New OC Thread (Welcome Aboard Eric Bieniemy!)

[KWilliamsAWinfield]

2 hours ago, Conn said:

That may be true. It also may not be true as any coordinator with a great QB also has the ability to bring many of their own strengths to the table. 
 

The most important thing though is that we have no idea whether it’s true or not, which makes your post dumb. 

 

Well, if Eric ends up being an awful offensive coordinator because he does not have Mahomes then my post will not be dumb but yours will 

[Conn]

10 minutes ago, KWilliamsAWinfield said:

 

Well, if Eric ends up being an awful offensive coordinator because he does not have Mahomes then my post will not be dumb but yours will 

 

 

Well-reasoned, can’t wait to read more of your posts so I can keep learning 

[Skinsinparadise]

55 minutes ago, Renegade7 said:

 

 

I honestly believe so many folks are just too jaded to appreciate how much of a massive victory this is for this franchise, couple years ago our reputation woulda been so stank we wouldn't of even been on the man's list.  

 

 

Agree.  this is a rare stroke of luck for this organization.

 

Andy Reid and Rivera being close friends was obviously a key to this.  Him waiting on the Colts HC job which dragged right through SB day likely helped.    So many offensive coordinator jobs were filled in the meantime.  The Ravens deciding not to wait, etc.

 

There are no guarantees but i am jazzed.  And more importantly according to some who cover the team, the offensive players are jazzed.

 

Listening to a KC reporter on Keim's podcast tonight.  He went on about how Bieniemy is detail obsessed.  And most players love him.  There are some straggelers who don't love his hard coaching but most embrace it.  Listening to him it reminded me of Gregg Williams who was received in a similar way -- most players loved him but there were a few who did not.

Edited February 20, 2023 by Skinsinparadise

[Simmsy]

1 hour ago, Conn said:

 

I already told you you’re incorrect, it’s not on me to insist further if you disagree. This has been by far the biggest narrative surrounding him for YEARS, it’s all anyone has talked about. You’re making up a strawman and beating the hell out of it. You’re literally working yourself up and getting mad for no reason because your entire premise is false. Good luck and have fun. 

 

What is the strawman? Beating the hell out of it? I made a few posts. Anyways, there is nothing I enjoy more than giving my genuine, personal point of view of a racial issue and have someone tell me I'm wrong and to sit down and shut up. Thank you for being so rude and dismissive, I don't feel like I'll be needing your input on anything else.

[RVAskins]

On 2/19/2023 at 8:41 PM, KWilliamsAWinfield said:

 

Well, if Eric ends up being an awful offensive coordinator because he does not have Mahomes then my post will not be dumb but yours will 

What if the Chiefs trade Mahomes to Washington and Eric is still awful. Whose post will be dumb?

Edited February 21, 2023 by RVAskins

[CapsSkins]

4 minutes ago, RVAskins said:

What if the Chiefs trade Mahomes to Washington and Eric is still awful. Who's post will be dumb?

 

It's *whose, not who's. What are you, dumb?

[The Rook]

2 hours ago, TheBlueIndian said:

PSA.  There is no "being on the right side of history"  

 

Nice.  I like it.

Namaste 🙏 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The Rook

[CapsSkins]

2 minutes ago, The Rook said:

 

Nice.  I like it.

Namaste 🙏 

 

 

The Rook

 

As the board's resident Indian guy, I feel obliged to point out "namaste" just means "hello". Haha

[wit33]

15 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

What he changed with the cap was Vinny would Eagles, Rams, Saints style at times stagger contracts to punt cap into the future.  Bruce mostly stopped that.  The irony about that is some are now pissy that they don't go back to some of that future is now approach to load up this roster more especially with the cap rising a lot every year.

 

Bruce and company attempted to change the model and build through the draft and not overspend in free agency. It’s wasn’t just putting a stop to punting money into the future. 
 

15 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Some suspect that move was out of necessity because Dan wasn't willing or able to deal with the escalating contracts which continued to rise over time (putting money into escrow) which he was more easily able to do in his younger days.  Failing radio stations and businesses might have contributed to this, along with the inflation of contracts.   But no way to know.  But some suspect especially recently that Dan had to change. 

 

Vinny has a better record than Bruce.  Vinny-Dan would overspend on more of the sexy names.  It failed but the car crash was a little more interesting to follow.  Bruce would go bargain basement shopping and the car crash which was a little worse than the previous one was also boring.  IMO and some others Bruce's approach was the nail on the coffin for the floodgates as to fans leaving.  Bruce was saved by the dude he didn't like, Kirk, from having an even bigger discrepancy between his record and Vinny ironically.  
 

 

Both regimes fell into the NFL abyss of average. Sure, some seasons below average, average, and above… but altogether, average or mediocre. 
 

15 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

 

Mike Jones mentioned what was offered.  Jay mentioned what was offered.  If I am bidding on Ebay, I and the seller know what was offered.  We know.  Everyone else can speculate.  That was an article from SB Nation you gave, not a direct quote from John Lynch, unless am missing something?  But yeah even if I pretended that was the gospel, SB Nation, not Kyle or Jay, the 2nd pick in that draft in an exchange would have been tremendous.  But I am tired of debating it.  You can have the last word.  At a minimum even going with the version you'd like to believe about this, it refutes the point you made over and over again that Bruce nailed it with the third round comp pick for Kirtk. 
 

 

Never have I felt Bruce nailed it with compensation for Kirk. It was an extremely difficult situation combined with Kirk and agent wanting an unprecedented deal. I graded it a bit more on a curve due to the circumstances. 
 

I will relent that they could’ve gotten more than 3rd. At the time I thought nothing more than a second when coupled with outrageous at the time salary demands (guaranteed deal). 
 

It was Solamon Thomas not Bosa in terms of who was drafted that year. Washington got Jon Allen at 17. Kirk and 17 for their number 2 pick is solid and better than a 3rd, but you also lose out on 16 games of Kirk who many on this board argued was a top 7-10 QB. 

 

15 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

It doesnt matter how many times I gather for me to explain the nuance about overpaying versus grossly overpaying and what happens which often does when mutiple bids are close. 

 

Sincerely, I don’t think you have a clue what the difference of rightly paid, overpaid, or grossly overpaid is from contract to contract. 
 

15 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

My argument has been this is the place where players and coaches with options don't want to go to everything being equal or close enough and plenty of times the bidding is close enough where these players and coaches can make a decision that weighs more variables than just money.

 

This is a large part of the point, very rarely are things all equal in the open market. 
 

Spinning off your McDonald’s analogy, you’re focusing on the ketchup packets at McDonalds and not the actual burger and fries. The burger and fries is money and opportunity, the ketchup is what kind of guy the owner etc.. 
 

15 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Yes some players aren't part of much a bidding war so its much easier. It's not a binary argument. But nuance is lost here and big time so.  So I give up. 
 

 

Tons of nuance, but elite young talent will go to franchises with most money available. This used to be an overwhelming truth, but acknowledge the willingness for the better organizations to indulge/match aggressiveness in free agency has increased. The free agent landscape has changed a bit and aligns more than in past with your premise. 
 

15 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

 

 

If there were only a zillion people who talked about this. Ex-players.  Agents.  National reporters, local reporters.  Heck even someone who works in that building.  It's just us nerds spitballing on this with no one backing the point.   
 

 

I fully acknowledge I’m a complete contrarian on this topic and you’re aligned with the masses. This isn’t missed by me. The mob attempts to connect simple cause and effect to non linear discussions, IMHO. I completely own this is my opinion, personal bias, and subjective thoughts. 
 

The overwhelming evidence in my 25 years doesn’t support that Washington isn’t able lure high profile coaches or players. 

 

15 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

I don't mean this sarcastically but I gatther you don't read much or listen much about football.  And hence maybe that's the discrepancy here?  Because I am not beating on an obscure point with no one saying the same thing.  The point has been beaten to death by just about any source you can imagine.

You have to be one of the most respectful disrespectful people I’ve come across in my time lol 

 

If you must know, I’d put myself above 99.7% of the population on this planet in terms of time spent observing the NFL and discussing it over the last 20 years. 
 

I do want to respond in a defensive manner and throw a purposeful “sarcastic” response that questions your football acumen, but I won’t  

 

15 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

I've had many debates here over the years.  But this shouldn't be a debate.  I don't think there is a single soul here who agrees with you that this is one of the top destination spots that players and coaches covet and nobody cares about the decaying stadium, facilities, sleaze, etc.

 

The continued use of “top destination” is your skillful way to place me in a box reserved for the extremists. Like most discussions, this topic requires nuanced discussion. This has to be in your PR book, attach the opponent to an extreme point of view and pound it home home until it becomes true in most people’s minds lol

 

No way do I feel it’s a top destination spot year over year, situationally Washington has been attractive to high profile coaches and players. I don’t think

any pace is a top destination spot year to year… it’s situational to the individual. 
 

Who are the top destination spots in your view this upcoming season for free agents?
 

 

15 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Yes people will sign here.  They will sign everywhere.  But if you took a survey and asked players where they'd want to go, this team would be at the bottom or close to it.   And yes below teams with worse records than us. 
 

 

They can compile any and all lists they want, it will come down to a few teams with cap space and opportunity. I’m not saying it doesn’t at times magically line up for player and team, but that’s not the norm. 
 

15 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

 

EB is a good hire, I think, will see.

 

The rookie contract is great but he has to play well.  This fanbase IMO will keep weakening if they stay mediocre to worse.   Dan selling should bring some fans back.  I am more optimisitc about the roster than most.

 

For sure, I like you am bullish on the roster, infrastructure is there for to foster and support a young QB. Just need competency, enter the 70%  QB class. 
 

15 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

To expland on my point about why I think Bieinemy might attract players.

 

A.   Players who are FAs and played for him -- if the Chiefs reporter is right and most players loved him why not go play for a coach like that?

 

B.  The backdrop of this hire is a bit wild and wide reaching.  He's a national story.    I think that might add to the intrigue of playing for him and helping him succeed.

 

Agree with all this. This represents how easy it can be to become a place a player may want join. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited February 20, 2023 by wit33

[RVAskins]

9 minutes ago, CapsSkins said:

 

It's *whose, not who's. What are you, dumb?

Nope....well maybe

[illone]

Hey we can have nice things after all!

 

What a great hire. 
 

How did a lame duck staff pull this off?!

 

im still kinda shocked about this….

[The Rook]

On 2/19/2023 at 8:41 PM, KWilliamsAWinfield said:

 

Well, if Eric ends up being an awful offensive coordinator because he does not have Mahomes then my post will not be dumb but yours will 

 

So many layers:

Awful is subjective, unsuccessful is objective

Personnel is not in his control

"Not having Mahomes" is a subset of the NFL to which 31 other OC's are members - will they be rated on the "awful scale? 

Awful - he will be proclaimed awful by many people on Extremeskins regardless of success

 

If your post is that "He should be evaluated for his plays, use of personnel and play calls." - I agree.  If your saying "Watch him be awful because he doesn't have Mahomes", I'd say you are trolling.  

 

He may or may not be successful, but one thing for sure, he doesn't have to beat KC in the Super Bowl to determine that.

 

 

 

 

 

 

The Rook

 

Edited February 21, 2023 by The Rook

[The Rook]

19 minutes ago, CapsSkins said:

 

As the board's resident Indian guy, I feel obliged to point out "namaste" just means "hello". Haha

 

I respect that and hope you are not offended.  I do understand it is commonly used as "Hello" or "greetings to you"'

 

Going back to the 70's, I was taught that is was a salutation to something great or divine - a teacher, a thought, nature, peace.  I have used the term in yoga and meditation as term of respect, or peace, or inner peace so I still continue my use as such.

 

We good?

 

 

 

 

 

 

The Rook

[NoVaSkins21]

Not sure where thread been going the past few pages, but I can't wait for the EB press conference.  Maybe we can get some nuggets about his offensive staff.

[MartinC]

2 hours ago, Renegade7 said:

 

I was hoping for more insight on what to expect from the offense with his addtion and impact on what Ron said he wanted to maintain.  Seen some specific to the new OC, but not really touched on where that meets with what Ron wants, and if that needs time to flesh out, I guess I have no choice but to wait a little bit.

 

Edit: see thread title updated while typing post 👍

Truth is we don’t really know yet. But we can put some breadcrumbs together and look at where EB has been and comes from in terms of system and make some reasonable assumptions.

 

First he’s left the Chiefs to prove he can install and run HIS system not just Andy Reid’s. So from that I would conclude he’s only agreed to take this job if he has control of his side of the ball. That’s doesn’t mean Ron won’t have some input and say in overall philosophy - he is still the HC - but EB will have a lot of control. His roots are West Coast and that’s more than just a change of terminology it’s a change of philosophy over the system Turner picked up from his father. More pass to set up the run than run to set up the pass.
 

It’s likely we will see a pass first game plan centered around getting the ball out quickly with the aim of building a lead and running late in games to eat clock. We had the 3rd lowest pass rate on 1st and 2nd down in neutral game situations (so not a 2 minute drill or when falling behind or ahead etc), expect that to change. But that doesn’t mean it will be a carbon copy of what the Chiefs run, given we don’t have Mahomes. Or Kelce for that matter … You’d hope he will look to maximize the talent we have and feature the 3 receivers, Gibsons ability to catch and in space and Robinson’s toughness. 
 

Reports are the plan is still to give Howell the first opportunity to be the starter. So building something that suits him would seem like a good idea, RPOs, movement and built in deep shots. 

[CapsSkins]

7 minutes ago, The Rook said:

 

I respect that and hope you are not offended.  I do understand it is commonly used as "Hello" or "greetings to you"'

 

Going back to the 70's, I was taught that is was a salutation to something great or divine - a teacher, a thought, nature, peace.  I have used the term in yoga and meditation as term of respect, or peace, or inner peace so I still continue my use as such.

 

We good?

 

 

 

 

 

 

The Rook

 

It's all good man I was just shooting the ****. I don't sweat small stuff like that.

 

But FWIW, I have always been confused why we say it at the end of yoga (which I started practicing recently myself) because it really is just how ppl in India say hello. There's nothing spiritual about it in that context. But I'm no expert - I grew up in Nova, so who knows. Anyway, keep doing your thing. There's real problems in the world to worry about... like whether EB is gonna succeed in Washington!

[Renegade7]

44 minutes ago, MartinC said:

… You’d hope he will look to maximize the talent we have and feature the 3 receivers, Gibsons ability to catch and in space and Robinson’s toughness. 
 

Reports are the plan is still to give Howell the first opportunity to be the starter. So building something that suits him would seem like a good idea, RPOs, movement and built in deep shots. 

 

He'll have a chance to catch a lot of people off guard if he isn't too predictable because there's zero tape on whatever our offense is going to be this year under Eric until we start playing games this year.

 

Someone earlier posted bits on expecting more RPOs. It makes total sense given what Howell showed against Dallas and what Eric had a chance to attempt and also be involved with having Mahomes.

 

Winning so many TOP battles with our known handicaps at OC and QB screams it getting potentially much worse for our opponents in 2023.  And I reserve the right to get frustrated if we keep getting too cute on all the possible ways to try and convert short yardage situations. 😒

 

A lot of folks with a lot to prove on offense next year, but I hope we stay grounded to help protect Howell given how young he is (I see his birthday is 9/16/2000) : /

 

I never in a millions years thought we'd get so lucky to cut Wentz and not have to give his cap space to some other Veteran QB. I was convinced that money was spent for sure, now we have got house money years with a starter in a rookie contract. There's no excuse not to sign at least one or two new starters on the oline alone (send a message and draft another in the first round this draft).

Edited February 20, 2023 by Renegade7

[method man]

I am very curious what EB does with the coaching staff. Given that he spent his NFL coaching career with Andy the last several years and Childress 15 years ago, he doesn’t have a deep network to pull from. 
 

I don’t think the assistant coaches are the problem - Zampese, Matsko, Castillo, Terrell and Jordan are all respected position coaches and all five guys have done at least relatively well with the talent they have. Terrell is apparently a highly respected assistant coach in the league and a Stanford grad. 
 

I hope he keeps this group together but also pulls in young talented assistant position coaches and quality control guys from KC here. If they need to free up position coach roles, they could promote Terrell to pass game coordinator and Castillo to senior offensive assistant or something like that. I’d like to see an infusion of young talent with future coordinator and even HC potential

[Fan since a Fetus]

55 minutes ago, NoVaSkins21 said:

Not sure where thread been going the past few pages, but I can't wait for the EB press conference.  Maybe we can get some nuggets about his offensive staff.

The press conference won’t be that good because Patrick Mahomes won’t be beside him…

 

Poor dude probably can’t even say hello.

He’ll probably come out with “Happy Hispanics de Mayo and for the Jewish members, happy 4th of Christmas! It’s ok to be once again involved in the space race. Our next stop will be Fajita where we’ll dribble on the Frozen Tundra “

[El Mexican]

6 hours ago, CommanderCarson said:

...
 

I can confidently say this is the most talented young roster we’ve had in town in 20 plus years and that’s a big reason bienemy took the job. 

 

Well...we still need a better OL and some key LB. Oh, and the QB position is still very shaky.

 

Howell may be the next Brady of the next Leaf. We just don't know.

 

More importantly, what's the backup plan if he doesn't cut it?

We all saw last year what happens when you're forced to roll with a QB that divides the fan base.

[Koolblue13]

4 hours ago, method man said:

I am very curious what EB does with the coaching staff. Given that he spent his NFL coaching career with Andy the last several years and Childress 15 years ago, he doesn’t have a deep network to pull from. 
 

I don’t think the assistant coaches are the problem - Zampese, Matsko, Castillo, Terrell and Jordan are all respected position coaches and all five guys have done at least relatively well with the talent they have. Terrell is apparently a highly respected assistant coach in the league and a Stanford grad. 
 

I hope he keeps this group together but also pulls in young talented assistant position coaches and quality control guys from KC here. If they need to free up position coach roles, they could promote Terrell to pass game coordinator and Castillo to senior offensive assistant or something like that. I’d like to see an infusion of young talent with future coordinator and even HC potential

I'm doubting that he'll make any changes, if any. This feels more like Ron giving EB the reigns of his own job. 

 

I called EB a post turtle last week and now we're watching it happen.

[Darrell Green Fan]

8 hours ago, Simmsy said:

 

What is the strawman? Beating the hell out of it? I made a few posts. Anyways, there is nothing I enjoy more than giving my genuine, personal point of view of a racial issue and have someone tell me I'm wrong and to sit down and shut up. Thank you for being so rude and dismissive, I don't feel like I'll be needing your input on anything else.

 

The poster was not being "rude and dismissive", he/she was simply posting the truth.  EB not getting a head coaching job has been discussed at length for years across the league, most fans are aware of how unfair this has been and I'm not sure how you missed it.  The number of posters who are claiming it was only Mahomes etc have been outnumbered here like 30 to 1.  So no "a lot of people" are not sharing the sentiment you are claiming, it is a very small minority of posters here.    

 

And pointing this out is not telling you to "sit down and shut up", you are free to be wrong as often as you like here or anywhere else. But getting butt hurt when people point out your errors is not a good look for you.  

 

As for the posts claiming he won't do anything without Mahomes we all saw players wide open when they played. I want an OC who can draw up plays like that and we have may have one, not sure how this can be criticized in any way.  

Edited February 20, 2023 by Darrell Green Fan

[redskinss]

1 hour ago, Koolblue13 said:

 

I called EB a post turtle last week and now we're watching it happen.

That seems like a curious metaphor considering the consensus on Bienemy is that he should have been given a head coaching position by now and is over qualified for the position. 

He's won two superbowls in the last 5 years as an offensive coordinator, nobody is wondering how he got a job as an offensive coordinator. 

[Skinsinparadise]

10 hours ago, wit33 said:

 

Bruce and company attempted to change the model and build through the draft and not overspend in free agency. It’s wasn’t just putting a stop to punting money into the future. 
 

 

 

This sooo brings me back to the FO thread fron years ago when 6 or so people (you among them) would argue that Bruce was at a minimum a solid GM.  

 

Yeah he built through the drafft whle trading away three first rounders, three 2nd rounders, two 3rd rounders, and a 4th rounder in trades.  Whie bringing back a whopping 4th rounder -- 3 drafts in the future so the equivant of a 6th rounder.  Bruce was Howie Roseman in reverse as to pissing away draft assets and gaining back basically nothing.

 

 

10 hours ago, wit33 said:

 

Never have I felt Bruce nailed it with compensation for Kirk. It was an extremely difficult situation combined with Kirk and agent wanting an unprecedented deal. I graded it a bit more on a curve due to the circumstances. 

 

 

 

When it was mere speculation years ago, I would criticize Bruce for getting basically nothing back for an asset, Kirk.  I even compared it to imagine Roseman in the same situation?  You hated that point.  It wasn't hard to miss because only one person would defend him every time for the 3rd round comp -- it was you and you would say over and over again that's as good as we could have gotten for him.  Ask @BatteredFanSyndrome who was on that thread all the time, am sure he recalls it, too.  It was hard to miss.  

 

But thanks for relenting on the compensation finally.  My point at large to you is its hard to debate anyone when no matter what they never admit being wrong.  We are all wrong about stuff.  It's OK.  That's it.  I misspoke as to the 2018 draft as opposed to 2017 draft.  So I was wrong about that.  It's OK to admit it.  We aren't paid professionals who need to get things right to save our jobs.  

 

 

10 hours ago, wit33 said:

 

 

 

Sincerely, I don’t think you have a clue what the difference of rightly paid, overpaid, or grossly overpaid is from contract to contract. 
 

 

This is a large part of the point, very rarely are things all equal in the open market. 
 

Spinning off your McDonald’s analogy, you’re focusing on the ketchup packets at McDonalds and not the actual burger and fries. The burger and fries is money and opportunity, the ketchup is what kind of guy the owner etc.. 
 

 

 

 

At least you are following my analogy now versus reframing it  So thanks.   In your mind, this team -- the owner, the crap stadium, the crap facilities, the half full stadiums, means close to nothing to players because youi feel like they just care about money.  But you also went further than that in a different post.  Heck this whole thing was reignited on this thread by you touting your destination point.  You said if anything not only isn't it a hinderance but everything being equal this is where players want to be.  That's the point I was really attacking.  But that point seems to have softened now from you, now we are talking about whether money overrides this not being a destination.

 

The thing is people who actually talk to players, including an actual player said it matters.    I was listening to Czaben yesterday on Sheehan's podcast talking about Aaron Rodgers coming here and he said covering GB and knowing Aaron a little bit that no way he's going to a decaying franchise with the worst stadium which is half full.  He said he thinks its Raiders or bust for him if its a trade.  I guess will see.  A ton of examples of this that goes beyond just the media talking about it, as i told you in other posts.

 

10 hours ago, wit33 said:

 

 

I fully acknowledge I’m a complete contrarian on this topic and you’re aligned with the masses. This isn’t missed by me. The mob attempts to connect simple cause and effect to non linear discussions, IMHO. I completely own this is my opinion, personal bias, and subjective thoughts. 
 

 

 

The thing is you talk is if this is opinion versus others opinion.  But it's not.  Plenty have spoken about exactly this from every angle imaginable -- people working there, agents, ex-players, local media, national media.  For example you act like Logan Paulsen who I think had the most damning tell about this is just giving his opinion, no its not his opinion, he's saying people who work there feel this way from their experience chasing players.   How much more specific can it get?  Agents polled on this, asked off the record.  Ex-player.  On and on.   

 

10 hours ago, wit33 said:

 

You have to be one of the most respectful disrespectful people I’ve come across in my time lol 

 

If you must know, I’d put myself above 99.7% of the population on this planet in terms of time spent observing the NFL and discussing it over the last 20 years. 
 

 

 

I am actually ironically trying to be respectful on this by saying you must not read or watch or listen to much commentary on this. The reason I said that is because if you did, it comes off much more that believing is seeing in your case because you would have to ignore so much informaton on this point that contradicts your take.  

 

If I were digesting information where no matter what i am exposed to that conflicts with my belief I am sticking with my belief anyway, IMO I would suck at digesting name that topic or at a minimum i'd be impossible to have a debate with on said topic.  If there is competing information to my original belief, I'll change my mind,.  I and others here do it all the time. 

 

10 hours ago, wit33 said:

 

The continued use of “top destination” is your skillful way to place me in a box reserved for the extremists. Like most discussions, this topic requires nuanced discussion. This has to be in your PR book, attach the opponent to an extreme point of view and pound it home home until it becomes true in most people’s minds lol

 

 

I don't have any "playbook".  I am not here to "win" debates.  I can give a rats behind about that.  i am here to talk football.  But yeah on some sports subjects I do consider you as an extremist, not all.  It's not a tactic to make you look it, its genuinely what i feel, where its facts be damned, you stay on your point regardless, you aren't changing your mind no matter what. 

 

And as i said there are topics where you aren't like that at all.  But on some, you don't budge no matter what.  And I am not the only one who made that observation.    I am not trying to be a pain in the butt about it, i am just doing it for the sake of future debate.

 

I don't think you are doing it on purpose but the tactics here seem to be from you.  the lack of nuance issue is exactly what I accused you of.  I'll give you credit though you backed off of the binary argument in this post unlike some of the others.  But yeah as far as nuance I did say that SOME players would indeed come here for money reasons alone.  And explained why.  And SOME would not.  And explained why.   I've said of course they can get some players and some coaches.  It was easier years back then now but its still doable.  But there are plenty of situations where the suitors are equal or close to equal enough and in those cases we will likely lose out.  That's the nuance in this discussion.  It's not about yes versus no.  It's about what if things are equal or close enough.

 

The tipping point would be to not come here.  You suggested in another thread that the tipping point would be for them to indeed come here.  But that point has been softened from you some, so all is cool.

 

I am done with this topic, don't want to derail the thread, I'll respond to the Bieniemy part and the current destination part in a seperate post. 

Edited February 20, 2023 by Skinsinparadise

[Koolblue13]

1 hour ago, redskinss said:

That seems like a curious metaphor considering the consensus on Bienemy is that he should have been given a head coaching position by now and is over qualified for the position. 

He's won two superbowls in the last 5 years as an offensive coordinator, nobody is wondering how he got a job as an offensive coordinator. 

If you had read both sentences, you would understand what I said.