The Official QB Thread- JD5 taken #2. Randall 2.0 or Bayou Bob? Mariotta and Hartman forever. Fromm cut

[FootballZombie]

4 minutes ago, Conn said:

Saying we paid more than we had to to still get him is irrational given the information we have about other teams pursuing a trade as well,

 

I have evidence to support my claims. I'm good w/ them.

 

I'm not building an argument on the hope that mystery team X offered two threes.

Even if that was true, nobody has evidence of such, which means your arguing me w/ next to nothing.

[Skinsinparadise]

Granted this is from long ago.  But Carson is about 2:1 Wins-losses versus the NFC East.

 

 

 

[SpacePenguin]

I'm like 99% sure that the Colts are going to use our higher 2nd rounder on a QB that will be someone the Commies had interest in, probably Ridder or Strong. This QB will become successful there, and we'll all look back at this trade with hatred.

 

Hahahaha, its too Redskins to not happen.

Edited March 10, 2022 by SpacePenguin

[oraphus]

2 minutes ago, SpacePenguin said:

I'm like 99% sure that the Colts are going to use our higher 2nd rounder on a QB that will be someone the Commies had interest in, probably Ridder or Strong. This QB will become successful there, and we'll all look back at this trade with hatred.

 

Hahahaha, its too Redskins to not happen.

yeah... because Colts have a history of hitting on QBs  🙄

[Skinsinparadise]

I am glad we aren't swimming in this pool anymore with the exception of Carr but keep hearing Carr isn't being traded

 

 

 

[Burgold]

 

The acquisition of Carson Wentz isn’t going to sell jerseys or tickets. So, that means this is a football move and not a marketing move.

 

As I said yesterday, it feels more like a lemonade move than a desperation move. I think Rivera and the front office decided this was their best non-marquee guy and that they needed to get it done. 
 

The salary cap hit hurts a bit, but it’s foolish to think you can get a starter at backup money. I think the draft pick cost is okay. 

 

[Koolblue13]

8 minutes ago, SpacePenguin said:

I'm like 99% sure that the Colts are going to use our higher 2nd rounder on a QB that will be someone the Commies had interest in, probably Ridder or Strong. This QB will become successful there, and we'll all look back at this trade with hatred.

 

Hahahaha, its too Redskins to not happen.

The Colts are a worse off organization with a worse owner than we are. It wasn't just Wentz leaving. They had 2 pretty good Offensive lineman refuse to resign and their TE just retired, The players are pretty unhappy they dealt Wentz. Reich blows. He had one lucky year thanks mostly to Wentz.

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

12 minutes ago, FootballZombie said:

 

I have evidence to support my claims. I'm good w/ them.

 

I'm not building an argument on the hope that mystery team X offered two threes.

Even if that was true, nobody has evidence of such, which means your arguing me w/ next to nothing.

It's funny that all in one post, you say that you have evidence to support your claim, but the opposition has none.  You literally have no evidence.  You have some dude from overthecap's opinion. 😂

 

[Skinsinparadise]

Not that I typically agree with Cowherd

 

 

 

[goskins10]

9 minutes ago, FootballZombie said:

 

 

My position is based on knowing exactly what our starting offer was and exactly what our final offer was.

 

My position is also further booned by numerous people who do this for a living that don't understand how Wentz yielded such a return. There are numerous postings out there alluding to such, but if you want an example, here you go.

 

 

https://overthecap.com/carson-wentz-traded-to-washington/

"From Washington’s standpoint this is a hard trade to wrap my head around if the reports of them taking on the contract as is are accurate. This is the second time in two years that Wentz has been traded and it seemed clear that the Colts were likely going to release him to avoid having to pay him his full salary. To give up picks and relieve the Colts of a $15 million obligation for a QB who is probably worth $10 million on the open market is crazy."

 

"This is basically a heist for the Colts who more or less admitted that they made a mistake by trading for Wentz last February."

 

 

 

Your position is currently based on what you think another team many have been offering. Your not arguing me w/ any kind of concrete evidense, just what you think is out there to support your narrative.

 

 

 

Both positions are from a place of very little knowledge. None of us know right now who else was involved and how much they offered. So the comment you quoted is worthless as they have no idea either, especially what they think he is worth on the open market - if he even hits the open market. All mind numbing speculation with no facts to support it. What we do know if there were other teams interested and bidding. So saying he hits the open market and speculating what he would demand in terms of salary is especially stupid. Of the QBs they had targeted based on pretty reliable sources, Wentz was probably the best option, and this coming from someone who does NOT like Wentz. 

 

Rodgers - Not available

Wilson - Seattle not trading in the conference and Wilson did not want to come here. 

Wentz

Garoppolo - He will cost more than Wentz if they move him, which I am nto sure SF will. 

Trubistky - at least $10 for a much lesser QB in terms of ability - and words he is at least a little bit of a head case too. 

 

And the CAP thing is such a non-issue. They can get CAP if they want it. They can restructure his deal, add 1 yr guaranteed, spread this years salary out as signing bonus with 2 or 3 voidable years and you get $20M quickly with only one more year commitment to Wentz. 

 

And people keep ignoring that this gets us out of settling for a QB in this years draft and gets us to next years draft that is much deeper at QB. 

 

 

[Skinsinparadise]

I forgot to mention one of the Indy reporters in the interviews I listented to said he believes Carson has to be stunned on how this all went down.  He was suggesting that if he needed a wake up call, this is it.

 

The thought is if this doesn't motivate Carson, nothing else probably will.  Also based on other things said by others, Carson is a really driven guy so hopefully he's fired up coming into this season.

Edited March 10, 2022 by Skinsinparadise

[Inigo Montoya]

1 minute ago, goskins10 said:

 

 

Trubistky - at least $10 for a much lesser QB in terms of ability - and words he is at least a little bit of a head case too. 

 

 

 

 

Weren't there rumors of Mitch commanding $20mil on the open market?? Took me a second, but this scenario is actually pretty cool. My hope is we make some cap moves, restructuring Terry, a safety and LB would go a long way for entering the draft being able to do whatever we want. 

[FootballZombie]

3 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

It's funny that all in one post, you say that you have evidence to support your claim, but the opposition has none.  You literally have no evidence.  You have some dude from overthecap's opinion.

 

First one I came across. I was asked for something showing that viewpoint and I provided it.

 

Feel free to parse Google and find a 100 more touting similar rhetoric if you so desire.

You can almost throw a dart against and map and find similar sentiment to what I have been saying. Its not a wild or even uncommon take.

[SoCalSkins]

13 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

Granted this is from long ago.  But Carson is about 2:1 Wins-losses versus the NFC East.

 

 

 

People seem to have amnesia man. The dude has played at a very high level in the NFL including much of last year. He was a jerk for not getting the vaccine and probably cost his team a playoff berth as a result and their aging owner who guaranteed 3 Super Bowls this decade to his fan base acted irrationally and was done with him.  
 

But to paint Wentz as some sort of scrub is crazy. The guy was literally throwing to his Indy teammates a few hours before the trade. He has a very strong arm, great decision maker while not shying away from risk, is elusive in the pocket and puts in a ton of film study and work.  Best QB we have had in a very very long time and people are saying we gave up too much. It’s crazy talk. By week 4 or at latest 8 people here are going to say it was one of the best moves the franchise has made. 

[goskins10]

1 minute ago, Inigo Montoya said:

 

Weren't there rumors of Mitch commanding $20mil on the open market?? Took me a second, but this scenario is actually pretty cool. My hope is we make some cap moves, restructuring Terry, a safety and LB would go a long way for entering the draft being able to do whatever we want. 

 

I never heard $20M but that just means I did not hear it. You could very well be right. QBs get paid a lot and it goes up seemingly exponentially. I think once we see some of the thier QB dominos fall we may look at this as a much more reasonable deal than it looks like right now.  

Just now, FootballZombie said:

 

First one I came across. I was asked for something showing that viewpoint and I provided it.

 

Feel free to parse Google and find a 100 more touting similar rhetoric if you so desire.

You can almost throw a dart against and map and find similar sentiment to what I have been saying. Its not a wild or even uncommon take.

 

 

But it is all sentiment and take not factual. Need to be clear. And yes in fairness the "other" side has no more data. But saying you have evidence and quote nothing more than talking heads does not validate your position. 

 

Last but not least, it would not by a long shot be the first time the popular narrative is totally wrong. In fact it's wrong a lot. 

[SoCalSkins]

2 minutes ago, goskins10 said:

 

I never heard $20M but that just means I did not hear it. You could very well be right. QBs get paid a lot and it goes up seemingly exponentially. I think once we see some of the thier QB dominos fall we may look at this as a much more reasonable deal than it looks like right now.  

Rodgers is getting $50M per year. A starting QB making 40% of the top of the market is fairly reasonable. It’s where the market is now. 

[Voice_of_Reason]

1 hour ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

 

 

I think Haskins was the last Dan Snyder move.

 

The one before that was Landon Collins. Though that could have been mostly Bruce.  Or some combination of the two of them. 

 

I'm not sure if Norman was Dan or Bruce, or both.  But it had Dan Snyder tendencies.  

 

Alex Smith was 100% Bruce trying to save face for screwing up completely the Cousins trade negotiations.

 

Bruce and Dan were the driving force behind the Griffin trade, Shanahan supported it. 

 

Dan was also behind the McNugget trade.  

 

Unless I'm missing one, that's it this decade.  

 

The 2000's were very different, but Dan was the defacto GM operating through Vinny. 

13 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

Not that I typically agree with Cowherd

I just typically refuse to acknowledge his existence.  

[lovemaskins]

10 minutes ago, Inigo Montoya said:

 

Weren't there rumors of Mitch commanding $20mil on the open market?? Took me a second, but this scenario is actually pretty cool. My hope is we make some cap moves, restructuring Terry, a safety and LB would go a long way for entering the draft being able to do whatever we want. 

I’d love to sign Bobby Wagner and restructure some of our guys like Payne and McKissic.  Then add another young linebacker at 11…

 

Dan is seducing me all over over again…

 

[Warhead36]

Yeah the Snyder move would have been like five first rounders for Russel Wilson.

[Koolblue13]

3 minutes ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

I think Haskins was the last Dan Snyder move.

 

The one before that was Landon Collins. Though that could have been mostly Bruce.  Or some combination of the two of them. 

 

I'm not sure if Norman was Dan or Bruce, or both.  But it had Dan Snyder tendencies.  

 

Alex Smith was 100% Bruce trying to save face for screwing up completely the Cousins trade negotiations.

 

Bruce and Dan were the driving force behind the Griffin trade, Shanahan supported it. 

 

Dan was also behind the McNugget trade.  

 

Unless I'm missing one, that's it this decade.  

 

The 2000's were very different, but Dan was the defacto GM operating through Vinny. 

I really think Haskins was the last one and Ron let them know it.

 

The Colts just shot themselves in the foot because of a bad irrational owner forcing the GMs hand and we benefited from it.

 

Amazing times we're living in.

[Conn]

37 minutes ago, FootballZombie said:

 

 

My position is based on knowing exactly what our starting offer was and exactly what our final offer was.

 

That’s how negotiating works, especially when other teams are involved. You start low and negotiate up until it’s enough. You realize how bizarre it is that our opening offer was even leaked to the public? That never happens for any trade, ever. Do you think that’s because the Colts FO needs to do everything possible to make it look like a miracle that they got what they got for Wentz seeing as their fans are looking at a draft with no 1st round pick AND no Wentz to show for it? Think about it critically.

 

 

37 minutes ago, FootballZombie said:

 

My position is also further booned by numerous people who do this for a living that don't understand how Wentz yielded such a return.

 

Because it hadn’t been reported yet for sure that there was competition. There was. 

[SoCalSkins]

3 minutes ago, lovemaskins said:

I’d love to sign Bobby Wagner and restructure some of our guys like Payne and McKissic.  Then add another young linebacker at 11…

 

Dan is seducing me all over over again…

 

Wagner needs to be the priority along with Amari Cooper. We can spend whatever on those two and we still get a 3rd round compensatory pick for Scherff. Cut players are exempt from the formula determining comp picks. 

[Inigo Montoya]

13 minutes ago, goskins10 said:

 

I never heard $20M but that just means I did not hear it. You could very well be right. QBs get paid a lot and it goes up seemingly exponentially. I think once we see some of the thier QB dominos fall we may look at this as a much more reasonable deal than it looks like right now.  

 

 

I swore I read that somewhere, but a quick search validates your numbers. Regardless, QBs are expensive and Mitch ain't worth $10mil

 

From PFF:

 

"Teams are openly discussing whether Trubisky gets $10 million or more annually on a new deal," Fowler said. "That his name is a hot one is not manufactured. It's real. ... [T]eams that will look to draft a quarterback could sign Trubisky to start this year."

[Conn]

35 minutes ago, FootballZombie said:

 

I have evidence to support my claims. I'm good w/ them.

 

I'm not building an argument on the hope that mystery team X offered two threes.

Even if that was true, nobody has evidence of such, which means your arguing me w/ next to nothing.

?? You’re arguing with and presenting as “evidence” opinion pieces that do not include the reporting that we had concrete competition. You have literally nothing but the hot take opinions of people whose job it is to publish an instant reaction and get you riled up. And they did. 

[Darrell Green Fan]

23 hours ago, Mrshadow008 said:

I dont know whether Watson is innocent or guilty. I'm not defending Watson just pointing out some of the "coincidences" on the other side of this equation.

 1) not one woman came forward until after he demanded trade
2)Tony Buzzbee is admitted Texans super Fan, STH, and former neighbor to the Texans owner
3) none of these women went to the police UNTIL AFTER 21 women had come forward, Buzzbee made multiple statements saying they wouldnt be going to police and then people started loudly questioning why they would not file police reports

4) the team supposedly were the ones providing Watson with NDAS so guess who wouldve most likely known who these women were and what was going on.
5) out of the 22 women in the civil case only 8 filed police reports and cooperated with investigation
6) DA took 7 months to decide whether they even had enough to bring it in front of grand jury despite having 8 women, phone records, access to his social media, cash app etc.
7) Up until this point he has refused to settle in the civil cases even though it probably wouldve been the easy thing to do
8 ) Texans are literally about to pay the man 40 million to sit on the bench because they won’t release him and asking for a kings ransom despite everything hanging over his head most teams wouldve distanced themselves as quickly as humanly possible
9) Jack easterby texans president is by all accounts the Texans version of Bruce Allen
10) The Mcnair family has been accused of racism on more than 1 occasion 

11) By any and all accounts Watson was a model citizen up until this point.

And before anybody attacks me Im not defending Watson nor am I saying hes innocent idk. Like I said all I'm saying lets look at all sides of this before just saying well its 22 women so he must be guilty. I just dont think its as simple as some make it out to be. 

 

Dear Lord are we really doing this again?