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The Impeachment Thread

No Excuses

By No Excuses
in The Tailgate

Impeachment  

198 members have voted

  1. 1. Should Donald Trump be impeached for obstruction of justice?


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twa

twa

Posted
Posted
19 minutes ago, Fresh8686 said:

 

that's called self-delusion

 

Not if you actually change it

 

Impeachment for example is not reality without completing it, tis more like a censure.

 

a successful vote to impeach certainly exists.

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mistertim

mistertim

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, twa said:

 

Not if you actually change it

 

Impeachment for example is not reality without completing it, tis more like a censure.

 

a successful vote to impeach certainly exists.


He says, right before trying to literally do exactly that.

 

Impeachment is completed, the trial isn't. Trump has been impeached. 

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RedskinsFan44

RedskinsFan44

Posted
Posted
4 minutes ago, twa said:

 

Not if you actually change it

 

Impeachment for example is not reality without completing it, tis more like a censure.

 

a successful vote to impeach certainly exists.

Judging from the last two it seems extremely unlikely. Have we ever had 67 Senators of the party opposing the President? I doubt that could happen given the way Senate elections are staggered. Maybe if the president was found with a dead child. Maybe.

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twa

twa

Posted
Posted
Just now, mistertim said:


He says, right before trying to literally do exactly that.

 

Impeachment is completed, the trial isn't. Trump has been impeached. 

 

 Can the Senate begin a trial now?

 

what is reality.

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mistertim

mistertim

Posted
Posted
8 minutes ago, twa said:

 

 Can the Senate begin a trial now?

 

what is reality.

 

The Senate begins the trial when the House appoints Managers and presents the passed impeachment articles to the Senate. That hasn't happened yet. Beyond that, there's really no historical precedent for this one way or the other. But that doesn't change the fact that the House "shall have the sole Power of Impeachment" and once the impeachment articles are passed by the House then the president has been impeached. 

 

As for what is reality, I'm not positive. But whatever it is, I'm fairly positive that you're trying to spray paint it with orange graffiti.

 

6 minutes ago, No Excuses said:

Good morning to everyone, on the second day of Trump’s impeachment. I see that President Dotard is melting down as usual. 

 

Yeah, he'll never read ET again, apparently.   :ols:

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twa

twa

Posted
Posted

Let me try a different example....

 

What happens if the house does not complete the impeachment process and this term ends?

 

add

not just passed, but sent to the Senate

 

to argue otherwise would mean the Senate can proceed to trial now

 

 

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PleaseBlitz

PleaseBlitz

Posted
Posted

This seems significant (note the publication).  Not sure if this should go here or elsewhere.

 

https://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/2019/december-web-only/trump-should-be-removed-from-office.html

 

Trump Should Be Removed from Office

 

Quote

In our founding documents, Billy Graham explains that Christianity Today will help evangelical Christians interpret the news in a manner that reflects their faith. The impeachment of Donald Trump is a significant event in the story of our republic. It requires comment.

 

The typical CT approach is to stay above the fray and allow Christians with different political convictions to make their arguments in the public square, to encourage all to pursue justice according to their convictions and treat their political opposition as charitably as possible. We want CT to be a place that welcomes Christians from across the political spectrum, and reminds everyone that politics is not the end and purpose of our being. We take pride in the fact, for instance, that politics does not dominate our homepage.

 

That said, we do feel it necessary from time to time to make our own opinions on political matters clear—always, as Graham encouraged us, doing so with both conviction and love. We love and pray for our president, as we love and pray for leaders (as well as ordinary citizens) on both sides of the political aisle.

 

Let’s grant this to the president: The Democrats have had it out for him from day one, and therefore nearly everything they do is under a cloud of partisan suspicion. This has led many to suspect not only motives but facts in these recent impeachment hearings. And, no, Mr. Trump did not have a serious opportunity to offer his side of the story in the House hearings on impeachment.

 

But the facts in this instance are unambiguous: The president of the United States attempted to use his political power to coerce a foreign leader to harass and discredit one of the president’s political opponents. That is not only a violation of the Constitution; more importantly, it is profoundly immoral.

 

The reason many are not shocked about this is that this president has dumbed down the idea of morality in his administration. He has hired and fired a number of people who are now convicted criminals. He himself has admitted to immoral actions in business and his relationship with women, about which he remains proud. His Twitter feed alone—with its habitual string of mischaracterizations, lies, and slanders—is a near perfect example of a human being who is morally lost and confused.

 

Trump’s evangelical supporters have pointed to his Supreme Court nominees, his defense of religious liberty, and his stewardship of the economy, among other things, as achievements that justify their support of the president. We believe the impeachment hearings have made it absolutely clear, in a way the Mueller investigation did not, that President Trump has abused his authority for personal gain and betrayed his constitutional oath. The impeachment hearings have illuminated the president’s moral deficiencies for all to see. This damages the institution of the presidency, damages the reputation of our country, and damages both the spirit and the future of our people. None of the president’s positives can balance the moral and political danger we face under a leader of such grossly immoral character.

 

This concern for the character of our national leader is not new in CT. In 1998, we wrote this:

 

The President's failure to tell the truth—even when cornered—rips at the fabric of the nation. This is not a private affair. For above all, social intercourse is built on a presumption of trust: trust that the milk your grocer sells you is wholesome and pure; trust that the money you put in your bank can be taken out of the bank; trust that your babysitter, firefighters, clergy, and ambulance drivers will all do their best. And while politicians are notorious for breaking campaign promises, while in office they have a fundamental obligation to uphold our trust in them and to live by the law.

 

And this:

 

Unsavory dealings and immoral acts by the President and those close to him have rendered this administration morally unable to lead.

 

Unfortunately, the words that we applied to Mr. Clinton 20 years ago apply almost perfectly to our current president. Whether Mr. Trump should be removed from office by the Senate or by popular vote next election—that is a matter of prudential judgment. That he should be removed, we believe, is not a matter of partisan loyalties but loyalty to the Creator of the Ten Commandments.

 

To the many evangelicals who continue to support Mr. Trump in spite of his blackened moral record, we might say this: Remember who you are and whom you serve. Consider how your justification of Mr. Trump influences your witness to your Lord and Savior. Consider what an unbelieving world will say if you continue to brush off Mr. Trump’s immoral words and behavior in the cause of political expediency. If we don’t reverse course now, will anyone take anything we say about justice and righteousness with any seriousness for decades to come? Can we say with a straight face that abortion is a great evil that cannot be tolerated and, with the same straight face, say that the bent and broken character of our nation’s leader doesn’t really matter in the end?

 

We have reserved judgment on Mr. Trump for years now. Some have criticized us for our reserve. But when it comes to condemning the behavior of another, patient charity must come first. So we have done our best to give evangelical Trump supporters their due, to try to understand their point of view, to see the prudential nature of so many political decisions they have made regarding Mr. Trump. To use an old cliché, it’s time to call a spade a spade, to say that no matter how many hands we win in this political poker game, we are playing with a stacked deck of gross immorality and ethical incompetence. And just when we think it’s time to push all our chips to the center of the table, that’s when the whole game will come crashing down. It will crash down on the reputation of evangelical religion and on the world’s understanding of the gospel. And it will come crashing down on a nation of men and women whose welfare is also our concern.

 

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tshile

tshile

Posted
Posted

The “he’s not impeached because the process isn’t finished” is a microcosm what what it means to deal with the modern GOP/Republican/Conservative

 

someone floats an inane argument on tv/web/radio, and the horde picks it up and runs with it

 

Many of them don’t realize it’s an inane argument. But some do. Like twa. He realizes it, the man is not stupid, he’s just messed up in the head (the worst kind of trump supporter, they know what they’re doing)

 

but that’s a distinction without a difference. They argue it with the same vigor either way. 
 

I realize this isn’t an all encompassing solution to the problem, but for the sake of your sanity my suggestion:

don’t be the dog that chases every stick thrown off the porch

 

that’s what they want you to do. Every time you chase one of their ridiculously dumb sticks they get a kick out of it and ultimately win that argument 

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mistertim

mistertim

Posted
Posted
16 minutes ago, PleaseBlitz said:

 

I mean, he has the thinnest skin of any adult I've ever seen.  

 

He accidentally said something a bit honest and revealing during his rally he had while he was being impeached; it showed how insanely insecure he is when it comes to his absolute need to be adored. 

 

Quote

But every time I see a man get up, I see a beautiful woman with a baby and they’re getting up. The baby’s going crazy and they’re getting up. They’re going to take it… But I know they’re going to be right back. And I say, “Fill those two seats. I don’t want them to see it.”

 

:ols:  "I see these beautiful people leave their seats, and I know they'll be right back, but I'm so insecure about people seeing empty seats when everyone is supposed to be worshiping me that I tell people to fill the seats immediately, because **** those people and their baby."

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mistertim

mistertim

Posted
Posted
19 minutes ago, PleaseBlitz said:

 

I mean, he has the thinnest skin of any adult I've ever seen.  

 

He accidentally said something a bit honest and revealing during his rally he had while he was being impeached; it showed how insanely insecure he is when it comes to his absolute need to be adored. 

 

Quote

But every time I see a man get up, I see a beautiful woman with a baby and they’re getting up. The baby’s going crazy and they’re getting up. They’re going to take it… But I know they’re going to be right back. And I say, “Fill those two seats. I don’t want them to see it.”

 

:ols:  "I see these beautiful people leave their seats, and I know they'll be right back, but I'm so insecure about people seeing empty seats when everyone is supposed to be worshiping me that I tell people to fill the seats immediately, because **** those people and their baby."

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Llevron

Llevron

Posted
Posted
19 minutes ago, NoCalMike said:

So are the evangelicals going to go to war with each other now?

 

We may actually get a separation of the ones that really believe it and the ones who only say they do cause reasons. Which i am fully down for.  

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No Excuses

No Excuses

Posted
  • Author
Posted
11 minutes ago, tshile said:

The “he’s not impeached because the process isn’t finished” is a microcosm what what it means to deal with the modern GOP/Republican/Conservative


To be fair to twa, it is also being said by a constitutional scholar from Harvard, who was a Dem witness during the judiciary portion of the hearings. 
 

 

But it’s a really pointless distinction. Everyone knows that articles of impeachment were passed by a majority of House. Especially when you know that the Senate will eventually have a trial after this political theatre over trial procedure is over. 

 

For a party that functions on the assumption that Americans are dweebs, such legalistic distinctions just make them sound hypocritical and desperate, especially when they disregard technical nuance for literally everything else.

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