Update: Good News - Ossoff has been called the winner - So Congrats to GA Senators Elect Warnock and Ossoff!

[tshile]

This is great news. 
 

im not a fan of some of the legislation this will allow to get through. 
 

but I’m even less of a fan of the idea of the “gatekeeper” role McConnell has played over the years. 
 

You’re there to vote on ideas. And be held accountable for those votes. Artificially manipulating the system by allowing a “safe” senator to block votes so your people can run misinformation campaigns about what it is they actually stand for seems inherently anti-Democracy to me. 
 

so while I will not be happy with some of the legislation, I will be happy to see people forced to vote on items and then be held accountable by their constituents. The way it’s supposed to be. 
 

the hollowness of these two GA Republican clowns claiming they wanted to vote for the 2000$ stimulus checks, when we know they don’t support it but could say so because their precious “gatekeeper” would block them from having to actually vote, is just so anti-Democracy to me. 
 

if your opinions and stances are so bad you have to publicly lie about them and run a campaign of lies, then your opinions are garbage and you should be held accountable for that. 

[Larry]

39 minutes ago, Simmsy said:

I hate to be that guy, but I don't think Mitch is all that concerned. He flooded the courts with garbage judges for life and he won his election, so he's safe for another six years. He knows he gets to try again in a couple of years and what he's "accomplished" so far won't be backtracked. However, if we really want to sock it to him, we have to do this again in two years...and every two years. Make Mitch a non factor from here on out. Now, I'm going to drink my morning coffee and enjoy the news.

 

And he's driven the country into a tar pit, and can now start working on the myth that the Dems are responsible for all of it.  He'll spend the next two years obstructing like hell, while pushing the story that he has no power whatsoever.  (And therefore zero responsibility.)  

 

[Larry]

Just now, tshile said:

im not a fan of some of the legislation this will allow to get through. 

 

The legislation that will get trough a filibuster?  

 

We're not going to be seeing legislation mandating a free Prius hybrid for every transgendered refugee.  

 

I think the Dems will be able to get through some budgetary things.  The GOP demonstrated how a majority acting in unison (are the Dems capable of that?) can ram through completely partisan measures under some circumstances.  But I don't see a huge tide of socialist extremism.  

 

Heck.  Odds are, Congress is going to have to come up with Obamacare 2, in the first 100 days or so.  Odds of them getting that through?  

[tshile]

13 minutes ago, Larry said:

 

The legislation that will get trough a filibuster?  

 

We're not going to be seeing legislation mandating a free Prius hybrid for every transgendered refugee.  

 

I think the Dems will be able to get through some budgetary things.  The GOP demonstrated how a majority acting in unison (are the Dems capable of that?) can ram through completely partisan measures under some circumstances.  But I don't see a huge tide of socialist extremism.  

 

Heck.  Odds are, Congress is going to have to come up with Obamacare 2, in the first 100 days or so.  Odds of them getting that through?  

this is odd because your examples of things I don’t like are:

socialist extremism

and giving transgenders a free prius

 

if you want to discuss it like an adult I’m here. But I’m not interested in starting from a point of clownery. 

[bearrock]

12 minutes ago, Larry said:

 

The legislation that will get trough a filibuster?  

 

We're not going to be seeing legislation mandating a free Prius hybrid for every transgendered refugee.  

 

I think the Dems will be able to get through some budgetary things.  The GOP demonstrated how a majority acting in unison (are the Dems capable of that?) can ram through completely partisan measures under some circumstances.  But I don't see a huge tide of socialist extremism.  

 

Heck.  Odds are, Congress is going to have to come up with Obamacare 2, in the first 100 days or so.  Odds of them getting that through?  

 

Changes to ACA is one of the things that would probably be doable through reconciliation (at least in some limited scope).  It would be interesting to see if they will propose a change to reconciliation rule to expand it to cover pandemic response.  

4 minutes ago, tshile said:

this is odd because your examples of things I don’t like are:

socialist extremism

and giving transgenders a free prius

 

if you want to discuss it like an adult I’m here. But I’m not interested in starting from a point of clownery. 

 

So no free prius for clowns?

[tshile]

1 minute ago, bearrock said:

 

Changes to ACA is one of the things that would probably be doable through reconciliation (at least in some limited scope).  It would be interesting to see if they will propose a change to reconciliation rule to expand it to cover pandemic response.  

It depends.... the reality is hard core conservative areas have suffered from the GOP’s tactics on healthcare since ACA passed. We’re seeing rural area hospitals shut down, doctors offices closing, etc. not because they can’t make it under ACA, but because they can’t make it under ACA with the GOP actively working to make ACA bad for people. 
 

there have been a few PAC’s or other groups formed dedicated solely to outreach to these people. 
 

It’s not like this is a magic wand that cures everything but it’s a massive step in the right direction to not allow McConnell to just block votes on everything outright. 
 

for midterms this hurts the GOP playbook and gives the Dems a better chance than they had before last night. 
 

 

[Ball Security]

6 hours ago, visionary said:

 

I can't wait to go back to Savannah again some day.

I was in Savannah in March the weekend before the lockdown. Can’t wait to go back.

[Larry]

4 minutes ago, tshile said:

this is odd because your examples of things I don’t like are:

socialist extremism

and giving transgenders a free prius

 

if you want to discuss it like an adult I’m here. But I’m not interested in starting from a point of clownery. 

 

Uh, I don't think I stated your opinion on either of those.  

 

I worked really hard to create the most glaring example of extreme, caricatured, far-lefty-ism.  

 

I guess you could say I implied your dislike of that.  Since I was intentionally trying to pick something that almost everybody would abject to.  

 

But my point is that the Dems really aren't going to be able to get really extreme things through.  

 

(Heck, given the level of coordination that the Dems have demonstrated in their past periods of power, I'll be surprised if they manage to pass budgets.)

[TK]

 

 

 

[Ball Security]

54 minutes ago, Simmsy said:

I hate to be that guy, but I don't think Mitch is all that concerned. He flooded the courts with garbage judges for life and he won his election, so he's safe for another six years. He knows he gets to try again in a couple of years and what he's "accomplished" so far won't be backtracked. However, if we really want to sock it to him, we have to do this again in two years...and every two years. Make Mitch a non factor from here on out. Now, I'm going to drink my morning coffee and enjoy the news.

Have you seen those pictures of his hands?  I don’t think he’s safe for another six years.  It is what it is.

[tshile]

7 minutes ago, Larry said:

Uh, I don't think I stated your opinion on either of those.  

 

I worked really hard to create the most glaring example of extreme, caricatured, far-lefty-ism.  

That’s not how it came across

me: this will allow legislation i don’t like

 

you: it’s not like we’re giving transgenders free priuses (what is the plural form of Prius...? Prii?) or a tidal wave of social extermism

 

it came across as completely minimizing the idea that you can have reasonable objections to some of the Dems platform ideas. 
 

that you must believe they’re going to push utter nonsense for policy to not like what they might do. 
 

Instead of talking about the list of items they’re likely to work on immediately, a list of items that’s been public and well discussed, you came up with extreme nonsense quite literally no one has campaigned on to minimize the idea that one could reasonable object to the items that have been discussed, and are likely to come up immediately. 
 

that’s how it came across to me. I didn’t appreciate it. I have not been a “socialism!!!” dolt and I don’t appreciate being treated like one by someone that frequents the politician threads enough to know I’m not. 
 

not trying to be a jerk about it. Just explaining how your post came across to me. I understand your follow up post. 

[Larry]

'Course, you could maybe reduce the hypothetical-ness of this discussion by actually listing some of the things that you think they are likely to successfully pass, that you object to.  

[tshile]

17 minutes ago, Larry said:

'Course, you could maybe reduce the hypothetical-ness of this discussion by actually listing some of the things that you think they are likely to successfully pass, that you object to.  

The two right off the bat will be student debt and minimum wage. 
 

it’s not that I don’t want something done about them it’s that I object to their solution. 
 

 

That said I accept the fact that when one party refuses to work to solve a problem, the other party sort of gets to implement their solution if they get power and you just sort of have to eat that. 
 

just like I reject the Dems gun control ideas, however I view it as a problem that needs to be worked on, and in absence of a legitimate alternative idea we sort of are just stuck with the Dems ideas. 
 

and as someone that’s “pro second amendment” (for the most part) I accept that I’ve played a role in allowing the GOP to get away with just ignoring the issue over the years. As such I accept that the Dems get to try to push forward their ideas. 
 

doesn’t mean I have to like them. Or stop thinking there are better ideas. Or stop thinking there are problems with the Dems ideas. 
 

and it doesn’t mean I have to be a far right nutter to think these things. 

[CousinsCowgirl84]

2 minutes ago, tshile said:

The two right off the bat will be student debt and minimum wage. 
 

it’s not that I don’t want something done about them it’s that I object to their solution. 
 

 

the student debt thing is essentially just changing numbers in a spreadsheet.  I don’t know how that affects you and me in any way.  What’s wrong with a free education.

 

I agree on the minimum wage issue and I think we should be focusing on getting people off of minimum wage jobs.
 

Mc Donald’s cashier shouldn’t be a career. 

 

A free education (debt forgiveness) is one of the ways to get people off minimum wage tho.

 

[Llevron]

4 minutes ago, tshile said:

The two right off the bat will be student debt and minimum wage. 
 

it’s not that I don’t want something done about them it’s that I object to their solution. 
 

 

That said I accept the fact that when one party refuses to work to solve a problem, the other party sort of gets to implement their solution if they get power and you just sort of have to eat that. 
 

just like I reject the Dems gun control ideas, however I view it as a problem that needs to be worked on, and in absence of a legitimate alternative idea we sort of are just stuck with the Dems ideas. 
 

and as someone that’s “pro second amendment” (for the most part) I accept that I’ve played a role in allowing the GOP to get away with just ignoring the issue over the years. As such I accept that the Dems get to try to push forward their ideas. 

 

I dont think you have to worry about anything that left leaning honestly. Biden is going to break his back trying to get us back to center and working as a unit again. Thats what he sees as his mission from the American people, and arguably thats why he was put into office over someone like Sanders. That and unless they do something about the filibuster, Mitch and Trump will still have enough control over the senate that they can stop progress. If I understand how this works correctly. I could be dead ass wrong obviously. 

[Larry]

Minimum wage is a funny issue for me.  

 

To me, it seems like a glaringly obvious way of making things just a small bit batter.  But it also seems like an issue that a lot of folks regard as far-left-land.  

 

But then, I also live in a state that voted for Trump, and voted 60% to raise the min wage on the same ballot.  Scratching my head on that one.  

[Rogue Jedi]

I understand this is probably going to be low on the list of this next administration, and I understand this is going to be an extremely selfish take, but it's about damn time they legalize marijuana on a federal level. For Christ's sake.

 

Who knows when we are gonna have control of the House and Senate again.

[tshile]

1 minute ago, Llevron said:

 

I dont think you have to worry about anything that left leaning honestly. Biden is going to break his back trying to get us back to center and working as a unit again. Thats what he sees as his mission from the American people, and arguably thats why he was put into office over someone like Sanders. That and unless they do something about the filibuster, Mitch and Trump will still have enough control over the senate that they can stop progress. If I understand how this works correctly. I could be dead ass wrong obviously. 

Maybe. 
 

my understanding is Biden can simply wipe out the student debt issue by appointing the right person that oversees that. It’s not a legislative thing. Changing it going forward is. I’ve been listening to it on the npr politics podcast. Although I suppose that’s less of a senate control thing and more of an executive move. 
 

We’ll see how the filibuster thing works out. Maybe I’m way over selling what the Dems can do. 

 

generally they suck at wielding power. The run up to the 2020 campaign was pretty much - we need to force our stuff through and stop being such sissies when it comes to things. 
 

At the moment I take that directive seriously. And while I’m on board with the Dems about what the “problems are”, I’m not usually onboard with their solutions. 
 

but yeah it’s much more likely we see the Dems weakly wield their power the gop block legislation despite being the minority party across the board. 
 

but, I do look forward to our government institutions being “fixed”. I do look forward to adults being in the rooms that matter again. 
 

and long term, it’s hard for me to imagine a scenario in which my future votes go for anyone other than democrats. 
 

but I will **** about it along the way. Sorry. 

[Larry]

Just now, Rogue Jedi said:

I understand this is probably going to be low on the list of this next administration, and I understand this is going to be an extremely selfish take, but it's about damn time they legalize marijuana on a federal level. For Christ's sake.

 

Who knows when we are gonna have control of the House and Senate again.

 

I think that on that subject, what I would pass would be the feds announcing that they will regulate interstate marijuana, but that simple possession is a state matter.  

[tshile]

4 minutes ago, Larry said:

Minimum wage is a funny issue for me.  

 

To me, it seems like a glaringly obvious way of making things just a small bit batter.  But it also seems like an issue that a lot of folks regard as far-left-land.  

 

But then, I also live in a state that voted for Trump, and voted 60% to raise the min wage on the same ballot.  Scratching my head on that one.  

i don’t regard it as far left land, I recognize we have a problem with the minimum wage. And the electoral college. And student debt. And healthcare. And the wealth gap. And wage stagnation. And immigration. 
 

and on some of those I align perfectly with the Dems. 
 

but I have significant reservations with the “living wage” platform. 
 

but, without derailing, my main argument was that I’m for thing being voted on and people being held accountable for those votes. Even if it means policy ideas I’m not exactly happy with. 
 

I am very much against political maneuvering and abusing rules so you can lie about what you stand for and what you don’t. 

13 minutes ago, CousinsCowgirl84 said:

the student debt thing is essentially just changing numbers in a spreadsheet.  I don’t know how that affects you and me in any way.  What’s wrong with a free education.

 

I agree on the minimum wage issue and I think we should be focusing on getting people off of minimum wage jobs.
 

Mc Donald’s cashier shouldn’t be a career. 

 

A free education (debt forgiveness) is one of the ways to get people off minimum wage tho.

 

I’ve gone to bat in the other threads on why I am against the Dems college debt platform. This isn’t the thread for it. 
 

I’ll just repeat: i recognize it’s a problem that needs to be worked on, I just reject the Dems solutions as adequate or the right thing to do. 

[Simmsy]

Ok, so this protest in DC, is this just for the presidential election? Is it for the whole election or just for Trump and or just states he lost? What about congressmen who lost? Does that also include this new Georgia runoff? its like a buffet of faux outrage.

[LadySkinsFan]

18 minutes ago, Larry said:

Minimum wage is a funny issue for me.  

 

To me, it seems like a glaringly obvious way of making things just a small bit batter.  But it also seems like an issue that a lot of folks regard as far-left-land.  

 

But then, I also live in a state that voted for Trump, and voted 60% to raise the min wage on the same ballot.  Scratching my head on that one.  

 

If companies don't want to pay a living wage for their employees (do the right thing), then when those employees lawfully access the social safety net of federal and state programs can have their Social Security numbers used to trace received benefits. Those benefits can then be charged off to their employers, thus returning those funds back into the Treasury. I've proposed this before and think it's the most elegant and fair way to put the onus on employers to do the right thing. Plus, we make those receivers of social safety net funds not liable for taxes on those funds.

[spjunkies]

 

[PleaseBlitz]

30 minutes ago, Rogue Jedi said:

I understand this is probably going to be low on the list of this next administration, and I understand this is going to be an extremely selfish take, but it's about damn time they legalize marijuana on a federal level. For Christ's sake.

 

Who knows when we are gonna have control of the House and Senate again.

 

I don't think it's selfish.  I don't smoke (and would not even if it became legal) and I think it's just good policy for about a dozen reasons.  

 

Edit:  Just in general and not directed any anyone in particular, all this discussion about the Biden administration and federal policy should probably move to an appropriate thread, not the still-going GA runoff thread. 

[Jumbo]

i went to bed about 10 and tho the radical lefties were in the lead i had prepared myself to reality of likely disappointment (wft fan training for 6 decades)

 

i was very pleasantly surprised and impressed with georgia--inc. some elected gopers there---and in admiration of the organization efforts and the resilience and determination of the black community, the work yang and others did on rallying the aapi vote, and the latino/latina organizers too, as well as my fellow honkies

 

still an independent but it's kind of moot in recent years given the sewer that's the bulk of the gop esp as peaking in this hugely dominant cesspool quality under trump

 

it's a little bit better world today, even with all the qualifiers, waking up to the two more unlikely events i wouldn't have predicted a couple months ago: wft being div champs (no ot digression meant) and georgia sending a young jewish man and its first black senator to congress

 

 

hang in there 'murica, "never give up, never surrender"