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The Washington Defensive Line Thread

Burgundy Yoda

By Burgundy Yoda
in The Stadium

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method man

method man

Posted
Posted
4 hours ago, mojo said:

Maybe not Chase but it’s time to trade one of these D linemen.  We’re going to be 5-12 and lose one of them for nothing in return.

 

If the losing continues, I'd definitely try to get value for Ioan and Settle, even if mid to late round picks. I think Payne and Sweat are building blocks, however.

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IrepDC

IrepDC

Posted
Posted

Young and Sweat during a game:

 

"Wow this speed rush around the outside hasn't been working. The Tackles keep pushing us 10 yards behind the LOS leaving a hug gap for the QB to step up, even though Allen and Payne are pushing the pocket back...."

 

"What should we try next play?"

 

"I got it!"

 

"Speed rush around the outside! They'll never see it coming!"

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IrepDC

IrepDC

Posted
Posted
Just now, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

It sure seems that's the only tool in the toolbox.  It regularly works them out of the play.

Do we have a DL Coach? Is he working with them at all? That seems like a dream coaching job having two athletic freaks to mold and teach the game to. Instead they don't seem to be developing any new techniques at all. This is why I was so adamant about keeping Kerrigan around to mentor them because there's no way a veteran wouldn't have pulled them to the side by now. The veterans we have on defense are literally liabilities who can't teach our young guys anything about being successful in this league.

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BatteredFanSyndrome

BatteredFanSyndrome

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, IrepDC said:

This is why I was so adamant about keeping Kerrigan around to mentor them because there's no way a veteran wouldn't have pulled them to the side by now.

I recall Chase speaking in depth about the influence Kerrigan had on him as for what it takes to be a pro and work hard.  Kerrigan leaves and Chase spends his off-season playing celebrity instead of football player, and it shows.  

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IrepDC

IrepDC

Posted
Posted
Just now, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

I recall Chase speaking in depth about the influence Kerrigan had on him as for what it takes to be a pro and work hard.  Kerrigan leaves and Chase spends his off-season playing celebrity instead of football player, and it shows.  

Allowing Kerrigan to go made them feel like they're ready to lead. They're not. Chase shouting before games was cool at first, but it gets old fast when that's his biggest impact on the game. He needed a vet like Kerrigan to keep him in apprentice mode another year or two. We have no veterans for the young guys to model after or look up to.

 

I've said from day 1 that DL are better on their 2nd and 3rd contracts. They need time. I still believe each of our four 1st rounders will be dominant players in this league, for us or other teams, but as usual, we have mishandled their development.

 

Look at how Cosmi is developing on the other side where we have plenty of veterans to show him the ropes and pull him to the side when necessary. Imagine if Cosmi was expected to be the leader of our OL next year. It would be a disaster like the DL has been.

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KDawg

KDawg

Posted
Posted

Someone mentioned Sheehan to me today and it reminded me to catch up on his podcast.

 

He mentioned something about how early last year the DL wasn't happy with the techniques they were being coached and Ioan even wanted out at one point. I don't remember hearing about that at all. They kept that pretty in house apparently. So... there's more to this whole thing than meets the eye and its real obvious.

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mojo

mojo

Posted
Posted

I think it’s pretty simple. We played garbage offenses with back up QB’s last half of last season. That was key to our ‘dominant’ defense.

Once we played a real QB like Brady, our D looked exactly how it’s has it has this year. No pass rush and can’t get off the field.

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Warhead36

Warhead36

Posted
Posted
20 hours ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

I recall Chase speaking in depth about the influence Kerrigan had on him as for what it takes to be a pro and work hard.  Kerrigan leaves and Chase spends his off-season playing celebrity instead of football player, and it shows.  

Meh, what Young does in the off season doesn't bother me at all. These guys have LOTS of time off. You can't expect them to just train non stop 24/7. You have an opportunity to make money and build your brand, you take it. We would all 100% do the same thing. I'm never gonna tell a guy to leave money on the table. And I follow him on IG, he trains plenty. That isn't the issue.

 

 

29 minutes ago, KDawg said:

Someone mentioned Sheehan to me today and it reminded me to catch up on his podcast.

 

He mentioned something about how early last year the DL wasn't happy with the techniques they were being coached and Ioan even wanted out at one point. I don't remember hearing about that at all. They kept that pretty in house apparently. So... there's more to this whole thing than meets the eye and its real obvious.

IIRC our DL are being coached to be more read/react instead of storm the gaps to make plays. I guess it makes sense if you don't have faith in your back seven to cover(which they can't) but right now we should just say F it and be as aggressive as possible. It can't get much worse than giving up 43 points.

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KDawg

KDawg

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, Warhead36 said:

Meh, what Young does in the off season doesn't bother me at all. These guys have LOTS of time off. You can't expect them to just train non stop 24/7. You have an opportunity to make money and build your brand, you take it. We would all 100% do the same thing. I'm never gonna tell a guy to leave money on the table. And I follow him on IG, he trains plenty. That isn't the issue.

 

 

IIRC our DL are being coached to be more read/react instead of storm the gaps to make plays. I guess it makes sense if you don't have faith in your back seven to cover(which they can't) but right now we should just say F it and be as aggressive as possible. It can't get much worse than giving up 43 points.

 

Yes, that would be 2-gapping. Which is what we have talked about a bunch on being a really poor use of talent.

 

Doesn't fix a lack of pass rush moves, but...

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Warhead36

Warhead36

Posted
Posted
3 minutes ago, KDawg said:

 

Yes, that would be 2-gapping. Which is what we have talked about a bunch on being a really poor use of talent.

 

Doesn't fix a lack of pass rush moves, but...

Yeah and it doesn't explain that our DTs appear to be doing quite well pushing the pocket. But maybe with a more aggressive scheme they'd be even better? I'm not an Xs and Os guru in that respect.

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Gurgeh

Gurgeh

Posted
Posted
10 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

But who is teaching him these moves? That's where coaching comes in.

 

I wonder if it's a case of he has been taught the techniques but he just isn't using them effectively; sometimes with great athletes they struggle to adapt because they've never had to before. 

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BatteredFanSyndrome

BatteredFanSyndrome

Posted
Posted
19 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

Meh, what Young does in the off season doesn't bother me at all. These guys have LOTS of time off. You can't expect them to just train non stop 24/7. You have an opportunity to make money and build your brand, you take it. We would all 100% do the same thing. I'm never gonna tell a guy to leave money on the table. And I follow him on IG, he trains plenty. That isn't the issue.

I can only say the same when the production on the field is there.  When it's not, it's a bad look.  Those are just the breaks of being a high profile athlete.  Beyond building the brand, he also wouldn't get vaccinated for his cancer surviving coach. 

 

The line of guys who fail to meet their potential because they are worried about more than football is a very, very long one.  We know this all too well. 

 

I'm not all out on Chase Young, I've seen enough of him to know that he has the tools to change the narrative.  But I can't overlook that his celebrity stats are higher than his football stats right now.

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50yrSKINSfan

50yrSKINSfan

Posted
Posted

I watched Whatt from the Steelers on his pass rush. At the snap the OT stands up and starts to back up which is normal for pass protection, but instead of trying to scoot around him on the outside Whatt puts his left hand into the chest of the QT and pushes him back because the OT s weight is already going backwards and then he scoots under the OT on the inside right to the QB who is climbing back towards the los at a much shorter route. Drove me crazy until I took the time to watch as I could not figure out how a 250lb guy could overpower a 325 lb guy but he does it with quickness and you can tell that he has drilled this move a million times. Without a detailed look at CY he just seems to rush to tho outside taking a longer route and letting the OT just ride him away from the QB who climbs back towards the los away from the outside rush.

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88Comrade2000

88Comrade2000

Posted
Posted
42 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

Meh, what Young does in the off season doesn't bother me at all. These guys have LOTS of time off. You can't expect them to just train non stop 24/7. You have an opportunity to make money and build your brand, you take it. We would all 100% do the same thing. I'm never gonna tell a guy to leave money on the table. And I follow him on IG, he trains plenty. That isn't the issue.

 

 

IIRC our DL are being coached to be more read/react instead of storm the gaps to make plays. I guess it makes sense if you don't have faith in your back seven to cover(which they can't) but right now we should just say F it and be as aggressive as possible. It can't get much worse than giving up 43 points.

How about 50,60,70 against Rodgers and Mahoney.

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JSSkinz

JSSkinz

Posted
Posted

Ron keeps harping on maturity and he's been saying it before the season started so its not a new thing, I feel like he's trying to be civil and not throw anyone under the bus but we all know who he's talking about, don't we?

 

You could probably throw in Collins with that and maybe even a few more but to me its clear we have an issue with a few players who think they know more than the coaches, or they're having huge issues mastering the scheme, I'm not buying the latter.

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BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93

BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93

Posted
Posted (edited)

There’s now 3 media members implying that the DEs are freelancing and not in sync with the rest of the defense. Keim, Sheehan, and Logan Paulsen (who breaks down a ton of tape on Instagram). The first two based off what they’re hearing from inside the building and the third from solely watching film. 
 

Im sure this is what Ron means about “maturity”. The fact that this is a thing INFURIATES me. 

Edited by BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93
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NoCalMike

NoCalMike

Posted
Posted

Usually it is a major issue if a single player on the defense is out there just "doing me" but if it is multiple players then that goes beyond.  It doesn't mean it can't be corrected, but it also means the defense is going to be mediocre until it stops.  You can't run a zone defense where players just decide to go wherever they want instead of going to cover where their assignment says they should be.

 

No defender on this team has proven themselves to be a Ray Lewis or London Fletcher where they can simply read & react based on what's happening after the snap.  

 

If it is just a maturity/inexperience/trust your teammates issue, I would actually be more relieved because that can be corrected over time, however if it is a "we don't respect what our coaches are preaching, and know better how to do this" then alarm bells need to ring and the sooner, the better. 

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