Skinsinparadise Posted October 1, 2021 Share Posted October 1, 2021 28 minutes ago, wit33 said: Going into stratosphere of speculation and above my football prowess, but worry a false belief system is going to take over Heineke- his scrambling and play making is an issue and must be fixed. He must fight the external forces and stay true to what he feels makes him special. My belief is the interceptions were a result of him trying to remain in the pocket and be what his coaches want him to be. His legs are a check down in his world. We will not be able to find or locate the check down due to his size. Thought Ron would be a bit more open and even publicly back Heineke more in this regard, but it seems they have a clear idea of what they want from him. Free Heineke, RPOs, ROs, and a few QB runs should be featured. Guarantee these things will wake him up and get him and teammates hyped. Either he learns to protect himself or he doesn’t. Allen is waiting and ready. Win the division by any means necessary. Rivera was asked about it this week, he said he's not opposed to Heinicke running and told him to run if the play warrants it as to how things unfold. It seems like Rivera's beef with Heinicke as to his play is to be careful about throwing the ball up for grabs. I saw that a bunch in camp. One person compared him here to the younger Kirk years on that front. It might be premature to label Heinicke as turnover prone but since Rivera has referenced it more than once, its clearly on the minds of the coaches. Listening to various interviews this week the vibe i get is Heinicke is being coached up hard not be reckless with the ball. I don't get the vibe so much about he's being coached up not to run much. I did have that concern prior to this week but after listening to Rivera (who is often brutally honest) I am not as concerned. But Heincike himself might have concerns on that front. Reading that long expose/article about Heinicke from the Athletic, it came off like he's very aware of his reputation of being injury prone. My feeling on that front is master what Russell Wilson and Kyler Murray do which is get down before they get hit. Like you, I think this is Heincke's strength. It's his super power. I don't think he's the same without it. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExoDus84 Posted October 1, 2021 Share Posted October 1, 2021 (edited) Hope Heini can pull us out of this funk. Here's a fun stat I just saw, though, which depresses me considerably: Quote Washington has a 26.5% conversion rate on third down this season (worst in the NFL). The last time an NFL team was below 30% for the full season was Washington in 2019 (29.1%) Edited October 1, 2021 by ExoDus84 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasRoane Posted October 1, 2021 Share Posted October 1, 2021 15 minutes ago, ExoDus84 said: Hope Heini can pull us out of this funk. Here's a fun stat I just saw, though, which depresses me considerably: I'd be curious to see what the average down and distance is on those 3rd downs. Turner can help with that with better play calling on first and second. Throwing out penalties of course. That's a player issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OMacAttack Posted October 1, 2021 Share Posted October 1, 2021 So our defense can't stop anyone on third down and we have the lowest third down conversion rate. I'm surprised we have a win to be honest. Hopefully we get both of these things figured out this week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted October 1, 2021 Share Posted October 1, 2021 1 hour ago, Skinsinparadise said: Rivera was asked about it this week, he said he's not opposed to Heinicke running and told him to run if the play warrants it as to how things unfold. It seems like Rivera's beef with Heinicke as to his play is to be careful about throwing the ball up for grabs. I saw that a bunch in camp. One person compared him here to the younger Kirk years on that front. It might be premature to label Heinicke as turnover prone but since Rivera has referenced it more than once, its clearly on the minds of the coaches. Listening to various interviews this week the vibe i get is Heinicke is being coached up hard not be reckless with the ball. I don't get the vibe so much about he's being coached up not to run much. I did have that concern prior to this week but after listening to Rivera (who is often brutally honest) I am not as concerned. But Heincike himself might have concerns on that front. Reading that long expose/article about Heinicke from the Athletic, it came off like he's very aware of his reputation of being injury prone. My feeling on that front is master what Russell Wilson and Kyler Murray do which is get down before they get hit. Like you, I think this is Heincke's strength. It's his super power. I don't think he's the same without it. I can understand coaches (especially a more defensive minded older school guy like Rivera) wanting to limit turnovers and having their QBs protect the ball really well, but that seems a bit odd coming from a coach who signed Ryan Fitzpatrick in the offseason. Fitz is pretty much the definition of "throw it and let a guy make a play on it" QB. I can't imagine Rivera having any illusions about suddenly being able to completely change Fitz's playing style. About Heinicke and his ability to move I agree...I hope he isn't taking all of this in and deciding not to use the main advantage he has, which is his ability to make and/or extend plays with his legs. I was actually wondering if that was the case during preseason as well, since he seemed to be really quick to check down if his first read wasn't open. Or maybe that's just more of a function of him playing more in the pocket and not being quite as comfortable there? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExoDus84 Posted October 1, 2021 Share Posted October 1, 2021 2 hours ago, OMacAttack said: SI'm surprised we have a win to be honest. We literally should be 0-3. If not for a Giants WR dropping an easy TD during a busted coverage, or a Giants player randomly jumping offsides during the Hopkins field goal shank at the end of the game, we'd be winless. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ODU AGGIE Posted October 1, 2021 Share Posted October 1, 2021 42 minutes ago, ExoDus84 said: We literally should be 0-3. If not for a Giants WR dropping an easy TD during a busted coverage, or a Giants player randomly jumping offsides during the Hopkins field goal shank at the end of the game, we'd be winless. But we're not! 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted October 2, 2021 Share Posted October 2, 2021 7 hours ago, ExoDus84 said: We literally should be 0-3. If not for a Giants WR dropping an easy TD during a busted coverage, or a Giants player randomly jumping offsides during the Hopkins field goal shank at the end of the game, we'd be winless. Don't forget the Daniel Jones rushing TD that was called back due to a holding penalty. We've been dominated by 2 good teams and got super lucky in beating a bottom 3 team. I honestly don't have a very good feeling about this Atlanta game. They're not a good team but they're better than the Giants, and likely better than us. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
petey hodge Posted October 2, 2021 Share Posted October 2, 2021 1 hour ago, mistertim said: Don't forget the Daniel Jones rushing TD that was called back due to a holding penalty. We've been dominated by 2 good teams and got super lucky in beating a bottom 3 team. I honestly don't have a very good feeling about this Atlanta game. They're not a good team but they're better than the Giants, and likely better than us. Meh, we'll be 2-2 after Sunday... And then the criticism will rage on. If we're 1-3, this thread will go nuclear. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
88Comrade2000 Posted October 2, 2021 Share Posted October 2, 2021 3 minutes ago, petey hodge said: Meh, we'll be 2-2 after Sunday... And then the criticism will rage on. If we're 1-3, this thread will go nuclear. We go 1-3, season is probably over and by the bye; no one will give a damn anymore. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCalSkins Posted October 2, 2021 Share Posted October 2, 2021 10 hours ago, Rdskns2000 said: We go 1-3, season is probably over and by the bye; no one will give a damn anymore. We close with 5 division games. If Dallas implodes nothing is over. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commander -JB- Posted October 2, 2021 Share Posted October 2, 2021 Somebody at work told me Dwayne Haskins is better than Taylor Heinicke he just didn’t get a chance 9 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malapropismic Depository Posted October 2, 2021 Share Posted October 2, 2021 (edited) 22 hours ago, ExoDus84 said: We literally should be 0-3. If not for a Giants WR dropping an easy TD during a busted coverage, or a Giants player randomly jumping offsides during the Hopkins field goal shank at the end of the game, we'd be winless. Those kind of things go both ways though. Even the Chargers' game. If our team had every bad call against us reversed, we'd have a LOT more wins. If you count the bad calls and fluke plays that favor us, why not count the ones against us, as well ? AND add a new column to the standings - along with the WIns, Losses, Ties, we'd have to add the "What IF ?" column Hey, maybe when there's a Tie for first at the end of the season, whoever has the most "WHAT IF" wins, would win the Tiebreaker ! Not serious about that, btw 2 hours ago, -JB- said: Somebody at work told me Dwayne Haskins is better than Taylor Heinicke he just didn’t get a chance Steelers don't think he's better than Mason Rudolph If you substituted "twitter" for "work", that would sound just like a post by @Cooleyfan1993 😆 2 hours ago, SoCalSkins said: If Dallas implodes Wouldn't be the first time ! Edited October 2, 2021 by Malapropismic Depository 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasRoane Posted October 2, 2021 Share Posted October 2, 2021 1 hour ago, SoCalSkins said: We close with 5 division games. If Dallas implodes nothing is over. 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malapropismic Depository Posted October 2, 2021 Share Posted October 2, 2021 (edited) On 10/1/2021 at 1:43 PM, Skinsinparadise said: Rivera was asked about it this week, he said he's not opposed to Heinicke running and told him to run if the play warrants it as to how things unfold. It seems like Rivera's beef with Heinicke as to his play is to be careful about throwing the ball up for grabs. This seems to be one of the differences between Heinicke and Fitzpatrick. There's a lot of differences, so I never understood why people compare the 2 QB's as if they're really similar. But this particular difference, is that when under pressure, Heinicke's response is usually to roll out, scramble, or run. Meanwhile, when Fitz is in those situations, his response is to try to force a risky, big play. I tend to prefer Heini's response. For one thing, when you scramble iike Heini does, and Fitz does not, it then creates a whole new scenario in the Defense, as a result of the Defense having to adjust to the scramble (to account for the probability he decides to just run), and that new scenario creates new opportunities. Edited October 2, 2021 by Malapropismic Depository 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinsinparadise Posted October 2, 2021 Share Posted October 2, 2021 23 hours ago, mistertim said: I can understand coaches (especially a more defensive minded older school guy like Rivera) wanting to limit turnovers and having their QBs protect the ball really well, but that seems a bit odd coming from a coach who signed Ryan Fitzpatrick in the offseason. Fitz is pretty much the definition of "throw it and let a guy make a play on it" QB. I can't imagine Rivera having any illusions about suddenly being able to completely change Fitz's playing style. Picks don't all come in the same flavor though. Are you throwing picks with contested throws? Heinicke or Fitz just throw it up and hope their guy wins the contested catch. I presume Rivera is cool with that. Some of the picks we've seen from Heinicke though don't speak to that concept -- I gather it's that which Rivera wants Heinicke to be more careful about regardless of how much a gunslinger Fitz can be at times. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xameil Posted October 2, 2021 Share Posted October 2, 2021 Jeeeeeze.... Seriously, the kid has 1 bad game, a game where he barely even had the ball to get a rhythm going because the defense couldn't stop anything. Get off the ledge people... 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted October 2, 2021 Share Posted October 2, 2021 1 hour ago, Xameil said: Jeeeeeze.... Seriously, the kid has 1 bad game, a game where he barely even had the ball to get a rhythm going because the defense couldn't stop anything. Get off the ledge people... I don't think anyone is really on the ledge here. Just talking realistically about the situation. IMO this is actually one of the unfortunate side effects of people getting super hyped about a guy like Heinicke in a thread like this. It can set unrealistic expectations, so if he has a bad game the effects and talk about it is more amplified than it would be if he were just some rando QB who was playing for us and who nobody was expecting to be the savior. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skins island connection Posted October 2, 2021 Share Posted October 2, 2021 It would be nice to see Heinicke thrive, but in order for that to happen he will need a good QB coach and supporting cast for it to happen. That kinda sounds like i'm making him to be a JAG, but he's not the type of QB to throw the team on his back, nor should anyone expect that from him. Its been done before, where an average-at-best QB makes it to the SB, but not often. Personally i'd like to see some designed roll-outs to give him a better field view, QBs his size have a hard time seeing the field with the gargantuan linemen nowadays, and it could cut down on his 'up for grabs' passes he sometimes throws. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malapropismic Depository Posted October 2, 2021 Share Posted October 2, 2021 (edited) 37 minutes ago, skins island connection said: It would be nice to see Heinicke thrive, but in order for that to happen he will need a good QB coach and supporting cast for it to happen. Ken Zampese has a pretty good reputation, as well as a good resume. Plus, he's the son of a Zampese. He's been here, just slightly over one season. Has he done something that caused you to lose hope in him ? Edited October 2, 2021 by Malapropismic Depository Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skins island connection Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 4 hours ago, Malapropismic Depository said: Ken Zampese has a pretty good reputation, as well as a good resume. Plus, he's the son of a Zampese. He's been here, just slightly over one season. Has he done something that caused you to lose hope in him ? Well, never say never..lol. Currently I don't see an issue with Z, i'm just hoping he can really have a positive influence and start the polishing aspect of Heinicke, BUT, if history is any indication, it will be either 'greatest QB ever or bust regarding the fanbase. A QB comes here, starts out doing ok, next season there's a regression, and boom he's out the door. I guess i'm too old fashioned where teams stuck with their QB even when they has a down year, but in today's game if the QB has 2 bas games back to back the torches and pitchforks come out. Its always 'win now and forever', no place for having an off year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reaper Skins Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 On 9/27/2021 at 5:02 PM, ILikeBilly said: Ps - did they even show a replay of Gibson 's catch and run? I didn't see one. Saw someone post this photo online of it. Would make a pretty sweet poster... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malapropismic Depository Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 Heinicke saved EVERYONE'S ass today. Practically the whole team tried to lose it, but Heini forced the win. Did so with a depleted offense on top of that, hampered with injuries to key players 6 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abdcskins Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 Heinicke's greatest asset imo his his legs. He is able to evade the pass rush and buy time to make throws, such as that astounging pass to McKissic. He is also able to scramble for yards and first downs. That skill set is essential. He is also able to keep his eyes downfield. Impressive, guy plays with a hell of a heart and grit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wildbunny Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 12 minutes ago, Malapropismic Depository said: Heinicke saved EVERYONE'S ass today. Practically the whole team tried to lose it, but Heini forced the win. Did so with a depleted offense on top of that, hampered with injuries to key players As Jon Allen said after the Giants' win: "Offense bailed us out time and time again today." This is true for today as well. Guy is good enough to play and carry the offense, much improvment from last week. All he needs is the D to start playing football. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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