The Skins Can't Win With These Coaches

[illone]

Give this guy a shot to replace Jay the rest of the way, it can't get any worse:  https://www.redskins.com/news/rapid-rise--kevin-oconnell-redskins-offensive-coordinator

[Capsman]

5 hours ago, Spaceman Spiff said:

 

You're correct, totally.  The pick six, he missed by a LOT.  And then he missed on that two point conversion by throwing the ball at Chris Thompson's feet.

 

IMO, Case is like Fitzpatrick.  Fitzpatrick has those "Fitzmagic" games where he looks amazing.  And then goes out the next week and has a clunker.  It's why he's never been able to cling to a full time, starting role.  Case seems to be a boom or bust kind of guy in a similar vein.

 

I think Gruden has lost this team, though.  I'm not sure wtf happened during that safety in the first half but people were coming apart on the sideline when he didn't challenge it.  No one said anything to him directly that I could hear but everyone was like THATS A SAFETY THATS A SAFETY....and nothing.  

 

And Gruden, after the game...has that deer in headlights look.  It's over.

We would have needlessly lost a timeout.  It was not a safety.  Neither Trubisky's feet nor the ball were in the end zone when the tackle began.   The ball was about at the 1 yard-line (although I guess they could have challenged the placement at the 2 yard line).  

[Capsman]

2 hours ago, kingdaddy said:

Trying to be somewhat of a voice of reason I agree with you. I'm actually glad Jay didn't push the panic button and put Haskins in despite how poorly Case played. To your point, Keenum missed seeing McLauren at least 2 other times deep down field in the Eagles game and no one brought it up on the telecast. This team lost Alex Smith and still is swimming upstream trying to recover. All that being said, the stuff the offense ran in the 2nd half was drastically different than the play action drop backs it ran in the 1st half. They ran quick hitting plays, screens and other stuff that got the ball out of Keenum's hands before he had to scan the field. 

One big reason I feel like Jay has lost the team is his failure to fix the defense. To me it's simple, go to Landon Collins and Jonathon Allen and ask them what they think needs to be done. If they say Manusky is playing to soft then either replace him or get him to step up the aggression. I can't believe how lost our defense looked against Trubisky of all people. God help us if Daniel Jones chews us up.

I truly believe that once Haskins plays this team is gonna be much better. The boys will rally around him like the hot new babe who shows up in your high school from another town. Jay's challenge is when to make that happen...I think he knows it but is trying to buy time til he believes Dwayne is ready. 

Final thing, I'm trying to figure out how to watch this team with an eye towards next year knowing that we will lose a lot more than we will win. Beer isn't helping much.

 

I don't think it's even an issue of aggression.  You can be aggressive rushing 6 guys or playing tight man to man and get burned badly.  It's that they are not prepared and, as Jay said, very vanilla in their schemes.  It seems very likely to me that Manusky does not do a lot of opponent film study and/or does not anticipate adjustments they will make.  So at game time he is clueless about making counter adjustments.  it's why every single game we are strong in the first quarter and then collapse spectacularly thereafter.  

 

But yeah, I agree. Ask the guys about Manusky behind closed doors.   

[Tomel]

Sorry if I'm repeating something (I probably am), but the best I can do is scan 31 pages of comments and hope to hit the highlights.

 

First you can't fire the owner -- he's the owner and, frankly, I believe he would love to see his Skins go to the playoffs and the big game

 

Second, I'm sure it's hard for Snyder to part with Allen who's kind of a legacy following his father's years with the Skins.

 

Gruden's the obvious choice to get the ax -- and he should. Same old, same old. I can predict most run plays. Lots of penalties, particularly holding penalties and, in prior years, false starts. Games that go downhill in the second half (sometimes even going downhill from a bad first half). Injury after injury after injury (does Trent, maybe, have it right? Is the medical and / or training staff incompetent? Or is Gruden's cushy training camp not resulting in adequate conditioning -- resulting in more injuries as well as fading as the game progresses.

 

The head coash has to go first. Let the new head coach decide what to do on the defensivive side. If I were Snyder, I would offer a real sweet deal with, say, five years guaranteed and big bonuses for Championship and Super Bowl appearances. In other words, make the deal sweet enough to attract a top, steller coach who, otherwise, wouldn't consider coming to Washington. Make the deal too sweet for anybody to turn down. And do it now! No sense waiting. Gruden has had ample opportunity and the handwriting is on the wall. New coach and new philosophy -- I'll bet Trent comes back in a heartbeat.

 

That's my take.

[wilco_holland]

It shocked me that Dan didn't fire Jay after the first half or today. 

 

We had every right to believe this team was decent but we look like we have no clue. There has been 0 D plays where I'm sitting watching and think NICE! That was a well designed and called play. We just do nothing

[NoCalMike]

I just want to know if Bruce or Dan has been on the phone with Al Saunders after last night, and if not, why?

[kingdaddy]

12 minutes ago, Tomel said:

Sorry if I'm repeating something (I probably am), but the best I can do is scan 31 pages of comments and hope to hit the highlights.

 

First you can't fire the owner -- he's the owner and, frankly, I believe he would love to see his Skins go to the playoffs and the big game

 

Second, I'm sure it's hard for Snyder to part with Allen who's kind of a legacy following his father's years with the Skins.

 

Gruden's the obvious choice to get the ax -- and he should. Same old, same old. I can predict most run plays. Lots of penalties, particularly holding penalties and, in prior years, false starts. Games that go downhill in the second half (sometimes even going downhill from a bad first half). Injury after injury after injury (does Trent, maybe, have it right? Is the medical and / or training staff incompetent? Or is Gruden's cushy training camp not resulting in adequate conditioning -- resulting in more injuries as well as fading as the game progresses.

 

The head coash has to go first. Let the new head coach decide what to do on the defensivive side. If I were Snyder, I would offer a real sweet deal with, say, five years guaranteed and big bonuses for Championship and Super Bowl appearances. In other words, make the deal sweet enough to attract a top, steller coach who, otherwise, wouldn't consider coming to Washington. Make the deal too sweet for anybody to turn down. And do it now! No sense waiting. Gruden has had ample opportunity and the handwriting is on the wall. New coach and new philosophy -- I'll bet Trent comes back in a heartbeat.

 

That's my take.

Sorry but I have to disagree with you on two things you said:

1). What George Allen did in DC has nothing to do with Bruce. If Dan thought like that he would've never changed the name of Jack Kent Cooke Stadium out of respect for what he accomplished as an owner here. 

2). your plan of overpaying a head coach was already tried and it was disastrous: Steve Spurrier. 

[wilco_holland]

7 minutes ago, Tomel said:

The head coash has to go first. Let the new head coach decide what to do on the defensivive side. If I were Snyder, I would offer a real sweet deal with, say, five years guaranteed and big bonuses for Championship and Super Bowl appearances. In other words, make the deal sweet enough to attract a top, steller coach who, otherwise, wouldn't consider coming to Washington. Make the deal too sweet for anybody to turn down. And do it now! No sense waiting. Gruden has had ample opportunity and the handwriting is on the wall. New coach and new philosophy -- I'll bet Trent comes back in a heartbeat.

 

 

I don't think we need to go for the sexy pick. We just need a tone setting HC. We are filled with Bama guys. They want to be coached hard and play hard. O has a big arm QB and Scary T. If we then can get any form of run game going, the play action will come and open it up. You don't need a O genius for that. 

 

We just need a HC who holds people accountable. Get everybody in line both coaches and players. 

[desertbeagle85]

Three games now we've been embarrassed. 3 in a row and here we are and it's Tuesday. Yet no changes, not even firing of the DC. 

 

If that doesn't show you that this organization doesn't care about losing. I don't know what will. This isn't a new catching staff that deserves a shot. This has been going on for years now and the team is regressing. Something has to change and it needs to be now. 

[FrFan]

" Gruden said he doesn’t plan on making any changes to the staff during the season "

Jay Gruden expects Jordan Reed to play again

[sportjunkie07]

1.) Fire Bruce allen. Get a competent gm.

 

2.) hire a younger, bright mind as our head coach. Not because it worked for the rams but because it is the only thing that will work for us.

 

We need a young guy with some energy whose livelihood and future will be determined based on the redskins turning into a success. That is the only way the team turns around. These older guys we hire have already made their mark and will not care enough to make the needed changes when the going gets rough. Gruden can always go work for his brother. He has no motivation to make it work here. 

 

There is a young coach out there with something to prove, who wants to make it bigtime in the nfl. Find him. 

 

Our defensive coach can be an experienced guy, but I'd prefer to go younger there as well. 

 

3.) Purge the roster and free up cap space. Remove Trent Williams and Jordan Reed from the roster. Use the next year to eat dead cap space from the smith debacle and any other undesirable contracts. 

 

3.) Avoid free agency like the plague. No one in the right mind wants to play in DC unless it is money motivated. Those kind of players will not withstand the clowning that this team routinely gets. 

 

4.) Focus on drafting heavily and building a scheme that allows rookies to contribute immediately.

 

5.) Hire a specialist whose focus is clock management. This is such an understudied area in the NFL; it reminds me of using advanced analytics in the movie Moneyball. It is a huge deal, but the nfl hasn't figured it out yet. 

 

 

[mexaskin]

2 hours ago, Tomel said:

Sorry if I'm repeating something (I probably am), but the best I can do is scan 31 pages of comments and hope to hit the highlights.

 

First you can't fire the owner -- he's the owner and, frankly, I believe he would love to see his Skins go to the playoffs and the big game

 

Second, I'm sure it's hard for Snyder to part with Allen who's kind of a legacy following his father's years with the Skins.

 

Gruden's the obvious choice to get the ax -- and he should. Same old, same old. I can predict most run plays. Lots of penalties, particularly holding penalties and, in prior years, false starts. Games that go downhill in the second half (sometimes even going downhill from a bad first half). Injury after injury after injury (does Trent, maybe, have it right? Is the medical and / or training staff incompetent? Or is Gruden's cushy training camp not resulting in adequate conditioning -- resulting in more injuries as well as fading as the game progresses.

 

The head coash has to go first. Let the new head coach decide what to do on the defensivive side. If I were Snyder, I would offer a real sweet deal with, say, five years guaranteed and big bonuses for Championship and Super Bowl appearances. In other words, make the deal sweet enough to attract a top, steller coach who, otherwise, wouldn't consider coming to Washington. Make the deal too sweet for anybody to turn down. And do it now! No sense waiting. Gruden has had ample opportunity and the handwriting is on the wall. New coach and new philosophy -- I'll bet Trent comes back in a heartbeat.

 

That's my take.

 

I can agree with that statement. I just really feel like if we are gonna really move on from this disaster Bruce Allen has to go. He is a big common denominator in all of our problems.  You cant fire the owner of course. If we keep Bruce he's just going to hire another buddy of his. Same old song and dance

[aszumilo]

I'm just waiting for the Swinging Gate play.  That's all I have to look forward to at this point.

[theTruthTeller]

8 hours ago, illone said:

Interesting take here:

 

https://riggosrag.com/2019/09/24/report-redskins-coaching-staff-dealing-incredibly-explosive-situation/

Promoting Rob Ryan to DC would be glorious.

[skinzplay]

A few thoughts on some things Gruden said yesterday, as reported by Keim:

 

"We've played three games against three playoff teams and we haven't played our best ball yet. I anticipate we're going to get better," Gruden said. "We're a pretty young football team on offense, haven't played together a whole lot. They're going to get better. And defensively, I think we've underachieved a little bit, but I still think they're going to come together and we'll make a move here."

 

Translation: "Just wait til we play some bad teams. You know, like how we got off to a 6-3 start last year because only one of the teams we beat made the playoffs, and the rest stunk. Just you wait til we stop playing good teams. Then my offense will click. Then Manusky's defense will be more banana split than vanilla. And you better bring Pa and Aunt Bee to those games because, gee willikers, you're gonna be in for a treat."

 

"I still feel like we have time, and these guys will come together. We have a strong locker room down there, and I feel like we're doing some good things," he said. "We just got to put it all together more consistently."

Translation: "I just need more time. Six years ain't long enough to install my offense. Hell, you see how long it takes me just to get the plays in to the QB. Just you wait and see. By the 19th year of this thing, my system will be just-a-clickin'. I'll have watched enough film to figure all this stuff out. Gotta watch the film. Yes siree, Bob, gonna turn this thing around."

[London Kev]

2 hours ago, skinzplay said:

A few thoughts on some things Gruden said yesterday, as reported by Keim:

 

"We've played three games against three playoff teams and we haven't played our best ball yet. I anticipate we're going to get better," Gruden said. "We're a pretty young football team on offense, haven't played together a whole lot. They're going to get better. And defensively, I think we've underachieved a little bit, but I still think they're going to come together and we'll make a move here."

 

<Edit>

 

I've been a bit of a Jay supporter on the basis that I think he's a good coach and play designer, but a subpar play caller. I still feel that if he relinquished play calling duties, then he and the team would benefit greatly.

 

What does bother me though are the excuses he gave for our bad start; He points out that we've played three playoff teams so far, OK I'll give him that, although Philly only got in as a wildcard with a 9-7 record and they're only 1-2 this year.

 

But him saying that 'we haven't played together a whole lot' is just extraordinary. They've had OTA's, TC, and four pre-season games to prepare, WTF have they been doing? I realise that the left side of the o-line is fairly new, but they have been surprisingly better than expected.

 

His job is to get the team ready for week one, not week four or five, not mid-season, week ****ing one. If the team isn't prepared for week one, then he hasn't done his job and should be held accountable. He's basically saying that we have lost the first three games because we weren't prepared properly and that is just unacceptable. Do your job or GTFOH.

[skinzplay]

For two years, he pointed to injuries as an excuse. Now it's youth as an excuse? Lack of time together? If a HC is using that as an argument to explain subpar performance, then he doesn't deserve to be a HC. We've seen his teams come out lethargic and unprepared far too many times for these last 3 games to be seen as any kind of anomaly. And crying a river over playing 3 playoff teams is just laughable. You get paid millions to figure out how to beat all teams, whether they were in the playoffs last year or not. Maybe the NFL will adjust the way it calculates W/L. If you get beat by a team that was in the playoffs last year, then it doesn't count as a L.

 

I don't disagree with you at all about his skills as a play designer. But I think that's his ceiling. If I were a HC, he'd be an OC without playcalling responsibilities. Buddy Ryan would've probably already knocked him out on the sideline. He's not some QB whisperer, either. Everybody in Cincinnati knows that Ken was the one who worked most closely with Dalton and developed him.

[TheShredder]

On 9/24/2019 at 10:57 AM, Burgold said:

I think the talent's there. I think it's being badly misused. The play calling and strategy is just awful.

 

At the very least, the Redskins have the talent to be a 8-8 or 9-7 type team. They are playing like they have Miami level talent. That's not the case.

Not from what I've seen.  I agree the coaching is terrible however the talent level isn't there.  Some positions are covered but far too many of the important slots are in serious decline or simply subpar.

[skinzplay]

I think we have a Singletary-to-Harbaugh type situation. This team, as is, is coachable to the playoffs. I'm not saying bring in Harbaugh, just making an analogy. The same as when Tony left Tampa. That was a squad ready to roll. The only thing holding them back, really, was Clyde Christensen as OC, and Tony's loyalty to him. Gruden stepped right into a perfect situation and steered a playoff-ready squad to a SB victory. Obviously, we have some mitigating factors at Ashburn. Can they be overcome? I don't know, but with the right coach  --- someone Snyder won't mess with --- and some wise addition-by-subtraction (showing the team president the door), this roster can do some damage.

[SkinsFTW]

On 9/24/2019 at 8:40 AM, Introspect said:

This team has an owner that just wants that money. He claims he is a fan but .... I don't know.

 

Oh, you know.

 

Just look at the fans that show up. Used to be that 200k Redskins fans waited for season tickets and didn't get them for over a decade. Now he's shrunk the capacity and still every opponents fans take over the stadium.

 

But in a few months Dan will be "on a boat"

[RandyHolt]

He's already on an island.  Well, at least Bruce is with him.

 

Dan is the Skipper.  Bruce is Gilligan, of course.

 

 

 

 

[SkinsGuy]

4 minutes ago, RandyHolt said:

He's already on an island.  Well, at least Bruce is with him.

 

Dan is the Skipper.  Bruce is Gilligan, of course.

 

 

 

Wouldn't Snyder be Mr. Howell? 

 

That would make Allen the Skipper and, say, Larry Micheal is Gilligan?

 

[Burgold]

2 minutes ago, SkinsGuy said:

 

 

Wouldn't Snyder be Mr. Howell? 

 

That would make Allen the Skipper and, say, Larry Micheal is Gilligan?

 

All that’s fine, but my question is where’s Ginger and Mary Ann?

[SkinsGuy]

5 minutes ago, Burgold said:

All that’s fine, but my question is where’s Ginger and Mary Ann?

 

Well I would say Ginger is Josh Norman. He wants to be a star.

 

I would say Mary Ann is probably Jay Gruden. He seems like simple folk.

 

Ain't nobody the Professor.

[RandyHolt]

Mrs. Alex Smith is Ginger

Manusky is Mrs Howell

Jay is Mary Ann

OCKOC is the Professor. 

 

At least we can hope.