No Excuses Posted May 31, 2018 Share Posted May 31, 2018 1 hour ago, zoony said: Yah those rust belt states reaally came thru for the old girl! De Now stop wasting your time with me, go comb the internet some more to work out that confirmation bias muscle There is a working class in this country beyond the white rural population. The Democrats have a problem reaching white rural voters. I don’t know why pointing a simple fact like this has your panties in a bunch. You could use some nuance in your most overused talking point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sacks 'n' Stuff Posted May 31, 2018 Share Posted May 31, 2018 (edited) 2 hours ago, zoony said: Whats left is two pockets of Dems in this country that chastize the rest of america as dumb because theyre not voting the way they ought to. We know how much you hate that. Of course, you're free to get on here and call people who don't agree with you "goddamn idiots", "hypocritical douchebags", and "****ing *******" til your ass turns blue. Must be nice. The logic loop created by the hypocrisy of you calling someone else a hypocrite could fry Watson's motherboard. Oh, and when someone points out that you are incorrect with statistically verifiable facts, they're the ones who are tone deaf and in an echo chamber. Riiiiiiiight. Let's just call it what it is, you hate liberals. You don't even know why you hate them as is evidenced by the amount of nonsense you post that is easily and immediately debunked. You've just been conditioned by right wing media that preys upon weak-minded people who are easily misled to the point where you will reflexively react to yet another Trump supporter exposing themselves as a racist loon by defending her and attacking the people who criticize her. You're pretty much everything that's wrong with our country right now... an intentionally misinformed, ideologue trained to hate half of his countrymen with no principles beyond "if my side does it it's ok and if the other side does it, it's not". Edited May 31, 2018 by Sacks 'n' Stuff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoCalMike Posted May 31, 2018 Share Posted May 31, 2018 Sometimes I wonder if regional racial demographics determine how easily people tend to fall for scare tactics when it comes to minorities and underrepresented groups. The things I hear "rural white folks" say about immigrants, minorities, etc etc....and not always necessary out of hate/racism, just sheer ignorance because of their own lack of coming into contact with diversity. It begs the question as to whether these people are more easily able to be duped by the types of thing Trump says. It's not hard to shine light on a handful of awful things done by undocumented immigrants, and if you don't have the every day life experience of being shoulder to shoulder with immigrants in general to see that you are much less likely to be in danger from an immigrant then a citizen. I know social media forums are mostly the wrong place to get good quality conversation, but whenever I peek into a comment thread on any topic related to immigration it baffles me the things people say about a state like CA in regards to immigration when they just have no clue what they are talking about, but all they have been told is that immigrants are bad, and CA has a lot of immigrants so their only logical conclusion is that "CA is all messed up" You can't even begin to try to have a conversation with these people because their starting point is already way out there in fantasy land. You'd be putting all your time & energy just trying to get them to acknowledge the real world. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Going Commando Posted May 31, 2018 Share Posted May 31, 2018 Most of my social circle are sheltered conservative Southern Whites. It's not a coincidence that almost all of the Southern Whites that I know who are liberal are things like teachers and healthcare workers who are much less sheltered. It's easy to not care about that which you're sheltered from. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renegade7 Posted May 31, 2018 Share Posted May 31, 2018 (edited) 2 hours ago, zoony said: Easier than admitting to yousrself that youre a goddam idiot. I thought you were a mod. 17 minutes ago, stevemcqueen1 said: It's easy to not care about that which you're sheltered from. How many societies we've seen in history pull off some of the most horrible atrocities in human history because a huge collective of them said "not my problem"? I thought it was a saying, but it was actually a poem: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_they_came_... Edited May 31, 2018 by Renegade7 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bang Posted May 31, 2018 Share Posted May 31, 2018 (edited) Vote for the destruction of the country and selling us out at every turn, using the White House liike a cum rag, huckstering and completely ignoring all attempts to explain WHY the president is not to profit from BEING the president until he['s done.. of all th things we are watching Trump do, **** yes i will tell anyone who voted to help put that asshole in power that they are a bonafide card carrying dumb sonofa****. It's one thing if this admin were simply playing politics as usual, but they are not. they are standing firmly against everything their office stands for and should be. Everything. the stupid sure as **** needs to be slapped out of a lot of people. Party, politics.. ok.. but straight up stupid is inexcusable. relishing in the stupidity .. how does anyone respect any of it? ~Bang Edited May 31, 2018 by Bang 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fresh8686 Posted May 31, 2018 Share Posted May 31, 2018 9 minutes ago, stevemcqueen1 said: Most of my social circle are sheltered conservative Southern Whites. It's not a coincidence that almost all of the Southern Whites that I know who are liberal are things like teachers and healthcare workers who are much less sheltered. It's easy to not care about that which you're sheltered from. It's hard for me to trust people who haven't been through things in life. I think of it like balancing and bridging fire and ice. Too much fire (struggle/scarcity) can break and twist you, make you too hard and bitter. Too much ice (comfort/shelter/abundance) and it numbs you, so the real struggle of others becomes a game or entertainment and you are unable to accurately judge the costs of things. The best way to live is to have a best of both worlds approach. Struggle and risk for the right things at the right intensities so you have skin in the game and have enough history of pain to share in the struggle of others (to actually feel inter-dependency and the benefits of abiding to a social contract). Plus, shelter for the right things at the right intensities so you know what trust and home feel like, so you have something you don't want to lose and instead want to protect and build for yourself and others. You have to have both. Any other combination tends to breed people with ****ed up ways of relating to the world. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGreatBuzz Posted May 31, 2018 Share Posted May 31, 2018 For those claiming gun control is popular with the "working class." It has been mentioned in other threads and I think in hear. When asked "do you support increased gun control?" it gets broad support. But try getting them to agree on the type of gun control. From what I have seen and heard, you could probably get bump stocks and gun show loophole through. That's it. Just saying "gun control" is far too broad a topic and getting people to agree on the details is damn near impossible. Just look at the gun control thread. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renegade7 Posted May 31, 2018 Share Posted May 31, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, Bang said: the stupid sure as **** needs to be slapped out of a lot of people. Party, politics.. ok.. but straight up stupid is inexcusable. relishing in the stupidity .. how does anyone respect any of it? ~Bang I'm starting to think calling Trump's base "stupid" isn't doing them justice. I saw your post before I left work and was thinking about it on/off during the way home, I think "maliciously ignorant" is more appropriate now. When I think "stupid", its not like Trump's base has a learning disability or something that if addressed early enough they wouldn't be doing what they are today. This isn't about them being too stupid to find the truth, they don't want the truth. That's why they ignore any information that interferes with their master plan that they are entrusting Trump with, the point of the article in the OP. They aren't stupid, they know exactly what their doing and hoping the ramifications don't backfire too much on them. Sure some, like my friend, aren't racist, he's just no longer interested in trying to do what's best for certain segments of our society at the expense of the country anymore, saying we've gone too far and need to reel it in. It was touched on people voting against their own best interests because they believe it will hurt others more then it hurts them "I'm not gaming the system, they are, make it harder, I don't care". We say Trump is retarded, but if you look at his actions, they are extremely calculated and textbook path to authoritarianism. We joke about him idolizing strong man, to me, it comes across like he's almost studying them. And he's smart enough to know that he can't get re-elected without his base, why he keeps throwing them red meat every chance he gets and started campaigning as soon as he took office. He is "maliciously ignorant" towards anything that interferes with his agenda or the one that he promised his base. Choosing to be "stupid" on issues so you can continue to hurt other people isn't stupid, its something far worse. The Law only comes up when it fits their agenda. They don't want amnesty because they want them to stay illegal and eventually gone. Edited May 31, 2018 by Renegade7 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinny21 Posted May 31, 2018 Share Posted May 31, 2018 (edited) Man, I just finally got done reading this entire thread.... whew! I wish we could all agree on certain things that need to be changed (and ‘common sense’ ways to bring that change about), but that may be an impossible bridge to span. Off the top of my head, I think I’d like to see Dem candidates talk about these things: About the similarities between urban and rural poor - economically, education-wise, drugs, etc. Talk about Christianity - about how we should strive to treat our neighbors (our fellow man) about helping those that are disadvantaged. Talk about how you’ll support common sense gun reform, but that ‘Conservatives’ must be the ones to lead on it... and if they refuse, they should be held accountable by their constituents. Talk about the historic income gap. Ask why/how giving more money to wealthy companies will reduce that gap (it won’t of course). Talk about how the money could have been/could be better used. About why we need money out of politics and how you (the candidate) will not except corporate money. About support for our schools. Kids in poor neighborhoods/areas need to have support for their schools to give their kids a better future. Talk about trade schools, and Americorps, etc. About how college isn’t for everyone. About how people need to have the “opportunity” to expand their horizons. Talk about our kids and grandkids - how we need to try to improve their lot - with a less effed up environment, the ability to have some faith in their officials, the need for a role model of decency in their politicians, etc. The need to change the marijuana laws to let the states decide. The need for everyone to have a chance at affordable healthcare. About getting rid of gerrymandering through bipartisan means. About the problems social media brings - from fake news, to bubbles, to how teens interact and kids learn. Edited May 31, 2018 by skinny21 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renegade7 Posted May 31, 2018 Share Posted May 31, 2018 22 minutes ago, TheGreatBuzz said: For those claiming gun control is popular with the "working class." It has been mentioned in other threads and I think in hear. When asked "do you support increased gun control?" it gets broad support. But try getting them to agree on the type of gun control. From what I have seen and heard, you could probably get bump stocks and gun show loophole through. That's it. Just saying "gun control" is far too broad a topic and getting people to agree on the details is damn near impossible. Just look at the gun control thread. Where are you looking exactly besides that thread? http://news.gallup.com/poll/1645/guns.aspx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGreatBuzz Posted May 31, 2018 Share Posted May 31, 2018 (edited) 24 minutes ago, Renegade7 said: Where are you looking exactly besides that thread? http://news.gallup.com/poll/1645/guns.aspx Interesting bit that I appreciate you sharing. I only read the first 20 or so polls. And I don't know how to copy the ones I found most interesting in here. But from what I see it kind of backs up what I said. For example, the second poll says 68% feel gun laws should be more strict (broad question). However, the 4th poll shows only 56% favor banning the sale of semi-automatic weapons such as the AR-15. The next poll shows that only 51% feel that availabililty of guns is a great deal of their worry. Poll 9 says only 46% want stricter laws. Poll 10 surprised me that less and less people are for banning handguns except for police. Edit: I just got to the one that asks about the effectiveness of potential new gun laws on mass shootings. 42% (at least double of any other answer) said the new laws would have no effect on mass shootings. That is very interesting. Edited May 31, 2018 by TheGreatBuzz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGreatBuzz Posted May 31, 2018 Share Posted May 31, 2018 32 minutes ago, Renegade7 said: Where are you looking exactly besides that thread? http://news.gallup.com/poll/1645/guns.aspx There are actually some really interesting polls in there that surprised the crap outta me. I'm going to post the link in the Gun Control thread. A poll from 2015 found more people feel that the Republicans match their feelings on gun control than Democrats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renegade7 Posted May 31, 2018 Share Posted May 31, 2018 (edited) 53 minutes ago, TheGreatBuzz said: But from what I see it kind of backs up what I said. I'll focus more on talking about this in the Gun Control Thread (later, busy right now), but this part seems pretty straight forwards: 37 minutes ago, TheGreatBuzz said: There are actually some really interesting polls in there that surprised the crap outta me. I'm going to post the link in the Gun Control thread. A poll from 2015 found more people feel that the Republicans match their feelings on gun control than Democrats. Have to be careful with any poll results that aren't current. In that example, its very close to Dems, its hard to argue its not at least even now, three years later. It feels like a loaded question anyway without knowing if the poll is split 50/50 Republicans and Democrats. Dems may be on the fence on how far to go with control, Republicans seem all in with the NRA. Edited May 31, 2018 by Renegade7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
visionary Posted June 1, 2018 Share Posted June 1, 2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mbws Posted June 1, 2018 Share Posted June 1, 2018 On 5/9/2018 at 9:59 AM, twa said: Kasich reminds me of the Maverick ya'll loved so much....until it came time to vote for him. For the record I would have voted for him if not for Caribou Barbie ****ing it all up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twa Posted June 1, 2018 Share Posted June 1, 2018 Just now, mbws said: For the record I would have voted for him if not for Caribou Barbie ****ing it all up. Everyone has a excuse. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LD0506 Posted June 1, 2018 Share Posted June 1, 2018 Just as a snotty aside, I absolutely love the way the oxycontin trailer trash demographic is always labeled the "working class" 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mbws Posted June 1, 2018 Share Posted June 1, 2018 43 minutes ago, twa said: Everyone has a excuse. What's yours? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renegade7 Posted June 1, 2018 Share Posted June 1, 2018 9 minutes ago, LD0506 said: Just as a snotty aside, I absolutely love the way the oxycontin trailer trash demographic is always labeled the "working class" I never did like that term, like everyone that doesn't fit what people consider the working class doesn't work. Please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LD0506 Posted June 1, 2018 Share Posted June 1, 2018 6 minutes ago, Renegade7 said: I never did like that term, like everyone that doesn't fit what people consider the working class doesn't work. Please. I'll tell you this from where I'm at, I look around and see a lot Hispanics replacing roofs and delivering appliances and mowing lawns but somehow they aren't "the working class". But then the African American doctors and Filipino nurses at Christiana aren't either. The guys from the Ivory Coast I was talking to about choosing ladders in Home Depot the other day? Nope, no way. You get my drift............ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renegade7 Posted June 1, 2018 Share Posted June 1, 2018 17 minutes ago, LD0506 said: I'll tell you this from where I'm at, I look around and see a lot Hispanics replacing roofs and delivering appliances and mowing lawns but somehow they aren't "the working class". But then the African American doctors and Filipino nurses at Christiana aren't either. The guys from the Ivory Coast I was talking to about choosing ladders in Home Depot the other day? Nope, no way. You get my drift............ I do, felt that same way. I looked into it finally, its technically supposed to be "voters without a college education working jobs that don't require a college degree", but the context I always see is concerning the White Working Class (they should either clarify the term or get rid of it). Seems like immigrants get their own category even when many of them are working class, it insinuates they don't work, so its not helping the discussion of our demographics at all. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcsluggo Posted June 1, 2018 Share Posted June 1, 2018 On 5/29/2018 at 1:00 PM, No Excuses said: Roseanne Barr's racist and anti-semetic meltdown on twitter today is pretty interesting. I don't think she expected the backlash she received because right wing twitter is basically a cess pool of racism and junk conspiracy theories. This is their normal. Also, the most visibly pro-Trump entertainer being a racist loon is a pretty good indicator that the GOP is indeed the party of racist nutjobs. Yes, we should stop trying to understand them and instead contemplate how we can make our society function when at a minimum 35% of the voter base is nuts. apparently she really IS a Trumpster... to her core. Hell, she is almost a Trump clone : https://www.snopes.com/news/2018/05/29/roseanne-barr-twitter-storm/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twa Posted June 1, 2018 Share Posted June 1, 2018 42 minutes ago, mbws said: What's yours? Hillary 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
visionary Posted June 3, 2018 Share Posted June 3, 2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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