Will Cousins Play For The Skins In 2018

[clskinsfan]

1 hour ago, Burgold said:

I'd rather we sign Kirk because I feel like he's good enough to be signed. I also feel like the Redskins' FO made a bet, lost, and ought to pay up. I don't feel like Kirk is Tom Brady, Joe Montana, John Elway, etc. but I do think he can be a good to very good qb.

This is me EXACTLY. He is better than anything else we would have next year regardless. Plus some stability at the QB position would be nice. 

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

2 minutes ago, jschuck12001 said:

 

If we can just sign Kirk for about $22M I think that's fair, all this talk about $25M - $30M is ridiculous, he's not worth that amount of money.

 

That's all I'm saying, let's be smart, don't just give the farm away.

 

The market is what the market is, and its not 22M.

 

Not even sure where that # comes from as the team missed that boat long ago.

 

Im not really sure how an extra 3-5M makes or breaks the roster either.  No matter which way you choose to go, start from scratch with a new QB or resign Kirk, successful drafting year in and year out is imperative to success.

[Rufus T Firefly]

22 minutes ago, Grizz said:

I think there are only 10 teams that need a QB and are in position to either draft or pay big $ for one.  Based on Teams CAP space and draft position, I think Kirk won't have a lot of choices.  Now I realize that teams can create CAP space but as it is now,

The thing is, that's not just a throwaway line you can bring up and then ignore. How much cap space teams have now is irrelevant. How much they can make is the only thing that matters.

 

Jacksonville, for example, would obviously be dumping Bortles if they are going after a new QB,  and Chris Ivory is an easy cut decision. Those two moves create nearly 23 mil in cap. Allen Robinson is the only costly FA they're likely concerned about, and they can make the space to sign him by cutting Allen Hurns. Then, they have several players they can create nearly 10 apiece from by just converting salary to signing bonus. So, they can quite easily become a team with plenty of space to be able to sign Cousins. So, just to dismiss them as "no cap space" is completely inaccurate.

 

Washington's big issue here is their big salaries are guys with 3 years on their deals. That's why I have said I think a team trying to create an offer sheet the Redskins can't match should concentrate on big cap hits for both 2018 and 19. The only way we can make space from our contracts would be to negotiate extensions, which is a much harder process than just converting salary to bonus. Plus, the players we would have to do that with would be 33 year olds when those extensions kick in the exception to all this is Reed, who comes with his own issues).

[JSSkinz]

7 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

 

The market is what the market is, and its not 22M.

 

Not even sure where that # comes from as the team missed that boat long ago.

 

Im not really sure how an extra 3-5M makes or breaks the roster either.  No matter which way you choose to go, start from scratch with a new QB or resign Kirk, successful drafting year in and year out is imperative to success.

 

Your worth what someone will pay you.  How do you know what his market value is?  Do you know GM's and front office people, I'm not trying to be a smart ass but everyone thinks they know what other teams will offer Kirk but they really don't know, those people are talking out of their ass until an actual offer is made.

 

All I want to do is find out what he's worth, the only way I know how to do that is let the market dictate his value.

 

As for what $3M - $5M will do for a team, see Zach Browns contract this year.

 

 

[LaxBuddy21]

23 hours ago, clskinsfan said:

 

Calling someone stupid because they dont agree with you makes you look well....stupid. Breaking the bank for Cousins WILL have an effect on how you can build the rest of the team. I want Cousins back. But after his performance during the past 5 weeks I am not so sure he is worth making the highest paid player in NFL history either. And that is what it is going to take to sign him. Even if they transition tag him he could just run into Redskins Park and sign that 28 million deal. He then would be a UFA in 2019 as the Skins cannot tag him at all that year simply because of the financials.Cousins holds all of the power in this and if he doesnt want to be here he will be gone.

Do you know what else affects your ability to build the rest of the team? Instability at quarterback. The free agents worth anything want to go to teams they can help go to the next level not the ones that can't even reach mediocrity. Keeping Kirk and being a .500 team is actually an attractive option for many even with Dan and Bruce in charge. All we could attract before Kirk were guys looking for that big pay day. 

[HOF44]

Ok we are all skins fans and should know how this is gonna work out.  If he stays here long term he’s gonna be the frustrating inconsistent QB we see sometimes, even more though.  If we let him go he becomes the next Brady and wins multiple Super Bowls. It’s jus how things go for us Skins fans. 

[wit33]

The whole Super Bowl argument for either side is silly, In my humble opinion. 

 

The true rue value is getting to the playoffs and having “at bats”. A lot must go right and luck in many cases to win a Super Bowl.

 

Getting to the playoffs is the real barometer for me. 

[Skinsinparadise]

40 minutes ago, jschuck12001 said:

 

But Kirk isn't Rodgers and I know this has already been debated so no need to beat a dead horse.

 

 

 

Neither is Stafford, Carr.  Then before those two the other guys who got paid the previous year -- on and on.  The Rodgers drill is a construct for conversation on this board -- mostly used as an example to denigrate Kirk.   But the conversation for paying QBs around the league clearly isn't Rodgers or Brady or bust. 

 

40 minutes ago, jschuck12001 said:

 

If we can just sign Kirk for about $22M I think that's fair, all this talk about $25M - $30M is ridiculous, he's not worth that amount of money.

 

$22M is low in today's market.  Kirk just isn't Derek Carr and doesn't deserve what he gets or name that QB who hits FA at each given year?

 

40 minutes ago, jschuck12001 said:

 

The Bruce Allen thing is interesting, he doesn't get credit for any of our good signings but everyone says he's been controlling things since he's been here, which is it?

 

 

This sort of answers my question.  Yeah If I believed in Bruce -- this seems to be his wild ride -- so I'd be all in.   I've not seen anything yet that bring any cloudiness to Bruce not being heavily involved in the contract situation. 

 

Bruce controlling the money hasn't really been a debate.  I know you aren't saying this in this fashion but to bring the point home...the idea that Bruce is spearheading the scouting and Jay and Scott Campbell were lying when they said that Scot had a heavy influence on their draft board, etc.  It's a different discussion.  Apples to oranges to the Kirk contract.

[Rufus T Firefly]

7 minutes ago, wit33 said:

The whole Super Bowl argument for either side is silly, In my humble opinion. 

 

The true rue value is getting to the playoffs and having “at bats”. A lot must go right and luck in many cases to win a Super Bowl.

 

Getting to the playoffs is the real barometer for me. 

I kind of half agree with you. Being a Super Bowl contender is really what you can build and drive for. Basically, any year they are healthy, New England, Pittsburgh, Green Bay and Seattle are title contenders. That's really what you want from your team. If your standards (ie Super Bowl team or not) considers those teams essentially equal to Cleveland, then it's a dumb standard.

 

However, I don't buy the idea that you just get to the playoffs and "get lucky" and I think it's silly for people to look at it that way. There are playoff teams and SB contenders. Tennessee and Buffalo ain't wining a title this year. Not a chance in hell.

[JSSkinz]

 

1 minute ago, Skinsinparadise said:

Neither is Stafford, Carr.  Then before that the other guys who got paid.  The Rodgers drill is a construct for this board.  But the conversation for paying QBs around the league clearly isn't Rodgers or Brady or bust.

 

I would just stop comparing Kirk to hall of famers, its silly.  I think Stafford is a much better QB than Kirk and I don't care what the stats are.

 

3 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

$22M is ridiculous in today's market.  Kirk just isn't Derek Carr and doesn't deserve what he gets or name that QB who hits FA at each given year?

Derek Carr could be a bust, the guy looks like he lost all confidence after his injury.  Carr is an example of why you better be sure who you're dumping your money on.

 

4 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

This sort of answers my question.  Yeah If I believed in Bruce than this seems to be his wild ride -- so I'd be all in.   I've not seen anything yet that bring any cloudiness to Bruce not being heavily involved in the contract situation. 

 

Bruce controlling the money hasn't really been a debate.  I know you aren't saying this in this fashion but to bring the point home...the idea that Bruce is spearheading the scouting and Jay and Scott Campbell were lying when they said that Scot had a heavy influence on their draft board, etc.  It's a different discussion.  Apples to oranges to the Kirk contract.

 

Let me be clear, I don't know what to believe when it comes to our front office, most of the info out there has not been backed up with solid facts from verified sources and many times it's not clear what really happened, like with the Scott M. situation.

 

Bruce was not a good evaluator of talent at his previous 2 teams so did that all the sudden change? I doubt it but I would like to know more about who is actually doing what and who has been involved in drafting our players since he got here.

 

 

[actorguy1]

Just making sure. The Redskins can start negotiating with Cousins now, they don't have to wait until after the league year ends after Super Bowl?

[Skinsinparadise]

12 minutes ago, jschuck12001 said:

 

I would just stop comparing Kirk to hall of famers, its silly. 

 

The ones that make the comparison are Kirk critics.  Not the ones pushing for the signing.  

 

12 minutes ago, jschuck12001 said:

 

Derek Carr could be a bust, the guy looks like he lost all confidence after his injury.  Carr is an example of why you better be sure who you're dumping your money on.

 

Carr was like a football god on this thread to the Kirk critics last off season -- then to them Carr deserved it. And the dude was used as a weapon against Kirk.  Now he's coming off of an off year so now he's an example of why not to make a deal. 

 

12 minutes ago, jschuck12001 said:

 

Bruce was not a good evaluator of talent at his previous 2 teams so did that all the sudden change? I doubt it but I would like to know more about who is actually doing what and who has been involved in drafting our players since he got here.

 

 

Not sure where you are going with challenging Bruce's involvement with the deal.  Is it Bruce really isn't driving the train on it?  And the national-local reporters saying there was tension between Kirk-Kirk's agent with Bruce are wildly off? There have been specific details thrown in the mix including Bruce having drinks with Kirk's agent among other things.  Unless I dreamt it Bruce actually read the press release himself in front of beat guys in July.

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

14 minutes ago, jschuck12001 said:

 

 

I would just stop comparing Kirk to hall of famers, its silly.  I think Stafford is a much better QB than Kirk and I don't care what the stats are.

 

Why exactly? He just "looks" better? 

 

Stafford has has been starting a long time.  Rarely in the playoffs and never won a playoff game.

 

I'm not saying that as an indictment on him.  Like Kirk he also plays for a team that cannot run the ball for squat.

[JSSkinz]

15 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

Not sure where you are going with challenging Bruce's involvement with the deal.  Is it Bruce really isn't driving the train on it?  And the national-local reporters saying there was tension between Kirk-Kirk's agent with Bruce are wildly off? There have been specific details thrown in the mix including Bruce having drinks with Kirk's agent among other things.  Unless I dreamt it Bruce actually read the press release himself in front of beat guys in July.

 

Bruce is definitely driving the train now and I do believe there was tension, but it wasn't just with Bruce, Scott M seemed frustrated with Kirks agent as well.

 

You can read this article and see some of the comments Scott made.

 

http://www.nbcsports.com/washington/washington-redskins/scot-mccloughan-hints-one-possible-hold-kirk-cousins-contract-talks

 

I have no clue about drinks and Kirks agent and what that all means.

9 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

 

Why exactly? He just "looks" better? 

 

Stafford has has been starting a long time.  Rarely in the playoffs and never won a playoff game.

 

I'm not saying that as an indictment on him.  Like Kirk he also plays for a team that cannot run the ball for squat.

 

Specifically, he's big and to have such good footwork where he can sidestep incoming defenders and move into space is something he can do consistently and Kirk cant.

 

I don't think there is one thing Kirk can do that Stafford cant, so that's why I say he's better.

[BLEED-B&G]

We’ve had several good developments on the buyers side that should help us...

 

San Fran and LAR getting comfortable with their current QBs helps.

 

Arians hanging it up in AZ should help as I don’t think KC would view a 1st year HC as a better situation. They’d have to pull of a hell of a hire.

 

Bowles in NY and Joseph in Denver were both rumored on the hot seat this season so I wouldn’t call that “stable”. You could say the same about Gruden I know but it felt like there was more smoke in NY and CO.

 

houston also found a QB and the Browns will draft one.

[SkinsFTW]

1 hour ago, jschuck12001 said:

Every dollar counts and I know Skinsparadise keeps posting about all those WR's at GB and why can't we do it if they do it but GB has invested heavily in offense and not so much on defense, it may be why they haven't won a Superbowl since 2011 and they have the best QB in football.

 

They pay Clay Matthews big money and that's it, nobody else on that defense has a chunky cap number.

 

 

And after only paying for all that offensive talent, every year GB's defense is still better than ours and one thing you didn't mention was that Rodgers only won a SB with the 2nd ranked defense in the entire league.

 

So right now Rodgers still has all those offensive weapons that are highly paid, he still has a better defense too, and he still can't get the team to the SB anyway, but he's immortal therefore we are required to pretend Cousins couldn't possibly get this team to a SB with a good defense, maybe even the 2nd ranked defense in the league.

 

Same can be said for Brady and even more so with Roethlisberger who hasn't even been able to win much the past few years with the best offensive talent on any team in the league, by far. And now his defense improves alot (they're top 5/10) and mysteriously they go 13-3. Roethlisberger must once again be a god, nevermind that he has almost identical stats to Cousins with 1000% more talent around him. 

[Veryoldschool]

Stop the madness.... please stop the madness.....  extend him with HUGE $$$$$$$$$$$$  or let him walk but do it soon.  Do it in January, no reason to jerk us around any longer Snyder!

 

For those of you who aren't interested in paying Cousins, imagine that Kirk walks and goes to Dallas where he wins Super Bowls and dominates Washington completely.  The media pours salt on the wounds for a decade rehashing the 2012 draft debacle except the RGIII bust is becomes the merely a background story in Snyder's real screw up letting Cousins, a Super Bowl-winning future HOF QB slip out of his hands to Dallas where he wins big.  

 

That couldn't happen, that is ridiculous!  You have lost what remained of your tired old mind veryoldschool.  Yeah, maybe but if I was Jerry Jones I'd love to have to have Cousins and would personally pack Prescott's bag if Dak had a problem riding the pine.  We got to see Prescott play without a dominant run game this year and it was ugly.  Imagine Cousins playing with a great run game in 2018.  Imagine Kirk handing the ball to Zeke, how effective would the best play action guy in the league be with that kind of bait and behind the Dallas line?  I'd sign Kirk in a heartbeat and start dreaming about a new Cowboy Super Bowl dynasty if I was Jones.

 

But, but..... this couldn't happen Dallas would never pay Cousins as much as Cleveland, they'd never give Kirk 30M a year!  Probably not, but what if that wasn't necessary?  Kirk Cousins is a nice choirboy but what if Kirk is so pissed about being jerked around and undervalued he is eager to give Snyder the biggest F you in the history of the NFL in addition to going to a franchise that is capable of winning a Super Bowl or two during the next 5-10 years?

 

I don't want this to happen.  I don't want Cousins to go to a team I could never root for if he leaves but it would serve Snyder right and despite what you might think it would make a lot of sense for Kirk and the Cowboys who could win it all with Cousins in addition to sticking it to Snyder.  This would be the Snyder screw up to top all of his previous screw ups.  This could happen.

[SprintBomb]

4 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

A guy said on 106.7 on Russell's show this afternoon that season ticket holders got an email today about how fans blame Kirk for yesterday's loss.   Russell asked the caller to find that email for him if he could.  I haven't heard it mentioned again on the show.  But it created a little discussion from Russell about how Bruce is determined to make Kirk look like the bad guy in the negotiation.  And he said that Dan worked to make nice with Kirk ultimately last off season.  But Russell suggested he doesn't think its the same with Bruce-Kirk. 

I got this email. It's not an official Redskins email though. It's from 247sports.com.  Not sure how or why I got  It but it's garbage. also includes a picture of an actual dumpster fire. 

[gooseneck]

What ever happened to Mark Rypien's  daughter: https://www.bing.com/images/search?q=mark+rypien+daughter+photos&id=B19F7B089C984B2FD26B72E6CB71B9351B159B98&FORM=IQFRBA

 

she never threw 3 interceptions.  Maybe she could be a legacy QB for us next year

[zoony]

Whats this about kirk taking all redskins mentions off his twitter?

[wit33]

2 hours ago, Rufus T Firefly said:

I kind of half agree with you. Being a Super Bowl contender is really what you can build and drive for. Basically, any year they are healthy, New England, Pittsburgh, Green Bay and Seattle are title contenders. That's really what you want from your team. If your standards (ie Super Bowl team or not) considers those teams essentially equal to Cleveland, then it's a dumb standard.

 

However, I don't buy the idea that you just get to the playoffs and "get lucky" and I think it's silly for people to look at it that way. There are playoff teams and SB contenders. Tennessee and Buffalo ain't wining a title this year. Not a chance in hell.

 

I agree, usually 2-3 teams have separated themselves by seasons end, but even those teams often get beat in the playoffs. 

 

The Patroits are an extreme anomaly when used for any argument. 

 

History tells us a few surprises will happen in these playoffs. I’m one that thinks lesser QBs (non hall of famers) will begin to win more Super Bowls in the future. As playing the position continues to be made much easier with rule changes and old coaches/methodologies being cycled out of the league. 

[BleedBNG]

35 minutes ago, zoony said:

Whats this about kirk taking all redskins mentions off his twitter?

 

Well, technically as of now he's not employed by the Redskins.

http://www.12up.com/posts/5934770-kirk-cousins-twitter-activity-fuels-rumors-he-s-on-his-way-out-of-washington

[actorguy1]

40 minutes ago, zoony said:

Whats this about kirk taking all redskins mentions off his twitter?

Fake news. Still has a pinned tweet about voting for a bunch of Redskins for Pro Bowl

[RemoveSnyder]

4 minutes ago, BleedBNG said:

Well, technically as of now he's not employed by the Redskins.

 

Uh, no. 

 

 

[RemoveSnyder]

1 hour ago, Veryoldschool said:

Stop the madness.... please stop the madness..... 

Mutual Assured Destruction 

 

 

 

It's clear to me that Bruce is waiting to hear what Kirk has to say on January 5 before he does anything. You know, like this is meant to be a rebuttal to his diatribe press conference last summer. Bruce is teenage girl in that way.