Cousins Is The Man

[dyst]

A quietly "GREAT" year by Cousins so far. 

 

[redskins59]

Everybody needs to head over to pro football reference and check out Derek Anderson's stats. If Cousins had those numbers, he would be run out of town.

Now, Foles had a good season, but he did not play one full season. It was Chip Kelly's first year--so NFL did not know how to deal with his system. Not surprising at all. RG3's first year was not surprising at all.

So the bottomline is, gimmick systems all get figured out eventually.

On the other hand, with Cousins, we run a pro style offense. The West Coast offense is the most popular system in the NFL.

[TheGreek1973]

Totally agree with Redskins59.  People forget that Cousins was running a pro style offense in college and as for those that say I am not sold on Cousins, no problem please tell us who you are sold on.  Tell us if Cousins decides to leave next year who can run this offense better and who would be someone we can count on for the next 8-10 years.  

[BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93]

Dude, who's talking about Derek Anderson? He was never even decent if I remember correctly

[DC9]

Dude, who's talking about Derek Anderson? He was never even decent if I remember correctly

 

He made the pro bowl in Cleveland back in the day, I think.

[redskins59]

Dude, who's talking about Derek Anderson? He was never even decent if I remember correctly

People keep bringing his name up, suggesting that Cousins can follow a similar path. If not here, in other forums. He had that one decent season, and if I recall, he got a contract based on that year. However, his QB rating was terrible, he threw 19 ints. Now, he also threw 29 td's. But completion % was 56.5.

So I guess TD is not the most telling stat. In my opinion, Bortles has a bigger chamce of regressing.

[dyst]

^Regarding completion %, as a whole...isn't the league in general up when it comes to completion %?

[justice98]

Everybody, please troll Jamie Dukes.  You like that...You like that!

I take it he was not a Cousins believer?

^Regarding completion %, as a whole...isn't the league in general up when it comes to completion %?

I would say so. With the way the rules are, nobody should really be below 60%, IMO. 70% is still impressive though.

[redskins59]

^Regarding completion %, as a whole...isn't the league in general up when it comes to completion %?

True, but neither Cam Newton nor Blake Bortles have completion % above 60%..they are similar to Derek Anderson in that regard...

About that one Nick Foles season. He started hot, but by the end of the year he was clearly regressing. Cousins on the other hand started slow, but has improved compared to his first 6 or 7 games. So Cousins and Foles have followed opposite paths.

[dyst]

Regarding Cousins, it could go either way. He hasn't produced at a high level for very long. If he has another great year, no one should be surprised. If he regresses, well, no one should be surprised. 

[dahibachi]

The Redskins are not dealing from a position of strength. Cousins is the QB this franchise has needed for decades. We can't let him go. It may be another generation before we are able to groom another QB in this organization. Cousins' agent should understand this and know he is dealing from a position of strength.

We also have the cap space next year to make a sizable offer to Kirk. I'm sure his agent knows this as well.

I'm not sure that Cousins is sold on this organization and I can't say I blame him. I think Kirk has had some issues with the communication skills in the front office and the coaching staffs. I can't provide any quotes for you at the moment, but I remember him saying something about whether or not he would start a preseason game. His reply was that no one had talked to him. I also remember a recent article where his father said that there is no guarantee that Kirk will play for the Redskins long term.

Again, I don't have anything concrete, I just get the feeling that Kirk doesn't trust this organization. In my mind, all of this adds up to a franchise tag. The success he has experienced this year may give him more faith in the coaching staff, but I'm not sure that will overcome the previous 3 years he has been here.

You may be right but I think that was more just Kirk not wanting to be the backup to RG3. I think now that he is the unquestioned starter, he would prefer to stay in DC as soon as RG3 gets cut. He has even mentioned his desire to stay within the same scheme for multiple years. He won't come cheap, but hopefully that 19-20 million dollar deal will come with outs for the Redskins in the event that he regresses. I think it would actually be beneficial for both sides to do a deal like that.

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

I'm sure there is some part of Kirk that would like to stick it to the Skins. 

 

I recall a blurb from 2012 when Kirk beat the Browns and they said Dan came right into the locker room to be at Roberts side, completely ignoring Kirk and his first career win. 

 

I'm not sure if there is an actual quote or not, but there was a tweet out there the other day saying Kirk said he really appreciates Jay and Scott "standing on the table for him".  Which by many would be seen as a subtle shot at Dan/Bruce for not believing in him.  He also made comments a few times on the GP&Danny show about wanting to be where he's wanted and that he would only find that out come the offseason.

 

8 weeks ago I wouldn't have agreed with anyone that Kirk would hold all the cards and could potentially get franchise tagged.  However at this point he indeed holds all the cards and has this organization by the balls. 

[Larry]

I'll be the first to say that Cousins is playing terrific football right now, but can we please stop comparing him to established All Pro, Super Bowl and league MVP NFL Quarterbacks? The comparisons are meaningless at this point.

I do think you've got a point. (Although the folks I really want to muzzle are the "let's compare him to some HOF QB, before he became great" people.

One reason why people like Big Ben or Aaron Rogers or Tom Brady have the reputations they have, is because they've put up numbers like that FOR 10 YEARS.

I wouldn't be at all surprised if the NFL has lots of QBs who did it, for one year. And who I've never heard of.

[Larry]

....you'd think that with all of the QBs getting big deals that have built in "get out of jail free" cards recently, our fans would just trust Scott...but I guess not.

You can give a guy a big deal and still have a way out. I expect nothing different in this scenario.

With me, it's not even Scott.

IMO, whoever's been negotiating contracts for this team has been doing a good job for a few years, now.

[SkinssRvA]

I do think you've got a point. (Although the folks I really want to muzzle are the "let's compare him to some HOF QB, before he became great" people.

One reason why people like Big Ben or Aaron Rogers or Tom Brady have the reputations they have, is because they've put up numbers like that FOR 10 YEARS.

I wouldn't be at all surprised if the NFL has lots of QBs who did it, for one year. And who I've never heard of.

Would it help if we started removing names?  Here's a look at a few other QBs, in their first year starting, and what they accomplished.  Kirk's name will be represented, all others won't.

 

QB1

Completion%: 56.7  Yds: 3739  TD: 26 INT: 28 Rating: 71.2  Best Ever Completion %:68.8

 

QB2

Completion %: 62.1  Yds: 3764  TD: 28  INT: 14  Rating: 85.7  Best Ever Completion %: 68.9

 

QB3

Completion %: 56.5  Yds: 3787  TD: 29  INT: 19  Rating: 82.5  Best Ever Completion %: 56.5

 

QB4

Completion %: 63.6  Yds: 4038  TD: 28  INT: 13  Rating: 93.8  Best Ever Completion %: 68.3

 

Kirk Cousins:

Completion %: 69.5  Yds: 3990  TD: 26  INT: 11 Rating: 99.2  (one game remaining)

 

Kirk has the favorable or better stat lines than all QBs he is compared to here.  You take a look and tell me which QBs it is best to compare Kirk to and which ones it is not, and I'll reveal the names.  

[Larry]

Would it help if we started removing names?  Here's a look at a few other QBs, in their first year starting, and what they accomplished.  Kirk's name will be represented, all others won't.

 

 

Was my point too complicated for you?

Kirk has had ONE highly successful season.

Trying to compare him to quarterbacks who've posted TEN successful seasons is premature.

Hiding the names of the people you're cherry picking, or picking more than one, or using multiple colors of text or special fonts, doesn't change that.

[SkinssRvA]

Was my point too complicated for you?

Kirk has had ONE highly successful season.

Trying to compare him to quarterbacks who've posted TEN successful seasons is premature.

Hiding the names of the people you're cherry picking, or picking more than one, or using multiple colors of text or special fonts, doesn't change that.

woah buddy.  Take it easy.

 

My point maybe wasn't clear enough for you.  There are certain things good QBs do in their first year that is pretty consistent.  There are certain things flash in the pan qbs do, that is also pretty consistent.  Kirk and his statistics are closer aligned to a good QBs first season than that of flash in the pan type seasons.  

[DC9]

With me, it's not even Scott.

IMO, whoever's been negotiating contracts for this team has been doing a good job for a few years, now.

 

Eric. Schaffer. (Vice President for Football Administration).

 

One each.

 

Best in the business, sir.

[Skinsinparadise]

Regarding Cousins, it could go either way. He hasn't produced at a high level for very long. If he has another great year, no one should be surprised. If he regresses, well, no one should be surprised. 

 

I'd be surprised if he regresses.  Leading into this season it was practically a mantra about how the running game is a Qb's best friend.  It helps play action, brings in the safeties, ensures the secondary-pass rush isn't cued to the pass, etc.  And Kirk really had none of that to help.  He has a center who is lucky to even get the count right and snap the ball competently.  He didn't have his best playmaker for half the season.   And more.

 

It's not like Kirk has had a magical run of luck -- its been if anything closer to the opposite.  So on context alone, I think Kirk should be better positioned next season.  That's before even getting into the notion that he should progress as a relatively new QB, in terms of having chemistry with these playmakers, knowing the offense, etc.

 

I just listened to Kirk on 106.7.  he talked about last season studying to death other big time QB's in the league and working and improving his footwork, reads, protections, etc.  He talked about multiple guys he's worked with in the off season and how he tries to pick everybody's brain and will continue to do so.  I am sure plenty of players do the same but if you guys listen to the interview he gives off a strong vibe as a guy who at least understands he's a work in progress.   Not that it guarantees success -- but at the very least he doesn't come off as a guy who is going to get complacent in the off season.

 

I think there is a middle ground on some of the positions on the thread.  I don't think most here think the dude is Tom Brady, Peyton or Luck, etc.   But at the same time, I think most of us would agree he's had an above average season and there is plenty to be optimistic about.   And yeah of course the bigger sample, the more you can believe or not. 

 

Bottom line to me is I don't think its a far fetched argument to say Kirk who has the 7th best QB rating in the league and 7th best in QBR in his first season as a starter can indeed be one of the top 10 QBs in the league.  This season he is clearly one of the best 10 Qbs in the league so for that to be fools gold -- it would be have to be that this season was just some odd fluke.  It doesn't feel like an odd fluke to me but I guess we will see over time.

[DM72]

Stephen A and Skip were just on First Take HATING on Cousins.

You're doing something right when the haters come out.

[Cliffmark1]

Was my point too complicated for you?

Kirk has had ONE highly successful season.

Trying to compare him to quarterbacks who've posted TEN successful seasons is premature.

Hiding the names of the people you're cherry picking, or picking more than one, or using multiple colors of text or special fonts, doesn't change that.

Larry there is an expected growth of an elite qb. think of it as pattern matching. if you dump cousins now he will be deprived of two big jumps at year two and three of full seasons and youll get a quarterback who is no doubt in the wanning and least productive years of their career.

if the redskins go with rodgers brees or manning next year it will hurt the redskins and be a terrible mistake that they will get critizied for indefinitely. u drop cousins for the last years of manning or brees or rodgers and you have downgraded and deprived yourself of selling jerseys 7 years down the line or tickets since youll have to rebuild and will suck again. unless you want to cover more stadium seats u stick with cousins and do what a good organization would do.

[mistertim]

woah buddy.  Take it easy.

 

My point maybe wasn't clear enough for you.  There are certain things good QBs do in their first year that is pretty consistent.  There are certain things flash in the pan qbs do, that is also pretty consistent.  Kirk and his statistics are closer aligned to a good QBs first season than that of flash in the pan type seasons.  

And there are QBs who have had years that are better than some of the guys on that list but we don't even remember them. That's the point. I'm not saying Kirk is like that (I don't think he is) but the point is valid. You can't compare a guy with a single good season to guys with a decade of good seasons. Its way too early for that. If Kirk has another couple seasons of big time QB play then perhaps we can start comparing him to guys like Rodgers and Brady, etc.

Larry there is an expected growth of an elite qb. think of it as pattern matching. if you dump cousins now he will be deprived of two big jumps at year two and three of full seasons and youll get a quarterback who is no doubt in the wanning and least productive years of their career.

if the redskins go with rodgers brees or manning next year it will hurt the redskins and be a terrible mistake that they will get critizied for indefinitely. u drop cousins for the last years of manning or brees or rodgers and you have downgraded and deprived yourself of selling jerseys 7 years down the line or tickets since youll have to rebuild and will suck again. unless you want to cover more stadium seats u stick with cousins and do what a good organization would do.

I don't recall seeing Larry suggesting to "dump Cousins".

[armstrong001]

wasn't that Buffalo's Jim Kelly and Bebe or somebody...I watched the Bills 30 for 30 and coulda sworn that's what they said..but when youre as wrong as I am so often you get use to it..

 

 

lol isn't it sad that that is the Bill's legacy...lol their best....you don't see the Vikes making their 30 for 30 on them going 4 otta 5 years in the 70's...

 

It could have been Buffalo.  I binge watched a football life and 30 for 30 episodes over a weekend last month, and I may have gotten confused as well. 

 

I think if the Vikes had lost those games in the 80's or 90's, they might have had a show about them too.  Seems like it had the same kind of feel, a city/state with not much else going for it, a beloved team, great players who couldn't quite win in the end.  Maybe a show like they are doing with Dallas/San Fran comparing the two would've been cool.

 

I do feel bad about those Bills teams though.  So many great players, the truly were some amazing teams.  I kind of wish they had won at least one of the other three Superbowls they lost (not against the Skins of course!). 

[Cliffmark1]

i think Larry is laying out the argument for the organization to go for a big star qb who will not be as good as cousins, here.

really i bet the wheels are turning in some minds that cousins will cost as much as a star qb and we should just get a wanning star instead.

[wit33]

I would agree with what a few have posted about in regards to Cousins being non committal with the Skins. This is the unfortunate part of sports these days, athletes trying to leverage for more money when in position of power. Cousins attitude towards Skins seems to surly and one of, I told you and why did it take you so long... Now pay me a kings Ransome.

Nothing major and I believe it will all get sorted out in the offseason. It will be nice when Cousins has security of long-term contract and happy with front office.