when he was healthier and with the 49ers? Some have a lot of hope for him.

Yes he was good in his rookie year.

 

[Sacks 'n' Stuff]

5 hours ago, Burgundy Yoda said:

the 2nd round has hot been friendly to us.

Boy you ain't kidding. If you look at how we've used all of our 2nd round picks since Snyder bought the team, it is mindblowingly bad.

1 hour ago, 98ORAKPO98 said:

Reuban Foster is the offspring of Ray Lewis, Brian Urlacher, Mike Singletary, and D!ck Butkus.

And one part Jabar Gaffney

[Malapropismic Depository]

1 hour ago, spjunkies said:

My sources are telling me that Chase Young will be the pick for the Washington Redskins in the upcoming NFL draft. 

 

My source is telling me it will be Isaiah Simmons.

But then again, my source is a pineapple.

So that that, FWIW

[D’Pablo]

17 minutes ago, Sacks 'n' Stuff said:

And one part Jabar Gaffney

I think you meant Taylor Jacobs.

[Malapropismic Depository]

Just now, D’Pablo said:

I think you meant Taylor Jacobs.

 

Is there really that much of a difference ?

[D’Pablo]

Just now, Malapropismic Depository said:

 

Is there really that much of a difference ?

Only in the amount of time Redskins fans deluded themselves...

[mistertim]

5 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

We take Laron Landry over Adrian Peterson.

 

Oh dear lord, I'd forgotten how bad we ****ed up on that 2007 draft. We drafted Laron "I love PEDs and being a bodybuilder" Landry with Adrian Peterson, Patrick Willis, Marshawn Lynch, and Darrelle Revis still on the board. Three sure-fire first ballot Hall of Famers and one borderline (Lynch). 

 

[Mr. Sinister]

Landry was a great pick (for Gregg Williams defense). What happened with him is unfortunately more to do with bad luck/organizational dysfunction than him sucking.

[Burgundy Yoda]

5 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

I am not down on Payne.  I like him, I just had two points about that pick.

 

A.  Payne thus far represents the typical Redskins player we get excited about.  He's one of our best players, he's a good player.  But he's not as of yet one of the best players in the league or some super star.  That's somewhat been the theme of this team under Dan.  We've had some nice players but no special ones sans Sean and maybe Trent.

 

B.  Many of us wanted Derwin James.  We skipped him.  He was a star at least his rookie year.  First team All Pro.  We don't do First Team All Pro.  We take Laron Landry over Adrian Peterson.   We take Carlos Rodgers over Demarcus Ware.  We take Trent Murphy and let Dallas get D. Lawrence.  We take Kerrigan and skip Watt.  We take Malcomb Kelly instead Calais Campbell. Devin Thomas instead of Jordy Nelson or Desean Jackson.  On and on and on.

 

I know some say its easy to say this with 20-20 hindsight.  My response to that is some of us liked these other players.  I've been part of the draft thread for a long time.  We've liked some of those guys.  But it wouldn't matter anyway.  The bar for our FO shouldn't be whether they are better draft pickers than the average fan -- we'd expect better than that.  They are supposedly the professionals.    It's one thing to get it wrong sometimes.  But they've passed on a lot of elite players that where right there for them to draft. 

 

And if If I recall correctly we are the only team without a first team All Pro player in the last 20 years aside from a punter.  Most have had multiple first team All Pros.  Heck the Lions have had a bad run like us.  But they had C. Johnson, Bernie Sanders. they've had some legendary players.  What legendary player have we had under Dan?  Really no one aside from Sean's brief career IMO. 

I'm pretty much in agreeance with you when it comes to Payne. I'm not sure if you share the same opinion on me about his ceiling like I do, with his athleticism for his size and power I think he has a lot of room to grow and I have his ceiling pretty high (in comparison to say, Jonathan Allen).  

 

A. Yeah, in my opinion, Champ Bailey is the only dominant player we've ever drafted under Snyder (If it even counts,I'm not sure if Snyder was in the office during the 1999 draft). Sean was close and would have been there, but he wasn't. Trent is/was also close but I don't quite put him there either because of injuries. 

 

B. This defense with Derwin James would have been further along, definitely. Ioannidis, Settle, and Allen is a fine rotation at DT, so Payne was sort of a luxury pick, but I also don't think the team anticipated the Ioannidis breakout when they drafted Payne. Team success still has a bit to do with first-team all-pro selections. Champ Bailey played amazing for us for 5 seasons, his last season with us he should have been 1st team All-Pro. What happens? He gets traded, has a worse season and somehow gets 1st team All-Pro with Denver. You can't make this up.

 

Hard to disagree with you, we need elite talent. After the draft this year, if nobody turns into an elite 1st team All-Pro player, I give up. We haven't had this much young talent in a while, most of the time the rosters are filled with mercenaries. Hopefully, someone breaks through and if it's Haskins we're going to win a super bowl in the next 5-7 years. 

Edited April 19, 2020 by Burgundy Yoda

[mistertim]

6 minutes ago, Mr. Sinister said:

Landry was a great pick (for Gregg Williams defense). What happened with him is unfortunately more to do with bad luck/organizational dysfunction than him sucking.

 

I think Landry was an ok pick but there were guys on the board who were much better. As far as what happened with him, some of it was bad luck with injuries, some of it was just him and bad decisions (with how he treated his injuries, doing PEDs, and focusing on becoming some huge bodybuilder). I don't really necessarily see an organizational thing because it isn't like he became a superstar after we cut him loose. He had one good year with the Jets, then busted in Indy after being mediocre and then being suspended for PEDs. He tested positive twice again after that for PEDs.

 

I was ok with the pick at the time, but mostly just because he'd be playing along with ST and seeing two headhunters prowling the secondary would be really fun to watch. I actually remember really really wanting us to draft Willis with that pick, and also considering Revis as a guy who could be a great shut down corner. RB wasn't really something I was focused on as far as our draft but damn I was impressed with AP's college tape. 

 

I guess it just comes back to us really sucking when it comes to finding elite All-Pro level game changing talent. We either have the worst luck at it, we've had **** for scouting, or we had decent scouting but dunces making the decisions in the end despite the scouts (Vinny, Dan, Bruce). 

[Burgundy Yoda]

 

 

 

1

52 minutes ago, mistertim said:

 

Oh dear lord, I'd forgotten how bad we ****ed up on that 2007 draft. We drafted Laron "I love PEDs and being a bodybuilder" Landry with Adrian Peterson, Patrick Willis, Marshawn Lynch, and Darrelle Revis still on the board. Three sure-fire first ballot Hall of Famers and one borderline (Lynch). 

 

The team got dumb and fell for the "Area 51" hype. This was an example of the FO overvaluing their own talent. They had Clinton Portis, why draft Adrian Peterson? They had London Fletcher, why draft Patrick Willis? Lastly, they had Carlos Rogers, why draft Darrelle Revis? God, I hope this FO doesn't overrate their talent like this team has done in the past. 

[Koolblue13]

7 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

 

And if If I recall correctly we are the only team without a first team All Pro player in the last 20 years aside from a punter.

TBF, he's a hell of a punter though, amirite?

4 hours ago, Malapropismic Depository said:

my source is a pineapple.

 

Pineapple is wonderful. I'm growing some. Pretty cool. 3 years to fruit. Just amazing. 

[PartyPosse]

1 hour ago, Burgundy Yoda said:

This defense with Derwin James would have been further along, definitely. Ioannidis, Settle, and Allen is a fine rotation at DT, so Payne was sort of a luxury pick

Not to nitpick but Settle was drafted 4 rounds after Payne so technically he wasn’t A skin yet.

[Burgundy Yoda]

1 minute ago, PartyPosse said:

Not to nitpick but Settle was drafted 4 rounds after Payne so technically he wasn’t A skin yet.

I didn't word that right. I know they were in the same draft, what I was trying to say was in general, that is a fine DT rotation.

[Darrell Green Fan]

13 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

Part of this team's demise under Dan IMO is definitely the lack of star power which I think has not only hurt the team's performance but also made it a really boring team that gets no national attention. 

 

How ironic seeing how obsessed he was about buying star power for much of his time here.  

[Skinsinparadise]

15 minutes ago, Darrell Green Fan said:

 

How ironic seeing how obsessed he was about buying star power for much of his time here.  

 

Yep I know.  And I think for this reason the Redskins roster building can get twisted especially by the national media.  They recall some of the high profile FA signings where they've attempted to bring star power.  Though the reality of that has been mostly former stars not in their prime or overpaying for dudes who were never stars.  There were some exceptions like Haynesworth, etc. But this is not a franchise that has gone the star route in spite of their attempts. 

 

I think Bruce more than anyone has contributed to the downfall of the franchise with more causal fans (who you need to fill a stadium) as a national attention type franchise.  Pre Bruce, this team was at least a little interesting even though they did things the wrong way.  Bruce was mostly yawn in FA.  Old school Redskins (under Dan) were losers but somewhat interesting.  Under Bruce they were losers (worse record than Vinny) and boring.   We can't even get a SNF game anymore because not enough people care to watch us.  That wasn't the case pre Bruce.

 

I don't think any of this stuff is a reason to draft Chase Young.  But IMO Chase will likely bring seriously needed gravy to the franchise.  You put on a football show and Chase is almost always there, being interviewed or talked about.  No one is talking about dudes like Daron Payne.   We've not really had a genuine star under Dan with the exception of Sean's last seson and RG3 in 2012.  And I can't think of a franchise more starving for star power than this one.   

 

Edited April 19, 2020 by Skinsinparadise

[Skinsinparadise]

12 hours ago, Koolblue13 said:

I agree with all of that and was super excited thinking Fitz was gonna fall to us.

 

Supposedly they loved Fitz and Derwin James pre-draft.  I loved both players, too.  I was constantly pushing the both of them.  I just whined more about James in retrospect since that was the dude we passed over not Fitz.  

 

And Doug admitted that there wasn't a consensus in the draft room about picking Payne.  If I had to guess it was Jay-Kyle for James.  And Doug, Bruce, Dan for Payne.  Reason for that is Doug alluded to him being on team Payne.  And a mod insider here said Jay wasn't for Payne.  And I've heard multiple times Kyle and Jay were typically aligned on players.

 

It's not that I disagree that D line > S.  I am a build in the trenches guy.  But I'd take a special player in one position over a good position player in another.  And ironically the Derwin James type players some are now saying are more valuable.  He's not just a safety.  He covers in the slot.  He plays some LB.  He rushes the passer.  Isaiah Simmons is somewhat of an outgrowth of the James profile.  It's the hybrid defender type that so many say is the new wave of the NFL. 

 

The fact that they got Settle later in that draft and the subsequent draft was loaded with DTs make the pick look even dumber IMO.  And that's not because I didn't like Payne.  I like Payne.  I did prefer Vea who also arguably has been the better player including as a pass rusher.   But Payne was just behind him to me.  And they couldn't take Vea anyway since he went first. 

 

It's spilled milk.  But passing over players in the draft who ended up stars in the NFL seems to be a theme under Dan.  Obviously it hasn't been intentional.  But its not like we've been unfortunate and simply don't have these dudes fall to our pick.  We've passed over our share of studs in the draft and even traded our picks away multiple times for other teams to find their All Pros.  It's been borderline comical. 

 

Having said that, I do have faith in Kyle now that he's in control.  And I'd put money that Chase Young helps break their miserable streak on this count. 😀  Also if there is a chance for Payne to develop (Allen, too) than more than just a good player -- Chase is the ticket to help make that happen. 

 

Edited April 19, 2020 by Skinsinparadise

[max21]

11 hours ago, dyst said:

Was Rueban Foster even good when he was healthier and with the 49ers? Some have a lot of hope for him.

He was a monster his first year. 

[Skinsinparadise]

Finally a WP columnist who gets it on this point.  Brewer isn't in the trade down camp.   😀

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/redskins/chase-young-is-the-obvious-pick-for-the-redskins-and-theres-no-need-to-overthink-it/2020/04/17/73b45e5c-810a-11ea-9040-68981f488eed_story.html?utm_campaign=wp_redskins&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter

Many regard Young as the best talent in this draft. If football weren’t such a quarterback-driven sport, he would be a legitimate challenger to Burrow for the No. 1 pick. In this case, the Bengals’ need at that position — and Burrow’s status as an Ohio native — gives Washington a chance to add a player with superstar ability to a roster desperate for an athlete with franchise-player talent. Young, a prodigy who played at DeMatha High, has been front of mind since the 2019 season ended. Redskins quarterback Dwayne Haskins, who played with Young at Ohio State, left for the offseason with a simple message.

“Two words: Chase Young,” he said. “That’s all I got to say.”

 

That’s all he needed to say. You can make legitimate arguments about the many needs the Redskins have as Coach Ron Rivera tries to rebuild the franchise. You can imagine the possibilities of using the No. 2 pick to trade down and fill more holes. But the biggest issue with the roster is that it lacks a game-changing, top-five-at-his-position, perennial all-pro who plays a premier position. Ideally, if you want to chase championships, a team would like to have three or four of those players. The Redskins have none.

 

There is plenty of solid young talent, including Haskins, Jonathan Allen, Daron Payne, Matt Ioannidis, Terry McLaurin and Derrius Guice. But the team doesn’t have a defining player, someone so gifted and deserving of the opponent’s attention that he makes the game significantly easier for his teammates.

Young is that kind of talent. The coaches need to smooth out some rough edges and teach him the nuances of pass rushing at the NFL level, but his continued improvement doesn’t require magic. It’s all about polishing and refining.

 

For the past five years, the Redskins have done a solid job of drafting and stockpiling good players who have contributed to a good culture in the locker room. In that sense, they have functioned the way a franchise should. But what did stringing together good and pretty good drafts do for former coach Jay Gruden? The Redskins went to the playoffs once, hovered around .500 and then fell apart last season. Some of the blame can fall on Gruden and the old coaching staff, but you must look at what the Redskins were building.

 

They weren’t ambitious enough or, rather, they weren’t skilled enough in going beyond the template for team building and understanding when to play it safe and when to go after dynamic athletes who tilt the game in their favor. The greatest example is the 2018 draft, when they took Payne at No. 13, even though a highly regarded safety, Derwin James, was dropping inexplicably. Payne is a good player, and he will be even better under Rivera and defensive coordinator Jack Del Rio. But James was an all-pro as a rookie with the Los Angeles Chargers (who grabbed him with the 17th pick), and he plays a more pivotal position in today’s NFL, with its emphasis on speed, versatility and the ability to make plays in space.

In 2018, Washington overthought the obvious pick. Rivera would be wise not to start his tenure with a similar mistake.

 

When weighing value, there are ways to crunch the numbers and make a strong case for trading down. My colleague, Barry Svrluga, did just that recently. But if Washington projects Young to be a superstar, as many other teams do, the value of such a talent is difficult to scale.

 

....Of course, the San Francisco roster was in better shape than the one in Washington. But drafting Young could make that D-line — which isn’t as good as its investment just yet — special. In particular, the attention required to keep Young in check could be the key to unlocking all that Allen has to offer. He could allow Kerrigan to slide into a role on the opposite side that would extend his time as a standout player. His arrival would put Montez Sweat and Ioannidis — who combined for 15.5 sacks last season — in specialized, non-starter roles. The defensive line’s rotation would be incredible and multifaceted, and Del Rio’s track record indicates he knows how to leverage such a gift.

Edited April 19, 2020 by Skinsinparadise

[98ORAKPO98]

The WP writer above seems to think Kerrigan will be the starter, I'm not so foolish then am I eh? Kerrigan will dominate next year, as could Sweat and Young, regardless of who starts. Same can be said in the Allen,  Ioannidis, Payne debate. 

[ntotoro]

6 hours ago, Mr. Sinister said:

Landry was a great pick (for Gregg Williams defense). What happened with him is unfortunately more to do with bad luck/organizational dysfunction than him sucking.

Had more than just a little to do with his fascination with PED’s than anything else, including a bad FO.

[carex]

5 hours ago, Burgundy Yoda said:

I didn't word that right. I know they were in the same draft, what I was trying to say was in general, that is a fine DT rotation.

 

we needed a nose tackle, we didn't know we'd be switching back to a 4-3 in two years

[mistertim]

1 hour ago, 98ORAKPO98 said:

The WP writer above seems to think Kerrigan will be the starter, I'm not so foolish then am I eh? Kerrigan will dominate next year, as could Sweat and Young, regardless of who starts. Same can be said in the Allen,  Ioannidis, Payne debate. 

 

Still don't see any specific reason for it. IMO Sweat is just as good against the run as Kerrigan, especially because of his length to keep blockers off of his body while sealing the edge, and his freakish athleticism to be able to get to RBs who try to bounce outside. During his rookie season Sweat had a PFF run defense grade of 67.2 which is better than Kerrigan's 55 grade. Pass rushing Sweat took a while but he really came along in the end; he was just raw but once things started clicking for him he was getting to the QB well and ended with 7 sacks, which is pretty good for a rookie. 

 

Some of the issues with Sweat also may very well have been scheme as they dropped him too often into coverage and our defense last year was apparently just a cluster**** with no real unified game plan between the various coaches and Manusky being a dip****. But the same could be said about Kerrigan.

 

Either way, as has been noted previously, guys on the DL are going to get rotated plenty I'm guessing so "starter" doesn't mean as much as it does at other positions. But with his really good play in the latter half of the season and his crazy upside, I'd be more prone to trying to get Sweat as many reps as possible to start maximizing his huge potential. 

[mistertim]

19 minutes ago, carex said:

 

we needed a nose tackle, we didn't know we'd be switching back to a 4-3 in two years

 

Eh, that's not really all that relevant IMO. Most 4-3 defensive packages nowadays (Under and Over, for example) still utilize a "nose tackle", though he's generally a 1 tech and not an old school 0 tech. But we usually played Payne as a 1 tech, or a shaded 0, anyway from what I saw the last couple of seasons. 

 

Anyway, regarding Payne, it was still reaching for need while passing on elite talent. We need a LT and we have plenty of good players on the DL...should we pass on Chase Young because of that and draft Thomas, Wirfs, or Wills? Of course not.

 

Granted, James wasn't nearly the unanimous beast that Chase Young is but he was graded out by most scouts who I read as being elite traits. I think one of his draft issues (outside of possible injury concerns)was that people weren't positive what to really do with him as such a hybrid player. That's not the case anymore as we see with Simmons skyrocketing up the boards in the last few months. 

Edited April 19, 2020 by mistertim

[Riggo#44]

23 hours ago, mistertim said:

So clearly teams were not nearly as scared of Payne or Allen as they were of Ioan, and it showed. But he still put up some very good numbers for an interior DL. IMO at the moment Ioan is definitely our best interior DL.

 

I knew Ioannidis was good, but not that good. That's interesting. Wasn't Allen injured last year though? I thought he had a nagging injury. Payne though, I thought would be more of a pass rusher. I am really excited about having a legitimate DC this year--for the first time since Gregg Williams. It's clear to me that the previous staff was not getting the best out of anyone.