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Welcome to the NFL Dwayne Haskins QB Ohio State


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8 hours ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

 

Winning has to be the most important thing if you want to actually build a decent organizational culture.  Everyone must always compete and earn their place with the team.  You can't just pick and choose when you compete, and you can't just hand any player a job he hasn't earned, no matter what his position or draft status is.

 

This is the first year in what should be a long career for Haskins.  The team needs to be patient with him and they definitely need to make him compete just like the rest of the guys on the team.  He needs to be one of them, for the good of both him and the team.

Typically if would agree with you.  Competition and playing the best guys are generally what I go with.  

 

However QB is a special circumstance.  You need to develop your QB to win, and playing is the best way.  Especially if the other options are meh and meh.  

 

The goal should be winning a championship.  If you can’t do that with Colt/Case, then the goal is to develop the talent to achieve that goal.

 

the goal should not be to get to 9-7 and squeak into the playoffs. 

 

If you’re not going to make a deep playoff run, it’s better to be 2-14 and get the first pick in every round in the draft and build a team that can compete. 

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@HTTRDynasty

 

I like Orlovsky but IMO it's an odd point he makes.  He is basically blaming the coaching staff for Robert Davis missing his assignment.  It would be interesting if he likewise used a young nonstarter type Eagles receiver trying to make camp mastering the same play in the preseason.  Instead, he uses an Eagles bonafide starter (pro bowler, too) during the season getting the assignment right.

 

I agree with him that Haskins would have had an easier time if Davis positioned himself right and got in the way of the defender.  But I am not sure why I am supposed to blame the coaches for not coaching up Davis better.  Maybe O'Connell for example drilled Davis about it in practice and told him to play tighter to the numbers and he made a mistake anyway -- he is no slam dunk to make this roster and there is a reason for it.

 

The one point Orlovsky though illustrates well is that Haskins has it tougher playing with the 2nd-3rd stringers.  I agree and made that point after the game.   

Edited by Skinsinparadise
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Cowboys will have so much tied up in just a few players. They will be in cap hell for a long long time. 

 

 

I rewatched the game and just feel like Dwayne wasn’t too sure of himself. Too much thinking. I have no doubt he will look much better overall this week. 

Edited by skinsfan93
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Either way the Cowboys are ****ed. Give Dak the money and he wont live up to it without Elliot. Give them both the money and you cant afford anything else. Dont give them the money you have no offense. 

 

Yes. Good.

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2 minutes ago, Llevron said:

Either way the Cowboys are ****ed. Give Dak the money and he wont live up to it without Elliot. Give them both the money and you cant afford anything else. Dont give them the money you have no offense. 

 

Yes. Good.

 

And they got Cooper coming up for a contract, too and he supposedly wants close to 20 million.  Normally IMO you pay the QB in that mix.  But Dak to me by a mile is the weak link of those 3. 

Edited by Skinsinparadise
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15 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

I agree with him that Haskins would have had an easier time if Davis positioned himself right and got in the way of the defender.  But I am not sure why I am supposed to blame the coaches for not coaching up Davis better.  Maybe O'Connell for example drilled Davis about it in practice and told him to play tighter to the numbers and he made a mistake anyway -- he is no slam dunk to make this roster and there is a reason for it.

 

True.  It's preseason game one too.  Guys in midseason form are sharper.  But rewatching that play, it looks like Haskins also underthrew the route and/or threw it too early.

 

When I first watched the play, I thought the ball came out late.  But I was wrong, he throws it at the bottom of his drop.  It's clear that the play was broken by the failure on the rub by Davis.  In that situation, the only way for Haskins to adjust is to hold onto the ball like Foles did and make the throw further downfield.  It's a risky game because his left tackle got his ass kicked and the blindside pressure was coming.  Hitch back up in the pocket maybe.  Or recognize Davis ****ed up out of the snap and check back left to the other flat I guess.  It's not reasonable to expect any rookie to have made those play under those circumstances. 

 

It's also troubling that we couldn't block a three man rush.  This offensive line is a serious problem.

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17 hours ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

Typically if would agree with you.  Competition and playing the best guys are generally what I go with.  

 

However QB is a special circumstance.  You need to develop your QB to win, and playing is the best way.  Especially if the other options are meh and meh.   

 

The goal should be winning a championship.  If you can’t do that with Colt/Case, then the goal is to develop the talent to achieve that goal. 

 

the goal should not be to get to 9-7 and squeak into the playoffs. 

 

If you’re not going to make a deep playoff run, it’s better to be 2-14 and get the first pick in every round in the draft and build a team that can compete.  

 

I disagree that playing a young QB is the best way to develop them.  In fact I think it's usually better for them when they get to sit, but most teams don't have the luxury to do that.  And I don't think a QB should be treated differently from the rest of the team such that he doesn't have to earn his job.  That was one of the ways we got into trouble with RGIII's development.

 

Our goal going into this season is to win a championship.  Nobody's goal is to go 9-7.  That happens as a result of failing to meet your goal.  But you can't signal to your team that your goal isn't to compete for a championship before the year even begins by giving the starting job to  a young QB when everyone can tell he didn't earn it in camp.  That'd poison the well and you'd end up with a team full of guys playing for themselves.

 

This isn't the NBA.  The NFL draft is deep.  Tanking isn't necessary, nor is it at all clear that tanking teams end up being better than the teams who pick in the 20s every year.  The culture gap in the NFL is a lot bigger than the talent gap.

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Haskins looked more like he was playing in a scrimmage than a game-like atmosphere.  He's in with guys who are (at best) backups and other that won't make the team, and there's no chemistry in any of those units.  I understand that the starters normally do not play, if at all, until the second or third preseason game, and even then its limited to a drive or two.  I'd like to see him play with those units instead of the hodgepodge that he had to deal with last Thursday.

 

BTW-  If Erik Flowers sees the field this year for the Redskins (or any team), and I was the quarterback, I'd feign some sort of terminal disease to avoid having to play.  Wouldn't have to worry about my backup taking my job, because he'll be killed in the game by whoever Flowers was supposed to block.

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1 hour ago, kfrankie said:

.BTW-  If Erik Flowers sees the field this year for the Redskins (or any team), and I was the quarterback, I'd feign some sort of terminal disease to avoid having to play.  Wouldn't have to worry about my backup taking my job, because he'll be killed in the game by whoever Flowers was supposed to block.

 

The psychology of this above fascinated me. It’s my belief Erik Flowers can be overall average, but will undoubtedly be crucified due to pre conceived narratives. Our mental representation associates Flowers with 1st round bust, having to positions, and being given up on by multiple teams. 

 

He could end up not working out at G, but man, does he have a lot to overcome from a perception standpoint. 

 

 

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1 hour ago, kfrankie said:

 

BTW-  If Erik Flowers sees the field this year for the Redskins (or any team), and I was the quarterback, I'd feign some sort of terminal disease to avoid having to play.  Wouldn't have to worry about my backup taking my job, because he'll be killed in the game by whoever Flowers was supposed to block.

 

Flowers has no business playing tackle in the NFL. But if you watch the cut ups of the game again he actually played reasonably well at guard. It was certainly not a train wreck.

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6 minutes ago, MartinC said:

 

Flowers has no business playing tackle in the NFL. But if you watch the cut ups of the game again he actually played reasonably well at guard. It was certainly not a train wreck.

 

I've heard that same assessment about his play at guard against the Browns. Well, that it was a decent showing, gave some optimism that he could produce at guard if needed.

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8 minutes ago, Califan007 said:

 

I've heard that same assessment about his play at guard against the Browns. Well, that it was a decent showing, gave some optimism that he could produce at guard if needed.

Move Sherref and Moses to LG & LET and put Flowers @ RG with Penn and Wes battling it out for RT.

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4 minutes ago, jbird said:

Move Sherref and Moses to LG & LET and put Flowers @ RG with Penn and Wes battling it out for RT.

I am confused. Why would we flip our entire offensive line just for the sake of putting Penn and Wes at a position that both are completely unable to play?

 

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11 minutes ago, NickyJ said:

I am confused. Why would we flip our entire offensive line just for the sake of putting Penn and Wes at a position that both are completely unable to play?

 

Left side of line being more important.

 

At least our Rook or QB will see the freight train that is about to run him down.....

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2 hours ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

Our goal going into this season is to win a championship. 

 

This isn't the NBA.  The NFL draft is deep.  Tanking isn't necessary, nor is it at all clear that tanking teams end up being better than the teams who pick in the 20s every year.  The culture gap in the NFL is a lot bigger than the talent gap.

 

Im going to disagree with this logic. We arent winning anything nor are we in contention. The plan was always for 2020. This year was about Alex showing our rookie the ropes, and passing it off in 2020. Things happened, but the plan stays the same. We rebuilt the DL from worst in the league to potentially one of the best, got younger almost everywhere, and now have a smart and driven rookie qb with the luxury of sitting and learning for a year.

 

I would pull the same exact strategy that Indianapolis has pulled (TWICE) going into the offseason. Tank the year and make a power move after. The first time they tanked during Peyton's surgery and landed Luck. The second time resulted in perennial all pro- Quentin Nelson among others and look at Indy now...

 

We could potentially tank most of this year while letting Haskins learn and eventually assume the starting spot in the second half, then flip that pick to a desperate franchise for a franchise altering haul.  If you move Trent for a 1st and 3rd, you are going to be absolutely rich in assets for a decade with a young qb of the future already on the roster. That is the best case scenario here. ( even if it comes at the expense of a terrible 2019 season)

 

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Everyone likes Colt, the coaches love Colt.  But he can't stay healthy.  He's listed at QB1, but if he's not healthy enough to practice or play in the pre-season, while it's a 3 man competition...then he's QB1 in name only.  I'd think come Week 1, Case/Dwayne would be suited up, and Colt would be in street clothes on the sideline.

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1 hour ago, Skin'emAlive said:

 

Im going to disagree with this logic. We arent winning anything nor are we in contention. The plan was always for 2020. This year was about Alex showing our rookie the ropes, and passing it off in 2020. Things happened, but the plan stays the same. We rebuilt the DL from worst in the league to potentially one of the best, got younger almost everywhere, and now have a smart and driven rookie qb with the luxury of sitting and learning for a year.

 

I would pull the same exact strategy that Indianapolis has pulled (TWICE) going into the offseason. Tank the year and make a power move after. The first time they tanked during Peyton's surgery and landed Luck. The second time resulted in perennial all pro- Quentin Nelson among others and look at Indy now...

 

We could potentially tank most of this year while letting Haskins learn and eventually assume the starting spot in the second half, then flip that pick to a desperate franchise for a franchise altering haul.  If you move Trent for a 1st and 3rd, you are going to be absolutely rich in assets for a decade with a young qb of the future already on the roster. That is the best case scenario here. ( even if it comes at the expense of a terrible 2019 season)

 

Loser mentality. 

 

There is no guarantee that we draft a perennial pro bowler by tanking. We could also have a medicore year and draft a perennial pro bowler anyways. 

 

The nfc east is wide open. It is better to keep a competitive mentality building amongst the youngsters. The Eagles won the superbowl 2 years ago mainly off their backup qb and a strong defense. 

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4 hours ago, kfrankie said:

 

BTW-  If Erik Flowers sees the field this year for the Redskins (or any team), and I was the quarterback, I'd feign some sort of terminal disease to avoid having to play.  Wouldn't have to worry about my backup taking my job, because he'll be killed in the game by whoever Flowers was supposed to block.

 

Eagles and Fletcher Cox week 1. 

 

Actually he's still coming off surgery. Maybe we'll be spared. Lol

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  • MartinC changed the title to Welcome to the NFL Dwayne Haskins QB Ohio State

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