Birdlives Posted March 11, 2018 Share Posted March 11, 2018 Kirk is taking a deal above the SF JimmyG deal. I guarantee it. He has no choice. The narrative of taking less to play for a competitive team is BS. He’d never get away with it. The NFLPA would crush him for lowballing other players. Kirk wanted free agency, fine. But there’s a high level of responsibility that comes with that. I said before almost anyone that he’d sign with the Vikings; but it won’t be for less than the highest paid QB. If the Vikings don’t come through, he’s bound for whichever team gives him the appropriate contract. I expect Kirk to be a Viking. The deal will be either 5 years, 145 with 95 in the first three, or 3 for 90, like Cooley noted. Wouldn’t surprise me. I think McCartney would love to get Cousins back to free agency before he’s worn out. As for those who question my logic, watch and see. Brees and Rodgers are on hold waiting for the Cousins deal because they’re both going North of that. If he low balls them by taking a sub-par contract because “he wants to win” he’ll have hell to pay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinsFTW Posted March 11, 2018 Share Posted March 11, 2018 2 hours ago, Birdlives said: If he low balls them by taking a sub-par contract because “he wants to win” he’ll have hell to pay. You mean like Tom Brady? Isn't that who everybody always brought up when Cousins was lowballed by the Redskins? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Veryoldschool Posted March 11, 2018 Share Posted March 11, 2018 7 hours ago, Birdlives said: The NFLPA would crush him for lowballing other players. Kirk wanted free agency, fine. But there’s a high level of responsibility that comes with that. If he low balls them by taking a sub-par contract because “he wants to win” he’ll have hell to pay. Baloney, he'll get a big deal but the notion that he has to get the biggest deal is nonsense in my opinion. If Cousins wants to take a smaller deal from Minnesota because he wants to win that is his business. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinsfan66 Posted March 11, 2018 Share Posted March 11, 2018 6 hours ago, Birdlives said: Kirk is taking a deal above the SF JimmyG deal. I guarantee it. He has no choice. The narrative of taking less to play for a competitive team is BS. He’d never get away with it. The NFLPA would crush him for lowballing other players. Kirk wanted free agency, fine. But there’s a high level of responsibility that comes with that. I said before almost anyone that he’d sign with the Vikings; but it won’t be for less than the highest paid QB. If the Vikings don’t come through, he’s bound for whichever team gives him the appropriate contract. I expect Kirk to be a Viking. The deal will be either 5 years, 125 with 95 in the first three, or 3 for 90, like Cooley noted. Wouldn’t surprise me. I think McCartney would love to get Cousins back to free agency before he’s worn out. As for those who question my logic, watch and see. Brees and Rodgers are on hold waiting for the Cousins deal because they’re both going North of that. If he low balls them by taking a sub-par contract because “he wants to win” he’ll have hell to pay. I agree, Kirk would be as always talking out of both sides of his mouth, and then changing course if he took less. Remember its his duty to do what's best for the QB's that follow him, taking less money makes him look 2 faced. I posted Rodgers and Brees are waiting for him to sign and it already has had a effect on Jimmy G's. deal, earlier in thread. It says 27 plus if he signs with Vikings , Jets still have plenty of cap too and go higher than the Vikings, don't rule them out yet. Kirk and Allen have drove up the QB cap big time and that is going to drive up the whole salaries of all players. Kirk is as Greedy as the next and will get all he can. So now Kirk and his agent can have a little prayer with God and thank him, All those years of being pissed off at the Redskins for drafting him after RG3 will be over and like he said then, God has a reason for this. Its nice to have god on your side! Smith 's contract will be a bargain, other teams will have to pay the piper. Other NFL owners should force Dan to fire Allen the same day kirk signs for being a jackass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmandoug1 Posted March 11, 2018 Share Posted March 11, 2018 9 hours ago, CjSuAvE22 said: Nope not surprised at all if the Vikings do sign him they will be able to beat philly guaranteed if it’s a rematch next year he’s a great player who will have a running back in cook and solid receivers something he hasn’t had simultaneous here in dc. Well if he beats Philly that will make it two teams with a winning record that be beats.......? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinsfan66 Posted March 11, 2018 Share Posted March 11, 2018 NFL players union should make Kirk top player rep and his agent new president, biggest victory for them in a long time. Every top QB or free agent has just got a nice bonus. QB's are like the top 1% now, other position players will be hoping for the that trickle down effect to happen. It also will be put up time for Saints if you want to keep your QB from going to NY or...........high cap team after Kirk signs his big $ contract. Rogers will want new contract and QB franchise tag is going to go up, up, up, next year , it will be his friend everybody knows that now. Packers may have no choice but to trade him now while he has great value like Allen should have done.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmandoug1 Posted March 11, 2018 Share Posted March 11, 2018 Ok, ok, ok last one then I'm done. Do you think this weakness evaluation from 2012 has changed over the last 6 years? WEAKNESSES Cousins is widely considered to be a game manager type at the next level. He makes good decisions with the ball but has not shown he can make the flash plays to move the offense and win games for his team at the next level. He will need talent around him to succeed, which limits his value. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BatteredFanSyndrome Posted March 11, 2018 Share Posted March 11, 2018 14 minutes ago, tmandoug1 said: Ok, ok, ok last one then I'm done. Do you think this weakness evaluation from 2012 has changed over the last 6 years? WEAKNESSES Cousins is widely considered to be a game manager type at the next level. He makes good decisions with the ball but has not shown he can make the flash plays to move the offense and win games for his team at the next level. He will need talent around him to succeed, which limits his value. I absolutely think it’s changed and it appears other NFL GM’s concur. I was never big on Cousins 2012-early 2015 but he won me over year over year with his play. Made me eat a lot of crow, and I expect him to continue getting better year over year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silvernon Posted March 11, 2018 Share Posted March 11, 2018 Cousins lost me this season. I fall in line with Jay Gruden's assessment of Kirk. Glad they moved on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Veryoldschool Posted March 11, 2018 Share Posted March 11, 2018 3 hours ago, tmandoug1 said: Ok, ok, ok last one then I'm done. Do you think this weakness evaluation from 2012 has changed over the last 6 years? WEAKNESSES Cousins is widely considered to be a game manager type at the next level. He makes good decisions with the ball but has not shown he can make the flash plays to move the offense and win games for his team at the next level. He will need talent around him to succeed, which limits his value. Of course and anyone who hasn't figured that out just doesn't understand football. Kirk carried three piss-poor Redskins teams to mediocrity, he kept them competitive and gave them a chance to win virtually every game and was successful without talent around him. All of the Skins teams Cousins played on were imbalanced with a poor defense and running game. It will be different for him if Kirk goes to Minnesota where he is going to really have talent around him for the first time in his career. Let's see if Alex Smith can drag a sorry ass Redskin team to .500 this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UKskins Posted March 11, 2018 Share Posted March 11, 2018 54 minutes ago, tmandoug1 said: Ok, ok, ok last one then I'm done. Do you think this weakness evaluation from 2012 has changed over the last 6 years? WEAKNESSES Cousins is widely considered to be a game manager type at the next level. He makes good decisions with the ball but has not shown he can make the flash plays to move the offense and win games for his team at the next level. He will need talent around him to succeed, which limits his value. Yes, he doesn't make good decisions with the football. He consistently throws dumb INTs right into the hands of the D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Llevron Posted March 11, 2018 Share Posted March 11, 2018 His play definitly improved and he can certainly kill you if you mess up. He even has stretches where he looks unstoppable. The only thing really missing from his resume is any kind of success when the team is failing around him or when its win or go home. In those situatioons he still struggles and it's what separates him from Rodgers, basically. Even then hes more then good enough. I think that scouting report is changed and unfortunately I don't think that means anything really for anyone but him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goskins10 Posted March 11, 2018 Share Posted March 11, 2018 10 hours ago, Birdlives said: Kirk is taking a deal above the SF JimmyG deal. I guarantee it. He has no choice. The narrative of taking less to play for a competitive team is BS. He’d never get away with it. The NFLPA would crush him for lowballing other players. Kirk wanted free agency, fine. But there’s a high level of responsibility that comes with that. I said before almost anyone that he’d sign with the Vikings; but it won’t be for less than the highest paid QB. If the Vikings don’t come through, he’s bound for whichever team gives him the appropriate contract. I expect Kirk to be a Viking. The deal will be either 5 years, 125 with 95 in the first three, or 3 for 90, like Cooley noted. Wouldn’t surprise me. I think McCartney would love to get Cousins back to free agency before he’s worn out. As for those who question my logic, watch and see. Brees and Rodgers are on hold waiting for the Cousins deal because they’re both going North of that. If he low balls them by taking a sub-par contract because “he wants to win” he’ll have hell to pay. Please describe exactly what the NFLPA will do? Under the CBA what mechanisms do they have to "crush" him? Let me help you here - not a thing! Nothing! There is absolutely zero the NFLPA or any individual player can do if Kirk takes a contract for $0.01. Interestingly the contract you mentioned equals to just $25M/yr with a 3 yr out - assuming that at least part of those guarantees are for injury - that would be in line with the latest big contracts. That is only $2M/yr more than Alex. So why not pay that guy who is in house for 6 yrs and is 4 yrs younger? It would have been good to at least make him turn the offer down. Then you can put it on Kirk. They just gave up. None of these guys are going to trash the other for doing what's right for their families. Yes, Brees and Rogers are hoping that Kirk get's a big deal as it helps their cause. But if he takes something less - there will not "be hell to pay. That's just absurd. Let's just start with who are Brees and Rogers to tell him where he should play? He will take the best deal for him - if that helps the other players great. That's the first option. But if not, it's not his problem. What's most interesting is that many of those who have been continuing to argue that - Kirk is gone, time to move on! - are the same ones that are fascinated with what he gets on another team. 13 hours ago, HigSkin said: If this is true, what happened to visit teams and take his time finding the right fit? Edit http://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nfl/report-kirk-cousins-to-sign-with-the-vikings-at-dollar27-plus-million-annually/ar-BBK5wso?li=BBnb7Kz&ocid=UE01DHP ....Now, according to SiriusXM Radio’s Adam Caplan (h/t Zig Fracassi of the same outlet), indications are that Cousins will sign a free agent deal with Minnesota once the market opens up on Wednesday. Said deal is expected to value Cousin at $27-plus million per season. So I guess it's not possible that if he was having backdoor discussions with the Vikings, that he said forget it - I will not talk to anyone else. If this deal happens you are sure there were no other discussions? If so, that's either naive or or you are willfully ignoring that possibility as it doesn't fit your narrative. Anyone making this statement clearly does not understand the WCO. Fundamentally many more of your passes are going to be underneath. It's not as sexy as long bombs that have a much lower comp rate so fans do not like it. But it is the primary foundation of the WCO - which is what Jay runs. You get the ball out quickly, taking what's open. Then rely on the players to get YAC. Interestingly enough many have called Kirk the same ridiculous name. The actual difference between Alex and Kirk is that Kirk will take a few more chances where as Alex is a bit cautious. Kirk will make a few more big plays but he will also make some really bad passes at the wrong time - something Alex does not do nearly as much. He has I believed only 2 ints in the RZ his entire career. Alex is also a bit more mobile and IMO more under control when under pressure. But then he has been a starter many more years than Kirk also. I see Kirk getting better - he has improved every year despite what some naysayers want people to believe. Smart QBs take what the D gives them. Also, you need guys that can get open downfield. Just heaving out there every couple of downs with no one there to catch it is just dumb and will get a guy benched. What's most ironic about your statement is that Alex led the league in deep passing for 2017. In fairness Kirk was #3. For his career Kirk has been better than Alex. However, you can also argue that Kirk has had better deep threats - 2015 and 2016 he had Garcon and especially Jackson (a move I agreed with and still do. The unfortunate thing is the Pryor busted bad and Doctson had some growing pains.). Smith did not have those tools until last year. As a result Kirk fell back and Alex surged. This is not to trash Kirk. The point is it's not all just on the QB. You need guys that can get open down field. Also, while having better overall numbers down field he has also had more ints. Both guys have strengths and weaknesses - but are also pretty close overall. The issues here have not ever been Alex vs. Kirk in terms of irritation wit the FO - it's how they got themselves in that corner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wyvern Posted March 11, 2018 Share Posted March 11, 2018 Oddly, I'm going to miss this thread after it is closed. It's been the source of so many long posts, stats, extensive debates (some heated), links, conjectures on the future, and some great gifs. It was like a microcosm of Extremeskins where the emphasis was on the extreme. However, even though this thread will be closed -- I suspect some comments around Cousins will keep popping up in future threads, especially in the threads evaluating Smith. (It will be a little bit similar to what was happening when RG3 was still considered a possibility.) ....At this point in time, I'm going to try to move on. While I had hoped Cousins could have been kept on the Skins roster (hopefully without crippling the team's salary cap), that's not going to happen. So, as a Skins fan, I'll keep my fingers crossed for Smith's success and a long and healthy career with Washington. I'll be able to do that, because it would be really nice if we can see the Skins continue to improve, even without Cousins. (After all, Smith's success or failure won't change my mind on what quality QB'ing I thought Cousins had brought to the Skins over these last couple of seasons.) But I'll also wish the best of fortune to Cousins in his next endeavor -- I thought he was a quality person, who fared as well as possible within a flawed Skins organization, and during difficult times. He had to cope with constant change in coaching as well in turnover of key supporting teammates, and challenging conditions while the team tried to rebuild. No doubt, he had to absorb many personal challenges resulting from the weekly ups and downs of the team's performance -- no small task when you come snider that Cousins is in viewing market where everything about the QB is criticized, reviewed, second-guessed, down to a microscopic level of detail. For the most part, I think he handled these challenging situations with grace. And the off-seasons were no cakewalk either. Cousins wasn't perfect, but he definitely wasn't on the perfect team either. So, just because Kirk's leaving, there's really no cause to keep on reviling him or what he did accomplish, in some sort of "sour grapes" coping strategy. That's in the rear-view mirror. Cousins will be some other team's concern now. However well he performs in the future for his new team, won't change what he did for this team (good or bad, depending on your view) while he was here and learning his craft. Also, how well he performs elsewhere, won't equate to how well he might have performed here, had the Skins re-signed him. So, what happens with Cousins in the future won't really provide vindication to either the pro-Kirk or the anti-Kirk factions, and allow them to then crow, "I told you so." That said, I suspect this type of Cousins-related comment will crop up in other threads, even though it's speculation. ...After all, this is Extremeskins! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CjSuAvE22 Posted March 11, 2018 Share Posted March 11, 2018 2 hours ago, Silvernon said: Cousins lost me this season. I fall in line with Jay Gruden's assessment of Kirk. Glad they moved on. They didn’t have a choice and have downgraded the position Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Birdlives Posted March 11, 2018 Share Posted March 11, 2018 Sorry, typo. That was meant to say 145. Didn't notice until someone quoted me. Nevertheless, we'll all see what's what come the 14th. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr_ Skinshead Posted March 11, 2018 Share Posted March 11, 2018 4 hours ago, Veryoldschool said: Of course and anyone who hasn't figured that out just doesn't understand football. Kirk carried three piss-poor Redskins teams to mediocrity, he kept them competitive and gave them a chance to win virtually every game and was successful without talent around him. All of the Skins teams Cousins played on were imbalanced with a poor defense and running game. It will be different for him if Kirk goes to Minnesota where he is going to really have talent around him for the first time in his career. Let's see if Alex Smith can drag a sorry ass Redskin team to .500 this year. Let's see how good you look in purple. Please post pics sporting your new Cousins jersey and we'll see if there's a .500 approval rating. Best of luck in the poll and with your new team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Veryoldschool Posted March 11, 2018 Share Posted March 11, 2018 22 hours ago, Wyvern said: So, what happens with Cousins in the future won't really provide vindication to either the pro-Kirk or the anti-Kirk factions, and allow them to then crow, "I told you so." That said, I suspect this type of Cousins-related comment will crop up in other threads, even though it's speculation. ...After all, this is Extremeskins! I disagree, I certainly will feel my supreme confidence in Kirk Cousins will be vindicated if Kirk signs with the Vikings has a Pro Bowl year and wins the Super Bowl as I hope. I also will be very interested to see how supportive some of Kirk's critics here treat Alex Smith, who I hope is successful. A lot of posters here have failed to recognize it is a team game and there are limits to what a good quarterback can accomplish on a weak team. I will be interested to see if they apply the same standard to Smith when the Skins come up short or whether they will be more understanding and supportive of Smith since there is no Griffin disappointment baggage associated with Smith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Llevron Posted March 11, 2018 Share Posted March 11, 2018 Who do you hope is more successful in the next 5 years? Smith or Cousins? A few of y'all bout to lie to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Birdlives Posted March 11, 2018 Share Posted March 11, 2018 Watching the NFL network Saint/Skins game. Kirk had a tendency to panic but as he’s matured he’s overcoming that. So stupid that we didn’t sign him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Llevron Posted March 11, 2018 Share Posted March 11, 2018 2 minutes ago, Birdlives said: Watching the NFL network Saint/Skins game. Kirk had a tendency to panic but as he’s matured he’s overcoming that. So stupid that we didn’t sign him. I think, had we been in the same position the Vikes are, we would have had no choice. But we are far from that. Still, he was our best chance on the roster to go from loser to contender. Shame it couldn't work out between him and Bruce. I would love to get the two of them drunk and talk it out lol. I'm so curious about what really was so hard for them to get over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Birdlives Posted March 11, 2018 Share Posted March 11, 2018 15 minutes ago, Llevron said: Who do you hope is more successful in the next 5 years? Smith or Cousins? A few of y'all bout to lie to me. Dan Snyder doesn’t deserve to win a championship. Painful, but true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted March 11, 2018 Share Posted March 11, 2018 17 minutes ago, Birdlives said: Watching the NFL network Saint/Skins game. Kirk had a tendency to panic but as he’s matured he’s overcoming that. So stupid that we didn’t sign him. I agree that he's improved on it, but it does still rear its head at very inopportune moments unfortunately. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmandoug1 Posted March 12, 2018 Share Posted March 12, 2018 9 hours ago, Veryoldschool said: Of course and anyone who hasn't figured that out just doesn't understand football. Kirk carried three piss-poor Redskins teams to mediocrity, he kept them competitive and gave them a chance to win virtually every game and was successful without talent around him. All of the Skins teams Cousins played on were imbalanced with a poor defense and running game. It will be different for him if Kirk goes to Minnesota where he is going to really have talent around him for the first time in his career. Let's see if Alex Smith can drag a sorry ass Redskin team to .500 this year. Yes it will be interesting to see how all of this plays out. However I will say I root for the piss poor skins every year since 1973 and will continue to do so until the day I die. I hope the extremevikings enjoy your posts as much as I have!? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CousinsCowgirl84 Posted March 12, 2018 Share Posted March 12, 2018 After two years when it doesn’t work out with the new moneybags team, would you take kirk back eg nick foles? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.