2021 Draft Order / Tracker: Current Pick #19

[Skinsinparadise]

2 minutes ago, CapsSkins said:

@Skinsinparadise I would be thrilled if they feel Lance is a special, franchise-caiber guy and they get him, even if it means giving up a first.

 

Alex Smith, Kyle Allen, Trey Lance next year w/ an improved roster and Year 2 of the RivEra could get you to 10-6 PLUS the belief that the franchise guy is on the roster. Lance takes over in 2022 or 2023 and we're contending for our first 11+ win season since 1991.

 

If they love him, I'd be ok with it.  I didn't love Lance when I watched him but Kyle Smith knows a zillion more about football than me so i'd trust him. 

[CapsSkins]

1 minute ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

If they love him, I'd be ok with it.  I didn't love Lance when I watched him but Kyle Smith knows a zillion more about football than me so i'd trust him. 

 

I think even if he can be a Derek Carr-level guy, it's worth it. We just can't be satisfied banking on Kyle Allen or Haskins. I'm fine overpaying to get a guy if you're confident you can get top 16 QB-quality play out of him. It's the only position that is in of itself a stage-gate to true playoff contention.

Oakland can win a SB with Carr. We will never win a SB with our current guys.

[Darrell Green Fan]

1 hour ago, CapsSkins said:

 

I think even if he can be a Derek Carr-level guy, it's worth it. We just can't be satisfied banking on Kyle Allen or Haskins. I'm fine overpaying to get a guy if you're confident you can get top 16 QB-quality play out of him. It's the only position that is in of itself a stage-gate to true playoff contention.

Oakland can win a SB with Carr. We will never win a SB with our current guys.

 

I'm trying to understand what they will do with Dwayne. All indications are they are happy with his effort now, they don't appear ready to just give him away. But Kyle's play certainly should earn him a spot.  I never expected Smith to return next year but if they draft a QB (expected) then who is the odd man out?

 

 

[CapsSkins]

7 minutes ago, Darrell Green Fan said:

 

I'm trying to understand what they will do with Dwayne. All indications are they are happy with his effort now, they don't appear ready to just give him away. But Kyle's play certainly should earn him a spot.  I never expected Smith to return next year but if they draft a QB (expected) then who is the odd man out?

 

 

 

Here's what I think their plan is:

 

If they draft a guy in the 1st round, they will trade Dwayne.

 

If they draft a guy in a late round, Dwayne will have an opportunity to compete for the 3rd roster spot. Late draft guy can either beat out Dwayne for the 53 or beat out Montez for the PS.

 

If they don't draft a guy, Dwayne will return. 

[Darrell Green Fan]

26 minutes ago, CapsSkins said:

 

Here's what I think their plan is:

 

If they draft a guy in the 1st round, they will trade Dwayne.

 

If they draft a guy in a late round, Dwayne will have an opportunity to compete for the 3rd roster spot. Late draft guy can either beat out Dwayne for the 53 or beat out Montez for the PS.

 

If they don't draft a guy, Dwayne will return. 

Could be, but there does not appear to be a market for Dwayne. What if they take a QB early 2nd or 3rd?  They won't want to expose him to the PS.

 

 

[Skinsinparadise]

Some discussion here about QB.  Dane Brugler, who sometimes I agree with, sometimes not. Delves into for the Bears.  Some relevance to hypotheticals for us in the first round, too.

 

 

[FootballZombie]

1 hour ago, CapsSkins said:

 

Here's what I think their plan is:

 

If they draft a guy in the 1st round, they will trade Dwayne.

 

If they draft a guy in a late round, Dwayne will have an opportunity to compete for the 3rd roster spot. Late draft guy can either beat out Dwayne for the 53 or beat out Montez for the PS.

 

If they don't draft a guy, Dwayne will return. 

 

Never really considered it before but what about the nuclear option.

 

Smith is quietly pumping his own trade value. Maybe a team w/ no shot at drafting a guy *cough* Bears *cough* wants to try and pick up Smith? Even though it leaves us w/o a QB, if the compensation is there, that could be quite tempting. Might even provide the package of picks you'd need to move up and get a specific guy.

 

That would open up a ton of cap for us or even allow us to chase down our own QB via FA, Trade or draft.

 

I always felt the rumors of the Bears wanting Smith was farfetched last off season, but assuming Trubisky flames out again, he's on his way out since they didn't pick up his option. Bears have to do something drastic, they are wasting that solid team.

[Skins199021]

We are going to go 6-10 purely based off of our hideous schedule and get pick 18 aren't we? 

[OVCChairman]

1 hour ago, Darrell Green Fan said:

Could be, but there does not appear to be a market for Dwayne. What if they take a QB early 2nd or 3rd?  They won't want to expose him to the PS.

 

 

 

 

Market will be different in season during off season.  With covid, nobody is trading for a qb at deadline.  Market likely changes on a flyer qb with a big arm if they can have 6 months to groom instead of a couple weeks.  Improved market may only be a 5th round pick... but it would be an improvement to the market 

[Dark Acre]

Nobody is going to stick their neck out and give you anything for Haskins.  Whoever makes that trade is getting death threats and then if (when) Haskins fails, one of those threats might be for realz.  Not happening.

[zCommander]

18 hours ago, ConnSKINS26 said:

I mean, sometimes it makes sense to trade up a few spots to get your QB. Chiefs traded up for Mahomes when they had a younger Smith. Ravens traded up for Lamar Jackson. Texans traded up for Desean Watson I believe. 
 

If anything there’s an argument that being a better team than wouldn’t usually pick in a premium position and then trading up to jump on a falling QB prospect you love is perfectly viable. You don’t want to mortgage the future to trade multiple drafts worth of picks to get into the top-3,  but trading into the 10-20 area if you aren’t where you want to be to get your guy is perfectly viable.

 

Okay, a couple of spots up is okay but not that whole RG3 route. Let's not do that again. 

[Riggo#44]

6 hours ago, KDawg said:

Dylan Moses, anywhere from 10-40ish

 Dylan Moses that high? I thought he was showing the ill effects of his injury. Has he improved? 

[zCommander]

45 minutes ago, Skins199021 said:

We are going to go 6-10 purely based off of our hideous schedule and get pick 18 aren't we? 

 

If we beat the Panthers and the Eagles than that actually makes us the division winner and into the playoffs. If we win a playoff game, somehow, we will be picking later than sooner. 

[KDawg]

15 minutes ago, Riggo#44 said:

 Dylan Moses that high? I thought he was showing the ill effects of his injury. Has he improved? 

He is showing effects but that doesn’t mean someone won’t take a risk.

[VaK9Trainer]

Here's a thought that no one has mentioned but I'm just wondering if we could fit them both under the cap. IF the Jets pick first and take Trevor Lawrence, Sam Darnold is likely going to be traded. I'd jump all over that as long as it wasn't going to be too high of a price tag for him. The question is, could we fit him and Alex both under the cap? Obviously, you'd have to dump Haskins which I think they're going to do regardless. Smith is your starter and let Darnold learn from him to undo all the damage that the Jets have done to him. 

[Dark Acre]

You know what good teams don't do?  Good teams don't pitch a fit about picking 19th.  They pick 19th and then go smack the next j-hole in the mouth.

[Sacks 'n' Stuff]

41 minutes ago, GothSkinsFan said:

You know what good teams don't do?

Get swept by the Giants.

[Anselmheifer]

The cowboys and eagles are both awful. Our only hope is that the Giants get hot. 
 

If we wind up with the same record as the giants, is head to head record the first tie breaker?

[Warhead36]

1 hour ago, Anselmheifer said:

The cowboys and eagles are both awful. Our only hope is that the Giants get hot. 
 

If we wind up with the same record as the giants, is head to head record the first tie breaker?

Yes. They have the tie breaker over us. But their schedule(after the Bengals this Sunday) gets brutal. They may only finish 5-11. I think 6-10 gets us the division.

[Darrell Green Fan]

9 hours ago, VaK9Trainer said:

Here's a thought that no one has mentioned but I'm just wondering if we could fit them both under the cap. IF the Jets pick first and take Trevor Lawrence, Sam Darnold is likely going to be traded. I'd jump all over that as long as it wasn't going to be too high of a price tag for him. The question is, could we fit him and Alex both under the cap? Obviously, you'd have to dump Haskins which I think they're going to do regardless. Smith is your starter and let Darnold learn from him to undo all the damage that the Jets have done to him. 

I'll continue to ask this question:  How often has a first round QB bust gone to another team and turned into a good QB?  It like never happens. Tannehill is the closest example we can find but as a 6 year starter in Miami he was far more accomplished than what we have seen out of Sam Darnold.  

 

 

[Anselmheifer]

4 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

Yes. They have the tie breaker over us. But their schedule(after the Bengals this Sunday) gets brutal. They may only finish 5-11. I think 6-10 gets us the division.

They play the Bengals without Burrow and the Eagles. They are winning both of those games. 
 

If we lose to Pittsburgh, the 49’ers, and Seattle, that means we have to drop a game to Carolina or the Eagles. I give that about a 50% chance of happening.

[Cooleyfan1993]

2 hours ago, Anselmheifer said:

They play the Bengals without Burrow and the Eagles. They are winning both of those games. 

The giants? They already played both their games against the eagles, and split the season series. The only division game left is Dallas 

[Sellersfan]

12 hours ago, VaK9Trainer said:

Here's a thought that no one has mentioned but I'm just wondering if we could fit them both under the cap. IF the Jets pick first and take Trevor Lawrence, Sam Darnold is likely going to be traded. I'd jump all over that as long as it wasn't going to be too high of a price tag for him. The question is, could we fit him and Alex both under the cap? Obviously, you'd have to dump Haskins which I think they're going to do regardless. Smith is your starter and let Darnold learn from him to undo all the damage that the Jets have done to him. 

I fully expect the Patriots to pull out the stops to get Darnold. Would be a Belichek move. Rescue a damaged QB from a division rival and fix him

2 hours ago, Anselmheifer said:

They play the Bengals without Burrow and the Eagles. They are winning both of those games. 
 

If we lose to Pittsburgh, the 49’ers, and Seattle, that means we have to drop a game to Carolina or the Eagles. I give that about a 50% chance of happening.

Our guys will play extra hard for Rivera against his old team. I think that is going to be a fun game to watch.

[Darrell Green Fan]

The Giants hold the tie breaker so they should be a game up essentially with an expected win over Cincy.  That means the WFT has to win a  game with Pittsburgh, SF, Seattle, SF, Carolina and Philly remaining.  I'm not so sure that's going to happen. And that is assuming NY loses all but Cincy.  Dallas appears to have the easiest schedule but they have given up, are a game back and lose the tie breaker with Washington.  Then there is Philly who would only need to win twice with one Washington win.  

 

So basically it's wide open and too tough to call.  

 

 

[Skinsinparadise]

2 hours ago, Darrell Green Fan said:

I'll continue to ask this question:  How often has a first round QB bust gone to another team and turned into a good QB?  It like never happens. Tannehill is the closest example we can find but as a 6 year starter in Miami he was far more accomplished than what we have seen out of Sam Darnold.  

 

 

 

I am with you. I don't want Darnold.   Heck Flacco who isn't that much of a QB anymore looked much better with the current Jets supporting cast than Darnold did.