Always A Commander Never A Captain Posted December 10, 2018 Share Posted December 10, 2018 I'm not surprised by the loss at all. I'm not surprised we got blown out either. I think the writing was on the wall for this game ever since Colt McCoy broke his leg. I don't know how a locker room rebounds from 2 respected QB's going on IR. There's a possible Apocalypse scenario for our Cap. The Smith injury puts us in a bad bind. We have a projected $13.75 million in cap room next season. Draft picks will bring that number down to $8 million. How can we get that up to something we can work with? We need to be ruthless and heartless in our cuts. We can not afford to have someone on the roster whose massively underperforming their contract. If the backups produce 80% of what they do for a 25% of the cost, then we have to go with the backup. 2019 Cuts: Jordan Reed - saves $6.12 million Zach Brown - saves $5.75 million Stacy McGee - saves $2.28 million Chris Thompson - saves $3 million Mason Foster - saves $2 million These cuts would push us to $32.9 million in cap room. Or probably $27-28 million after draft picks are signed. This gives us breathing room, but might not be enough. Ryan Kerrigan would save us a lot of money, but there's nobody on the roster who can replace him. Same with Vernon Davis, but there isn't anybody like his vertical threat on the team. Kerrigan and Davis both are durable guys, who have a history of playing 16 games. That alone increases their value compared to guys like Thompson and Reed who might get you 15 games, 10 games, 5 games, or none. If the Apocalypse Cap Scenario happens, then we're likely cutting everybody who performs or not that's on their 2nd contract. Kerrigan, Davis, Williams, Norman, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dyst Posted December 10, 2018 Share Posted December 10, 2018 1 hour ago, Wildbunny said: So they ahve another opportunity at a SB trophy? No way! They are better than us anyways. As fans we should be tired of being spoilers. I know I am. We don’t have high draft picks, we don’t have great players, we don’t make the playoffs so our excitement comes from hoping others don’t do well. Just where we’re at as a franchise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voice_of_Reason Posted December 10, 2018 Share Posted December 10, 2018 I think the thing that irritated me most about yesterday was the complete lack of any type of ingenuity or creativeness in the offensive plan. Just sticking with the same-old-same-old, trying to get guards out pulling who have been here 5 minutes and are not really mobile, always running on first down, predictable pound-draw type of play. And then when they do try something creative, it's a jet-sweep to a guy I didn't even know was on the team... The plan was just bad. All the way around. It was the same plan, and it's been a bad plan, and it's going to continue to be a bad plan. It's as if Gruden/Manusky are just dead set to do it their way, even at the expense of trying to play to the strengths of their personnel or exploiting weaknesses in the other team. Yeah, Bruce is an idiot who needs to be fired. But these weren't the 1990 Parcells Giants with LT and Simms and the group. This is a 4-8 Giants team, who granted has been playing better, without arguably their best player (though Barkley would argue with that), they should not be 40-0 better than any NFL team which is well prepared. Period. Jay could get more out of these players if he wanted to. I'm not sure he really wants to anymore. Oh, and he said there would be no changes. I'm not sure what good a change would do at this point, but since you're out of it anyway, I have 2 suggestions: 1. Fire Manusky and promote Tomsula. I know Manusky and Tomsula are friends, and MAYBE Tomsula doesn't take the job, but it would send a message that this isn't good enough. 2. "Fire" himself, and turn play calling over to Kevin O'Connell. Coaches have done that from time to time when the offenses haven't been working. I'd also fire Cavanaugh because he can't possibly be having a positive effect anyway. Jay turned play calling over to McVay in 2015-2016, so he's not opposed to it. He should do it now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WelshSkinsFan Posted December 10, 2018 Share Posted December 10, 2018 1 hour ago, UK SKINS FAN '74 said: I agree, said yesterday that we should cut Sanchez. He sucks, Gruden has now benched him/sold him down the river. Makes no sense to keep him at all. As for the game, hard to see much when the then 4 win Giants could have hung the best part of 60 on us at home, without Beckham. Can't agree with this at this point. Sanchez was bad yesterday but he was badly hampered by a terrible performance from the OL which was understandable considering a couple of them only got in the building this week, he was also the victim of some pretty egregious drops by his receivers. I am not suggesting he is a great player but his stat line was badly impacted by the terrible performance around him. If we cut him, we then have to sign another retread who won't be any better and will also not have had 3 weeks in the building learning the playbook. Josh is slated to start the next 3 games but we have to have a backup and as bad as yesterday was Sanchez is the best option we have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomwvr Posted December 10, 2018 Share Posted December 10, 2018 1 hour ago, BurgundyBooger said: Tom Brady would have been mismanaged and miscoached were it not for the fertile foundation of winning New England had established. Do you think he'd be as successful in Washington had we drafted him instead of Quincy Sanders? What winning in New England before him? there really hadn’t been any since the70s Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
veteranskinsfan Posted December 10, 2018 Share Posted December 10, 2018 They are going to fire Manusky at the end of this season. You can tell because Jay keeps talking about defense issues in his last few press conferences. It is so typical of the Skins to fire one guy instead of blowing up the whole coaching staff because Jay signed a two year deal so he is safe for one more year. They have some veterans they signed who stink. The injury prone group of players need to be let go at the end of the year- there are about at least 4 players who fall into this category. Andy Reid has snookered the Redskins before if you remember the Donovan McNabb saga. Other teams love to make trade deals with our dumb management team. The Packers fooled us with HaHaClinton Dix who forgets how to tackle now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unbias Posted December 10, 2018 Share Posted December 10, 2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c slag Posted December 10, 2018 Share Posted December 10, 2018 So depressing especially since at one time the record was 6-3 That seems so long ago like it wasn't even this season Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wildbunny Posted December 10, 2018 Share Posted December 10, 2018 2 hours ago, A Skinhead in Saints Land said: Exactly, my point. Get your guy, let him put in his system and invoke his culture, and get the **** out the way. Just like Kraft did. My point is they'll go back to darkness fast as soon as both will retire. And both will retire at the same time. And honestly, no matters what both did, having your team nicknamed "Cheatriots" by opposing teams' fans wouldn't please me at all. Like you cannot win without cheating... 1 hour ago, dyst said: They are better than us anyways. As fans we should be tired of being spoilers. I know I am. We don’t have high draft picks, we don’t have great players, we don’t make the playoffs so our excitement comes from hoping others don’t do well. Just where we’re at as a franchise. I do agree on that. But sadly, that's all we have for now... So I'll take that... For now... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhead36 Posted December 10, 2018 Share Posted December 10, 2018 2 hours ago, Alcoholic Zebra said: I'm not surprised by the loss at all. I'm not surprised we got blown out either. I think the writing was on the wall for this game ever since Colt McCoy broke his leg. I don't know how a locker room rebounds from 2 respected QB's going on IR. There's a possible Apocalypse scenario for our Cap. The Smith injury puts us in a bad bind. We have a projected $13.75 million in cap room next season. Draft picks will bring that number down to $8 million. How can we get that up to something we can work with? We need to be ruthless and heartless in our cuts. We can not afford to have someone on the roster whose massively underperforming their contract. If the backups produce 80% of what they do for a 25% of the cost, then we have to go with the backup. 2019 Cuts: Jordan Reed - saves $6.12 million Zach Brown - saves $5.75 million Stacy McGee - saves $2.28 million Chris Thompson - saves $3 million Mason Foster - saves $2 million These cuts would push us to $32.9 million in cap room. Or probably $27-28 million after draft picks are signed. This gives us breathing room, but might not be enough. Ryan Kerrigan would save us a lot of money, but there's nobody on the roster who can replace him. Same with Vernon Davis, but there isn't anybody like his vertical threat on the team. Kerrigan and Davis both are durable guys, who have a history of playing 16 games. That alone increases their value compared to guys like Thompson and Reed who might get you 15 games, 10 games, 5 games, or none. If the Apocalypse Cap Scenario happens, then we're likely cutting everybody who performs or not that's on their 2nd contract. Kerrigan, Davis, Williams, Norman, etc. My plan would be to cut everyone that isn't on a rookie contract, although I'm okay with keeping Thompson since he's still fairly cheap, along with Dunbar and Swearinger. How much would we save cutting Trent Williams? I hate to suggest it, I love the big Silverback, but he's hurt all the time and commits a holding penalty EVERY week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burgold Posted December 10, 2018 Share Posted December 10, 2018 9 hours ago, KDawg said: People put blame on the training staff for the injuries, but to be honest, I think a lot of our injuries are just coming from guys who are routinely injury prone and I'm not sure it can be put on their shoulders. I think the solution might be kale. Kale, Broccoli, fish... anything with calcium in it. I think the Redskins are vitamin deficient. I'm kidding. I'm not sure I'm kidding. I do think the problem is multiple. I think endurance based. I think people get hurt more when they get tired. I think we focus too much on weight training and not on agility training and quickness. I suspect nutrition plays a part too. I also think I probably don't know what I'm talking about, but there's enough of a consistent problem that it's more than just blind bad luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BleedBNG Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 This is what I love... 3rd qtr. Redskins 3rd and 2 at NY22. DoubleJ throws to Floyd towards the left in the endzone... incomplete. Then he scrambles for 1 yard... turnover on downs. Way to go Gruden! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinny21 Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 Nicholson had a heck of a ST tackle. Way punted well (though it looked like he outputted the coverage team once). Crowder made up for his drop with that TD. JJ played pretty well all things considered. Was glad to see SDH get some PT. Thats all I got. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KillBill26 Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 3 hours ago, Alcoholic Zebra said: Ryan Kerrigan would save us a lot of money, but there's nobody on the roster who can replace him. Same with Vernon Davis, but there isn't anybody like his vertical threat on the team. Kerrigan and Davis both are durable guys, who have a history of playing 16 games. As someone who was so high on the short term future of the skins going into this season, it pains me to say it but I think blowing it up with a new coach/GM is probably our best approach. And if we are going to do it, I wouldn't view deciding whether to hang onto vs parting ways with a player based on the current depth behind them. I would somewhat consider leadership skills and mentoring younger players to some degree as a reason to maybe keep some of our aging vets, because we probably aren't going to be very competitive for the next couple years. That locker room could get pretty miserable. New coach, and there is no way we are going to have an average or better QB in 2019, so we are going to be pretty bad. Having said that, if we can get a decent draft pick in return for our current guys, we can bring aging high character guys on short term contracts to fill that role. So if kerrigan has any value on the trade market, get what we can for him. Same with Trent. I doubt we get anything for Davis, but we should cut him if we need the space to shed contracts or to sign someone that fits our long term plan. By the time we build the roster to make a run, Davis will not be part of the plan, so parting ways now isn't a bad idea. And if hanging onto aging players who aren't in the long term plan leads us to 6-10 instead of 3-13, we would be drafting 10th instead of 2nd. For what? A few meaningless wins? I'd be totally fine with having a terrible product on the field next year if it meant 1. We made changes to our front office/coaching staff and there is an adjustment period, 2. We shed all the bad contracts we could so there were some young inexperienced guys forced into action, and 3. It ultimately gives us a good shot at tua/fromm in 2020 draft. And if we shed enough bad contracts in 2019, maybe we could shed Smith's in 2020. I think we need to ignore sentimentality and our attachment to awesome players and people such as kerrigan and Trent, and do like pats did in trading Seymour and milloy, and make difficult moves that are in the best long term interest of this team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skins island connection Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 1 hour ago, Burgold said: I think the solution might be kale. Kale, Broccoli, fish... anything with calcium in it. I think the Redskins are vitamin deficient. I'm kidding. I'm not sure I'm kidding. I do think the problem is multiple. I think endurance based. I think people get hurt more when they get tired. I think we focus too much on weight training and not on agility training and quickness. I suspect nutrition plays a part too. I also think I probably don't know what I'm talking about, but there's enough of a consistent problem that it's more than just blind bad luck. Well, considering that one of the guys in that area came from a BASEBALL team! I could see it then; no one wants to see a 6'1 275 lb baseball player who can't run. They have to be lean and eating all that crazy health stuff. If you feel like blowing a little time, go take a gander at the assistant coaches on the team [ click on the 'more' tab on bottom of their page ] and see where these people came from. I did and put it in one of my replies, and I couldn't believe it! One guy came from the Tuskaloosa rubber Ducks, or something like that. Now THAT is scraping the barrel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redskinscub Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 Not sure why Bruce gets all of this hate, truth be known he has very little power in picking players. I like having the great George Allen's son in the organization, and until papers are produced that show him to be adopted, I am sticking with him. Just let him do what he does best which is the business side of things. We do need a sober version of Scott Mc in the organization. Many things have contributed to the Skins demise as I see it. The biggest thing is that there are just too many needs to fill via the draft and free agency. Like it or not, we are in a rebuilding mode. Defense should be our strength but chemistry seems to have gone away with the signing of Dix RGIII set us back years, and because of the way his situation was handled, Kurt did not want to be here. Alex Smith seemed like a good compromise to me, but now his signing will set us back years. We are letting players go without handing them a blank check like we have done before. I like that. Drafts have been better than average, but no impact players. We need someone that teams fear on each side of the ball. Sua could have been that guy on defense, he just did not want to be here as well. Jay is a terrible coach. I think he woke up one day and said, I want to be a head coach in the NFL. The skins wanted brother Jon, so Jay was a compromise. He should go find something he can do well, like participate in a Dan Aykroyd sound a like contest. We had McVay and I am sure they recognized what they had, but with Jay still being fairly new, no way we could have kept him happy here. Injuries have hurt, some of that is just bad luck, some of it is gambling on players with an injury history. My opinion is to continue to build thru the draft, get a real football guy to lead the organization, and get a real coach to coach the team. It will take years to turn this around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sempre_victrix Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 15 minutes ago, Redskinscub said: Drafts have been better than average, but no impact players. We need someone that teams fear on each side of the ball. Sua could have been that guy on defense, he just did not want to be here as well. Sua who? Cravens? Another wasted pick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wysknz1 Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 12 hours ago, KDawg said: The pain made me feel alive. But man, that was quite the stinker. So are you a cutter too? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinsfan35yrs. Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 11 hours ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said: I don’t see how firing Jay today does anything but appease the fans that want his blood. Other than that, I don’t see any advantages to sending him packing now. Hell, he might actually enjoy it. Bruce on the other hand, his firing would send a greater message. It gets an early start on figuring out what the FO is going to look like AND appeases those like me that want him publicly humiliated and fired. I’m not big on ugly, as we’ve seen too much of it here, but Bruce deserves ugly. As for the game, I totally understand folks clamoring for Smith after watching Mark Sanchez play QB for us. But the whole idea that Alex = winning and everyone else doesn’t is an odd one. Since Scherff and Lavaou went to IR this team has absolutely no ability to run the football. Smith doesn’t win games where you cannot run the football. A lot of QBs don’t. No QB available to us was going to continue winning given the circumstances. Our Oline’s propensity for injury coupled with poor depth is the Achilles heel of this football team. As for the defense, I venture a guess we will start getting leaks, if not prior to week 17 definitely after the season is over. Something is up. I do believe part of their downfall is teams catching on to the scheme/weaknesses and responding accordingly and even the lack of running game on offense keeping them on the field too long. But there is more at play here. Not sure what it is other than lack of team speed and desire to tackle, but drama will come out about this side of the football very soon. I really dont think us wanting Gruden fired is for an advantage. This season is toast all the way around. We want him fired because of just that, we want him fired because he sucks as a head coach. Show us fans that you, Snyder are listening. That you get it, Gruden is not a Head coach. Send the message 11 hours ago, NoCalMike said: I hate to be the "still have a chance" guy, because realistically they don't however mathematically they do, just a fact. Firing the head coach (and other coaches) right now makes no sense. I want and expect Gruden to be gone the day after the season ends, but I don't see how firing him now does anything to effect the final 3 games of the season. Not to mention that as injury ravaged as the offense is, it's really the defense that has less of an excuse for being awful. A game against the Giants with no ODB Jr, and they didn't even seem to stack the box to stop Barkley. They let no name WR's run all over the field making big plays. Eli threw 3 TDs. It was disgusting to watch. I am more convinced firing Manusky today would make a positive impact rather than Gruden being gone. With the a fore mentioned, So why even give even a second to the thought we still have a chance? You think this will change over the next 3 games? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinsfan35yrs. Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 9 hours ago, Thinking Skins said: So the question that was in my mind when Alex Smith went down was at what point do we start a rebuild? And when i say a rebuild, I don't mean a lose out for draft picks, but more of a "why are we playing these 30+ year olds who are unlikely to be here in our future". If we have young guys who are here and need experience, then we should play them. If we don't are there any available? I'm kinda mad that we got those 16 poitns because Josh Johnson actually looked good in his small stretch of time. Problem 1 is it was against prevent defense, and problem 2 is he's 30+ and not a part of the future. I would have much rather signed a Paxton Lynch or a young QB who could come in and either suck like Sanchez or maybe provide a spark like Josh Johnson. Are there any other mobile QBs that are young? I don't care about draft position or much else but just that they could potentially have a future here (Jerod Evans? Christian Hackenberg? Tom Savage?) Still haven't seen Alexander on defense? No more Montae on detense? Vigil was good on defense last year. Now he's unseen. JHC was in on only 8 plays Why did we ever have Dunn on our roster? Why do we have a practice squad? I would be activating players from that if we needed depth. Settle got some snaps, but why wasn't there a rotation before this? Something's not right because everybody (myself included) talks about how great our drafts have been these last two or so years, but what does that mean if we're not playing our draft picks? Are they not good? I've always assumed they were just too raw but would you rather just play raw players or bad players? Exactly, I have been laughing my head off at all the comments from people that think Johnson is the answer by stating what he did when they benched Sanchez. Kinda like all the stats our ex QB got at the end of games that were out of reach. The Skins could bring in Brady right now but it wont matter, we are NOT a playoff team Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinsfan35yrs. Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 3 hours ago, skinny21 said: Nicholson had a heck of a ST tackle. Way punted well (though it looked like he outputted the coverage team once). Crowder made up for his drop with that TD. JJ played pretty well all things considered. Was glad to see SDH get some PT. Thats all I got. I didnt watch the game so correct me if I am wrong but unless the drop was on the same drive as the Td catch, there is no way you make up for it because that drop if caught instead may have led to a TD also, so 2 TD's instead of 1. I do hope you and all who say Johnson played well factor in the gnats were ahead by 40 points and were playing 2nd and 3rd stringers I hear and not to mention they played it soft on defense as well. I bet Sanchez could have done the same if left in because from what I hear the O line was crap and receivers were dropping balls like crazy on him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinny21 Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 1 hour ago, skinsfan35yrs. said: I didnt watch the game so correct me if I am wrong but unless the drop was on the same drive as the Td catch, there is no way you make up for it because that drop if caught instead may have led to a TD also, so 2 TD's instead of 1. You got me. I should have said... no, wait... maybe you can tell me what I should have said. That way we can save the board any more back and forth over such trivial misunderstandings. (seriously, it might be better that way, ‘cause I was originally gonna type something to the effect of - is it kind of like if I point the grammatical errors in your post, then you edit your post, but it’s too late to “make up for it” because I already quoted you?... or some such nonsense. It’s been a long day, sorry) Quote I do hope you and all who say Johnson played well factor in the gnats were ahead by 40 points and were playing 2nd and 3rd stringers I hear and not to mention they played it soft on defense as well. I bet Sanchez could have done the same if left in because from what I hear the O line was crap and receivers were dropping balls like crazy on him Pretty sure no one is going to confuse Johnson for a good qb, so I think we’re ok here. BTW, you did notice that I said “pretty well” and “all things considered”, right? Also, I’m not at all blaming Sanchez for the loss. There was a noticeable difference when Johnson came in though. Kinda weird you’d make that bet not having watched the game. I bet everyone that watched the game would take that bet. Kudos to you for not watching it though, I bet your day was better for it. Edit: Just read the transcript and Gruden said the Giants didn’t change how they played when Johnson came in. Johnson just gave them a spark because they were getting a lot of interior pressure and he was moving more/avoiding it better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rufus T Firefly Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 7 hours ago, Alcoholic Zebra said: There's a possible Apocalypse scenario for our Cap. The Smith injury puts us in a bad bind. I'm still not at all sure what this "Apocalypse scenario" you're afraid of is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BleedBNG Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 Well hope the Giants are happy with their big win. They just sank (from 5 to 8) below the Jags for a QB pick in the draft. C'mon Skins, let's help the Jags keep it that way this week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KDawg Posted December 11, 2018 Author Share Posted December 11, 2018 9 hours ago, wysknz1 said: So are you a cutter too? Odd question to ask... but no. Thanks for checking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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