Dan T. Posted November 20, 2019 Share Posted November 20, 2019 3 minutes ago, AJ* said: It's looking more and more like Rudy is going to be the fall guy here. He's the supposed protective buffer between Sondland and Trump. It's stunning how far Rudy Giuliani has fallen, from crime-fighting U.S. Attorney to "America's Mayor," to... what? Stooge for Donald Trump who will get kicked to the curb by the corrupt liar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumbo Posted November 20, 2019 Share Posted November 20, 2019 ...and castro just dumbs the hell out of himself too just now with the mulvaney quote (a lot of lefties get dumb on that one). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted November 20, 2019 Share Posted November 20, 2019 5 minutes ago, Burgold said: I'm not sure Rudy is willing to take the fall though. He's already made not-so-veiled threats to the White House in regards to this. Ultimately, I don't think it comes down to it though. I don' think there is a crime or misdeed serious enough to make McConnell blink. I don't think you can find enough GOP senators who love their country enough to convict Trump if he is impeached. I don't think Rudy will take the fall either. He's already under investigation; no way does he want all this **** heaped on him in addition to that. Rudy is almost as slimy as Trump is and, despite obviously being a lunatic, does still have a law degree so he'll actually have known that he needs a way to cover his ass in case he seems to be the one left holding the bag. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoCalMike Posted November 20, 2019 Share Posted November 20, 2019 Rudy turning on Trump is all going to come down to the Supreme Court ruling about that "immunity" claim by Trump. If the Supreme Court rules in favor of Trump, then he can pretty much demand folks ignore the subpoenas and they can listen without any repercussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burgold Posted November 20, 2019 Share Posted November 20, 2019 11 minutes ago, Jumbo said: and you left out the most meaningful part of my inference...a lot of dems are simply the same kind of ego-driven self-serving, semi-honest, ethically-pliable, often incompetent camera hogs as many mainstream gopers in the pre-trump gop...i mean the gop were still worse overall by a margin... I can't agree to this inference just because it approaches the gravitational pull of botherism (even though you made an effort to say there is a difference in degrees.) I contend at this point the parties are substantially different in many important ways. Heck, the very fact that the Democrats are still being meek, cautious, and legally careful when Trump is as dirty as can be in this hearing serves as a counterpoint to the bombast and ridiculousness of the bull **** that was the Benghazi hearings. Now, I hardly think the Dems are saints and think many of them are bums/incompetent, but the GOP as currently comprised are malicious in their avarice. They are content to harm people with their policies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drowland Posted November 20, 2019 Share Posted November 20, 2019 Question...How does Rudy take the fall in this? Congress concludes there was illegal activity and makes a criminal referral to the DOJ? Couldn't Barr just ignore it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burgold Posted November 20, 2019 Share Posted November 20, 2019 Just now, drowland said: Question...How does Rudy take the fall in this? Congress concludes there was illegal activity and makes a criminal referral to the DOJ? Couldn't Barr just ignore it? The premise would probably be that Rudy ran the operation in a rogue way without the President's knowledge and wishes. Every bad thing to do was Rudy and everyone else was an innocent bystander or dupe. After all, Trump wanted nothing from Ukraine it was all Rudy who wanted the dirt. That would be the spin anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Llevron Posted November 20, 2019 Share Posted November 20, 2019 Maloney for president. He almost stood up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoCalMike Posted November 20, 2019 Share Posted November 20, 2019 Damn Maloney laying the smackdown on Sondland's nonsense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumbo Posted November 20, 2019 Share Posted November 20, 2019 Just now, Burgold said: <edit stuff> Now, I hardly think the Dems are saints and think many of them are bums/incompetent, but the GOP as currently comprised are malicious in their avarice. They are content to harm people with their policies. well duh the gop as "currently comprised" being far worse is something i've been saying almost every time i post try to keep up bur, i'd call it that you've always been way way more "lefty-biased" then i am at a base level...you have way rosier/forgiving glasses per the dems and always have vs me, and i'd say that shows here...and that's not an attempt at any kind of slam or even necessarily a criticism in this case....when/if you are in error, you're still a benign and non-dangerous agent...and it just may be that my grumpy pants simply make me a hard taskmaster (i know from past comments you've made you'll like that theory) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJ* Posted November 20, 2019 Share Posted November 20, 2019 So Sondland asks an open ended question and Trump just blurts out "no quid pro quo" out of the blue? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoCalMike Posted November 20, 2019 Share Posted November 20, 2019 Sondland comes off as your typical political stooge in way over his head that was appointed to a position he had no business being in, got involved with some bad stuff and his testimony is reflecting that he is too nervous to just come out and say the obvious in fear that he might implicate himself. This is the exact kind of corruption and cronyism that these GOP members claim Trump wanted rooted out in Ukraine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drowland Posted November 20, 2019 Share Posted November 20, 2019 10 minutes ago, Burgold said: The premise would probably be that Rudy ran the operation in a rogue way without the President's knowledge and wishes. Every bad thing to do was Rudy and everyone else was an innocent bystander or dupe. After all, Trump wanted nothing from Ukraine it was all Rudy who wanted the dirt. That would be the spin anyway. Yeah but what would happen to Rudy? Public embarrassment? Or would charges come out of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burgold Posted November 20, 2019 Share Posted November 20, 2019 1 minute ago, Jumbo said: well duh the gop as "currently comprised" being far worse is something i've been saying almost every time i post try to keep up bur, i'd call it that you've always been way way more "lefty-biased" then i am at a base level...you have way rosier/forgiving glasses per the dems and always have vs me, and i'd say that shows here...and that's not an attempt at any kind of slam or even necessarily a criticism in this case....when/if you are in error, you're still a benign and non-dangerous agent...and it just may be that my grumpy pants simply make me a hard taskmaster (i know from past comments you've made you'll like that theory) I wouldn't categorize that as unfair Mind you, I'd also say that history has proven me correct in many of my right vs. left assertions. I'd also contend (and this makes me a bit sad) that I used to be way more neutral in my postings, but time has tilted my viewpoint. It may also be, for example, that while I viewed George W. Bush as often wrong on the issues I didn't really view him as evil or malicious. The current iteration of the Republican party I see as evil and malicious. I find it frustrating that I am losing the ability to give some the benefit of the doubt or the grace to explain why their policy isn't evil, corrupt, evil. I don't like that I see the sky falling. On the other hand, being fair isn't turning a blind eye to the truths we witness. 5 minutes ago, drowland said: Yeah but what would happen to Rudy? Public embarrassment? Or would charges come out of it. I'm not really sure. If a "private citizen" decided to use their own resources to launch an investigation on foreign soil for political purposes if that would be criminal. Now, it'd be really hard to argue that Rudy wasn't wielding or fraudulently wielding the muscle of government to extort an investigation, but I'm not sure... I don't know what would happen to him other than he would become a political pariah. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted November 20, 2019 Share Posted November 20, 2019 7 minutes ago, drowland said: Yeah but what would happen to Rudy? Public embarrassment? Or would charges come out of it. Hard to say. Depends on what the full implications are. Also depends on whether the courts end up compelling the release of documents and testimony by all of the "first hand" witnesses the GOP claims don't exist. Also also depends on whether Barr is willing to insert himself into this mess in order to squash any investigation into Rudy. It's certainly possible that Barr could jump into the mud in this but so far it seems he's being quite scrupulous about keeping himself as far away from it as possible. Barr is one of the only intelligent people left in the admin. Completely amoral and has a ludicrous view of the power of the Executive branch, but he ain't dumb. IMO he knows this impeachment stuff is going nowhere good so he's keeping himself out of it and "focusing" on the "Investigate the investigators" thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No Excuses Posted November 20, 2019 Author Share Posted November 20, 2019 Ministry of Truth getting an early start. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted November 20, 2019 Share Posted November 20, 2019 4 minutes ago, No Excuses said: Ministry of Truth getting an early start. Holy ****balls, that's hilarious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cooked Crack Posted November 20, 2019 Share Posted November 20, 2019 For those that didn't see it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bearrock Posted November 20, 2019 Share Posted November 20, 2019 48 minutes ago, Jumbo said: well duh the gop as "currently comprised" being far worse is something i've been saying almost every time i post try to keep up bur, i'd call it that you've always been way way more "lefty-biased" then i am at a base level...you have way rosier/forgiving glasses per the dems and always have vs me, and i'd say that shows here...and that's not an attempt at any kind of slam or even necessarily a criticism in this case....when/if you are in error, you're still a benign and non-dangerous agent...and it just may be that my grumpy pants simply make me a hard taskmaster (i know from past comments you've made you'll like that theory) Can I have his spot in your administration now? I mean seriously? What does @Burgold have that I don't have? Ability to read? Ability to write? Famous author? Mark Hamil's favorite ES member? Big swinging di..... Alright, I'm just gonna stop now.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
88Comrade2000 Posted November 20, 2019 Share Posted November 20, 2019 2 hours ago, mcsluggo said: the GOP base isn't watching these hearings, they will watch the Jeanine Pirro/Sean Hannity/Tucker Carlson digested and edited summary presentation of the hearings.... and they will emerge outraged at yet ANOTHER brazen attempt by deep-state-socialist-never-trumper's to unjustly tar heroic Donald J Trump and steal an election they could never win. the corrupting influence and damage to the core values of the USA from having a pravda network continuously drip-feeding opium-laced swill directly into the red-blood of red-state citizens is impossible to over-emphasize. It isn't just a disgrace, or a disease... it is a ****ing inoperable gangrenous tumor deep in the brain of the country. It is straight out of a Ray Bradbury or George Orwell story ... but it is vomit-inducing to behold in real-life, rather than in fiction. At dialysis today one of the patients said Watch Fox News. They are revealing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartinC Posted November 20, 2019 Share Posted November 20, 2019 1 hour ago, mistertim said: I don't think Rudy will take the fall either. He's already under investigation; no way does he want all this **** heaped on him in addition to that. Rudy is almost as slimy as Trump is and, despite obviously being a lunatic, does still have a law degree so he'll actually have known that he needs a way to cover his ass in case he seems to be the one left holding the bag. The above would have been Roger Stones line of thinking as well I assume. 1 hour ago, Jumbo said: a lot of dems are simply the same kind of ego-driven self-serving, semi-honest, ethically-pliable, often incompetent camera hogs as many mainstream gopers in the pre-trump gop... Thats a lot of words when you could have said 'politicians'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcsluggo Posted November 20, 2019 Share Posted November 20, 2019 there yer goes with them fancy words and sheet. commernist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LD0506 Posted November 20, 2019 Share Posted November 20, 2019 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No Excuses Posted November 20, 2019 Author Share Posted November 20, 2019 Must be something in the water of Fresno, or maybe he’s just truly representing the nutjob base. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burgold Posted November 20, 2019 Share Posted November 20, 2019 12 minutes ago, LD0506 said: Where's the joke? Seriously, I don't get it. Both Vindman and Nunes appear as they do every day. This is just a photorealistic representation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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