Dan T.

Some More Cops Who Need to Be Fired

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@visionary i think it is wrong but, with your examples, it may be understandable. 

 

I'm not talking about those type of cases though.  I'm talking about the broader cases of (paraphrasing) people saying all cops are corrupt or black people deserve the treatment because they are criminals.

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While I don't think everyone has equal blame in this, I do think there are things that both police and people angry or scared of them can learn from each other.  

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Just now, visionary said:

While I don't think everyone has equal blame in this, I do think there are things that both police and people angry or scared of them can learn from each other.  

I agree both sides are not equal on levels of blame.  Among other reasons, cops are held to a higher standard.  If a black person and a cop were both caught stealing a pack of gum, I would expect the cop to be punished more harshly because of that higher standard.  

 

My issues are that with the blanket condemnations made against police, it minimizes all the good work that many police do.

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3 minutes ago, TheGreatBuzz said:

I agree both sides are not equal on levels of blame.  Among other reasons, cops are held to a higher standard.  If a black person and a cop were both caught stealing a pack of gum, I would expect the cop to be punished more harshly because of that higher standard.  

 

My issues are that with the blanket condemnations made against police, it minimizes all the good work that many police do.

 

That analogy doesn't do your point justice (which I wish I could agree with you on).  Just a couple searches, I see cops caught selling crack and heroin getting 5 or less years.  

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If your going to say that cops earned mistrust because of some cops behaving badly you how is it different than making the same argument about any particular race, of which consists of some people behaving badly?

 

 

When your on the beat, in the hood, and you see a lot of black people doing crime, (a police officer would naturally see a lot of crime) it would be easy to think all blacks are like that...

 

When you are constantly getting stopped, profiled, fines into prison, it’s easy to think all cops are corrupt.

 

im not seeing a huge difference there. Both are wrong...

 

You would expect cops to be held to a higher standard, but they are held to a lesser one... they get the benefit of the doubt.... 

 

Edited by CousinsCowgirl84

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19 minutes ago, Renegade7 said:

 

That analogy doesn't do your point justice (which I wish I could agree with you on).  Just a couple searches, I see cops caught selling crack and heroin getting 5 or less years.  

I was talking about how it should be, not how it is.

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8 minutes ago, TheGreatBuzz said:

I was talking about how it should be, not how it is.

Ya, the generalization thing kills me... in general.

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1 hour ago, visionary said:

While I don't think everyone has equal blame in this, I do think there are things that both police and people angry or scared of them can learn from each other.  

 

Absolutely. You wont catch me in here saying all the people catching the beat down from these police are innocent. 

 

But that doesnt mean everyone else had it coming too. 

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21 minutes ago, visionary said:

 

Important thing to remember, this doesn't just happen to black people. A very similar thing happened to me as a upper middle class white guy.  We need to address law enforcement overreach.  Not against blacks, against everyone.

 

I think a lot has to do with how they dress.  All these traffic cops dressed in their tacti-cool outfits feel emboldened.  Put them in their stuff police uniforms could remind them what their job is.  I also think a sign in their car that says something like "you are here to serve this community, you don't run it".  Sounds dumb but there is a reason industrial work places are covered in safety posters.

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4 hours ago, Llevron said:

 

To earn what? Being brutalized by police? Naw I cant. If you can please get started. I expect this from you so you wont hurt my feelings at all. 

 

Would you agree that it is more likely that a black man would be a pimp rather than a white man ?

Would you agree that it is more likely to see a black woman with a weave than a white woman ? 

You earn stereotypes, based on reality. 

Cops are not in general violent people, they tend to have a power complex ...some, but not all.

Same as all black women do not have weaves and all black men are not pimps. 

More white folks sniff coke. This is a sterotype based on fact. 

 

Certainly I do not expect or respect police officers that take the law into their own hands as vigilant idiots. That is not what they are there for. So brutalizing any race of people is wrong 100%.  

 

As a man that is black and native... I am a double minority, My sisters have the tri-fecta.  

Edited by Kosher Ham

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So that's the list of stupid things black people do that cause them to be brutalized by the police? 

 

Its laughable. You are a joke and I dont care what your nationality is. 

Edited by Llevron
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Black hair is notoriously hard to manage, that's like saying poor african women have a sterotype of cutting their hair off.  I gotta believe there's a way for officers to assess a situation without relying on stereotypes, as the thing about stereotypes is that they are by definition oversimplifications.

Edited by Renegade7

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My my, didn't this get a lil snippy.............

 

GOOD!

 

If someone gets their cage rattled and gets a lil hot, they tend to speak their truth. They say "In vino veritas", I tend to believe "In ira veritas" applies more often. While it gets messy we advance the conversation when people actually tell you how they feel, right or wrong, 'cuz you can't do jack without the veritas part.

 

IMO this is just another symptom of a broader disconnect in society, there is no overarching inclusive definition for us all anymore (if there ever really was). It was supposed to "American", E pluribus unum, that whole schtick where we could willingly, voluntarily, consciously transcend the short-sighted, narrow tribalisms of class or color or race or whatever to see ourselves as all members of the same team. This never truly existed but the great American mythos was that we aspired to it, we were supposed to be grinding our way closer to it. As long as the status quo kept it far enough out of reach that was fine, aspire all you want but you'll never really see it happen kinda mindset.

 

WWII ****ed everything up. The desperation and immediacy of essentially fighting two world wars simultaneously thousands of miles apart forced a grudging acquiescence to allow women to work in war industries, to allow minorities to advance in the military, etc., to defeat the Germans and Japanese both. Problem was, after it was over, none of the "lessers" were willing to just shamble back into the shadows and reassume their "place". They stood up and demanded the respect they had earned, the return on their investment and a seat at the table, and then the **** started.

 

Outsourcing and job flight was a direct result of all of the "others" wanting to move up into management jobs, to actually cash in on that "climb the ladder" mythos that had been sold for generations. Oooops, you thought we were serious? You found a judge that took that Constitution literally? Nope, taking our ball and heading home......

 

The more society fractured and splintered the more the police morphed into something else, and were forced by those that controlled the pursestrings to keep the lowers in check and protect the status quo. The job description has changed radically over the last couple generations driven by those that feel it all slipping from their fingers and are more than willing to arm and train the police into an occupying force in order to keep control. Overwhelmingly the cops are between a rock and a hard place, and are frequently called upon to do **** they shouldn't have to as police but that is absolutely necessary as an occupier quashing dissent.

 

Is it really any wonder it goes so badly so often?

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So, to you, instead of the problem being the result of narrow minded view on how to solve crime (jail as a deterrent, tough on crime, broken windows theory) that we've recently (in the grand scheme of things) finally come to realize doesn't really work... and instead of poor education, skill set, job economy creating higher crime which leads to lots of problems (which anyone who studies this stuff seems to agree is the case).... you think this all goes back to post-world war 2 white males being upset at the change in how society wants and it's all a grand conspiracy to put women and minorities back in the shadows?

 

This is why this is going no where. The "two sides" (if that's even an accurate descriptor) aren't even in the same universe when it comes to the problem. Solutions? :ols: 

 

I do agree with the asking cops to do things they shouldn't. We either need to redefine who should be a cop, and the pay it should demand, or reduce what we ask them to do and come up with something better. Training academy/Rookie school and random classes through your career doesn't seem to be enough to make cops respond to drug overdoses and mental health situations. I don't know what an actual solution is.

Edited by tshile

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23 minutes ago, tshile said:

I do agree with the asking cops to do things they shouldn't. We either need to redefine who should be a cop, and the pay it should demand, or reduce what we ask them to do and come up with something better. Training academy/Rookie school and random classes through your career doesn't seem to be enough to make cops respond to drug overdoses and mental health situations. I don't know what an actual solution is.

 

Honestly I think cops need to be treated better. And im not really sure if Im saying it correctly. But what I mean is they need wayyyyy better pay. Better benefits. If they are going to be seen as the bad guy out in the streets they need to make sure it is worth it for them financially. What I hope is that when the position is valued more, better people will fill the ranks. 

 

Thats where I would start. Whats I dont understand is how you do that and get rid of the bad ones at the same time. 

 

I dont know its complicated. 

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15 minutes ago, Llevron said:

 

Honestly I think cops need to be treated better. And im not really sure if Im saying it correctly. But what I mean is they need wayyyyy better pay. Better benefits. If they are going to be seen as the bad guy out in the streets they need to make sure it is worth it for them financially. What I hope is that when the position is valued more, better people will fill the ranks. 

 

Thats where I would start. Whats I dont understand is how you do that and get rid of the bad ones at the same time. 

 

I dont know its complicated. 

 

better pay? Is that possible?

 

1,012 Baltimore City Police employees made more than 100k gross pay in 2016. Im an attorney and I make a shade under 100k. 

 

https://data.baltimorecity.gov/City-Government/Police-Salaries-FY2016/evsk-6ys8/data

 

^ filter by gross pay. 

 

This doesnt even include the pension and benefits police officers get.

 

imo Police Officers are very very well paid. Some of them are just jerks and some civilians are just jerks. 

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28 minutes ago, Why am I Mr. Pink? said:

 

better pay? Is that possible?

 

1,012 Baltimore City Police employees made more than 100k gross pay in 2016. Im an attorney and I make a shade under 100k. 

 

https://data.baltimorecity.gov/City-Government/Police-Salaries-FY2016/evsk-6ys8/data

 

^ filter by gross pay. 

 

This doesnt even include the pension and benefits police officers get.

 

imo Police Officers are very very well paid. Some of them are just jerks and some civilians are just jerks. 

 

Baltimore may not be the best example to use, considering they had a massive scandal where many officers were getting paid for overtime when they weren't working. Even getting paid overtime while they were on vacation. Baltimore PD isn't a good example for anything but how not to police a city, unfortunately. 

Edited by Gamebreaker
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20 minutes ago, Why am I Mr. Pink? said:

 

better pay? Is that possible?

 

1,012 Baltimore City Police employees made more than 100k gross pay in 2016. Im an attorney and I make a shade under 100k. 

 

https://data.baltimorecity.gov/City-Government/Police-Salaries-FY2016/evsk-6ys8/data

 

^ filter by gross pay. 

 

This doesnt even include the pension and benefits police officers get.

 

imo Police Officers are very very well paid. Some of them are just jerks and some civilians are just jerks. 

That police work is also with massive overtime, so it's an apples to oranges comparison with your salary to theirs.

 

My brother is a DC firefighter and he makes more than his salary because he's constantly working overtime which I believe includes time and a half pay.

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Also keep in mind pay for beat officers vs desk jockeys or leadership positions. 

 

Because it seems the beat officers are the ones interfacing with the community directly - ie: the ones we see in these videos. 

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Man files lawsuit over ketamine injection

 

A Minneapolis man alleges police brutality, after he being involuntarily sedated with ketamine and hospitalized.

 

MINNEAPOLIS -- John Powell went to North Memorial Hospital to visit a cousin, but ended up as a patient himself, after an involuntary injection of the powerful sedative ketamine.

 

What happened to Powell that night, in July of 2015, is now the subject of wrongful arrest and police brutality lawsuit in federal court against the cities of Robbinsdale and Brooklyn Center and North Memorial Ambulance Service.

 

Officers from the Robbinsdale Police Dept were in the area after a North Memorial nurse spotted a man in car in the hospital parking ramp with a handgun, who appeared to her to be possibly suicidal.

 

Powell, who had been inside the hospital at the time, went outside to get his car. It was raining at the time, so he planned to pull back around to the entrance to pick up his wife and mother.

 

That's when the Robbinsdale officers approached him, and ordered him to the pavement.

 

"When they first grabbed me they had me on the ground, in the storm, in the rain, about an hour," Powell recalled, during an interview with KARE Thursday.

 

"I asked them what was going on, and he replied that someone had brandished a gun in the parking ramp. My first thing I said to them was, 'I’m not in the parking ramp'."

 

The nurse had described the suicidal man as a light-skinned Hispanic or white person, according to the lawsuit. Powell, by contrast, is African American. And he wasn't armed.

 

He said officers continued to hold him against his will for some time, and that he began to get agitated because nobody would tell his wife what was happening.

"You don't even treat a dog that way, leave them on the street in the rain, like that for so long."

 

Eventually they drove him to the hospital entrance, to show him to the nurse who'd made the original emergency call.

 

"They had a lady come out and security guard and they looked at me, and they said, 'That’s not him'," Powell said.

 

But officers continued to detain him, in handcuffs, and question him.

 

"I told them, 'They said I wasn't the one, so you've got two choices: charge me with something or let me go.' And he said to me, 'Shut up or you'll be going out of here on a gurney'," Powell said.

 

He said a North Memorial Ambulance Service squad arrived, and he saw officers and paramedics huddle. Then he saw an EMT walking over with a syringe and a vial of fluid.

 

"I was handcuffed, and he snatched my arm out the car, put his gloves on, grabbed my arm out the car, and he stuck the needle in my arm. All I remember is falling over."

 

Powell immediately had trouble breathing, and was admitted to the hospital.

 

When he woke up the next day he was in a hospital bed with a breathing tube in his throat. His wife told him doctors had placed him in an induced coma, and told her he may never regain consciousness.

 

Click on the link for the full article

 

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35 minutes ago, China said:

Man files lawsuit over ketamine injection

 

A Minneapolis man alleges police brutality, after he being involuntarily sedated with ketamine and hospitalized.

 

 

The response by the attorney representing the city reads like hilariously obvious horse**** .

Quote

Jason Hively, an attorney representing the City of Robbinsdale in the lawsuit, gave KARE the following account:

 

"As the officers searched the ramp and surrounding lots, Mr. Powell approached them cursing and yelling and exhibiting strange behavior. He ignored all of the officers’ initial commands and, combined with his erratic behavior, raised suspicions he may have been the reported armed suspect."

 

Hively said officers were prepared to release Powell once they learned he was not the suspect they were seeking. But he said they didn't let him go, because of his "erratic" behavior.

 

He also rejected the notion that officers requested the ketamine injection.

 

"At no time during their interaction with Mr. Powell did the officers request or in any way encourage North Memorial staff to use any medication on Mr. Powell. The decision to sedate him was an independent medical determination made by NM staff based on their overall evaluation of Powell’s medical and emotional condition."

 

So we're to believe that officers minding their business encountered a man ranting like a total mad man in the parking lot.  Naturally no one saw this crazy lunatic screaming curse words while otherwise behavior strangely.  That these police officers believed that this man's erratic behavior somehow made him appear to be a different color to the nurse who called them.  Why else would they think this black man fit the description of a not-black man?  Whatever the reason the nurse later told them directly that this black man was decidedly not that not-black man she had called in to report. 

 

The officers wanted to release that entirely innocent man, and totally would have had he not continued to behave so darn erratically.  (Erratic is a wonderfully vague word isn't it?)  Somehow during all of this they managed to avoid thinking "you know, maybe this guy is exhibiting erratic (some might say angry) behavior because he didn't do anything wrong and we had him laying on the ground in the damn rain for a long time." 

 

And finally we're told the most obvious lie, that hospital staff decided to medicate a man that was not in their care at the time.  That they did this independently and without checking or speaking with him at all.  They were just, I don't know, eavesdropping or something and apparently heard enough to rush over with a syringe full of ketamine.  Of course they did. 

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, China said:

Man files lawsuit over ketamine injection

 

A Minneapolis man alleges police brutality, after he being involuntarily sedated with ketamine and hospitalized.

 

MINNEAPOLIS -- John Powell went to North Memorial Hospital to visit a cousin, but ended up as a patient himself, after an involuntary injection of the powerful sedative ketamine.

 

What happened to Powell that night, in July of 2015, is now the subject of wrongful arrest and police brutality lawsuit in federal court against the cities of Robbinsdale and Brooklyn Center and North Memorial Ambulance Service.

 

Officers from the Robbinsdale Police Dept were in the area after a North Memorial nurse spotted a man in car in the hospital parking ramp with a handgun, who appeared to her to be possibly suicidal.

 

Powell, who had been inside the hospital at the time, went outside to get his car. It was raining at the time, so he planned to pull back around to the entrance to pick up his wife and mother.

 

That's when the Robbinsdale officers approached him, and ordered him to the pavement.

 

"When they first grabbed me they had me on the ground, in the storm, in the rain, about an hour," Powell recalled, during an interview with KARE Thursday.

 

"I asked them what was going on, and he replied that someone had brandished a gun in the parking ramp. My first thing I said to them was, 'I’m not in the parking ramp'."

 

The nurse had described the suicidal man as a light-skinned Hispanic or white person, according to the lawsuit. Powell, by contrast, is African American. And he wasn't armed.

 

He said officers continued to hold him against his will for some time, and that he began to get agitated because nobody would tell his wife what was happening.

"You don't even treat a dog that way, leave them on the street in the rain, like that for so long."

 

Eventually they drove him to the hospital entrance, to show him to the nurse who'd made the original emergency call.

 

"They had a lady come out and security guard and they looked at me, and they said, 'That’s not him'," Powell said.

 

But officers continued to detain him, in handcuffs, and question him.

 

"I told them, 'They said I wasn't the one, so you've got two choices: charge me with something or let me go.' And he said to me, 'Shut up or you'll be going out of here on a gurney'," Powell said.

 

He said a North Memorial Ambulance Service squad arrived, and he saw officers and paramedics huddle. Then he saw an EMT walking over with a syringe and a vial of fluid.

 

"I was handcuffed, and he snatched my arm out the car, put his gloves on, grabbed my arm out the car, and he stuck the needle in my arm. All I remember is falling over."

 

Powell immediately had trouble breathing, and was admitted to the hospital.

 

When he woke up the next day he was in a hospital bed with a breathing tube in his throat. His wife told him doctors had placed him in an induced coma, and told her he may never regain consciousness.

 

Click on the link for the full article

 

 

Wow. ****ing wow.

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I thought I'd heard it all, thought I'd never be surprised about the lengths these gangs with badges would go. And yet I'm still surprised. 

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16 hours ago, China said:

Man files lawsuit over ketamine injection

 

A Minneapolis man alleges police brutality, after he being involuntarily sedated with ketamine and hospitalized.

 

MINNEAPOLIS -- John Powell went to North Memorial Hospital to visit a cousin, but ended up as a patient himself, after an involuntary injection of the powerful sedative ketamine.

 

What happened to Powell that night, in July of 2015, is now the subject of wrongful arrest and police brutality lawsuit in federal court against the cities of Robbinsdale and Brooklyn Center and North Memorial Ambulance Service.

 

Officers from the Robbinsdale Police Dept were in the area after a North Memorial nurse spotted a man in car in the hospital parking ramp with a handgun, who appeared to her to be possibly suicidal.

 

Powell, who had been inside the hospital at the time, went outside to get his car. It was raining at the time, so he planned to pull back around to the entrance to pick up his wife and mother.

 

That's when the Robbinsdale officers approached him, and ordered him to the pavement.

 

"When they first grabbed me they had me on the ground, in the storm, in the rain, about an hour," Powell recalled, during an interview with KARE Thursday.

 

"I asked them what was going on, and he replied that someone had brandished a gun in the parking ramp. My first thing I said to them was, 'I’m not in the parking ramp'."

 

The nurse had described the suicidal man as a light-skinned Hispanic or white person, according to the lawsuit. Powell, by contrast, is African American. And he wasn't armed.

 

He said officers continued to hold him against his will for some time, and that he began to get agitated because nobody would tell his wife what was happening.

"You don't even treat a dog that way, leave them on the street in the rain, like that for so long."

 

Eventually they drove him to the hospital entrance, to show him to the nurse who'd made the original emergency call.

 

"They had a lady come out and security guard and they looked at me, and they said, 'That’s not him'," Powell said.

 

But officers continued to detain him, in handcuffs, and question him.

 

"I told them, 'They said I wasn't the one, so you've got two choices: charge me with something or let me go.' And he said to me, 'Shut up or you'll be going out of here on a gurney'," Powell said.

 

He said a North Memorial Ambulance Service squad arrived, and he saw officers and paramedics huddle. Then he saw an EMT walking over with a syringe and a vial of fluid.

 

"I was handcuffed, and he snatched my arm out the car, put his gloves on, grabbed my arm out the car, and he stuck the needle in my arm. All I remember is falling over."

 

Powell immediately had trouble breathing, and was admitted to the hospital.

 

When he woke up the next day he was in a hospital bed with a breathing tube in his throat. His wife told him doctors had placed him in an induced coma, and told her he may never regain consciousness.

 

Click on the link for the full article

 

This is insane 

 

police state is here

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