A New Start! (the Reboot) The Front Office, Ownership, & Coaching Staff Thread

[Andre The Giant]

 

[Rufus T Firefly]

6 minutes ago, method man said:

There are unemployed veteran OCs with their old teams still paying their salaries like Frank Reich

LOL. I don't think you understand how coaches pay works. 

[Chris 44]

33 minutes ago, Andre The Giant said:

 

Ultimately this is what I would love to see moments after the final whistle tomorrow.

"Toot. toot. All aboard".

 

Edited January 7, 2023 by Chris 44

[88Comrade2000]

2 hours ago, method man said:

Yep. Ron needs a playoff season in 2023 to have a chance at keeping his job. In his heart of hearts, he has to know that Turner is not going to put up a league average offense even with a decent QB and better OL play

 

If he is smart, he will go find a guy off the Reid or Shanahan tree. At this point, nearly all vet QBs have played in one of the two systems

Ron already had a playoff season. He needs a playoff win.

[Skinsinparadise]

 

 

[Conn]

I don’t really agree with the narrative that’s building in here that McDaniel is some sort of dorky weirdo just because he charms the press with corny jokes and casual banter, and those are the clips that go viral. Or that his personality being the opposite of Rivera while being a dude who wears glasses and is like 5’9” puts into question his ability as a “leader of men”. He’s extremely emotionally intelligent, believes in teaching over just motivating, and connects with his players that way—look back at Tua’s vulnerability in his pressers earlier this year about how McDaniel taking time to get to know him as a man and encourage the growth of his strengths on the field—McDaniel literally saved his career in a cool bit of sports psychology that you rarely hear about in this league.
 

You know who is very similar to Rivera in coaching philosophy and almost ended that kid’s career due to destroying his confidence through poor coaching and poor leadership? Flores. That type of old school stoic, honorable, military-style tough love coaching doesn’t connect with everyone, and is dying out in this league in favor of younger guys with high emotional IQ’s who get players to believe that the coaches will coach to their strengths, minimize their weaknesses, and set everyone up for success. Rivera connecting with the men in our locker room one way doesn’t preclude someone else doing it differently somewhere else. 
 

Tua has played poorly in between his concussions btw, if you watch a lot of the Dolphins the main story has been that the team stopped winning when they could no longer produce on offense at a high level because Tua’s own limitations were showing up after being worked around for the first half of the season. He’s a talented kid in a lot of ways but he’s not Mahomes. Hill and Waddle are running open nearly every play and he’s not alway seeing them or able to get them the ball efficiently down the field outside the hash marks. I’m not saying Tua is garbage or that McDaniel shouldn’t be doing more to readjust to the way the league has adjusted to what Tua was doing well early in the season—but the concussion stuff with Tua is kind of a unique situation and it’s tough to know how that’s effected things. The backups have not been good. 
 

Anyways, I’m not personally invested in McDaniel or anything but the narratives on him, especially his personality, are getting too extreme. In fact his personality is one of his big positives, for the players that love him. Even if some of the magic has worn off down the stretch (and when your brand is analytics and trying to outsmart the dinosaurs, people are going to turn on you faster when you hit a down streak) his type of coaching is much more the future of this league than not imo.
 

We’d be lucky to land him, with whatever lessons he learned from a quick firing, if Miami was crazy enough to move on so quickly. He’s the real deal imo and I think the quirkiness and weirdness aspects to his personality are being WAY overblown just by being repeated over and over again in here. The dude still came up the hard way in this league, took his lumps and matured past some early young dumb stuff, and earned his shot in extremely organic fashion with years of hard work and grinding, even at his young age. That shows he gels with the traditional football types, and locker rooms, just fine—he’s not some weirdo outsider who snuck in through the back door. The dude majors in connecting with players through empathy, and positivity, teaching to players’ strengths. He was many players’ favorite coach long before he was on the national radar as a HC candidate, that’s pretty well documented. He has no problem connecting within locker rooms, that’s one of his primary strengths. How people judge his demeanor in a presser doesn’t change that. You don’t need to be like Rivera or Dan Campbell or whoever to be a “leader of men”. In fact many of those types are revealed as frauds as soon as the winning stops—look at Harbough in SF for a prime example. 

Edited January 7, 2023 by Conn

[NewCliche21]

I think Ron should be here next season.  Our defensive line was trash last year, and as soon as he ousted the line coach, whether JDR wanted it or not I don't know, it changed.  I don't think he felt comfortable doing that with the OC given it's a philosophy and literally the entirety of the offensive side of the ball.  You can't just switch up OC/DC if the *system* is also part of the problem, because the coaches there are under that system's umbrella.

I think Turner's good as gone Monday morning.  Mid-season wouldn't help.

[Skinsinparadise]

24 minutes ago, Conn said:

 

We’d be lucky to land him, with whatever lessons he learned from a quick firing, if Miami was crazy enough to move on so quickly. He’s the real deal imo and I think the quirkiness and weirdness aspects to his personality are being WAY overblown just by being repeated over and over again in here. The dude still came up the hard way in this league, took his lumps and matured past some early young dumb stuff, and earned his shot in extremely organic fashion with years of hard work and grinding, even at his young age. That shows he gels with the traditional football types, and locker rooms, just fine—the dude majors in connecting with players through empathy, and positivity, teaching to players’ strengths. He was many players’ favorite coach long before he was on the national radar as a HC candidate, that’s pretty well documented. He has no problem connecting within locker rooms, that’s one of his primary strengths. How people judge his demeanor in a presser doesn’t change that. You don’t need to be like Rivera or Dan Campbell or whoever to be a “leader of men”. In fact many of those types are revealed as frauds as soon as the winning stops—look at Harbough in SF for a prime example. 

 

I've read the fluff articles about McDaniel.  And I am not saying they are wrong.  I am simply saying to my eyes-ears, McDaniel is super weird and awkward and it makes me pause.     

 

Jim Zorn also a weird dude, got props for his ability to connect to players, weird dude but super nice guy and unconventional -- Matt Hasselbeck loved him as a coach and as a dude, Steve Largent would say he's one of the nicest guys on the planet.  Now it sounds comical but in real time it wasn't a joke.  Gregg Williams among others told Cerrato at the time, that's the dude he'd want to run an offense.  His name kept coming up in interviews as it was revealed later for being uncoventional and a dude who connects with others. 

 

I've just seen a lot of him all season.  I watch the local news including sports almost every day.  i see a lot of Mcdaniel.  He strikes me as a nice guy, nothing wrong with him at all, but a leader of man, of a bunch of a jock Alpha males, it strikes me as an odd fit.  But like I said if they win, it works.  I can see it going south eventually if they don't.

 

And I am not saying I am out on the dude.  Just simply saying, I am not rushing in on him or feel like you say "we'd be lucky to have him."  Not saying you are wrong.  I honestly got no feel for it.  My gut is I'd like to see a bigger sample size.

 

I am not suggesting he's not smart.   I am not suggesting he hasn't paid his dues.  I am not suggesting he isn't a hard worker.   IMO running a unit versus being a CEO are two different animals.   

 

I am not really sweating it one way or another.  It will play out organically.  If they lose to the Jets, that's 6 games in a row of losses to close the season, that alone would make me pause.  If they win, they make the playoffs and no way they fire him.  So in short I think the discussion is irrelevant.

Edited January 7, 2023 by Skinsinparadise

[Skinsinparadise]

19 minutes ago, NewCliche21 said:

I think Ron should be here next season.  Our defensive line was trash last year, and as soon as he ousted the line coach, whether JDR wanted it or not I don't know, it changed.  I don't think he felt comfortable doing that with the OC given it's a philosophy and literally the entirety of the offensive side of the ball.  You can't just switch up OC/DC if the *system* is also part of the problem, because the coaches there are under that system's umbrella.

I think Turner's good as gone Monday morning.  Mid-season wouldn't help.

 

I think Turner is gone, too.

 

As for Rivera, I don't really care one way another. I won't jump off a cliff as I think some might if he's back or for that matter care much if he's gone.

 

Not to jinx it with Dan but if Dan is leaving everything else is a distant 2nd to me including what happens with Ron.   My gut is we got Ron for one more year and that's it.

 

My gut is they do fix the offense.  I don't think the offense's woes is purely on Turner.  I think he's one of the variables though.  Get rid of Turner.  Beef up the O line.  Find a better QB and I think this is a playoff team next season. 

[Conn]

This video below is more the direction I lean, but I’m willing to agree to disagree on this one SIP. I know you’re well-informed on any subject you comment on, and appreciate your posts for that reason. But I’m not on board with the amateur psychology on this one. There’s no evidence at all that his leadership style with “alpha jock males” in this league is any less effective than however Rivera connects with his guys. Again, his ability to get along and lead a locker room by connecting with his players is one of his most obviously positive traits, and I’m not referring to “fluff pieces”. But I’ll let it lie. Just thought the narrative was getting a little strong for my tastes. 

 

 

[skinzplay]

RR must be gone. Decision-making 101....he failed 3 years in a row. How the hell should he stay?

[Skinsinparadise]

22 minutes ago, Conn said:

This video below is more the direction I lean, but I’m willing to agree to disagree on this one SIP. I know you’re well-informed on any subject you comment on, and appreciate your posts for that reason. But I’m not on board with the amateur psychology on this one. There’s no evidence at all that his leadership style with “alpha jock males” in this league is any less effective than however Rivera connects with his guys. Again, his ability to get along and lead a locker room by connecting with his players is one of his most obviously positive traits, and I’m not referring to “fluff pieces”. But I’ll let it lie. Just thought the narrative was getting a little strong for my tastes. 

 

 

 

Thanks. I appreciate the complement. 

 

It's not really though amatuer psychology as you paint it.  It's like anything in life, we form impressions based on what we see and read.    Yours is valid.  And so of course is mine.

 

And part of it for me is i've soured over the years over X's and O's guys where later it came out that they failed as head coaches because they weren't leaders of men in the locker room and or CEO types. At the time of the hires, they were all praised as wonderful. 

 

Almost every assistant coach will have players swear by them including pushing their people skills.  Heck I can recall like yesterday Troy Aikman hyping Norv Turner, not just as a strategist but also as a dude.  Heck before it was cool, I trashed the idea of Scott Turner being a head coach that some were pushing this off season.  He just didn't strike me personality wise as the head coaching type and i explained why in detail.   

 

Count me as dude who used to fall for name that narrative to now being a hard sell-cynic about narratives.    Am I too cynical now?  Maybe. 😀

 

I subscribe to three newspapers, one of them is in South Florida.  My local news covers the Dolphins and I've seen plenty of McDaniel this season.  Half of the family on my side are Dolphins fans.  Sadly, my brother in law was once a Commanders fan and now roots for the Dolphins.  I've been to my share of Dolphin games, granted none this season. 

 

It doesn't make me an expert by any stretch.  But like any red blooded human, if i watched someone over and over again, I form an impression.  

 

And again i am not really anti-McDaniel at all.  I am just not at the you had me at Hello mode with McDaniel.  There are things I like about him and things I don't..

 

If they lose to the Jets, do I think he gets fired, yes.  If they win, they won't fire him.  I seriously doubt we'd chase him if he was canned.  So the debate IMO I think is a waste of time.
 

I am only bothering to make the case.  That for me, personaity is a big component that I care about for head coaches.  And yes its subjective as to what moves me on that front and what i perceive is more likely to work.  But heck that's what we do, we give subjective opinions. 

Edited January 8, 2023 by Skinsinparadise

[Redwolves92]

ron def deserves blame but i also feel for him when it comes to qb. nobody wants to come to washington, jimmy g had surgery to avoid us lol. hopefully they drafted a gem in howell. 

[Conn]

Deciding whether a guy (who has shown major promise in his first season as a HC) will be fired or not based on one game—nvm a game involving the team’s rookie 3rd string QB—says a lot more about the Dolphins FO and Ownership than it does the HC in question imo. That’s extremely bush league level stuff when there’s no evidence he’s actually lost the locker room. If it’s that bad, it should already be obvious whether to fire him or not and this final game shouldn’t hold such weight. Very strange. It’s not like he took over a good team and cratered it lol. I’ll never understand this story but definitely interested to see if it plays out. 

[Skinsinparadise]

 

 

[Skinsinparadise]

5 minutes ago, Conn said:

Deciding whether a guy (who has shown major promise in his first season as a HC) will be fired or not based on one game—nvm a game involving the team’s rookie 3rd string QB—says a lot more about the Dolphins FO and Ownership than it does the HC in question imo. That’s extremely bush league level stuff when there’s no evidence he’s actually lost the locker room. If it’s that bad, it should already be obvious whether to fire him or not and this final game shouldn’t hold such weight. Very strange. It’s not like he took over a good team and cratered it lol. I’ll never understand this story but definitely interested to see if it plays out. 

 

I joke with a friend of mine who is a big Dolphins fan, how much their team's luck and record has mirrored this team over the last decade or so.   They also have a bad owner albiet not nearly as bad as ours.

 

I think the narrative with Miami whether deserved or not is they felt they finally escaped the dungeon this season after their fast start and with all of that if they don't make the playoffs I gather it will feel deflating. 

 

They went 9-8 last season and did it sort of the reverse way, losing at the start and then won at the end.  This season is almost the mirror opposite, with 5 loses in a row at the end.

 

I do think they should beat the Jets.  Yeah the Dolphins have their 3rd string Qb playing but so do the Jets and the Jets from what I read aren't starting three of their O lineman.  

 

And as someone who has sat multiple times above the road team's bench in the stands -- the Dolphins stadium construction guys did a masterful job in how they crafted the ergonomics of that stadium in that the sun at that time of day just bakes the road side of the stadium, hot as heck, and its supposed to be 80 degrees tomorrow.

 

The Dolphins have all the makings of a win here.  If they lose the 6th game in a row, I think there is a shot he gets canned. There is a lot of built in frustration with that team that McDaniel inherits. 

[RWJ]

I don't post much anymore.  Couple of things.  Before we were the Washington Panthers this year and when RR and Co. arrived, we were the Washington Buccaneers.  It sure would be nice for a GM or HC NOT to be tied to their former teams (coaches, players, etc.).  I like to see some different.  Will we?  Time will tell.  

Edited January 8, 2023 by RWJ

[NewCliche21]

47 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

I think Turner is gone, too.

 

As for Rivera, I don't really care one way another. I won't jump off a cliff as I think some might if he's back or for that matter care much if he's gone.

 

Not to jinx it with Dan but if Dan is leaving everything else is a distant 2nd to me including what happens with Ron.   My gut is we got Ron for one more year and that's it.

 

My gut is they do fix the offense.  I don't think the offense's woes is purely on Turner.  I think he's one of the variables though.  Get rid of Turner.  Beef up the O line.  Find a better QB and I think this is a playoff team next season. 

 

I think the same.  Truthfully, I almost view Rivera as I did Trent Green when JKC died.  Caught up in the hoopla and we let him get away. I want a guarantee for Ron for at least this year (23-24), though I don't know how that would actually work.  Just a modicum of stability, not greatness just stability, at a key position would really help that transition.

And as I'm typing this, I hear that McVay may be on the outs?  If we got McVay I would sell a kidney and put the other up for auction just to bring him in for an interview.

[Skinsinparadise]

12 minutes ago, NewCliche21 said:

 

I think the same.  Truthfully, I almost view Rivera as I did Trent Green when JKC died.  Caught up in the hoopla and we let him get away. I want a guarantee for Ron for at least this year (23-24), though I don't know how that would actually work.  Just a modicum of stability, not greatness just stability, at a key position would really help that transition.

And as I'm typing this, I hear that McVay may be on the outs?  If we got McVay I would sell a kidney and put the other up for auction just to bring him in for an interview.

 

I think with McVay the narrative is like Sean Payton he might take a year or two off.

 

As for Rivera, I just don't really care too much.  I mentioned they can get rid of him for all i care back when it wasn't as cool to say it back when they were winning. Why?

 

A.  i want the new owner to be able to do whatever they want.  And all things equal, I'd rather wipe the slate clear across the board as to any hire or anything that Dan touched.

 

B.  Even if the owner likes him, I doubt Ron goes more than another year whether its him being replaced by someone the owner wants or Ron wants to leave.

 

Ron and his future to me is almost borderline yawn because I think it will play out organically and whatever happens it won't be long.  but if he's back this season, I am not in the camp that we are doomed.    I like where this roster is.  i don't think Ron is a moron. i do think he sees what we do which is upgrade the O line, add depth to the defense and the team should climb even if they upgrade their QB spot to just average versus the train wreck we got right now at QB IMO.

 

I used to love the narratives of name that hot shot coordinator, especially on the offensive side, but so many are hit and miss that I am more cynical about the coaching prospects than i was years ago.  Sean McVay is a great X and O's guy but also has through the roof people-leadership skiils.

 

I love for example what Ben Johnson in particular has done in Detroit.  But i need to learn more about him as a dude to be sold as an example. 

Edited January 8, 2023 by Skinsinparadise

[Hooper]

Fine with firing Turner.

 

But have NO faith in Ron bringing in a good replacement.

 

Hey, maybe it will be Jay Gruden with Derek Carr.  JK -- sorta.

 

Also, I'm old enough to remember when the fans and the media couldn't wait to get rid of Kyle Shanahan, so I have no idea what to think of anything when it comes to our team. 

 

Please sell, Dan.

 

 

 

 

Edited January 8, 2023 by Hooper

[SoCalSkins]

9 minutes ago, Hooper said:

Fine with firing Turner.

 

But have NO faith in Ron bringing in a good replacement.

 

Hey, maybe it will be Jay Gruden with Derek Carr.  JK -- sorta.

 

Also, I'm old enough to remember when the fans and the media couldn't wait to get rid of Kyle Shanahan, so I have no idea what to think of anything when it comes to our team. 

 

Please sell, Dan.

 

 

 

 

Who is going to come here? The coach is pretty much a lame duck and the chances of being fired after the year are nearly certain for anyone taking the job. Only benefit is that Ron is a defensive coach so the OC will have a lot of autonomy. Someone like Jay is the best we can hope for. Most likely, Ron would hire Jason Garret in my opinion.

[KDawg]

3 hours ago, Conn said:

I don’t really agree with the narrative that’s building in here that McDaniel is some sort of dorky weirdo just because he charms the press with corny jokes and casual banter, and those are the clips that go viral. Or that his personality being the opposite of Rivera while being a dude who wears glasses and is like 5’9” puts into question his ability as a “leader of men”. He’s extremely emotionally intelligent, believes in teaching over just motivating, and connects with his players that way—look back at Tua’s vulnerability in his pressers earlier this year about how McDaniel taking time to get to know him as a man and encourage the growth of his strengths on the field—McDaniel literally saved his career in a cool bit of sports psychology that you rarely hear about in this league.
 

You know who is very similar to Rivera in coaching philosophy and almost ended that kid’s career due to destroying his confidence through poor coaching and poor leadership? Flores. That type of old school stoic, honorable, military-style tough love coaching doesn’t connect with everyone, and is dying out in this league in favor of younger guys with high emotional IQ’s who get players to believe that the coaches will coach to their strengths, minimize their weaknesses, and set everyone up for success. Rivera connecting with the men in our locker room one way doesn’t preclude someone else doing it differently somewhere else. 
 

Tua has played poorly in between his concussions btw, if you watch a lot of the Dolphins the main story has been that the team stopped winning when they could no longer produce on offense at a high level because Tua’s own limitations were showing up after being worked around for the first half of the season. He’s a talented kid in a lot of ways but he’s not Mahomes. Hill and Waddle are running open nearly every play and he’s not alway seeing them or able to get them the ball efficiently down the field outside the hash marks. I’m not saying Tua is garbage or that McDaniel shouldn’t be doing more to readjust to the way the league has adjusted to what Tua was doing well early in the season—but the concussion stuff with Tua is kind of a unique situation and it’s tough to know how that’s effected things. The backups have not been good. 
 

Anyways, I’m not personally invested in McDaniel or anything but the narratives on him, especially his personality, are getting too extreme. In fact his personality is one of his big positives, for the players that love him. Even if some of the magic has worn off down the stretch (and when your brand is analytics and trying to outsmart the dinosaurs, people are going to turn on you faster when you hit a down streak) his type of coaching is much more the future of this league than not imo.
 

We’d be lucky to land him, with whatever lessons he learned from a quick firing, if Miami was crazy enough to move on so quickly. He’s the real deal imo and I think the quirkiness and weirdness aspects to his personality are being WAY overblown just by being repeated over and over again in here. The dude still came up the hard way in this league, took his lumps and matured past some early young dumb stuff, and earned his shot in extremely organic fashion with years of hard work and grinding, even at his young age. That shows he gels with the traditional football types, and locker rooms, just fine—he’s not some weirdo outsider who snuck in through the back door. The dude majors in connecting with players through empathy, and positivity, teaching to players’ strengths. He was many players’ favorite coach long before he was on the national radar as a HC candidate, that’s pretty well documented. He has no problem connecting within locker rooms, that’s one of his primary strengths. How people judge his demeanor in a presser doesn’t change that. You don’t need to be like Rivera or Dan Campbell or whoever to be a “leader of men”. In fact many of those types are revealed as frauds as soon as the winning stops—look at Harbough in SF for a prime example. 

I think you missed my point.

 

As people, McDaniels and Rivera are different. So, the conversation flow built on that narrative.

 

I said I thought it would be a major transition for the players to go from Rivera to McDaniel. Someone countered that didn’t matter. I responded that it did, because coaches only get so long and can’t turn over an entire roster. 
 

McDaniels may get fired after a season in Miami. I think that’s nuts, to be honest. But it illustrates my point.

 

You using Flores = Rivera isn’t lost on me. McDaniel had success early coming in and taking Flores’ spot so he could do the same here. Yeah. Maybe. 
 

I’m not sure. I like the guy, actually. I find is humor and approach with the media to be hilarious. 
 

But to the idea that not Rivera = Bad as your post reads, I don’t think that’s what anyone involved in this convo thinks. 
 

It means exactly as it reads: McDaniel and Rivera are polar opposites in style.

 

Thats all that means.

[Warhead36]

1 hour ago, RWJ said:

I don't post much anymore.  Couple of things.  Before we were the Washington Panthers this year and when RR and Co. arrived, we were the Washington Buccaneers.  It sure would be nice for a GM or HC NOT to be tied to their former teams (coaches, players, etc.).  I like to see some different.  Will we?  Time will tell.  

It wouldn't bother me as long as they come from a good organization. Look at the Giants. Their GM came from Buffalo and he brought Daboll with him.

 

The problem is we're hiring retreads from another bad franchise in the Panthers. 

[HigSkin]

😂

 

 

[kingdaddy]

Hire Frank Reich as OC and don't think twice. He was huge in the Eagles SB win and he could help us immensely.