The 2021 o line thread

[RWJ]

13 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Not sure who would be left at LT in the 2nd.  Of the ones I like maybe Radunz? Eichenberg?    I'd guess right now they do it in the first and Darrisaw or Cosmi is the pick. Will see.

 

Most QBs taken fail and the lower in the draft you go the more failures you get.  So personally i wouldn't force a pick at QB considering the odds on we'd be throwing that pick in the trash.  it's a lottery ticket and if they want to take one (as Keim mentioned that would likely mean discarding Heinicke or Allen because they unlikely keep 4 QBs) then OK.  But i am not anxious about it one way or another.  If it were me I'd skip QB but if they want to try a lottery ticket, i am cool with it.

Eich is my guy in the 2nd.  Can do everything but isn't a superstar or spectacular but is worthy of a 2nd round pick, gets the job done and plays for a long time. Of course someone else could pick him too. 

[bowhunter]

2 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Not sure who would be left at LT in the 2nd.  Of the ones I like maybe Radunz? Eichenberg?    I'd guess right now they do it in the first and Darrisaw or Cosmi is the pick. Will see.

 

 

We at least have a starting LT at the moment. Unless a trade happens, we don't have a starting LB.  I believe in the value of a strong OL, and depth helps. But without some LB core I think we're missing the boat. It will be interesting if Darrisaw/Cosmi are there at 19 and Collins is still on the board

[GhostofAlvinWalton]

4 hours ago, bowhunter said:

We at least have a starting LT at the moment. Unless a trade happens, we don't have a starting LB.  I believe in the value of a strong OL, and depth helps. But without some LB core I think we're missing the boat. It will be interesting if Darrisaw/Cosmi are there at 19 and Collins is still on the board

 

Financially it makes more sense to get your LT in the draft when at all possible. Look at the LT contracts compared to MLB/OLB (not edge rushers). If WFT wants to re-sign as many of their own DLs, TMac, etc...they better find the future LT in the draft and not FA.

 

But they do need to have an actual human body for LB this year as well...

[skinny21]

7 hours ago, bowhunter said:

We at least have a starting LT at the moment. Unless a trade happens, we don't have a starting LB.  I believe in the value of a strong OL, and depth helps. But without some LB core I think we're missing the boat. It will be interesting if Darrisaw/Cosmi are there at 19 and Collins is still on the board

I’ve been thinking to myself for a few months now that if we don’t upgrade at MLB, I might just consider this offseason a failure.  Of course, then we got the best available qb*, the best receiver fit for the team, a talented corner and the draft fits our needs pretty well.  Point being, I get where you’re coming from.  I’m hard pressed to bypass a talented LT at that point for a few different reasons, including that I’d think RR and Del Rio have a better shot than just about anyone at finding a linebacker after the 1st.

 

* maybe Stafford was a better option, but the minimal assets given up weigh pretty heavily in Fitzpatrick’s favor.  Wasn’t a fan of any of the other options.

Edited March 23, 2021 by skinny21

[method man]

On 3/22/2021 at 3:31 PM, RWJ said:

Eich is my guy in the 2nd.  Can do everything but isn't a superstar or spectacular but is worthy of a 2nd round pick, gets the job done and plays for a long time. Of course someone else could pick him too. 

I think of him as Riley Reiff. Is that fair?

[RWJ]

4 minutes ago, method man said:

I think of him as Riley Reiff. Is that fair?

That's fair.  He's blue collar and get's the job done and plays multiple positions on the line well too.  He's not spectacular but he's good.  

[BleedBNG]

 

 

[skinny21]

@Riggodrill44 You said “I’m saying we know what the top guards get paid. Scherff sees it too. He wants to either reset the top or play this out on the Franchise tag.

 There is absolutely no reason to bid against yourself. Age and durability matter. Scherff is lacking both.”

 

Do you have any evidence that he wants to “reset the top or play this out on the franchise tag”?  Seems to me we’re lacking info to know where exactly things stand, and what exactly has occurred to this point, but I may have missed something.  I’m not saying you’re wrong, it just seems like you’re making assumptions based off what little info we do have.

Do we know what he was offered?  Or what was counter offered?  Years?  Guaranteed money?  Salary?

I’m curiously how things typically play out when negotiating with tagged individuals (or extensions, such as for Allen).  Seems logical that from the start of FA through the draft, these types of negotiations are put on hold, but I don’t know if that’s actually the case.  Didn’t surprise me in the least that RR said they haven’t spoken to Scherff’s camp since the tag... though maybe it is surprising (ie, out of the norm), I don’t know.

[Est.1974]

I’m quickly in the area of shipping Scherff out for draft picks. Bored of the tag crap, move him on if no deal is coming. 

[RWJ]

30 minutes ago, UK SKINS FAN 74 said:

I’m quickly in the area of shipping Scherff out for draft picks. Bored of the tag crap, move him on if no deal is coming. 

He's going to play on the $18 mill tag, UK74.  Others on ES talk about negotiations etc. this side; that side.  One is entitled to whatever they want to guess and we don't know but personally my thoughts are he's going to play on the $18 mill and move on after next year.  RR and Co. are at fault too as they tagged him knowing that he would be paid $18 mill on the tag this year if a LTD isn't worked out.  Scherff, IMO wants to be the highest paid OG in the league.  He isn't worth it to me.  To RR and Co. they think highly enough of him to tag him so that's that.   Post at you later, brother. 

[Est.1974]

1 minute ago, RWJ said:

He's going to play on the $18 mill tag, UK74.  Others on ES talk about negotiations etc. this side; that side.  One is entitled to whatever they want to guess and we don't know but personally my thoughts are he's going to play on the $18 mill and move on after next year.  RR and Co. are at fault too as they tagged him knowing that he would be paid $18 mill on the tag this year if a LTD isn't worked out.  Scherff, IMO wants to be the highest paid OG in the league.  He isn't worth it to me.  To RR and Co. they think highly enough of him to tag him so that's that.   Post at you later, brother. 

well just maybe someone else wants to give him that 80mil deal, you never know....but yes the smart money is he plays out the year here on 18mil....

[NoVaSkins21]

The fact that they haven't had any discussions with Schereff means that this situation is probably headed in the Cousins direction.  They sill have until mid July, but this FO is very similar to the old regime where they don't take care of their own.  

[HigSkin]

1 hour ago, UK SKINS FAN 74 said:

I’m quickly in the area of shipping Scherff out for draft picks. Bored of the tag crap, move him on if no deal is coming. 

 

I've always thought if they don't get a deal done and our season isn't going well, they'd try and trade him in-season before that deadline.

[RWJ]

3 hours ago, UK SKINS FAN 74 said:

well just maybe someone else wants to give him that 80mil deal, you never know....but yes the smart money is he plays out the year here on 18mil....

It'd be nice to get a 1st and 3rd for him, even a 2nd and 3rd but his price went down due to all the OGs that hit the FA market and with the upcoming draft.  He's here for a year then goodbye.

2 hours ago, HigSkin said:

 

I've always thought if they don't get a deal done and our season isn't going well, they'd try and trade him in-season before that deadline.

See my post above to UK74, HigSkin. 

Edited April 2, 2021 by RWJ

[JoggingGod]

18 hours ago, SAli457180 said:

The fact that they haven't had any discussions with Schereff means that this situation is probably headed in the Cousins direction.  They sill have until mid July, but this FO is very similar to the old regime where they don't take care of their own.  

They just paid their center a good amount so idk what you mean

[Riggodrill44]

21 hours ago, skinny21 said:

@Riggodrill44 You said “I’m saying we know what the top guards get paid. Scherff sees it too. He wants to either reset the top or play this out on the Franchise tag.

 There is absolutely no reason to bid against yourself. Age and durability matter. Scherff is lacking both.”

 

Do you have any evidence that he wants to “reset the top or play this out on the franchise tag”?  Seems to me we’re lacking info to know where exactly things stand, and what exactly has occurred to this point, but I may have missed something.  I’m not saying you’re wrong, it just seems like you’re making assumptions based off what little info we do have.

Do we know what he was offered?  Or what was counter offered?  Years?  Guaranteed money?  Salary?

I’m curiously how things typically play out when negotiating with tagged individuals (or extensions, such as for Allen).  Seems logical that from the start of FA through the draft, these types of negotiations are put on hold, but I don’t know if that’s actually the case.  Didn’t surprise me in the least that RR said they haven’t spoken to Scherff’s camp since the tag... though maybe it is surprising (ie, out of the norm), I don’t know.

It looks like Scherff has turned down offers that would make him the highest paid guard in the NFL. Thank God he didn’t take it. We can get a good guard for half of that salary. 
 

It still looks like he wants to bet on himself and play out the one year deal.

[skinny21]

13 minutes ago, Riggodrill44 said:

It looks like Scherff has turned down offers that would make him the highest paid guard in the NFL. Thank God he didn’t take it. We can get a good guard for half of that salary. 
 

It still looks like he wants to bet on himself and play out the one year deal.

I was approaching it w/o prior to Keim’s statement/info, so it seemed a bit of jumping the gun.  Knowing that now though (thx for bringing it up), that changes things big time for me.  I would guess Scherff/his agent’s problem with the contract comes down to guaranteed money and or length of contract, but even so... it’s not a good look.  I’m ready to move on.  It’s unfortunate we couldn’t work it out and now have to push G up our list of needs going into the draft.  Bummer.

[posse87]

Seems a lot of players are pushing long term contracts to next year when the cap goes up because of the new broadcasting deals. Bad business to lock in when the cap is down as well cause of COVID. He could move on or get a deal done to stay at a substantially higher rate

[PartyPosse]

If Scherff would rather chase dollars than a ring than I’d rather he just go. 

[CommanderInTheRye]

On 4/2/2021 at 4:11 PM, SAli457180 said:

The fact that they haven't had any discussions with Schereff means that this situation is probably headed in the Cousins direction.  They sill have until mid July, but this FO is very similar to the old regime where they don't take care of their own.  

 

 

Agreed with everything you said and was willing to give you a well earned trophy emoji then you ruined it with the last line (bolded above).

 

If at some point you begin to realize that Scherf (like Cousins before him) really just doesn’t want to be here at any reasonable price do you continue to negotiate against yourself by raising your offer just so he can say no again?

 

Sometimes the wise decision is to end negotiations and move in a different direction. I think that point has been reached with BS and the WFT.

 

Trade him and move forward with the players that believe in the organization and want to be here.

 

 

 

 

Edited April 4, 2021 by TrancesWithWolves

[bentskin]

On 4/2/2021 at 2:43 PM, RWJ said:

He's going to play on the $18 mill tag, UK74.  Others on ES talk about negotiations etc. this side; that side.  One is entitled to whatever they want to guess and we don't know but personally my thoughts are he's going to play on the $18 mill and move on after next year.  RR and Co. are at fault too as they tagged him knowing that he would be paid $18 mill on the tag this year if a LTD isn't worked out.  Scherff, IMO wants to be the highest paid OG in the league.  He isn't worth it to me.  To RR and Co. they think highly enough of him to tag him so that's that.   Post at you later, brother. 

 

I agree. I am hopeful that they come to their senses and trade him. I find it hard to believe that another team will not give 2nd for him (at least a 3rd). I would rather have a 3rd this year and move on then play him, let him walk only to get a comp 3rd (maybe) the following year. 

A high second rounder gives them flexibility in the draft obviously.

#19 Darrisaw / Jenkins

2nd round - Wyatt Davis G Ohio St.

2nd round - Jabril Cox

3rd round - Caden Sterns

3rd round - Dyami Brown / Davis Mills

or

#19 LB - JOK or Collins

2nd round - Wyatt Davis G Ohio St.

2nd round - Eichanberg / Little / Carmen

3rd round - Caden Sterns

3rd round - Dyami Brown / Davis Mills

 

Either one of these scenarios I like Charles to compete at LT/RT or LG. If Scherff is traded pencil in Schweitzer at RG and see what happens with the rooks and Charles. 

Darrisaw - Davis - Roullier - Schwietzer - Charles

Charles - Schweitzer - Roullier - Davis - Eichanberg 

 

HTTR

[RWJ]

Just now, bentskin said:

 

I agree. I am hopeful that they come to their senses and trade him. I find it hard to believe that another team will not give 2nd for him (at least a 3rd). I would rather have a 3rd this year and move on then play him, let him walk only to get a comp 3rd (maybe) the following year. 

A high second rounder gives them flexibility in the draft obviously.

#19 Darrisaw / Jenkins

2nd round - Wyatt Davis G Ohio St.

2nd round - Jabril Cox

3rd round - Caden Sterns

3rd round - Dyami Brown / Davis Mills

or

#19 LB - JOK or Collins

2nd round - Wyatt Davis G Ohio St.

2nd round - Eichanberg / Little / Carmen

3rd round - Caden Sterns

3rd round - Dyami Brown / Davis Mills

 

Either one of these scenarios I like Charles to compete at LT/RT or LG. If Scherff is traded pencil in Schweitzer at RG and see what happens with the rooks and Charles. 

Darrisaw - Davis - Roullier - Schwietzer - Charles

Charles - Schweitzer - Roullier - Davis - Eichanberg 

 

HTTR

Just posted but if we could trade a 2021 2nd and let's say a 2022 4th rounder to sweeten the pot for Orlando Brown and then draft Jamis at #19 that might be an option.

[bentskin]

I forgot to mention that option. I would be in for LT Brown trade but no more than a second. Maybe 3rd this year and 4th next. Give him Scherffs money.

HTTR

[Ball Security]

We now have Christian, Cosmi, Lucas, Sharpe, Moses, and Charles competing at tackle.

Roullier at Center with Ismael as the backup.

Scherff, Schweitzer, Flowers, and Martin at guard.

I think we have another 3-4 fringe players signed, but are likely camp fodder.

Those 12 will have to be trimmed down to 9 or 10.

They need to make a T/G decisions on Charles and Cosmi.

[Malapropismic Depository]

27 minutes ago, Ball Security said:

We now have Christian, Cosmi, Lucas, Sharpe, Moses, and Charles competing at tackle.

Roullier at Center with Ismael as the backup.

Scherff, Schweitzer, Flowers, and Martin at guard.

I think we have another 3-4 fringe players signed, but are likely camp fodder.

Those 12 will have to be trimmed down to 9 or 10.

They need to make a T/G decisions on Charles and Cosmi.

 

 

I usually follow our own roster really closely and know about players on the roster, that a lot of people didn't know existed, but I completely forgot all about Christian being on our team.

I don't know if it's my memory starting to go, or if it's a reflection of what I think his chances are, of making this team in 2021.

 

Oh, and I don't consider Larsen to be Camp Fodder. He has a decent chance of making the team.

And don't forget we still have about 4 draft picks left to make

Edited May 1, 2021 by Malapropismic Depository