DiscoBob Posted September 28, 2014 Share Posted September 28, 2014 Neither one is someone I'd consider a "premium" pass rusher. I'm just not sure what else 98 has to do to prove to everyone that he's average and 91 is inconsistent. I'm sure you could get a 3rd or a 4th for each in the right situation. I totally agree that Orakpo is not a premium pass rusher. I've been very satisfied with Kerrigan. BUT...you are greatly undervaluing them as trade bait. I bet Kerrigan would easily get you a first. The only reason Orakpo probably wouldn't is that he is on a one year deal and wants big money. Instead we tanked it last year for the Rams to get our #2 overall. Yeah, how many of those anti suck for luck fans are happy now that Grossman got extra 2-3 meaningless wins in 2011? Amen - this pissed me off, even when RGIII was lighting it up his 1st year. We were so close to getting him without having to trade up, but we got a few moral (hollow) victories that people forgot about 2 weeks later...in exchange for 3-4 years of having mediocre talent.....YEAH! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC9 Posted September 28, 2014 Share Posted September 28, 2014 I totally agree that Orakpo is not a premium pass rusher. I've been very satisfied with Kerrigan. BUT...you are greatly undervaluing them as trade bait. I bet Kerrigan would easily get you a first. The only reason Orakpo probably wouldn't is that he is on a one year deal and wants big money. When we tagged Orakpo we made it public that he could seek a trade. No one bit. Now, it wasn't 100%, but our insiders hinted that we would take a 2nd round pick for Orakpo. He's still here. I really don't want to make this about Orakpo. He isn't the REASON we suck, but he is getting the big money and isn't earning it. So he's high on my **** list. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knowledge316 Posted September 28, 2014 Share Posted September 28, 2014 Wish we would have tanked the season 2 years ago like the Colts did, no king's ransom to the Rams and I bet we would have drafted the offensive line to protect Robert. Teams don't need 5 1st rounders to protect their QB. This organization have drafted 5 OL in past few years in the top 3 rounds. Trent Williams was top 5, Rinehart (3rd, starting for Chargers), LeRibs (3rd, 3rd yr and still a backup), Long (3rd), and Moses (3rd). Those are fairly high picks for guards. It's piss poor player development and/or scouting department. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FrFan Posted September 28, 2014 Share Posted September 28, 2014 Teams don't need 5 1st rounders to protect their QB. This organization have drafted 5 OL in past few years in the top 3 rounds. Trent Williams was top 5, Rinehart (3rd, starting for Chargers), LeRibs (3rd, 3rd yr and still a backup), Long (3rd), and Moses (3rd). Those are fairly high picks for guards. It's piss poor player development and/or scouting department. Didn't mean to draft all of the OL in the first round Mitchell Schwartz was available in the 2nd round of the 2012 draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinpride1 Posted September 28, 2014 Share Posted September 28, 2014 I agree but the front office needs to learn to build the correct way...An example would be the secondary how to you fix it...well duh freaking huh.. do you think getting some large fast corners might do the trick and actually drafting and getting a good safety?? Trading older players for draft picks because a certain #98 comes to mind ..when is the last time this team traded a player for a second round pick?? Tyler P. has been sucking at right tackle..put moses in there and see what he can do..im willing to bet he will perform better!!...bone head moves sums this franchise up!!! Until the front office can get it right than its just going to be the same around here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taylor703 Posted September 28, 2014 Share Posted September 28, 2014 Why is Trent Murphy on this team? Rob Jackson was better, fairly cheap, and we had much bigger needs along the offensive line. We had needs on both lines and basically wasted our second round pick. I like Murphy, hes a high-character, hardworker but the reality is we had major issues everywhere but pass rusher. Not to mention if you're going to draft a pass rusher what was the point of tagging Rak? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rufus T Firefly Posted September 28, 2014 Share Posted September 28, 2014 Didn't mean to draft all of the OL in the first round Mitchell Schwartz was available in the 2nd round of the 2012 draft. I really like Schwartz in that draft, but he's been fairly awful as a pro. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumbo Posted September 28, 2014 Share Posted September 28, 2014 Instead we tanked it last year for the Rams to get our #2 overall. Yeah, how many of those anti suck for luck fans are happy now that Grossman got extra 2-3 meaningless wins in 2011? I'll give you my response---as both an emotional and considered reaction, I personally lean towards temp bans to posters that advocate trying to deliberately throw games and that players and coaches give less than their possible maximum effort to win every game played (allowing for the occasional calling for it as a venting comment). I don't push such as a policy as it is arguably too restrictive to "reasonable" (always the debate) expression, and while it doesn't affect my stance, I wouldn't welcome the fact that some posters I really like, including one I consider a personal friend, would be eligible. But for a place called "extremeskins", and what that means to me, and given what my values are in these matters, I think it's the ultimate suck for a fan to advocate such. However, there are many types of people who consider themselves fans with many types of personalities, values, and views. So if one feels that coexistence is preferable (spell check tried to make that "insufferable" ) to censure in this case, enjoy. Now let me make it very clear that I don't need it ("why tanking") explained to me. I get it, and totally reject it with extreme dislike. If I ever was enjoying some sign of serious team success, and were to know that some of the reason for it came for a "deliberately tanking" strategy, that would upset me more than the "regular" losing crap. That's when I would feel the most disgrace and shame for the organization, well beyond what I feel about the constant football incompetence and various just dumbass shenanigans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rufus T Firefly Posted September 28, 2014 Share Posted September 28, 2014 Not sure I've ever seen anyone suggest players should "try to lose". More accurately, I guess, I don't know that anyone who should be taken remotely seriously has ever said that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumbo Posted September 28, 2014 Share Posted September 28, 2014 Not sure I've ever seen anyone suggest players should "try to lose". Seriously? That's your comment in reply? Do I really need to elaborate for clarity for you? Jesus, I don't know why I bother, which is why I rarely do anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taylor703 Posted September 28, 2014 Share Posted September 28, 2014 Getting rid of Trent Williams, a 26-year old elite left tackle to try and possibly find another elite left tackle is silly. It's as silly as pretending Morris isn't an elite RB when he is. He has a fumbling issue but several RBs have proven this is correctable. If you're considering trading away talent you trade guys like Reed, Cousins, Helu, Orakpo etc. Players where you have other viable options on your roster. If you don't want to pay Rak than see what you can get for him, even if it's a third or fourth rounder, just take it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumbo Posted September 28, 2014 Share Posted September 28, 2014 Not sure I've ever seen anyone suggest players should "try to lose". More accurately, I guess, I don't know that anyone who should be taken remotely seriously has ever said that. Listen, you put those words in quotes and they are words that I didn't use like that---what i'm saying is plain as day. You really think, and want to contend, that I don't understand what's been said on this board on this matter? Jesus. You best check yourself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rufus T Firefly Posted September 28, 2014 Share Posted September 28, 2014 posters that advocate trying to deliberately throw games and that players and coaches give less than their possible maximum effort to win every game played (allowing for the occasional calling for it as a venting comment). Maybe I shouldn't have put "trying to lose" in quotes because that isn't literally what you said, but it sure seems the same. During the 2011 season I was clear that I wanted us to lose, and I had many conversations with plenty of well known posters hear who had the same view. None of us wanted players to not give their all, and in fact most, if not all, of us specifically said that here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumbo Posted September 28, 2014 Share Posted September 28, 2014 Maybe I shouldn't have put "trying to lose" in quotes because that isn't literally what you said, but it sure seems the same. During the 2011 season I was clear that I wanted us to lose, and I had many conversations with plenty of well known posters hear who had the same view. None of us wanted players to not give their all, and in fact most, if not all, of us specifically said that here. I know of all the many different types of views represented, including the ones you refer to--and then there are the ones I refer to, that you seem to be unaware of, as well the fact the that numerous posters often "mixed" various tanking sentiments. Now i'm done with you. I know this board far better than you. That has nothing to do with differing opinions on topics--and if you need that claim explained, forget it. And if you don't buy it, that's fine too. My post addressed well-established activity on this site that anyone not trying to be oppositional or just a dip**** would find virtually impossible to argue, particularly during the suck for luck days. Site-wise, you're not even in remotely the same position to know all there is to know about posts related to anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TK Posted September 28, 2014 Share Posted September 28, 2014 As a REDSKINS fan womb-to-the-tomb I'm SO stealing that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FrFan Posted September 28, 2014 Share Posted September 28, 2014 I really like Schwartz in that draft, but he's been fairly awful as a pro. Are you sure about that ? "Schwartz started slowly in each of his first two years, but improved as the seasons unfurled. ProFootballFocus.com rated Schwartz as the league’s 11th-best right tackle who started at least 15 games at the position." Link Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thekyle1591 Posted September 28, 2014 Share Posted September 28, 2014 Are you sure about that ? "Schwartz started slowly in each of his first two years, but improved as the seasons unfurled. ProFootballFocus.com rated Schwartz as the league’s 11th-best right tackle who started at least 15 games at the position." Link Gave up 11 sacks last year lmao. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rufus T Firefly Posted September 28, 2014 Share Posted September 28, 2014 Are you sure about that ? "Schwartz started slowly in each of his first two years, but improved as the seasons unfurled. ProFootballFocus.com rated Schwartz as the league’s 11th-best right tackle who started at least 15 games at the position." Link Behind such heavyweights as Tyler Polumbus and Justin Pugh. There's a reason the link you provided was about speculation they'd move him to G. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedskinsInFebruary Posted September 28, 2014 Share Posted September 28, 2014 Teams don't need 5 1st rounders to protect their QB. This organization have drafted 5 OL in past few years in the top 3 rounds. Trent Williams was top 5, Rinehart (3rd, starting for Chargers), LeRibs (3rd, 3rd yr and still a backup), Long (3rd), and Moses (3rd). Those are fairly high picks for guards. It's piss poor player development and/or scouting department. It's definitely something. I doubt anything will substantially change until we acquire (or develop, or both) an NFL OL. It's sickening Jerry Jones understands this better than we do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinfan2k Posted September 28, 2014 Share Posted September 28, 2014 I will only like this if we try to develop our players. instead we trot Tyler, Chester out there and get no growth out of young ins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted September 28, 2014 Share Posted September 28, 2014 We had needs on both lines and basically wasted our second round pick. I like Murphy, hes a high-character, hardworker but the reality is we had major issues everywhere but pass rusher. Not to mention if you're going to draft a pass rusher what was the point of tagging Rak? I think we could have gotten him later in the draft and he wasn't a need. If we are going to give these QBs the best chance to succeed the place to start is the OLine. People saying the only issue is RT apparently haven't seen our guards and centers shoved into RG3's face at the snap of the ball. Even Cousins who likes to step into the pocket started setting up further back against the giant and not stepping into his throws. Bitonio made more sense in the second round. I'd like to see this team have the kind of line that made the Patriots successful. The only reason Tom Brady has had a long career is because for most of it, all he needed to do to have 5 seconds was move a few feet to help his blockers. Now that his line isn't so good, the Pats offense is struggling. Draft RG3 a center that can hold his ground against a nose tackle and a guard that can push a defensive tackle into the frustrated linebacker behind him. We built this team backwards and found the skill positions on offense first. Getting rid of Trent Williams, a 26-year old elite left tackle to try and possibly find another elite left tackle is silly. It's as silly as pretending Morris isn't an elite RB when he is. He has a fumbling issue but several RBs have proven this is correctable. If you're considering trading away talent you trade guys like Reed, Cousins, Helu, Orakpo etc. Players where you have other viable options on your roster. If you don't want to pay Rak than see what you can get for him, even if it's a third or fourth rounder, just take it. His fumbling issue is a bit exaggerated IMO. The example that keeps coming up is Tiki Barber, who corrected it, but look at Tiki's fumble numbers before the correction. Morris has 4 and 5 in his two years. (only 1 this year and people are losing their minds over it). Tiki had a 4 year span where he had 9, 8, 9, and 9. So he essentially fumbled twice as much as Morris for twice as long. Teams don't need 5 1st rounders to protect their QB. This organization have drafted 5 OL in past few years in the top 3 rounds. Trent Williams was top 5, Rinehart (3rd, starting for Chargers), LeRibs (3rd, 3rd yr and still a backup), Long (3rd), and Moses (3rd). Those are fairly high picks for guards. It's piss poor player development and/or scouting department. Weren't we drafting lighter and faster zone blocking lineman? I thought Shanahan was under the impression that he could get lineman cheap because his system favored the guys that other teams thought were too small and weak and that he could over come that with his offensive x's and o's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
respectgibbs Posted September 28, 2014 Share Posted September 28, 2014 It was a fun season folks! Interesting for 4 weeks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted September 28, 2014 Share Posted September 28, 2014 I'm SO stealing that. I think it's been used before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FrFan Posted September 28, 2014 Share Posted September 28, 2014 Gave up 11 sacks last year lmao. Polumbus already gave up 6 in 4 games Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibbs Hog Heaven Posted September 28, 2014 Share Posted September 28, 2014 I'm SO stealing that. Well Hell. I've had 'Redskin from cradle to grave' for years and you've said nada. Now he jumps on the bandwagon with his rhymey 'womb-to-tomb' you're all over it. You've CHANGED Boss Man since you started hanging out with Sonny! Humoh! Hail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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