Spaceman Spiff Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 (edited) 21 minutes ago, hawgboy said: He's THAT toxic... But is he REALLY that toxic? I mean, what are we talking about here, blowing up on the sideline? Twitter? He's not running around doing blow and banging hookers like Michael Irvin. Is he going to do anything thats going to get him suspended from the league? Is he punching teammates like Westbrook on Stephen Davis? Or is he shanking teammates in the neck like Michael Irvin? Has he ever been suspended by the NFL? He's got an attitude, sure. But a lot of WRs are divas. He's no different. The pearl clutching around here about Dez Bryant being a cancer or a poison is over the top. And that's what it is, pearl clutching at its finest. He'd be one of 53 guys here and signed to a small contract. One man, one possession WR does not bring down a team. He acts up and pisses people off? Cut him. Edited October 19, 2018 by Spaceman Spiff 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheShredder Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 I don't think you get any real value from adding WR's mid season. That's a position where it's better to use what you started the year with in order to take steps and adding guys into that mix are fillers at best. Skins have weapons in the TE's and some younger guys that can go up and make plays if they're given enough opportunities. Just obvious to me that the WR's aren't getting the opportunities. Smith's not throwing the 50/50 ball. Doctson isn't getting separation, but think about it, he never has. Smith throws Doctson's way and it's way out of bounds instead of a 50/50 ball. If Crowder and Richardson are out this week, then go with the TE's and a philosophy that the team will be going with Doctson and Mo in 1-on-1 matchups deep. I don't have any problem with TE's and AD game plan, but you've gotta take shots. Really need to see a true 50/50 ball opportunity. Let them go up and fight for the ball on deep routes. I'd say on the other side of the 50, that 20+ yard 50/50 ball is as good as a punt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koolblue13 Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 (edited) Y'all think Dez is gonna step to Allen and Trent, without busting his ass running routes and pass blocking? Especially after being cut, ignored by everyone and signing for an incentive contract? IR Docs soft ass and go sign Dez and Galette. Fix some needs. Edited October 20, 2018 by Koolblue13 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheShredder Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 (edited) 38 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said: Y'all think Dez is gonna step to Allen and Trent, without busting his ass running routes and pass blocking? Especially after being cut, ignored by everyone and signing for an incentive contract? IR Docs soft ass and go sign Dez and Galette. Fix some needs. I see that as a gamble that isn't worth taking since Dez Bryant has more downside then upside. Nobody wants Dez Bryant. If you look at the actual breakdown of his play falling off the last couple of years, you see that he can't get separation (which he needs to be affective), drops balls, doesn't run the full route tree at the same speed. Multiple posts on why nobody wants Bryant. He doesn't fix anything. Adding the Twitter baby doesn't do anything in the instance of Doctson's issues. Skins should have signed Jordy Nelson with Paul Richardson. Galette was done awhile ago. Skins took a cheap flyer on him and ultimately he didn't produce. He wanted to get one more contract to retire and failed. Definitely not any solution to why the Skins outside rushers aren't getting sacks. One of the main reasons the Skins are better in run defense is because they aren't selling out the ends for sacks. You can distinctly see it on the replays. Smith and Kerrigan are obviously being asked to defend the run before the sack. On many replays you have example after example of Smith and Kerrigan going after the running back on RPO's. That's the tell...they're assignments are stop the run game first. It's working. Edited October 20, 2018 by TheShredder 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thinking Skins Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 52 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said: Y'all think Dez is gonna step to Allen and Trent, without busting his ass running routes and pass blocking? Especially after being cut, ignored by everyone and signing for an incentive contract? IR Docs soft ass and go sign Dez and Galette. Fix some needs. But Doc isn't hurt. I don't even get the injury prone thing about him. He missed one season played one, and missed a game this year. He's not even in the injury list. Poor production is one thing, but he isn't this soft guy who plays one and misses 3. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crabbypatty Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 (edited) What's the deal with Trey Quinn? Will he ever be healthy? Nevermind. I didn't know he was on ir. Why haven't they brought simmie cobbs back? He's a big body, looked good in preseason.. kidsy as well Edited October 20, 2018 by crabbypatty Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thinking Skins Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 I'm watching the Carolina game again and that last pass to Doctson is what I've wondered about him all along. We were sold a bag of goods about his deep route, which he has kinda given us hints of. But I've wondered about his ability to be physical and win on shorter routes. This last pass was one of the few times where he's caught a short contested ball like that. Looking at his other routes and catches, i don't doubt that he'll still be used as a deep threat, but I wonder if Charles Davis was right in that we're seeing an evolution in his game where he's getting better at the short routes too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinsinparadise Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 10 hours ago, Koolblue13 said: go sign Dez and Galette. Fix some needs. Galette to me is a no brainer considering how the pass rush has gone. With each week Dez is getting more tempting, I wasn't into it before but after all these injuries, tempting. this is a PFF guy on it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandyHolt Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 (edited) Doctson is certainly still finding his place in the league. A bit part of learning to play in the NFL is also learning the physical part. Vets will say the kids need to learn to take care of their bodies, but its also learning how to deal with badass NFL corners. The bigger problem with Doctson is that its him and no one. How can we expect him to perform as a 1st round WR with no one to take the heat off him, and Alex as his QB. I think the expectations are largely unrealistic on him right now. I still say 6 TDs last year is nothing to scoff at. Scoring TDs ain't easy. I feel like we went a decade without a wideout scoring 6 TDs not long ago. The Thrash / Moss era. We could have also brought in Dontrelle Inman among others. I agree, its too late unless we need a body to throw out there. Anyone we add at wide in mid season simply is not going to be productive, short of coming from the same coaching tree / time with the QB in previous stops. Our WRs can't get no respect. It looks like tight man all the freaking time. We expect a little bit more from Harris or Quick but anytime they get a target, they are swarmed. Temper expectations on them as well until we see something. Our WR group right now has to be the thinnest in the league yes worse than Dallas. Its tough sledding out there. Jay needs to scheme up some open WRs, somehow. AP can't do it all. I want to see a trick or gadget play tried more often than never. Edited October 20, 2018 by RandyHolt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darrell Green Fan Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 14 hours ago, Spaceman Spiff said: The pearl clutching around here about Dez Bryant being a cancer or a poison is over the top. And that's what it is, pearl clutching at its finest. He'd be one of 53 guys here and signed to a small contract. One man, one possession WR does not bring down a team. He acts up and pisses people off? Cut him. There is a reason Dez is still out of work. It's the same reason a top 5 talent was still available with the 24th pick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Playaction2Sanders Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 9 hours ago, crabbypatty said: What's the deal with Trey Quinn? Will he ever be healthy? Nevermind. I didn't know he was on ir. Why haven't they brought simmie cobbs back? He's a big body, looked good in preseason.. kidsy as well He's on IR and can return 8 weeks after designation if he's ready..So I believe week 9 is the earliest we could see him.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandyHolt Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, Skinsinparadise said: Galette to me is a no brainer considering how the pass rush has gone.... One aspect of lobbying to add a player is, who are we going to cut. I feel like that name should be included, as that is the cost. But I also agree with a post that suggested we are prioritizing our efforts on D to more than pass rushing. Stop the run, stop the RPO, stop the gadget play... ok none of those happened, lets go get the QB. I feel like gone are the days of seeing Kerrigan rushing up field unblocked, as the back runs right by him. We are in read mode a lot more this year IMO. I will suggest that we have also had Preston in pass coverage a bit more.... going from the eye test. I am not seeing us blitz heavily. And it's not just sheer number of times blitzed, it's how many we send. We can "lead" the league in blitzing but when only blitzing 1, that stat may be misleading. I want to see 2 or 3 sent in, and really dial up the heat. All that aside, I suspect Galette burned his bridge here (nothing more than my speculation though). Back on topic, WR something something. Edited October 20, 2018 by RandyHolt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OVCChairman Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 Now devante parker is on the market... seen rumblings that itll take a 3rd. Not sure I wanna go that high but is it worth kicking the tires? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malapropismic Depository Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 Who's in favor of somehow slipping in Dunny at WR, his original position, since we're hurting so bad there ? I know that would take away from his CB2 availability, but at least on select plays. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OVCChairman Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 10 minutes ago, Malapropismic Depository said: Who's in favor of somehow slipping in Dunny at WR, his original position, since we're hurting so bad there ? I know that would take away from his CB2 availability, but at least on select plays. I'd be so worried about risking arguably, this year, our best cb... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 (edited) To me Dez is a no-go for multiple reasons, and they overlap. Obviously one is that he's a diva who will **** and moan when he doesn't get enough passes thrown his way and is very likely to become a distraction. The second is that his game would absolutely not mesh with our offense. He's a ****ty route runner (seriously, he just THIS YEAR started working with a route running coaching to improve on that) who isn't especially good at getting separation. He's almost always made plays purely on his physical ability and improvisation. That's one of the reasons that his play dropped off and that nobody is all that interested (besides his personality issues)...he just isn't that great of a WR once his physical abilities started to wane a bit. IMO if Dez hadn't been playing with Romo all those years he would have been far less prolific...not that Romo is a GOAT but his style of play suited Dez's...he was a sandlot football improviser who had no problem making risky or contested throws. That's basically the antithesis of Alex Smith. I think we've seen so far that Smith is very unlikely to throw it to someone unless they run a good route, get separation, and are open. So unless Gruden somehow forces him to throw to Dez, or Dez somehow magically becomes a precise route runner, he probably won't get many passes his way. So combine issues one and two together and you don't have a headache, you have a migraine. Dez probably won't get nearly as many passes as he'd want because of #2, and then because of #1 he'll probably then become a malcontent who will be a distraction. Add to that that he apparently wants a pretty good lump of money for a 1 year contract. It simply isn't worth it and I think the Skins FO probably feels the same way. Hard pass on Dez. Edited October 20, 2018 by mistertim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malapropismic Depository Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 I understand the concerns about Dez. But could it be worth a trial period ? We could cut him, the very moment he becomes a problem. Why not ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mooka Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 Alex Smith doesnt throw the ball to his outside WRs. No point in signing Dez. Should've picked up Carlos Hyde for a 5th who can catch or a slot WR. Missing Trey Quinn right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malapropismic Depository Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 14 minutes ago, Mooka said: Alex Smith doesnt throw the ball to his outside WRs. Tyreek Hill is outside, is he not ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mooka Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 2 hours ago, Malapropismic Depository said: Tyreek Hill is outside, is he not ? C'mon man, I'm talking about Alex Smith's entire career, not the 2 seasons he had Tyreek Hill who is dynamic enough to line up anywhere on the field. (including the slot which he is in plenty) Chris Thompson: 26 catches Jordan Reed: 20 Richardson: 16 Crowder: 13 Vernon Davis: 9 Docston: 8 AP: 7 This is the type of ball distribution you expect from Alex Smith. Bringing in Dez Bryant to be our 3rd/4th/5th passing option isn't going to open up our offense, defenses aren't going to play deep scared of Dez Bryant blowing past them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OVCChairman Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 33 minutes ago, Mooka said: C'mon man, I'm talking about Alex Smith's entire career, not the 2 seasons he had Tyreek Hill who is dynamic enough to line up anywhere on the field. (including the slot which he is in plenty) Chris Thompson: 26 catches Jordan Reed: 20 Richardson: 16 Crowder: 13 Vernon Davis: 9 Docston: 8 AP: 7 This is the type of ball distribution you expect from Alex Smith. Bringing in Dez Bryant to be our 3rd/4th/5th passing option isn't going to open up our offense, defenses aren't going to play deep scared of Dez Bryant blowing past them. Not saying dez is the answer... But Alex Smith goes outside when he had a weapon there. Look at the stats.. Crabtree and maclin both had 1000 yard seasons with Smith as QB. We dont have the weapons so why go outside? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 3 hours ago, OVCChairman said: Not saying dez is the answer... But Alex Smith goes outside when he had a weapon there. Look at the stats.. Crabtree and maclin both had 1000 yard seasons with Smith as QB. We dont have the weapons so why go outside? He went outside when he had an absolutely elite weapon who almost always had at least a few steps on the guy covering him. I don't think Alex necessarily has a problem with going deep. What he has a problem with is throwing to guys who aren't at least relatively open. That's like a guy who has no problem throwing contested balls but will only do it to Julio Jones or Calvin Johnson. It's frustrating. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickyJ Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 Richardson, Crowder, and Thompson are all out today. If Doctson doesn't show up tonight, I think that settles his case once and for all. Then we get to see what we have in the other receivers. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vladimir L Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 our wr arent the issue its alex smith he cant throw the ball 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justice98 Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 (edited) Man, it's really hard to judge anybody with the way the QB is playing, in fairness to Doctson and the other guys. Relative to Doctson, DBs are all over him. He gets no separation whatsoever, so they're living in his jersey. So everything feels like it has to be perfect. And the 50/50 balls seem like 30/70 balls. He never comes down with them. He jumps real high and makes a show of it, but never really seems close to coming down with it. Although, I felt Smith needs to let him high point some of these, rather than Doc having to go through people because there isnt enough air under it. Hopefully Criwder and Richardson are back soon. The passing game cant function at less than 100% Edited October 22, 2018 by justice98 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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