The 2021 o line thread

[KillBill26]

1 hour ago, UK SKINS FAN 74 said:

the comp pick allocation clearly depends on who we sign in free agency too.

Between 1. having established a young talented core already and 2. Focus should be shifting to use cap space to resign our own as opposed to FA, I think it won't be crippling for us to avoid a big FA contract next offseason, especially considering we know it would mean forfeiting the 3rd rounder.  

 

And a rather frugal FA approach is pretty much already in place, chasing 15 mil per year players hasn't really been Ron's cup of tea.

 

I loved the scherff pick, and I like him as a player with his blue collar approach, but I'm ok with letting him walk if he wants top dollar.  I'd rather have the 15+ mil in cap space in year 1 after his departure, more cap flexibility in the future, and a 3rd rounder than keeping him.  I feel confident we can fill the void at RG sufficiently.  It probably won't be a player of his caliber, but with the resources listed above allocated to different areas of the team, I think overall we will be better for it.

[Redskins Reparations]

6 hours ago, GothSkinsFan said:

Of course I implied it and of course it was blatant sarcasm.  Veiled sarcasm is as appropriate in a sports forum as a glass of chenin blanc.  This is our gridiron and to paraphrase the great H. L. Mencken, every man must be tempted at times to unleash his inner Conrad Dobler and begin slitting foolish remarks.

[Silvernon]

15 hours ago, UK SKINS FAN 74 said:

the comp pick allocation clearly depends on who we sign in free agency too.

Exactly. 

 

They're going to do another Samuel/Jackson tier FA contract next year, and that will cancel out the Scherff compensatory pick. 

 

The silver lining is not giving out the big deal because there's nothing coming back. 

 

17 hours ago, Burgundy Yoda said:

If there's no QB worth picking at our draft spot next year, it's obvious a premium pick needs to be spent to replace him. He's gone, but he'll be 30, you have to expect that he only has a few years of top level productivity left. He was older when we drafted him but we still got really good play from him. We're definitely going to need to spend a very high pick to replace him though. 

 

Very high pick? I dunno about that. 

 

Maybe Charles isn't the guy? They still picked up a viable starting guard two years ago in Flowers, then Schweitzer last year and Flowers this year again.

 

If he can stay healthy, all indications point to Charles having starting ability at guard.

 

I would be absolutely shocked to see a high pick used on a guard. 

[Burgundy Yoda]

6 minutes ago, Silvernon said:

Exactly. 

 

They're going to do another Samuel/Jackson tier FA contract next year, and that will cancel out the Scherff compensatory pick. 

 

The silver lining is not giving out the big deal because there's nothing coming back. 

 

 

Very high pick? I dunno about that. 

 

Maybe Charles isn't the guy? They still picked up a viable starting guard two years ago in Flowers, then Schweitzer last year and Flowers this year again.

 

If he can stay healthy, all indications point to Charles having starting ability at guard.

 

I would be absolutely shocked to see a high pick used on a guard. 

Not me, there aren't many holes on the roster, Scherff himself was a premium pick so it's not such a wild concept.

 

Well that's the catch with Charles isn't it? As of right now, he's unreliable and definitely not the reason we should be passing on a good guard prospect. 

 

Our other guards are solid but I think we could upgrade if the right player comes along. 

Edited July 15, 2021 by Burgundy Yoda

[Silvernon]

5 minutes ago, Burgundy Yoda said:

Not me, there aren't many holes on the roster, Scherff himself was a premium pick so it's not such a wild concept.

 

Well that's the catch with Charles isn't it? As of right now, he's unreliable and definitely not the reason we should be passing on a good guard prospect. 

 

Our other guards are solid but I think we could upgrade if the right player comes along. 

 

I think we're more likely to see a high pick spent on a RT or a corner.

 

Sure, they may have found a starter on day 3 this year, but Jackson will have two years left on his deal and it can take a corner a couple of years to hit their stride. 

 

It seems like a DB is on the radar again, and it's generally easier to find one on day 2 and generally easier to get a tackle on day 1. 

 

This organization goes after needs over BPA, so maybe you're right that they don't see the strength at guard. 

 

Forgetting about Charles. Schweitzer slides to the right on his last year of the deal, and the team brings Flowers back (not for $10M).

[PlayAction]

3 hours ago, Burgundy Yoda said:

Well that's the catch with Charles isn't it? As of right now, he's unreliable and definitely not the reason we should be passing on a good guard prospect. 

 

 

I don't know why everyone is so down on Charles.  He suffered a dislocated knee and was out for the season but injuries happen in the NFL.  I think fans are so accustomed to the team having drafted injury prone players that we immediately write rookies off if there is any injury.  I'll change my tune if he goes on IR in his second year though!!  Charles played LT, RT and RG in college and he showed good movement and power.  Just pretend that he suffered the injury in his last year in college and the team drafted him this year.  Bonus for the OL!!!  I'm feeling optimistic this offseason.   

[KillBill26]

15 hours ago, Silvernon said:

Exactly. 

 

They're going to do another Samuel/Jackson tier FA contract next year, and that will cancel out the Scherff compensatory pick. 

 I'm not sure exactly how they cancel out players signed vs lost to determine the picks a team gets, but looking at the titans last season, they lost conklin at 14m and Mariota at 8.8m, but when they signed Vic Beasley at 9.49, it cancelled out the Mariota deal, and they got awarded a 3rd for Conklin.  It makes sense bc Beasleys number is closer to Mariotas, but relating it to our situation, if scherff is at 16m yr, it is possible we sign a decent player at 9-10 aav and still not lose the scherff pick, as it would cancel out a player that we lost at a closer number to that.  We have several guys that could walk and get a nice sized contract in Fitz, Thomas, Leno, McCain, not to mention Allen.  And Troy apke.

 

 

[Silvernon]

5 hours ago, KillBill26 said:

 I'm not sure exactly how they cancel out players signed vs lost to determine the picks a team gets, but looking at the titans last season, they lost conklin at 14m and Mariota at 8.8m, but when they signed Vic Beasley at 9.49, it cancelled out the Mariota deal, and they got awarded a 3rd for Conklin.  It makes sense bc Beasleys number is closer to Mariotas, but relating it to our situation, if scherff is at 16m yr, it is possible we sign a decent player at 9-10 aav and still not lose the scherff pick, as it would cancel out a player that we lost at a closer number to that.  We have several guys that could walk and get a nice sized contract in Fitz, Thomas, Leno, McCain, not to mention Allen.  And Troy apke.

 

 

All about offsets.

 

Possible that they let Allen leave and WFT signs a player at that price point. Perhaps then Scherff brings back a 3rd.

 

Losing Allen in FA may be the contract that cancels out the incoming FA, but either way I think they lose one or both without compensation.

 

In your example, if the team hadn't also lost Mariota, the Conklin return wouldn't have been nullified but reduced (a round or two lower). 

[bakedtater1]

I have to be honest the release of Morgan Moses(with all do respect thank you for your services while here!)after the draft of Cosmi had me kinda gasping for air...now....I'm chill...😃👍

[Ball Security]

Cosmi played well in the first preseason game.  I read that Tevon Jenkins has a back injury and Alex Leatherwood has been a big disappointment in camp.

[Skinsinparadise]

 

 

 

 

Edited October 6, 2021 by Skinsinparadise

[Going Commando]

Leno is top ten in pass block win rate too.  I don't know his run block win rate, but he's been winning his match ups with high level consistency.

 

We are on a major hot streak at the position group with Christian and Martin being the only whiffs against like seven different hits.  It has been the key to the modest offensive success that we have had.  Man I wish we had gotten Trey Smith.  He could have replaced Scherff for next season with no drop off.  Fallers with major holes in their game but with freakish natural talent like Cosmi and Flowers are exactly who we should be targeting given our ability to develop linemen, and Smith fit that description to a tee.  We picked a freaking long snapper instead.

[Nerm]

I was looking at stats on profootball reference.  It surprised me to see that the WFT has given up the fewest sacks in the NFL so far this year.  I have only seen highlights of the WFT games this year.  Is the pass blocking that good?  Or is it play calling?  TH mobility?  Early season statistical fluke (e.g. Cowboys D takeaways so far)?

[Warhead36]

8 minutes ago, Nerm said:

I was looking at stats on profootball reference.  It surprised me to see that the WFT has given up the fewest sacks in the NFL so far this year.  I have only seen highlights of the WFT games this year.  Is the pass blocking that good?  Or is it play calling?  TH mobility?  Early season statistical fluke (e.g. Cowboys D takeaways so far)?

Combination of factors:

 

1. Heinicke knows the system, so the ball tends to come out faster.

 

2. Heinicke's mobility and pocket awareness allow him to evade quite a bit in the pocket. He's very Romo-esque in this regard.

 

3. The OL actually is pretty good. Scherff is an All Pro. Cosmi's PFF ratings have been through the roof. Roullier is a top 10 C(graded that way last year). Flowers has always been better at G. Leno might be the one guy playing above his level, but even then he made a Pro Bowl in 2018 and alternate in 2019 so he does have a track record of being pretty good.

[Skinsinparadise]

 

[Skinsinparadise]

Durability doesn’t come easy at that spot 

 

 

[mudhog]

39 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

Durability doesn’t come easy at that spot 

 

 

That's a good look for Leno. Looks way more relaxed and ready than if he were sporting the blazer and tie. Give em' hell today big guy!

[Going Commando]

Leno's been living right.  He's a positive and enthusiastic dude that seems to have fit in like a glove in our locker room.  I was a little worried about him at first, but he was our best offseason signing, and between him and Flowers, we rebuilt the left side of our line well.  We've got a lot of good dudes in the locker room like him and Terry and Scherff and Roullier.  Taylor is the leader for them, please Football Gods, just let this work out for us.

[Skinsinparadise]

 

 

[IrepDC]

I don't see how we can justify paying Scherff with his injury history and the way Wes stepped up

[Skinsinparadise]

 

 

[skinsfan66]

Maybe WFT is playing better without Schreff? line has looked better without him.

[Skinsinparadise]

 

 

[philibusters]

Back in the summer who had the offense line as the best unit on the team...Almost nobody.    And while the D-Line has been underwhelming they have been the second best unit on the team.   We are building our a solid foundation in the trenches.  Only problem with the Oline is the guys are not that young.  None of them are over the hill--Leno is the oldest and he just turned 30 on Saturday, but other than Cosmi are in their peak phase.

[skinny21]

Some random points - 

 

These guys are getting the job done in a big way and they’ve done it without the benefit of continuity.

They have the benefit of a qb that moves well, but I also imagine it can be tougher in some ways to block for a guy like Taylor.

I imagine it helps having a qb that knows the system well, but also having a savvy center like Roullier.

Gotta love the depth with Wes and Lucas in the wings.  

On the other hand, I’m a little worried about when we’ll get Scherff and Cosmi back, mostly because I don’t know what our depth looks like with Sweitzer/Lucas starting.

 

More of a side note, but I thought Scott and the players did a pretty good job winning the edge against NO when they were obviously focused on preventing just that.  We got stifled at times, but that was also partly without Scherff and Cosmi - our two best run blockers.