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A New Start! Ron Rivera, Dan Snyder, The Front Office, and Anything Team Related (other than name change)


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3 hours ago, CRobi21 said:

Just change it already. 

 

It's a dumb name of a dumb sports team. It's not that big of a deal.

 

They've been an embarraasment for as long as I can remember. I feel no pride when I hear the name Redskins.

And you can jump ship.

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7 hours ago, ConnSKINS26 said:

For those against the idea of change, let me pose it in a way that bypasses the need to care about other people and caters to you as a fan and NFL consumer, directly and selfishly:

 

Someday when we win another SB, or luck into a stud QB, or have a league-leading unit and a great record....do you want to be treated like NFL royalty again and be the talk of the league in respected fashion, relevant and central to football talk everywhere like the other currently great franchises? Or would you prefer that for the rest of the NFL's existence, and more and more every year, every single football-related accomplishment and honor is marred by the resurgence of this conversation? Forever. Tainting the conversation about this team no matter how good we get, because being in the spotlight for anything becomes inherently controversial. 

 

Sounds miserable to me. Think of it, if you have to, as taking control of our own destiny and re-writing the narrative instead of letting the rest of the world do it forever more. And then getting on with our lives as regular sports fans.

 

I suppose you're right, but my frustration is that I still think this truly stems from the fact that Dan Snyder is unlikable.  And because he's been a dick to the media, this becomes an easy target. 

 

Because the real facts of this conversation - the name Redskins IS NOT RACIST.  Period.  Anyone who has done their homework on the origins of the word knows the history of that it being a term of honor used by Native Americans ourselves. But don't let the facts get in the way of the media's narrative, because they push it constantly as fact, when it simply isn't. 

 

Go to the reservations and take polls on who their favorite NFL teams are - it isn't close, and you will see countless Redskins tattoos. There are multiple Redskins high school mascots in areas with high populations of Native Americans. How would that even be remotely allowed if the name was offensive to them?  Because it's not. It's offensive to white people because of lazy reporting and we just assume because of how it sounds that we SHOULD be offended. 

 

But you know what IS offensive?  The KC Chiefs tomahawk chop. And here we are after their Super Bowl win but no one is talking about it. Because their owner isn't an asshole. 

 

Just my $.02, but this whole topic gets me super worked up.  I am an American Indian and I BECAME A Redskins fan because of my heritage.  I love that my favorite football team keeps a small piece of my ancestors memory alive. I love the imagery of Chief Two Guns White Calf. 

 

But at this point, the ignorance is deafening because like anything, if you say something loud and long enough, people assume it to be true.  And the media has pounded on this for so long, that I'm not certain you'll ever convince the masses of the actual truth.  So I'm torn and ready to just quit caring and give up the fight. 

 

But it's sad, and when it eventually happens, it's certainly not appeasing the vast majority of American Indians that's for damn sure. 

 

Hail. 

Edited by LetThePointsSoar
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The above post is why I’m so upset about the name being changed which looks inevitable at this point. I’m a white man and I’ve heard what you said numerous times from American Indians, Native Americans And that’s who should matter. Not white or black Americans who tell you it’s racists and are super sensitive these days. Just my 2 cents.

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I see this differently than most.  

First let me be clear I support Dan's ability to make a decision that is best for the fans and legacy of the Washington Redskins.


But because I think he will make such a move, I do not expect him to bend to the latest pressure for the following reasons:

1. FedEx has a contract with the team... They are now in basically breach of that contract>
2. Pepsi likely also has a Contract with the team... and are now in basically breach of that contract
3. As for Nike?  Not sure if that's a league side decision or not.
4. All three are in effect corporations that have benefited from sponsoring or making product for the team for many years.
5. They should have no say in whether the team makes a decision either way.  To demand they do so, IMO is interference that could result in damages awarded to Snyder if he were to go to court (I hope he does)
6. ABC/ESPN/NBC have basically been lobbying for this for years, and as a partner of the NFL/team are also kind of in breach of the contract also
7. SNyder is not stupid, he can see that already the blow back from overreach from the current politics in many cities is coming.  Changing the name puts him on the wrong side of it.

8.  Many fans have invested years of their life buying, consuming, and supporting the legacy of this team.  I do not believe Dan has it in his heart to do anything that would throw away what good there is in the Redskins Legacy.
9. At what point, does this become a form of Defamation of character?  Seriously, consider this a moment, they are besmirching not just Dan's name, but every person who ever has been a fan.  This too might be a point that he could win in a court of law.

I hope Snyder takes them to court, and rakes them over the coals, gloats for 2 years... then some time later, changes the name only then because local groups agree they can do more good and honor more people long term by doing that, without throwing out the legacy with the bath water.

I do not wish the name to change, but I will understand if one day he decides its time for his own reasons, I do not think he should be forced to do so by corporations that have signed contracts with the team.

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10 hours ago, ConnSKINS26 said:

 

This is a ridiculous sentence and demonstrates willfull ignorance of the actual issue. Sorry, is "cowboys" a derogatory term for an oppressed minority group who are the victims of a historical systematic genocide? Or are you just posting like an ass due to the perceived politics of the issue, which aren't allowed in the Stadium?

No, not posting like an ass due to the perceived politics of the issue.  Cowboys worked the land that was claimed away from American Indians during westward expansion, land that was considered "up for grabs" with no ownership.  So tell me, how long until the Cowboys are forced to change their name because of that?  Or what about the other team I mentioned in the Chiefs? 

55 minutes ago, GOSKINS_08 said:

At what point does Snyder issue a statement? Has to be today or this weekend you would think.

He will issue a statement, and the holiday weekend sounds like the best time to him because fewer eyes will be on it.  

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Native Americans is a racist term created by the Whites.  I'm sorry there is no such thing as Indians in America. As a person from India, the only people that should be called Indians are from India.  

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58 minutes ago, LetThePointsSoar said:

 

I suppose you're right, but my frustration is that I still think this truly stems from the fact that Dan Snyder is unlikable.  And because he's been a dick to the media, this becomes an easy target. 

 

Because the real facts of this conversation - the name Redskins IS NOT RACIST.  Period.  Anyone who has done their homework on the origins of the word knows the history of that it being a term of honor used by Native Americans ourselves. But don't let the facts get in the way of the media's narrative, because they push it constantly as fact, when it simply isn't. 

 

Go to the reservations and take polls on who their favorite NFL teams are - it isn't close, and you will see countless Redskins tattoos. There are multiple Redskins high school mascots in areas with high populations of Native Americans. How would that even be remotely allowed if the name was offensive to them?  Because it's not. It's offensive to white people because of lazy reporting and we just assume because of how it sounds that we SHOULD be offended. 

 

But you know what IS offensive?  The KC Chiefs tomahawk chop. And here we are after their Super Bowl win but no one is talking about it. Because their owner isn't an asshole. 

 

Just my $.02, but this whole topic gets me super worked up.  I am an American Indian and I BECAME A Redskins fan because of my heritage.  I love that my favorite football team keeps a small piece of my ancestors memory alive. 

 

But it's sad, and when it eventually happens, it's certainly not appeasing the vast majority of American Indians that's for damn sure. 

 

Hail. 

Don't you know you are supposed to think the name is racist? After all, a bunch of SJWs told you so.  Therefore you should just convert your thinking. No difference of opinion is allowed or you are part of the problem. /sarcasm

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10 hours ago, ThomasTomasz said:

Because with the way things are going, it's only a matter of time before someone finds a way to demonize cowboys.  

 

Congratulations, you have become your own boogeyman!

 

24 minutes ago, ThomasTomasz said:

Cowboys worked the land that was claimed away from American Indians during westward expansion, land that was considered "up for grabs" with no ownership.  So tell me, how long until the Cowboys are forced to change their name because of that?

 

Using a loaded bull**** term like "SJW" in what has otherwise been a football team-related thread (despite the touchy topic) will probably get you mod attention, @Rex Tomb, just FYI. We can be better than that and still disagree.

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Dark are the days when you have to plant your flag on the side of Dan Snyder or a child labor corporation. Where is Nike when China was and still is actively oppressing protesters in Hong Kong? Pursuing different priorities. For trying to be a forward thinking company, they sure do spend a lot of time focusing on the past and not on the present.

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@ConnSKINS26 what term would you use, then? What term would be more appropriate. Not being snarky, just curious as to what you think would be a better way to describe what I'm looking for.

4 minutes ago, NickyJ said:

Dark are the days when you have to plant your flag on the side of Dan Snyder or a child labor corporation. Where is Nike when China was and still is actively oppressing protesters in Hong Kong? Pursuing different priorities. For trying to be a forward thinking company, they sure do spend a lot of time focusing on the past and not on the present.

Or sending the Wuygers to prison camps simply because they're Muslim.  Whatever Nike says, they are pointing out the splinters in people's eyes while avoiding the plank in their own.  They are basically owned by a country that routinely and openly oppresses the minority populations in their country.

Edited by Rex Tomb
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Dan Snyder is a piece of ****.  We all know this.  He has been a dreadful owner for 20 years now.  I don’t see how fans can halfway ride with that scumbag on such an issue as the offensiveness of the team name that was created by a known BIGOT (George Preston Marshall).  We should all hope and pray that little Dan is forced to change the name of this franchise and certainly HOPE that it also forces his hand & he sells the team!  Snyder effectively KILLED everything that we ever knew that was true Redskins football & it’s time to move on!!!

Edited by -JB-
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10 hours ago, ConnSKINS26 said:

Kinda dig this, not sure if it's been posted:

 

 


Out of all the suggestions I’ve seen I think people could rally around this. I like the uniform and logo design too. As others have mentioned, keeping any Native American imagery or reference is only going to be viewed as a half-hearted attempt.
 

Unfortunately for Snyder he waited too long and instead of being ahead of the wave he is now going to be swallowed by it. I don’t believe the NFL will force his hand, but I do believe they will make it clear by their inaction against league partners (e.g. FedEx, Nike, Pepsi, etc.) that he has no allies left. I suspect they will give him room to “get there”, and it wouldn’t surprise me if they asked Jerrah to try and give him a little push if needed. 

 

What I am curious to see is what Snyder will get in return. We know he wants a new stadium in DC at the RFK site. There are a lot of moving parts to that however and I’d be shocked if it could all come together right now with so many other pressing issues that have to be dealt with. 
 

It also wouldn’t surprise me in the least if he just decides to say **** it and let’s Bezos buy him out. 

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10 hours ago, Dont Taze Me Bro said:

 

Completely off-topic........every time you post (over the years) I always first read your username as Tampon75.  Nothing personal or about your posts, just where my mind wanders lol.

Is this the start of a movement to force me to change my name? I will never relinquish  😂 
   Got the name from my high school mascot, Fighting Tarpons. For those whom might not know,Tarpon are highly sought after game fish in this part of Florida, as well as some other areas. 

Edited by Tarpon75
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8 minutes ago, DJD2 said:


Out of all the suggestions I’ve seen I think people could rally around this. I like the uniform and logo design too. As others have mentioned, keeping any Native American imagery or reference is only going to be viewed as a half-hearted attempt.
 

Unfortunately for Snyder he waited too long and instead of being ahead of the wave he is now going to be swallowed by it. I don’t believe the NFL will force his hand, but I do believe they will make it clear by their inaction against league partners (e.g. FedEx, Nike, Pepsi, etc.) that he has no allies left. I suspect they will give him room to “get there”, and it wouldn’t surprise me if they asked Jerrah to try and give him a little push if needed. 

 

What I am curious to see is what Snyder will get in return. We know he wants a new stadium in DC at the RFK site. There are a lot of moving parts to that however and I’d be shocked if it could all come together right now with so many other pressing issues that have to be dealt with. 
 

It also wouldn’t surprise me in the least if he just decides to say **** it and let’s Bezos buy him out. 

Some of the ideas I've thought of if Snyder decided it was time to do so in no way am I advocating this should happen now: (In no particular order)

Washington Red Hawks
Washington Red Rivals
Washington Nation
Washington Trumpcards (hey adding a new casino right? why not get on the ground floor and embrace it?)  (Could also subtley thumb the eye of the people pushing this as some will shorten it to the Washington Trumps
Washington Forever (OR DC Forever)
Washintgon Hail  
Washington Triumph

(My favorites here are Washintgon Nation, Washington DC Forever, Washington Triumph, btw it would be fun to tie this to DC getting state hood if that were to actually happen)

Edited by Veretax
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34 minutes ago, Rex Tomb said:

@ConnSKINS26 what term would you use, then? What term would be more appropriate. Not being snarky, just curious as to what you think would be a better way to describe what I'm looking for.

 

You articulate what you're actually trying to say or convey with that derisive use of a catch-all shorthand for many different people and I'll see if I think there's a better term. Hard to say with such a broad, essentially meaningless buzzword. 

Edited by ConnSKINS26
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1 hour ago, Veretax said:

I see this differently than most.  

First let me be clear I support Dan's ability to make a decision that is best for the fans and legacy of the Washington Redskins.


But because I think he will make such a move, I do not expect him to bend to the latest pressure for the following reasons:

1. FedEx has a contract with the team... They are now in basically breach of that contract>
2. Pepsi likely also has a Contract with the team... and are now in basically breach of that contract
3. As for Nike?  Not sure if that's a league side decision or not.
4. All three are in effect corporations that have benefited from sponsoring or making product for the team for many years.
5. They should have no say in whether the team makes a decision either way.  To demand they do so, IMO is interference that could result in damages awarded to Snyder if he were to go to court (I hope he does)
6. ABC/ESPN/NBC have basically been lobbying for this for years, and as a partner of the NFL/team are also kind of in breach of the contract also
7. SNyder is not stupid, he can see that already the blow back from overreach from the current politics in many cities is coming.  Changing the name puts him on the wrong side of it.

8.  Many fans have invested years of their life buying, consuming, and supporting the legacy of this team.  I do not believe Dan has it in his heart to do anything that would throw away what good there is in the Redskins Legacy.
9. At what point, does this become a form of Defamation of character?  Seriously, consider this a moment, they are besmirching not just Dan's name, but every person who ever has been a fan.  This too might be a point that he could win in a court of law.

I hope Snyder takes them to court, and rakes them over the coals, gloats for 2 years... then some time later, changes the name only then because local groups agree they can do more good and honor more people long term by doing that, without throwing out the legacy with the bath water.

I do not wish the name to change, but I will understand if one day he decides its time for his own reasons, I do not think he should be forced to do so by corporations that have signed contracts with the team.

You some really good points. Well done!

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personally I like red tails and think it'd be a good choice but I also think eventually it'd be a constant battle trying to convince a group of people that it was chosen as a way to honor the Tuskegee airmen and not disparage them.

probably have to go with the Washington butterflies or something just to be safe. 

Edited by redskinss
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The only thing that anyone ever brings up is our name, I say we keep as much Native American imagery, history, etc as possible. Change to the warriors or the braves or something. But to completely change would be heartbreaking. I would rather Dan sell and the team move. 
I have lived in the Midwest the second half of my life... maybe I would just move on. 
to the folks so easily or eagerly awaiting this and telling everyone else they’re  cold hearted a holes... you do realize we are the most insane of Redskin fans in the world and that WAY too much of our life is wrapped up in this team? Being a fan of this team is literally the only constant in my entire life- it ****ing means a lot

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Is the Logo racist or is it more the name? I have to admit I am more attached to the Logo than the name. Keeping the Logo and using a name that is more respectful could be an option. What about The Washington Warriors. Does that offend people? Maybe with the blood in the water people won't be satisfied unless everything is changed. 

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  • Jumbo changed the title to A New Start! Ron Rivera, Dan Snyder, The Front Office, and Anything Team Related (other than name change)
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