2022 Comprehensive Draft Thread

[skinny21]

@Voice_of_Reason  I have a fairly similar take on DT.  I might slightly disagree that “they didn’t like Settle”, but that’s based on my (possibly faulty) recollection that they wanted a chance to make an offer after he tested the market.  I have no idea if they opted not to try to match what Buffalo offered, if Settle simply liked Buffalo more (and a chance at a ring or more snaps), or maybe he just didn’t like Mills?

 

There are/were a bunch of factors in that whole process though and it clouds things enough that I’m not willing to necessarily believe they reached/panicked, nor that they made the right call.  It’s in the air for me.

 

Some of the factors:

Io (seemingly) had some issues with Mills 

Io never really regained his early form

Io was quite pricey for his contributions (and I’m guessing the FO has a plan for the money they saved cutting him)

Settle never really showed all that much for us - I do think he outplayed his draft status, but he was also only taking around 20% of snaps

Settle was a FA, had options and we don’t really know his thought process, or the FO’s mindset about him

Payne and Allen got a bunch of snaps (Payne in particular - about 75%)

Winfrey was seen as a viable option in the 2nd by many on here, but we brought him in for a visit (and as RR said, a lot of times that is to answer questions the FO has about a player), and then picked Mathis ahead of him

Travis was seen as the better prospect by most, but that’s not how the FO had their board - I have to wonder if competition level played a heavy hand here

The team needs to have a pipeline of talent for each position, as well as an eye toward succession planning.  No telling if Mathis will have success here, but he’s a clear step in that direction.

Impossible for us to fully judge the FO’s thinking here IMO - did they like Mathis’ value more because they saw a bigger drop off in DT talent later in the draft vs the drop off for other positions of need?  Or did they indeed “force the pick”?  Not sure it’s possible for us to know for sure.

 

If Mathis works out, he can help keep Payne fresh, can handle snaps in place of Allen as well, can soak up double teams to 1) keep our backers clean and 2) to impact the run game (thereby giving our pass rushers more chances to pin their ears back), and he can (as he showed in college) get the clean up sacks.  For better or worse, as a senior coming from Alabama, he’s likely facing a much quicker transition to the pros than some of the other options.

 

Long story short, I’m not arguing that this is a great pick, or the right pick, but given all of those factors, I can’t ding the FO for the pick just yet either.

[The Consigliere]

19 hours ago, evmiii said:

If one of your offensive goals it to have a QB2 with a similar skill set as your QB1, we are much closer to that with Howell than Taylor H.  
 

Two scenarios I can envision.

 

Scenario #1.  QB#1 (Wentz) plays up to his potential, everybody contributes and the world is good.  QB#2(Heinecke) plays a the primary backup all season.  QB#3(Howell) is inactive all year.  QB#2’s contact expires and he takes his pockets full of cash back to ODU to finish his degree.  QB#1 signs 3 year extension for bags of money, QB#3 becomes QB#2.
 

Scenario #2.  Based on Washington’s recent history, QB#1(Wentz) and QB#2(Heinecke) will start the season on the active roster.  QB#3(Howell) will be on the roster but not active on game day.  QB#1 plays pretty good until week 4 and he breaks a finger on his throwing hand and is out for six weeks.  QB#2 starts game five, QB#3 now active as backup.  QB#2 plays pretty good for one game until he breaks his collarbone trying to get an extra yard when he is still four yards short of the third down.  QB#2 is out for the season.  QB#3 is now the starter and  QB#4(TBD) is the backup.  QB#3 plays pretty good until QB#1 gets healthy and returns on week 10.  Now we have a true QB controversy.  QB#1 returns to starter, but is replaced in week fifteen by QB#3.  QB#3 finishes the season as the starter.  QB#1’s and QB#2’s contracts expire and do not return.  QB#3 opens next year as the starter.

 

I am really hoping for scenario #2.

It’s so easy to envision that.

[Warhead36]

If Wentz plays up to his potential, his TRUE potential, we're talking top 10 QB and we're probably contenders in the NFC. You take that everytime. 

[rexxonator]

52 minutes ago, Cooleyfan1993 said:

….huh? Mayhew didn’t tweet anything lol 😂 that wasn’t his tweet.  Pete hailey tweeted that. 

exactly - this was a quote from the press conference after we made our last pick and before the 7th round ended

[Skinsinparadise]

A draft can't fulfill every need.  I was more offense obsessed than defense obsessed before this draft.  

 

Before the draft, I didn't think they'd pull all 3 maybe even all 4 of my desires on offense.  Another viable TE.  A big time WR.  A big time RB-B to play with Gibson.  But they did.  They hit all three of these goals.  My other desire was an OG.  i don't know about Paul.  But who knows?  A big athletic OG with Masko coaching him up?  You never know.

 

I'd have loved a backup QB with starter potential but didn't think we had the luxury of doing that in this draft, yet we did thanks to a trade back.    On offense to me its an A plus draft.  they covered all basis IMO with the cherry on top.

 

On defense, they didn't accomplish as much.  Some are just assuming that Butler can't play but maybe he can?  Matthis shores up the depth issue on the D line.

 

As for big nickel, Keim mentioned predraft if they don't land one they'd chase Collins.  Will see.  They need to add depth at LB.  But I can't fault them for not having one draft that addresses EVERY need.  that's impossible.  But they covered more ground than I expected. 

 

 

 

Edited May 1, 2022 by Skinsinparadise

[Burgold]

Some fans just want to be angry. The good news is the team gives them plenty of reasons to be, but for some that's not good enough. They have to go through the spin cycle, too.

[Anselmheifer]

9 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

A draft can't fulfill every need.  I was more offense obsessed than defense obsessed before this draft.  

 

Before the draft, I didn't think they'd pull all 3 maybe even all 4 of my desires on offense.  Another viable TE.  A big time WR.  A big time RB-B to play with Gibson.  But they did.  They hit all three of these goals.  My other desire was an OG.  i don't know about Paul.  But who knows?  A big athletic OG with Masko coaching him up?  You never know.

 

I'd have loved a backup QB with starter potential but didn't think we had the luxury of doing that in this draft, yet we did thanks to a trade back.    On offense to me its an A plus draft.  they covered all basis IMO with the cherry on top.

 

On defense, they didn't accomplish as much.  Some are just assuming that Butler can't play but maybe he can?  Matthis shores up the depth issue on the D line.

 

As for big nickel, Keim mentioned predraft if they don't land one they'd chase Collins.  Will see.  They need to add depth at LB.  But I can't fault them for not having one draft that addresses EVERY need.  that's impossible.  But they covered more ground than I expected. 

 

 

 

Would love a Collins return. The defense was better with him last year and I don’t think we have anyone better to fill his spot. 
 

Im not super satisfied with this draft. The second round reach kind of ruins it for me when there were potential impact players still available. 
 

Still, I didn’t like the Cam Kurl or Terry McLaurin picks, so I’ll give it a chance. 
 

If we resign Collins and add some IOL depth on FA, and maybe a LB, then I think we’ll be going into the season with a better roster on offense and defense, and that doesn’t even factor in the likelihood that we will be healthier and the upgrade at QB. 
 

I do find it irritating how much better I like what the Eagles and Giants were able to do. Both teams added at least two potential stars, IMO.

[RWJ]

23 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

A draft can't fulfill every need.  I was more offense obsessed than defense obsessed before this draft.  

 

Before the draft, I didn't think they'd pull all 3 maybe even all 4 of my desires on offense.  Another viable TE.  A big time WR.  A big time RB-B to play with Gibson.  But they did.  They hit all three of these goals.  My other desire was an OG.  i don't know about Paul.  But who knows?  A big athletic OG with Masko coaching him up?  You never know.

 

So true, but they may bring back Daryl Williams who played for RR in Carolina and is still a decent right side OG or OT, probably better at OG now.  

[Simmsy]

29 minutes ago, Burgold said:

Some fans just want to be angry. The good news is the team gives them plenty of reasons to be, but for some that's not good enough. They have to go through the spin cycle, too.

 

I don't know anything about these college players, I can't tell you who is good and who sucks, I don't have the knowledge on that one. However, I can say what positions I think this teams needs to fill and I believe they did a great job. So many people on this board are holding this team to "hypotheticals" and "dream scenarios". "If we hadn't traded down, the other team would've picked this guy and we would've picked that guy and I can see into the future and know this guy is going to be better". There has been a lot of ****ing in this thread, ut this is also the most excited I've seen fans of this team during the draft since...we took RG3.

 

We won't ultimately know until these guys start playing, so I'm just going to keep my mouth shut until then. I'll let the other guys do all the fussing, seems like so many are going to do that anyways.

 

I give them a "B" for their draft grade.

[sebestian]

7 hours ago, KDawg said:

Why do you like Brisker?

 

I watched him twice and came to the conclusion he stinks. Maybe I didn’t watch the right games, though? What does Brisker do that makes passing over him a mistake?

 

Huts like a truck.  Has good coverage skills.  Better n the box safety, and based on our percentages in which we use the buffalo nickel, my conclusion was that he would be ideally suited to take that roll that Collins was good at last year.  Personal bias, I simply like him (full disclosure)  I do not watch games like you, but specific to our defensive scheme I think he is ideal.

 

But again, I did not watch games.

[Koolblue13]

1 minute ago, sebestian said:

 

Huts like a truck.  Has good coverage skills.  Better n the box safety, and based on our percentages in which we use the buffalo nickel, my conclusion was that he would be ideally suited to take that roll that Collins was good at last year.  Personal bias, I simply like him (full disclosure)  I do not watch games like you, but specific to our defensive scheme I think he is ideal.

 

But again, I did not watch games.

Safety is one of the only positions I actually do watch stuff on guys and Brisker was my first target and I would have maybe drafted him in the 3rd, but not over who we did draft.

[The Consigliere]

18 hours ago, HigSkin said:

 

Not an argument. There are a gazillion more undradted free agents all time than #1 and #2 etc picks. There wasn’t even a freaking combine of any sort for more than the first 50 years of the leagues history. Teams had largely no clue what they were doing w/prospects for 5 decades starting from the 1920s onward.

Finlays point in another tweet is also of the “no duh” sort level of mindlessness. Every year we hear those same takes. No kidding. What you evaluate after a draft is the use of asset value in a draft. What you evaluate two years later is the nfl asset value of the selections. It doesn’t take time to figure out where teams blew it like say the raiders clueless use of asset value in ‘19 but it does take time to ascertain what degree of value if any said player would end up having long term in the league.

 

Right now we’re judging how effectively teams used draft capital, that’s it. The yearly lectures on it taking time or the stupidity of draft grades is just beyond cliche at this point and of no utility.

[Burgold]

2 minutes ago, sebestian said:

 

Huts like a truck.  Has good coverage skills.  Better n the box safety, and based on our percentages in which we use the buffalo nickel, my conclusion was that he would be ideally suited to take that roll that Collins was good at last year.  Personal bias, I simply like him (full disclosure)  I do not watch games like you, but specific to our defensive scheme I think he is ideal.

 

But again, I did not watch games.

I get that complaint because a lot of focus has been on replacing Colins and what he did well last year, but I also remember that Colins got demoted that position because he couldn't cover. In fact, I'd say that the weakness of our safties is their ability/inability to cover both over the top as well as running backs in the flat or tight ends anywhere. Maybe Brisker could have filled that, but I also wonder if Kurl might be better suited to strong and that what we really needed was a rangy free safety.

[sebestian]

1 minute ago, Koolblue13 said:

Safety is one of the only positions I actually do watch stuff on guys and Brisker was my first target and I would have maybe drafted him in the 3rd, but not over who we did draft.

 

Yeah, I was looking at Phi's stats, looked like it all came together for him last year.  I feel a bit better about that pick.  I just have an affinity, possibly to my detriment, athletic safeties that bring the wood, and could cover a bit.  It is my fav position to watch, I just love safeties.  My fav player will always be Sean, I do not care if we get the equivalent of Brady, Sean is always on top for me.  That's just me though, some people don't understand.  Its cool though.  Tucker might be a good little player, great on teams so I think they did ok.  Not Jets or Baltimore, but solid second IMO.

[seantaylor=god]

1 hour ago, skinny21 said:

@Voice_of_Reason

…Travis was seen as the better prospect by most, but that’s not how the FO had their board - I have to wonder if competition level played a heavy hand here

The team needs to have a pipeline of talent for each position, as well as an eye toward succession planning.  No telling if Mathis will have success here, but he’s a clear step in that direction.

Impossible for us to fully judge the FO’s thinking here IMO - did they like Mathis’ value more because they saw a bigger drop off in DT talent later in the draft vs the drop off for other positions of need?  Or did they indeed “force the pick”?  Not sure it’s possible for us to know for sure.

 

If Mathis works out, he can help keep Payne fresh, can handle snaps in place of Allen as well, can soak up double teams to 1) keep our backers clean and 2) to impact the run game (thereby giving our pass rushers more chances to pin their ears back), and he can (as he showed in college) get the clean up sacks.  For better or worse, as a senior coming from Alabama, he’s likely facing a much quicker transition to the pros than some of the other options.

 

Long story short, I’m not arguing that this is a great pick, or the right pick, but given all of those factors, I can’t ding the FO for the pick just yet either.

Great post. I know level of competition was big for Rivera, he mentioned it a ton leading up to draft. And also, Mathis was a team captain and leader (probably because he’s old as hell) which is a huge factor for Rivera too.

 

Time will tell if we regret choosing the less explosive player, but Mathis is absolutely solid and should be a rotation player and then starter for us when Payne leaves. 

[sebestian]

3 minutes ago, Burgold said:

I get that complaint because a lot of focus has been on replacing Colins and what he did well last year, but I also remember that Colins got demoted that position because he couldn't cover. In fact, I'd say that the weakness of our safties is their ability/inability to cover both over the top as well as running backs in the flat or tight ends anywhere. Maybe Brisker could have filled that, but I also wonder if Kurl might be better suited to strong and that what we really needed was a rangy free safety.

 

Maybe Butler could be that free!!

[Burgold]

2 minutes ago, sebestian said:

 

Maybe Butler could be that free!!

:fingerscrossed:

[Lovi]

6 hours ago, KDawg said:

Christian Holmes is a big corner. 6, 200ish. Good hitter. Seems to be okay in man but better in zone. He’s physical. He may be a very real nickel guy. Put him in curl/flat zones in 3 or at times man to man against less shifty slots.

 

He doesn’t seem to transition real well when he has to flip his hips and it’s mostly due to his feet. But I don’t think he has slow feet in the rest of his film so it seems like that’s a repetition thing.

 

I am higher on him than I am Butler based off of college film. But Butler is a better athlete and Holmes is a better tackler so I can see different values.

 

Almost wonder if Holmes could be a SS and Butler a FS and both get a shot at the nickel spot.

 

To be clear, Holmes didn’t play SS, he played corner. But it seems like his skill set would transition well to strong safety.

I think he could be their attempt to fill the Buffalo. Not sure if it’ll work or not. 

[HigSkin]

CB Josh Drayden from Cal is signing with Commanders per Nicki J but can't liad the tweet!

 

 

Edited May 1, 2022 by HigSkin

[Skinsinparadise]

1 hour ago, Anselmheifer said:

Would love a Collins return. The defense was better with him last year and I don’t think we have anyone better to fill his spot. 

Agree

 

1 hour ago, Anselmheifer said:

 

Im not super satisfied with this draft. The second round reach kind of ruins it for me when there were potential impact players still available. 

 

I am not ready to say its a reach. I've watched him now a little but I'll get to watch him deeper.  Keim in his podcasts braced me for a D lineman so I was somewhat ready for it.  I didn't think it was coming that early.  After I got over the shock and absorbed the profile some, the idea grew on me.

 

Alabama run stuffer with 10.5 sacks last season.  Team captain.  He has the reputation for having a boisterous/Infectious personality.    You can see that some on the field at times.  I've mentioned before we got too many quiet dudes in that locker room.  IMO we can use some ying and yang.

 

The third DT is basically a starter.  The D line is a heavily rotated spot.  Ionnaidis played 60% of the reps last year.

 

Among other things if this works out we no longer have to worry about the plotline that you can't have 4 really good D lineman for long, you have to break up that band.   That breakup is looming soon.  Now maybe not? 

 

I recall for years where we had a barren D line and we'd kill for an Alabama run stuffer DT who can go get the QB.  Now, its yawn.  But I think we might be spoiled.  Just like we were for years with the Garcon-D-Jax-Crowder combination.  It felt like we had the Wr spot nailed.  And the riches can easily be replaced once the band was broken up.  It hasn't.  It's taken us years to rebuild Rome on that front, maybe this year we finally did it at Wr.  Don't want to go through that pain on the D line so i like this pick in theory. 

 

1 hour ago, Anselmheifer said:

 

If we resign Collins and add some IOL depth on FA, and maybe a LB, then I think we’ll be going into the season with a better roster on offense and defense, and that doesn’t even factor in the likelihood that we will be healthier and the upgrade at QB. 

 

Yep and i think they will.

 

1 hour ago, Anselmheifer said:

 

I do find it irritating how much better I like what the Eagles and Giants were able to do. Both teams added at least two potential stars, IMO.

 

 

Tough not to look hot when you have two first round picks.

 

In the Giants case they had picks 5,7, 43.  And two third rounders.  two 4th rounders.  Two fifth rounders.

 

So its like saying we walked down a block with $100 and landed at one restaurant while two other dudes walking around with $200 walked into a nicer restaurant.  Yep it did happen that way.  But i am not blaming them for not matching teams with much better draft capital. 

Edited May 1, 2022 by Skinsinparadise

[The Consigliere]

1 hour ago, Warhead36 said:

If Wentz plays up to his potential, his TRUE potential, we're talking top 10 QB and we're probably contenders in the NFC. You take that everytime. 

I don’t see either happening. I see us sitting in the 8-12 zone again just like Vegas does. Every year they’ll undersell and oversell some but they’re more reliable than die hard fans of their own teams.

 

Last year they were too low on the Titans, raiders, bengals and pats and too high on the afc north squads, and the Seahawks. It’s possible their wrong about us but to my mind the only times they’ve missed badly in the past 25 years has been ‘99, ‘05-‘07, ‘12, ‘15. Basically they’re more or less right about 19-20 of the past 25 years or so give or take a year or two. 
 

I see a range of 5-9 wins, over under from Vegas is 7.5 and sharps have been hitting the under hard (-130). That seems just about right, 7-10 to 8-9. Floor of 5, ceiling of 9-10 wins, sweet spot about 7.5 

[mhd24]

16 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

Agree

 

 

I am not ready to say its a reach. I've watched him now a little but I'll get to watch him deeper.  Keim in his podcasts braced me for a D lineman so I was somewhat ready for it.  I didn't think it was coming that early.  After I got over the shock and absorbed the profile some, the idea grew on me.

 

Alabama run stuffer with 10.5 sacks last season.  Team captain.  He has the reputation for having a boisterous/Infectious personality.    You can see that some on the field at times.  I've mentioned before we got too many quiet dudes in that locker room.  IMO we can use some ying and yang.

 

The third DT is basically a starter.  The D line is a heavily rotated spot.  Ionnaidis played 60% of the reps last year.

 

Among other things if this works out we no longer have to worry about the plotline that you can't have 4 really good D lineman for long, you have to break up that band.   That breakup is looming soon.  Now maybe not? 

 

I recall for years where we had a barren D line and we'd kill for an Alabama run stuffer DT who can go get the QB.  Now, its yawn.  But I think we might be spoiled.  Just like we were for years with the Garcon-D-Jax-Crowder combination.  It felt like we had the Wr spot nailed.  And the riches can easily be replaced once the band was broken up.  It hasn't.  It's taken us years to rebuild Rome on that front, maybe this year we finally did it at Wr.  Don't want to go through that pain on the D line so i like this pick in theory. 

 

 

Yep and i think they will.

 

 

 

Tough not to look hot when you have two first round picks.

 

In the Giants case they had picks 5,7, 43.  And two third rounders.  two 4th rounders.  Two fifth rounders.

 

So its like saying we walked down a block with $100 and landed at one restaurant while two other dudes walking around with $200 walked into a nicer restaurant.  Yep it did happen that way.  But i am not blaming them for not matching teams with much better draft capital. 

 

 

I'm happy the Giants took Neal over Ekwonu & Cross (could have any of them at 5).  KT going there sucks, but maybe he flames out.  

 

Looks like Dean will be out for the year according to Lombardi.  He said he's got a pec issue and we know unfortunately, those are season enders (Okapo).  Philly's achilles heal is the CB position.  They didn't add anything to it.  Slay is aging (over 30).  When corners age, the falloff is drastic.  

[Redskins 2021]

26 minutes ago, The Consigliere said:

I don’t see either happening. I see us sitting in the 8-12 zone again just like Vegas does. Every year they’ll undersell and oversell some but they’re more reliable than die hard fans of their own teams.

 

Last year they were too low on the Titans, raiders, bengals and pats and too high on the afc north squads, and the Seahawks. It’s possible their wrong about us but to my mind the only times they’ve missed badly in the past 25 years has been ‘99, ‘05-‘07, ‘12, ‘15. Basically they’re more or less right about 19-20 of the past 25 years or so give or take a year or two. 
 

I see a range of 5-9 wins, over under from Vegas is 7.5 and sharps have been hitting the under hard (-130). That seems just about right, 7-10 to 8-9. Floor of 5, ceiling of 9-10 wins, sweet spot about 7.5 

 I think we get 9 to 10 based on the schudule and a first round playoff exit. We got 7 last year harder schudule. We are basically a 500 team last team in the playoffs type team. 

Edited May 1, 2022 by Redskins 2021

[oraphus]

35 minutes ago, mhd24 said:

 

 

I'm happy the Giants took Neal over Ekwonu & Cross (could have any of them at 5).  KT going there sucks, but maybe he flames out.  

 

Looks like Dean will be out for the year according to Lombardi.  He said he's got a pec issue and we know unfortunately, those are season enders (Okapo).  Philly's achilles heal is the CB position.  They didn't add anything to it.  Slay is aging (over 30).  When corners age, the falloff is drastic.  

Dean said he was cleared by multiple drs.... i guess time will tell but they might have gotten themselves a steal

[Koolblue13]

9 minutes ago, oraphus said:

Dean said he was cleared by multiple drs.... i guess time will tell but they might have gotten themselves a steal

Howie probably started that rumor to tank his draft.    Eagles added Riddick and Dean to their LBers. Not too shaby.