FAREWELL to the NFL Dwayne Haskins QB Ohio State

[justice98]

1 minute ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

 

So you sign a ****ing Brian Hoyer.  You don't trade picks for back up QBs.  And you certainly don't undermine any good faith attempt to develop a QB prospect by immediately and intentionally acquiring his replacement.

 

If that woulda been the thinking, they already know they have the wrong guy.  Rivera said Haskins got all the first team reps in camp, that's pretty much good faith. They didn't bring in Allen and make Haskins split reps with him.

[Skinsinparadise]

37 minutes ago, HTTRDynasty said:

 

I just don't see how you can justify to the fanbase your plan at QB being Keenum and McCoy.  You're just telegraphing a lost season without a plan for the future.

 

It's not like every draft at your spot where you pick you have an automatic likely out with a young QB ready to shine.  Sometimes it takes a season or two to find that guy.

37 minutes ago, HTTRDynasty said:

 

I thought we had inside sources saying he would have picked Jones if he was forced to take a QB and Jones was available?  I just don't see who else he would have taken other than Lock.  Maybe Minshew, but that would have been the 5th or 6th round, which would have made it clear he wasn't the QBOTF.

 

 

If "forced" is the operative word.  He shouldn't have been forced.  You used PFF's ratings to try to back a point about Haskins the other day.   PFF isn't your friend when it comes to Jones versus Haskins.  i am not a Jones guy myself.  He's not exactly brimming with talent all around him.  Jay preferring Jones over Haskins isn't exactly an egg on your face type of opinion in this given time.  Will see.  I am not a Jones guy personally, I think he and Haskins both end up just guys at best in the NFL. 

 

And like I said Dan shouldn't override his football people's opinion.  By your responses your point seems to be yes in theory except for when he likes a player that you might like, too. 

37 minutes ago, HTTRDynasty said:

 

I just find it fascinating that fans are willing to give up on a 23-year old kid after 4 starts in a new system, but not a 58-year old man who has made several serious missteps so far in the short time he's been here.  Not necessarily referring to you, since I know you've never been a fan of Haskins, but moreso the excuses that get made for one person over the other, when one has far more power, and therefore, far more responsibility, than the other.

 

I never believed in Haskins from the jump.  I am not giving up afer being a believer.   As much as a few here liked him before the draft, some didn't love him at all.  i was openly rooting against them taking Haskins on draft day with another regular on the draft thread.    

 

I am willing to be open about Haskins if the coaches dug him.  i'd change my mind.  They know miles more about him than i do.   But if they see it the same way i did before the draft, why would i cry about it.  i'd feel the same way if I were a Giants fan and their coaches gave up on Daniel Jones.

 

 

[Est.1974]

2 minutes ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

 

So you sign a ****ing Brian Hoyer.  You don't trade picks for back up QBs.  And you certainly don't undermine any good faith attempt to develop a QB prospect by immediately and intentionally acquiring his replacement.

Signing Allen should have been a fairly significant motivational factor in Haskins development. Allen was a clear threat that should have driven Haskins up the curve quicker. 
 

He kinda got so far up the curve, then **** the bed.

[MartinC]

1 hour ago, KDawg said:

 

People did NOT think LB was a hole. I would know, I was battling them daily. 

I did and have the posts to prove it 🙂

[justice98]

19 minutes ago, HTTRDynasty said:

 

You must not know a lot of Raiders fans or frequent NFL Gen boards.  Fans were calling for his head in the offseason Gruden was hired.  But Gruden was smart and patient, and eventually surrounded Carr with weapons.

 

What fans think is irrelevant. Who cares. Only matters what Gruden thought.  There was plenty of tape that said Carr could play.

[KDawg]

Just now, MartinC said:

I did and have the posts to prove it 🙂

You were in the fight with me.

[HTTRDynasty]

7 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

It's not like every draft at your spot where you pick you have an automatic likely out with a young QB ready to shine.  Sometimes it takes a season or two to find that guy.

 

If "forced" is the operative word.  He shouldn't have been forced.  You used PFF's ratings to try to back a point about Haskins the other day.   PFF isn't your friend when it comes to Jones versus Haskins.  i am not a Jones guy myself.  He's not exactly brimming with talent all around him.  Jay preferring Jones over Haskins isn't exactly an egg on your face type of opinion in this given time.  Will see.  I am not a Jones guy personally, I think he and Haskins both end up just guys at best in the NFL. 

 

And like I said Dan shouldn't override his football people's opinion.  By your responses your point seems to be yes in theory except for when he likes a player that you might like, too. 

 

I never believed in Haskins from the jump.  I am not giving up afer being a believer.   As much as a few here liked him before the draft, some didn't love him at all.  i was openly rooting against them taking Haskins on draft day with another regular on the draft thread.    

 

I am willing to be open about Haskins if the coaches dug him.  i'd change my mind.  They know miles more about him than i do.   But if they see it the same way i did before the draft, why would i cry about it.  i'd feel the same way if I were a Giants fan and their coaches gave up on Daniel Jones.

 

 

 

Haskins was rated higher than Jones by PFF last year, and Jones is rated higher this year.  I've never disputed that.  Not sure why you and KDawg seem to imply I don't like PFF when it doesn't agree with me.  I've never said anything like that.

[Darrell Green Fan]

2 hours ago, IrepDC said:

Nah I don't like QBR honestly lol how about top 10 passing yards? 

 

Yeah OK, I feel pretty safe making this bet. How do we keep track? Not a chance I remember your name in 5 years.  Send me a PM? 

2 hours ago, IrepDC said:

Look at the team the Bears have now though. While giving Mitch a chance, they built up their team. Their defense is solid and aggressive. Their offense has a good line, decent running game, and a few nice weapons. Their team is much more talented now than when they drafted Mitch so even with his failure, their team is playing better and winning right now.

 

What improvement have we made to our roster since drafting Haskins? We draft QBs, ask them to be our savior, give them weak talent and inconsistent coaching. You think this dysfunction that leads nowhere is better than the Bears building a team while giving Mitch a chance? Bringing another young QB in while their roster was weak would have been a waste, but that is exactly what I expect us to do.

 

In the end, neither team has "their" prospect, but only one organization actually has a respectable football team. 

 

And what is remarkable is the price they paid to move up for Tribinsky and they STILL built a very good team.  Why can't we ever do that? 

The good news is the Giants appeared to have also drafted a bust, the Eagles are committed to a QB who is playing very poorly and who knows what will become of the
Cowboys' QB situation. 

[Skinsinparadise]

2 hours ago, KDawg said:

 

 

I think Judge is looking at Jones the way that Rivera looked at Haskins, but is giving him more room to operate due to the difference in how Jones handles himself versus Haskins.

 

To me this is the operative point that seems to escape some in this debate.  If you follow what's been said about Jones, he shows up at the facilities at 4:30 am sometimes.  He's supposeldy an animal work ethic wise.  I heard a NY reporter talk on air about how last year the staff loves the dude because of his personality and work ethic.

 

Haskins doesn't have that same rep.   It looked like he was finally turning the corner this off season -- Rivera said Haskins basically transformed his personality.  But clearly it didn't hold.  Just rewatch one of the early Rivera pressers when he came here.  Ditto Scott Turner.  ditto Doug Williams.  They all referenced work ethic being key.  The Qb sets an example for the rest of the team on that front.  They laid out the challenge for Haskins thick.  We posted their comments on this thread at the time.  Haskins initially met that challange but it sounds like it didn't last.  And that's just the work ethic stuff, forget the immaturity questions.

 

Some are acting like the point has never come up about Haskins and its all new fangled stuff to bad mouth the dude as he likely walks out the door.  That's ridicilous. Haskins' questionable work ethic was the thick part of the plot line last year, multiple stories about it.  National reporters talked about it.  So did local ones.   An Ohio State reporter joked about it.  It was even a minor plotline about Haskins before the draft among draft geeks.  For people to pretend none of this existed and its all new are living in fantasy land.  All of this stuff has been documented on this very thread a million times.

 

Why ride a dude through thick and thin when you don't believe in his intangibes.  Every QB isn't the same guy.  Goff's work ethic has been praised.   He and Haskins aren't the same cat.  Every QB brings a different skill set and different personality.  you can't just say one perfectly correlates to another. 

 

https://www.latimes.com/sports/nfl/la-sp-nfl-draft-goff-20160424-story.html

Jared Goff’s laid-back nature, blue-collar work ethic could be a first-class ticket to the top of NFL draft

[DJHJR86]

People are aware that Kyle Allen can be the best quarterback on this roster and also not be the guy going forward?  Both of these things can be true.

37 minutes ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

 

I know you think that.  I think you're wrong and I think this "lazy and uppity" narrative that our fan base has eaten up about the kid is nasty and says more about the fan base than it does about him.

 

So why aren't you advocating for him to be traded so he can prove everyone wrong once and for all?

[Skinsinparadise]

15 minutes ago, HTTRDynasty said:

 

Haskins was rated higher than Jones by PFF last year, and Jones is rated higher this year.  I've never disputed that.  Not sure why you and KDawg seem to imply I don't like PFF when it doesn't agree with me.  I've never said anything like that.

 

Because there were some who thought Lock looked better than Haskins did last year.  It's not a fact that Haskins played better just because PFF had a better rating and that's the metric you used to make the point.  

 

For some within PFF, their current take on Haskins isn't kind and i don't mean just their grades.  They aren't Kyle Allen guys either. 

[DJHJR86]

I understand why people are upset at the seemingly double standard that Haskins has vs. the way Alex Smith has been treated.  For one, we do not know what happened behind the scenes to cause Haskins to be demoted to 3rd string.  Second, Alex Smith is just as much as, if not more, of the owner's pet as Haskins is.  A very small part of me thinks that one reason Rivera insisted on keeping Smith out there in the second half was to show Snyder (who was rumored to have been pushing for Smith if Haskins was going to be benched) how terrible he is.  

[IrepDC]

17 minutes ago, Darrell Green Fan said:

 

And what is remarkable is the price they paid to move up for Tribinsky and they STILL built a very good team.  Why can't we ever do that? 

The good news is the Giants appeared to have also drafted a bust, the Eagles are committed to a QB who is playing very poorly and who knows what will become of the
Cowboys' QB situation. 

We can't do it, because of the loser culture I keep talking about. We undervalue our talent and/or run our talent out of town. We over value players on other teams. We put players in bad situations and ask them to overcome it. We are very quick to air dirty laundry, and we throw a new player under the bus every year. We aren't a team players generally want to stay with, and I suspect we are one of the more insufferable fanbases and media-bases to deal with. Building a team with depth is also not something we understand i.e. guys who might be good depth or backups, we trash and disregard. I really am a fan of this team lol but I have watched the culture long enough to call it out.

 

 

[Mr. Sinister]

7 minutes ago, DJHJR86 said:

 A very small part of me thinks that one reason Rivera insisted on keeping Smith out there in the second half was to show Snyder (who was rumored to have been pushing for Smith if Haskins was going to be benched) how terrible he is.  

 

Oh god 🤦‍♂️

[DJHJR86]

5 minutes ago, Mr. Sinister said:

 

Oh god 🤦‍♂️

 

Cooley and Sheehan have brought this up multiple times on Sheehan's podcast.  They are saying that it had to be a way for Rivera to soften the blow of benching Haskins.  

[Vanguard]

16 minutes ago, DJHJR86 said:

 A very small part of me thinks that one reason Rivera insisted on keeping Smith out there in the second half was to show Snyder (who was rumored to have been pushing for Smith if Haskins was going to be benched) how terrible he is.  

 

Well I hope not, because Dan should know by now he has no business making football decisions.

[DJHJR86]

2 minutes ago, Vanguard said:

 

Well I hope not, because Dan should know by now he has no business making football decisions.

 

Lol, no he doesn't.

[DJHJR86]

 

 

Never heard this before.  Interesting.  

[dyst]

35 minutes ago, Vanguard said:

because Dan should know by now he has no business making football decisions.

If it is ONE thing Dan has proven by now, it is that he does not know anything.

[KDawg]

17 minutes ago, DJHJR86 said:

 

 

Never heard this before.  Interesting.  

Slander. There is no way there is any truth to this. Not a credible source.

[Skinsinparadise]

17 minutes ago, KDawg said:

Slander. There is no way there is any truth to this. Not a credible source.

 

It's going to be wild the one day where they uncover the deep plot to falsely malign Haskins' work ethic and intangibles.  Apparently 2 different coaching regimes are part of the wild plot.  The FO.  The local media.  The national media.  Some draft geeks.  And an Ohio State reporter.

 

The plot might be deeper than we can even comprehend.   We likely will find out we've been duped and heck yeah this could be a plot that runs wide and deep

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Darrell Green Fan]

1 hour ago, IrepDC said:

We can't do it, because of the loser culture I keep talking about. We undervalue our talent and/or run our talent out of town. We over value players on other teams. We put players in bad situations and ask them to overcome it. We are very quick to air dirty laundry, and we throw a new player under the bus every year. We aren't a team players generally want to stay with, and I suspect we are one of the more insufferable fanbases and media-bases to deal with. Building a team with depth is also not something we understand i.e. guys who might be good depth or backups, we trash and disregard. I really am a fan of this team lol but I have watched the culture long enough to call it out.

 

 

 

It was a retorical question.   We all know the reason this team has stunk for decades and that reason is Daniel Snyder.  But I'm curious, which good players have we run out of town?  

Just now, Skinsinparadise said:

 

It's going to be wild the one day where they uncover the deep plot to falsely malign Haskins' work ethic and intangibles.  Apparently 2 different coaching regimes are part of the wild plot.  The FO.  The local media.  The national media.  Some draft geeks.  And an Ohio State reporter.

 

 

 

 

 

This is the point I keep hammering home.  This isn't anything new, reports of Dwayne's lazy work habits have followed him throughout his career, then 2 different staffs here came to the same conclusion.

[Voice_of_Reason]

6 hours ago, mistertim said:

Then you see the BS with his agent tweeting dumb **** after the game. And I wonder if his benching was just the culmination of many things not related specifically to his performance (though if he's not working hard that would directly translate to performance as well so they go hand in hand).

I think you have to believe it was the culmination of a whole lot of things. 

 

The thing with Ron, is he has a track record of how he does things.  And one thing he is not known for is making rash decisions.  You can question a lot of what he does, but one thing you'll find is that he seems to be extremely pragmatic, and doesn't just have knee jerk reactions.  

 

Whatever it was that happened, I think it was the straw that broke the camel's back.  There were probably things leading up to it, but then whammo, something happened, and Haskins was relegated to water boy.  

 

 

[Skinsinparadise]

 

 

[GOATFrerotte]

Wow, Ron's comments. Seems like he's simply done with Haskins. Said he had 11 weeks as the starter. Even stated that he tried to be positive early because he wanted to build his confidence. Which is his way of saying it was nothing but bad. Pretty sure Haskins career here is done. I didn't want that for the young man, I just wanted to see Kyle Allen get some reps and see if he would be better. But in Ron I trust!