Voice_of_Reason

Evaluating Jay Gruden in 2018

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It was really disappointing (and surprising) to see so many empty seats at the home opener. Snyder can't be happy about that. Thankfully we won last week, but it was hard to watch as Gruden reverted to his opening game approach in the home opener. Complete lack of adjustment at any point during the contest, and just completely out-coached.

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1 hour ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

And replace with who? Cavanagh? Callahan?  Neither of those guys are inspiring...

Allen has to go first, during the season. And hire a new GM who is given full authority to blow everything up and rebuild it.  

:rofl89:

 

Dan Snyder will NEVER hire a person to be a traditional GM and let that GM then hire the coach.  He won't give the GM that kind of power. Odds are if Allen gets the boot, Dan gives the job to Doug Williams.

 

We all know, Dan is going to go after a big name coach next.  It's that turn, in the Snyder hiring cycle.  

 

I don't know of any big name NFL retreads Dan cure lure out of retirement; so my guess Dan tries the big name college coach.

 

Nick Saban?  Jim Harbaugh? Urban Meyer?   Somebody like that will be Gruden's eventual successor and they will have the real personnel control.

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1 hour ago, Bishop Hammer said:

The funny part is while Kyle was here people hated him and wanted him gone.  Even going as far as saying he only got the gig because he was Mike's son.  

 

Its even funnier how when he left he his next team went to The Superbowl and is now considered an up and coming young head coach.

The Browns went to the Super Bowl in 2014?

Edited by NickyJ
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2 minutes ago, Cooleyfan1993 said:

? wow, before you said that, i had forgotten that’s where he went after us ? wow. 

I know, I think he's the ONLY coach to make it out of there in one piece. It deserves a medal in itself.

Edited by NickyJ
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1 hour ago, Bishop Hammer said:

The funny part is while Kyle was here people hated him and wanted him gone.  Even going as far as saying he only got the gig because he was Mike's son.  

 

Its even funnier how when he left he his next team went to The Superbowl and is now considered an up and coming young head coach.

 

That's not what I remember at all. I remember people wishing there were some way of keeping Kyle but getting rid of Mike. There may have been a vocal few that did not like Kyle overall but the majority liked Kyle as an OC and as an up and coming HC. But there was no way to get rid of Mike and keep Kyle. He was not staying. That was a package deal. 

 

As for Sean - It was and has always been Jays offense run here. And Jay taught Sean how to call plays. Jay is generally considered by most NFL experts to be an excellent play caller. It seems since Madden all fans are the best play callers in the world and whoever is there coach is just stupid. 

 

Jay like everyone is no where near perfect. The play calling is not the problem. It's getting guys ready after a big win. Consistently this team cannot get up after a big win. While in general I think his laid back approach is good here, that is one place it yields poor results. He needs to pull a Popovich or Jackson or Gibbs and all but ignore a win and act and talk like the team just got blown out. It appears he keeps thinking when they have a good win they have "arrived" and the team carries that with them into the next game. 

 

Not sure what kind of "hot seat" Jay was on coming into the season,. But after the loss to the ****ing Colts I would expect he is there now and has 14 games to prove why he should get another season. If Jay does get fired after (during) this season my one hope is that Bruce goes with him. 

 

 

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5 hours ago, goskins10 said:

 

That's not what I remember at all. I remember people wishing there were some way of keeping Kyle but getting rid of Mike. There may have been a vocal few that did not like Kyle overall but the majority liked Kyle as an OC and as an up and coming HC. But there was no way to get rid of Mike and keep Kyle. He was not staying. That was a package deal. 

 

As for Sean - It was and has always been Jays offense run here. And Jay taught Sean how to call plays. Jay is generally considered by most NFL experts to be an excellent play caller. It seems since Madden all fans are the best play callers in the world and whoever is there coach is just stupid. 

 

Jay like everyone is no where near perfect. The play calling is not the problem. It's getting guys ready after a big win. Consistently this team cannot get up after a big win. While in general I think his laid back approach is good here, that is one place it yields poor results. He needs to pull a Popovich or Jackson or Gibbs and all but ignore a win and act and talk like the team just got blown out. It appears he keeps thinking when they have a good win they have "arrived" and the team carries that with them into the next game. 

 

Not sure what kind of "hot seat" Jay was on coming into the season,. But after the loss to the ****ing Colts I would expect he is there now and has 14 games to prove why he should get another season. If Jay does get fired after (during) this season my one hope is that Bruce goes with him. 

 

 

 

it was more than a vocal few.  Kyle had a way of outsmarting himself, never really going for the high percentage play.  Much like in the Super Bowl with Atlanta where all they needed to do was kill some clock and he threw three straight  passes

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9 minutes ago, carex said:

 

it was more than a vocal few.  Kyle had a way of outsmarting himself, never really going for the high percentage play.  Much like in the Super Bowl with Atlanta where all they needed to do was kill some clock and he threw three straight  passes

 

If you want to include game day rants then we must include the same comments about Sean. All was not always peaches and cream. Many a people were cussing him over play calling. I seem to remember many a game where he was accused of abandoning the run way too early. And that brings me back to my main point - Even when we win many are certain they are better play callers than whoever is calling plays. 

 

After the game day rant, most people acknowledged that Kyle was a pretty decent OC. 

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 Jay should be feeling the heat pretty quickly this season.

His post-game pressers are the same, you could play a recording of him 2 years ago and compare it to Sunday's, and it would be pretty much the same stuff; gotta play better, gotta get off the field defensively, gotta call plays better, etc etc.

He did admit to not adjusting until way into the 3rd qtr, so that's telling. The Colts were keeping Luck upright with his patchwork o-line, so why didn't Manusky have pkgs more designed to create pressure? Sure, Luck has a quick release, but the secondary shouldn't be playing so soft in that situation.

 

I'm done with Gruden. To me he is another Haslett; Thompson will be gone by week 7 from being beaten up by being used so much, Doctson is tall enough to battle for and win many catches if given the chance but either its not thrown to him or Gruden isn't aggressive enough to chance it, so it boils down to the TEs.

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25 minutes ago, skins island connection said:

 Jay should be feeling the heat pretty quickly this season.

His post-game pressers are the same, you could play a recording of him 2 years ago and compare it to Sunday's, and it would be pretty much the same stuff; gotta play better, gotta get off the field defensively, gotta call plays better, etc etc.

He did admit to not adjusting until way into the 3rd qtr, so that's telling. The Colts were keeping Luck upright with his patchwork o-line, so why didn't Manusky have pkgs more designed to create pressure? Sure, Luck has a quick release, but the secondary shouldn't be playing so soft in that situation.

 

I'm done with Gruden. To me he is another Haslett; Thompson will be gone by week 7 from being beaten up by being used so much, Doctson is tall enough to battle for and win many catches if given the chance but either its not thrown to him or Gruden isn't aggressive enough to chance it, so it boils down to the TEs.

Josh Doctson has proven time and time again that he is very unreliable.  How many drops do you need to see?  Pryor only lasted one season.  When Maurice Harris is healthy Doctson should see the bench.

 

If we’re talking about firing people, don’t talk to me until Bruce Allen is fired and replaced with an actual General Manager.

Edited by -JB-
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Just read the Times piece and I'm madder than ever

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2018/sep/16/redskins-blame-low-energy-colts-loss/

 

LOW ENERGY!!!! This has been a recurring theme with the Redskins not just with Gruden but since Gibbs quit....Honestly, can anyone who has played the sport in College or above explain what Peterson is saying???? Is it JUST LAZY??? WTH?? I believe it, we ALL see it..again and again. It's like a cancer that had been eating this team forever..

 

Seriously, is it the DC location and all the "activities" the athletes are partaking of?

 

I've said it so many time that Gruden is NOT a disciplinarian. If people are NOT TRYING and you and the team knows it..BENCH EM..make it public and humiliating and if you lose SO WHAT....gotta get control of this teams soul...right now it's SOFT..

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"Just played harder than us." - CT  (he didnt look happy in the video, def taking the loss hard)

 

https://www.redskins.com/video/chris-thompson-our-offense-is-way-better-than-what-we-did-today

 

"Energy level coming out was really poor." - AP

 

https://www.redskins.com/video/adrian-peterson-there-s-a-lot-we-re-going-to-learn-from-this-game-to-make-us-bet

 

Year 5, I think this is common to a lot of NFL teams, but at least 2-3 times a year, our team comes out flat with no energy and will lose to any opponent. If its a good team, we get steam rolled, a bad team we lose by 2 possessions or more.

 

Does some things really well like playcalling and offense but I dont think he is a leader of men and I think you still need that in todays NFL.

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The Redskins coaching tree is going to be the first one in NFL history to be a tiny shrivelled up rotten mess and somehow produce mighty oaks all around it.

Its disheartening to say the least and a huge indicator that our management has no idea how to get the most out of what is already in house.

Edited by redskinss
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Reading about the energy level reminds me of Gruden claiming that he was not responsible for motivating players. I don't have a quote right now. I just remember him saying it. I think that is a major reason we come out flat on games. He says that NFL players should be self motivated or they shouldn't be in the NFL.

 

I've defended Gruden til this point. But, if he doesn't make a playoff appearance this year, he needs to go. With yesterday's outcome, I don't see him making the playoffs.

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Ok, if was going to do this. I'd blow it all up., I'd fire Allen, promote Smith (not Alex) and hire a hard nosed, defensive minded coach.

 

And get a OC.

 

I don't have specifics. I got 3 hours of sleep last night and thinking hurts. :P

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Gruden is the type of guy who formulates a game plan and if it works, is as happy as can be.   If,however, he has to make in-game adjustments, is in trouble.  He doesn't seem or look that bright.  The guy is just average at best and that's it.  This is what we have to look forward to every week

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Just fire Joke Gruden already and focus on a top 10  pick. With this Joke of a HC we will be getting a mid round 1st pick (useless) and another mediocre season of DEATH BY A THOUSAND CHECKDOWNS.

 

 

Look to a playoff team and hire a young coordinator that has AMBITION, fire, and grit. Tired of seeing this Joke Gruden act a toad and roll over when things are harder than he thought it would be. FIVE YEARS OF THAT IS ENOUGH!

 

 

#FIREGRUDEN (and his entire staff)

Edited by zealoustuttle

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Gruden hasn't won a season opener at home, I believe. They always underachieve yet somehow manage to right the ship. A few years ago, this team started off 0-2 with losses to the Steelers and another team I can't remember. They had to win in New York and did so. That was the start of a little winning streak although the team finished 8-7-1. 

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1 hour ago, Fan since a Fetus said:

Reading about the energy level reminds me of Gruden claiming that he was not responsible for motivating players. I don't have a quote right now. I just remember him saying it. I think that is a major reason we come out flat on games. He says that NFL players should be self motivated or they shouldn't be in the NFL.

 

I've defended Gruden til this point. But, if he doesn't make a playoff appearance this year, he needs to go. With yesterday's outcome, I don't see him making the playoffs.

 

I don't like the lack of accountability, but I also agree with his point. 

 

Do you guys really think that Andy Reid is slapping shoulder pads in the Chiefs locker room? 

8 minutes ago, ixcuincle said:

Gruden hasn't won a season opener at home, I believe. They always underachieve yet somehow manage to right the ship. A few years ago, this team started off 0-2 with losses to the Steelers and another team I can't remember. They had to win in New York and did so. That was the start of a little winning streak although the team finished 8-7-1. 

 

It's no great feat but I think we lost the 2014 opener (on the road) and then came home and destroyed the Jags. 

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I blame Bruce Allen and the FO in general over Gruden at this point.  They let go our best receivers, QB, and now a promising defensive young talent in Fuller,  ****ing up team chemistry badly, yet expect to still win.  Our FO are BUFFOONS to the highest degree and it's scary they are actually still employed.  We will continue to struggle with these baffoons in charge.  

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As fans- we must be insane as the definition of insanity is the repetition of the same, but expecting changing results. Every year, over the past two decades we expect different results from the same pathetic ownership- and for the past 5 years from the same hopeless coaching staff. Here comes another 7- 9 season.

 

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OK..so Gruden doesn't think he should motivate...Just PLAY the Players who are Hungry and sit the rest..trade em next year (if you are still here) but get those cancers off the team..sheesh they even have AP making excuses for them...THAT is low.

 

It's put up or shut up time..maybe Jay doesn't want to be HC, just like Mike wanted to be fired...

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While I struggle to find any reason to defend Gruden yesterday, it shouldn't even be a question that the primary issue with this football team starts with the piss poor organizational structure and trickles down from there.  I know you can't necessarily see it on gameday but like every other business, success and failure starts at the very top and works its way down the organization.  What you see on gameday is the coach and his DC getting their ass handed to them and for good reason, you think swapping that out will make all the difference in the world.  Unfortunately, that's rarely the case.

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