The Official QB Thread- JD5 taken #2. Randall 2.0 or Bayou Bob? Mariotta and Hartman forever. Fromm cut

[DJHJR86]

15 minutes ago, kingdaddy said:

Lawrence, Z. Wilson, Lance, Fields, Mac Jones, Trask, Mond, Davis Mills, Book, Ehlinger, Pickett, Ridder, Willis, Corral, Zappe, Howell, Oladokum, Skylar Thompson, Purdy.

 

The only one I would swap with Howell without hesitation is Lawrence.  

[Thinking Skins]

2 hours ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

Sheehan is frustrating to listen to.

 

Actually, he was frustrating to listen to.  So I stopped listening.  Maybe he’s better now.  I doubt it, but I allow for the possibility given I haven’t listened in months.  Maybe I’ll give his podcast a listen today.  Does he have Cooley on for film reviews anymore?

If I had a better option I would, I love sports and local stuff is much better than national stuff. I cant stand stuss like Steven A Smith and the other blow hards. Occasionally in the offseason I'll just stop listening to sports podcasts and listen to audio books or quora threads. And there are still lapses during the day where there is a dought so I can catch a book or two or read an academic paper or learn a skill, but its hard to listen to the office gossip and stuff. I'd much rather listen to Sheehan complain abou Heinicke or Howell. At least Sheehan for the most part is logical. I can't stand Grant Paulsen and that other guy Danny ??? because I didn't understand their logic (I understand Grant's, and the other guy's individually, but togeher they just seem to joke around for 3 or 4 hours and I lose all sense of logic like a black hole). 

 

Cooley does film reviews on his podcast occasionally but he's not committed. With the number of film reviewers on Twitter I wouldn't even look to Cooley to do it any more. Its not even beneficial for him any more. Whats the point in him doing it? He's not going to be an NFL coach. He's just doing it for a friend. 

[NoCalMike]

For all the praise we are giving Howell right now, I am still expecting him to have some ugly games this season.  There will be more tape on him, D-coordinators will have a better way to cater specific strategies against him, but I felt overall he handled the pressure brought a lot better than he did against the Cards, and Denver is the better defense so it does show his ability to quickly learn from mistakes.  The execution of the screen passes against Denver was top notch and an efficient way to obliterate the aggressiveness of the blitz.   If Sam is able to do that at a good rate, it is going to have coordinators second-guessing how much they want to blitz him and start turning to trying to attack Sam with coverages instead.

 

Sam is passing all the tests right now, but there will be plenty more to come this season.

[TradeTheBeal!]

Not to be a Debbie downer, but I have serious concerns/doubts that Sam can hold up with the amount of hits he’s taken the first two weeks.  I think we can do more to help him with the run game and improving blocking schemes…and we will have do that, if we wanna see him in the huddle in December.

[Warhead36]

28 minutes ago, DJHJR86 said:

 

The only one I would swap with Howell without hesitation is Lawrence.  

Lawrence is better than Howell for sure. I think its close between him and Mac Jones. I'm not a big Jones guy but his supporting cast is pretty dog doo doo.

[Voice_of_Reason]

25 minutes ago, Thinking Skins said:

If I had a better option I would, I love sports and local stuff is much better than national stuff.

Galdi’s podcast is out by 5:00am every morning and is fantastic.  
 

If you’re not listening to it, you should be.  

[Thinking Skins]

Just now, Voice_of_Reason said:

Galdi’s podcast is out by 5:00am every morning and is fantastic.  
 

If you’re not listening to it, you should be.  

C'mon man, that's my morning workout listen. 

[gortiz]

26 minutes ago, TradeTheBeal! said:

Not to be a Debbie downer, but I have serious concerns/doubts that Sam can hold up with the amount of hits he’s taken the first two weeks.  I think we can do more to help him with the run game and improving blocking schemes…and we will have do that, if we wanna see him in the huddle in December.

u know, his stature is  stout.  i tihnk he can take some hits. he does have to get smarter.  but like russ, hes compact. Russ lead the league last year in sacks at 55 at 34 years old.  my point is he's been pretty damn durable despite getting hit a lot. 

 

this is wild, Russ has had over 40 sacks in a season 10 times in 5,284 career passing attempts.  Brady? only 2 two times over 40 sacks in 12,050 passing attempts. 

[skinny21]

1 hour ago, TradeTheBeal! said:

Not to be a Debbie downer, but I have serious concerns/doubts that Sam can hold up with the amount of hits he’s taken the first two weeks.  I think we can do more to help him with the run game and improving blocking schemes…and we will have do that, if we wanna see him in the huddle in December.

Yeah, I’m with you here.  
 

On the bright side, both Howell and the oline* should improve as the season goes on via experience and cohesion respectively (though it won’t be a linear growth for either - they’ll have their up and down games).  
EB should also get a better sense of what works, and the offense as a whole should get more comfortable in the system.  

*obviously the line has a governor on it (lack of talent), and this is assuming both stay relatively healthy

 

Even though I love the team’s upside, I still believe our success will be limited this year.  IMO, you either need a stout oline to protect a young qb (who’s decision-making will speed up with time), or an experienced qb that can help mask oline deficiency by getting the ball out quickly.  Poor oline, young qb, and new scheme… that’s a heck of a hill to climb.  Yesterday was a great sign though (of course I’m kind of dreading the next two weeks, lol). 

[Voice_of_Reason]

2 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

 

Anybody who needed to hear this from Grant Paulsen is a damn fool.  

 

2 hours ago, Ball Security said:

In hindsight, we probably should have traded up in 2021 to get Fields and pass up on Davis, Cosmi, Dotson, and Robinson.  /s

No.  We shouldn't have. Hindsight being 20/20, the Bears are regretting trading up for Fields.  

 

59 minutes ago, kingdaddy said:

 

 

 

Here's a list of QB's from the 21 and 22 drafts....judge for yourself on where Howell would fit based on all of their performances so far:

Lawrence, Z. Wilson, Lance, Fields, Mac Jones, Trask, Mond, Davis Mills, Book, Ehlinger, Pickett, Ridder, Willis, Corral, Zappe, Howell, Oladokum, Skylar Thompson, Purdy.

 

Of all of them you could argue that Howell would rank in the top 5 and maybe even higher depending on what you think of Fields, Pickett and Mac Jones. Howell might have the best package of skills out of each of them all things considered. It's too early to crown him but Sam is showing signs of having a bright future.

Lawrence - Would trade

Z. Wilson - Screws his mom's friends, can't play football, Hard Pass

Lance - Couldn't beat out any QB on SF's team. Hard Pass

Fields - Howell is a better passer after 3 games.  Pass.

Mac Jones - Inconsistent at best.  Makes some plays.  But had more time to develop.  Push (for now but I think Howell will be better.)

Trask, Mond - Pass

Davis Mills - Pass

Book - Who?

Ehlinger  - Pass

Pickett - Too early to tell.  

Ridder - Too early to tell. 

Willis - Can't beat out Tannehill in Tenn.  Thor Nystrom bet that the NFL was wrong on Willis.  So far, they're not.  Pass.

Corral - Hard Pass

Zappe - Hard Pass

Oladokum - Hasn't played

Thompson - Hasn't Played

Purdy - For now, Push, but Purdy could develop into an elite QB.  

 

 

16 minutes ago, TradeTheBeal! said:

Not to be a Debbie downer, but I have serious concerns/doubts that Sam can hold up with the amount of hits he’s taken the first two weeks.  I think we can do more to help him with the run game and improving blocking schemes…and we will have do that, if we wanna see him in the huddle in December.

The hits he takes this season will go down as he gets through his reads faster.  I am not going to do this, I'm sure some analytic site has it, but his time to pressure vs. time to throw, is off.  He waits that extra .5 second a lot of times, and pressure gets there when if he let it go that split second faster, he'd have a cleaner pocket with no hit.  

 

He'll learn.  

[Ball Security]

14 minutes ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

 

 

 

No.  We shouldn't have. Hindsight being 20/20, the Bears are regretting trading up for Fields.  

 

 

/s = sarcasm.

[Califan007 The Constipated]

5 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

 

 

I'm not sure we needed yesterday's game to reach that conclusion lol...

 

 

1 hour ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

 

Anybody who needed to hear this from Grant Paulsen is a damn fool.  

 

 

Even better than what I said lol...

 

Edited September 18, 2023 by Califan007 The Constipated

[MartinC]

4 hours ago, Thinking Skins said:

With the number of film reviewers on Twitter I wouldn't even look to Cooley to do it any more. 

 

But most of those are just guys who have access to All22 and dont know much more (and sometimes less) than you and I! Some add value thats for sure, but some post stuff that just tells me they dont really know what they are looking at.

[kingdaddy]

7 hours ago, NoCalMike said:

For all the praise we are giving Howell right now, I am still expecting him to have some ugly games this season.  There will be more tape on him, D-coordinators will have a better way to cater specific strategies against him, but I felt overall he handled the pressure brought a lot better than he did against the Cards, and Denver is the better defense so it does show his ability to quickly learn from mistakes.  The execution of the screen passes against Denver was top notch and an efficient way to obliterate the aggressiveness of the blitz.   If Sam is able to do that at a good rate, it is going to have coordinators second-guessing how much they want to blitz him and start turning to trying to attack Sam with coverages instead.

 

I'm gonna counter your point with this, and I don't disagree with you; Wait until this team fully grasps the offense and Howell gets comfortable with his teammates and the overall NFL game. Once he gets more comfortable with EB and EB with him it's gonna be beautiful. Howell has weapons everywhere....now we need to help him find them like he did in the 2nd half yesterday. Also, our defense needs to play full games, not just 2nd halves. Our future is incredibly bright as long as we can keep Sam healthy which I believe is the biggest challenge we face. 

Good point about the screen pass, I hope to see more of the crossing patterns too (where the guys don't crash into each other). It looks like EB is also getting a feel for his offensive line and how to use them. We abused Denver with the running game yesterday where Vegas couldn't run on them at all. If we can run the ball with confidence holy **** we're gonna be good.

[clskinsfan]

8 hours ago, DJHJR86 said:

 

The only one I would swap with Howell without hesitation is Lawrence.  

Lawrence, Pickett and Purdy I would probably take over Howell right now. But Howell has a stronger arm than Pickett and Purdy for sure. What has surprised me about Howell is his accuracy. He had lost some of that his last year at UNC. But he has been deadly so far this year. He has a chance to be special. Really needs to work on his pocket clock and backside awareness some though. All of those sacks are not the OL's fault. 

[KDawg]

25 minutes ago, clskinsfan said:

Lawrence, Pickett and Purdy I would probably take over Howell right now. But Howell has a stronger arm than Pickett and Purdy for sure. What has surprised me about Howell is his accuracy. He had lost some of that his last year at UNC. But he has been deadly so far this year. He has a chance to be special. Really needs to work on his pocket clock and backside awareness some though. All of those sacks are not the OL's fault. 

Starters wise, taking everything in consideration (including salary) I’d take these guys right now over Howell… if you include future prognostications this list shortens. But right now:

 

Jalen Hurts

Patrick Mahomes

Justin Herbert

Tua

Joe Burrow

Aaron Rodgers (pre Achilles)

Josh Allen

Trevor Lawrence

 

Guys who is listen to an argument for but you’d need to sell me.

Jordan Love

Bryce Young

CJ Stroud

Anthony Richardson

Derek Carr

Lamar Jackson (not in this offense, with a different OC he may be up in the first group)

 

 

[Hooper]

3 minutes ago, KDawg said:

Starters wise, taking everything in consideration (including salary) I’d take these guys right now over Howell… if you include future prognostications this list shortens. But right now:

 

Jalen Hurts

Patrick Mahomes

Justin Herbert

Tua

Joe Burrow

Aaron Rodgers (pre Achilles)

Josh Allen

Trevor Lawrence

 

Guys who is listen to an argument for but you’d need to sell me.

Jordan Love

Bryce Young

CJ Stroud

Anthony Richardson

Derek Carr

Lamar Jackson (not in this offense, with a different OC he may be up in the first group)

 

 

It's so early it's almost meaningless, but CJ has shown he can sling it.

 

Carr always looks like he is going to cry. And dude definitely spends too much time thinking how he is going to look before a game: long sleeve on one arm, oils up his arms on the other -- really short sleeve.  

 

Bryce is so tiny it has to scare Carolina fans. 

[HigSkin]

This is facinating data -

 

 

[Always A Commander Never A Captain]

1 hour ago, HigSkin said:

This is facinating data -

 

 

 

2 of the sacks were inches away from being a tackle for no gain. Him scrambling around has to muddy this stat a lot.

[FootballZombie]

1 hour ago, KDawg said:

Starters wise, taking everything in consideration (including salary) I’d take these guys right now over Howell… if you include future prognostications this list shortens. But right now:

 

 

I think Dak has to be on there somewhere

Surprised by no Purdy.

 

I can see not having Geno and Goff due to their contracts despite good play

[Always A Commander Never A Captain]

2 hours ago, clskinsfan said:

Lawrence, Pickett and Purdy I would probably take over Howell right now. But Howell has a stronger arm than Pickett and Purdy for sure. What has surprised me about Howell is his accuracy. He had lost some of that his last year at UNC. But he has been deadly so far this year. He has a chance to be special. Really needs to work on his pocket clock and backside awareness some though. All of those sacks are not the OL's fault. 

 

Pickett is not looking good to start this season, right read just off target. That said, the Browns defense might actually be stellar this season.

[KDawg]

12 minutes ago, FootballZombie said:

 

 

I think Dak has to be on there somewhere

Surprised by no Purdy.

 

I can see not having Geno and Goff due to their contracts despite good play

Dak isn’t worth the contract. Otherwise he would be.

 

Im not all in on Purdy. I think he and Howell are very similar at this point. Difference is we have more of a body of work for Purdy. 
 

I actually really like Goff. But he has a ceiling. We haven’t seen Howell’s yet. Though Goff’s contract is the primary reason I wouldn’t take him.

[Skinsinparadise]

 

[Always A Commander Never A Captain]

 

Sam Howell's year learning the ropes must have helped a bit with maturity on the field.

 

1st overall pick is looking a little overwhelmed by the NFL right now.

[MrJL]

more of an excuse to do that in shotgun than when you're taking the snap directly