Redskins receiving corp is beginning to shape up

[RichmondRedskin88]

Seriously would it really hurt to give Dez a shot?

[TheBlueIndian]

I was at the game and I don't remember seeing Quick get on the field. Can anyone confirm, was he out there at all. He wasn't listed as inactive.

[carex]

 

 

22 minutes ago, bobandweave said:

 

I did and it is on the receivers. Too many dropped passes they look like they are all 50-50 to catch the ball. The Reed fumble. There is plenty of blame to rest on the receivers hands before looking elsewhere imo

 

Shorter routes only would play into the dink and dunk offense and make the opposing team stack the box and rush more. The receivers need to hold onto the ball and make plays with there legs to open the offense up

 

there were only a couple of deeper passes dropped.  That's not enough to change the entire flow of the game

15 minutes ago, RichmondRedskin88 said:

Seriously would it really hurt to give Dez a shot?

 

if they believe the guy is a cancer then YES

[NoCalMike]

Any word on whether Maurice Harris is going to be able to play this week?

[MariusVT]

20 minutes ago, TheBlueIndian said:

I was at the game and I don't remember seeing Quick get on the field. Can anyone confirm, was he out there at all. He wasn't listed as inactive.

 

He was on the sidelines, caught a glimpse of him.

[megared]

16 hours ago, carex said:

cause no one else offered a fifth?  I think I saw the condition is if he's not active for  10 games they send back a pick

 

Apparently no one even offered a 6th, because that's in essence what the Patriots wanted to give.  They don't have a 6th rounder in the upcoming draft, so they offered a 5th, and get the Brown's 7th back if Gordon doesn't play 10 games this season. 

 

I can't see how we couldn't have gotten the deal done with a presumably much higher value 5th rounder, and for the fact that it gets him out of the AFC.  

Edited September 18, 2018 by megared

[CjSuAvE22]

6 minutes ago, megared said:

 

Apparently no one even offered a 6th, because that's in essence what the Patriots wanted to give.  They don't have a 6th rounder in the upcoming draft, so they offered a 5th, and get the Brown's 7th back if Pryor doesn't play 10 games this season. 

 

I can't see how we couldn't have gotten the deal done with a presumably much higher value 5th rounder, and for the fact that it gets him out of the AFC.  

Bruce Allen knows only how to get fleeced in trades if it’s a good deal he can’t get it together and get er done

[Voice_of_Reason]

11 hours ago, NoCalMike said:

From what I remember when Garcon & D-Jax were both free agents, Garcon was asking for a lot more than the front office was offering but D-Jax only got a few million more from Tampa then we were offering.  

They probably couldn't afford to keep both, you're right.  There was a lot of thought that they would have preferred to keep Garcon because he makes the big 3rd-down catches, tough-guy, etc.  And DJax is a head case.

 

That said, DJax has the TALENT to scare defenses.  Garcon worries defenses, but doesn't scare them.  And that's not a knock on him.  DJax is special.  You stick him out there, and you're playing 10 on 9 (if you count the QB) or 9 on 9 (if you don't) if you don't across the board, because 2 guys are going to be watching DJax on just about every play.  That's an advantage OCs should be able to maximize, even if they only get DJax 3-4 targets a game.  It SHOULD open up everything else.

 

 

 

11 hours ago, NoCalMike said:

We could have retained one of the two. I really think the front office drafted Doctson in anticipation of them both leaving and assumed with Crowder emerging in the slot, and Dotson being a 1st rounder, we could fill in the gap via free agency.  Ryan Grant was still younger at the time and maybe Gruden felt he could be developed. 

You're right, but the problem with this theory is that going into the 2017 season, Doctson hadn't shown anything but the ability to be hurt.  The plan was actually to have Doctson and Crowder on the outside, and then Crowder would slide inside and Grant would start in 3 WR sets.  The problem is that Crowder isn't big or fast enough to play on the outside consistently.  He's a slot guy, and they figured that out when he couldn't get off blocks. 

 

Then it because Grant and Doctson, and that's about as meek a pairing as you can have in the NFL. 

 

Gruden loved Grant because he's a try-hard guy who knows what he's doing.  But he just doesn't have the physical talent to be a starting WR in the league.  He's a great 3rd or 4th option and spot starter.  If Gruden couldn't see that immediately, then he's not good at judging talent, because it was obvious from the get-go.

 

[megared]

...

Edited September 18, 2018 by megared
doublepost

[carex]

47 minutes ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

They probably couldn't afford to keep both, you're right.  There was a lot of thought that they would have preferred to keep Garcon because he makes the big 3rd-down catches, tough-guy, etc.  And DJax is a head case.

 

That said, DJax has the TALENT to scare defenses.  Garcon worries defenses, but doesn't scare them.  And that's not a knock on him.  DJax is special.  You stick him out there, and you're playing 10 on 9 (if you count the QB) or 9 on 9 (if you don't) if you don't across the board, because 2 guys are going to be watching DJax on just about every play.  That's an advantage OCs should be able to maximize, even if they only get DJax 3-4 targets a game.  It SHOULD open up everything else.

 

 

 

You're right, but the problem with this theory is that going into the 2017 season, Doctson hadn't shown anything but the ability to be hurt.  The plan was actually to have Doctson and Crowder on the outside, and then Crowder would slide inside and Grant would start in 3 WR sets.  The problem is that Crowder isn't big or fast enough to play on the outside consistently.  He's a slot guy, and they figured that out when he couldn't get off blocks. 

 

Then it because Grant and Doctson, and that's about as meek a pairing as you can have in the NFL. 

 

Gruden loved Grant because he's a try-hard guy who knows what he's doing.  But he just doesn't have the physical talent to be a starting WR in the league.  He's a great 3rd or 4th option and spot starter.  If Gruden couldn't see that immediately, then he's not good at judging talent, because it was obvious from the get-go.

 

 

well Gruden never tried to make him a first or second option, so I think he did see that.  If you're refering to the times he was listed as starting, I point out that Jordan Reed and Jamison Crowder were also starting, so I'd say WR1 is option 1, with Reed and Crowder options 2 and 3 and WR2 as option 4

[RichmondRedskin88]

1 hour ago, carex said:

 

 

if they believe the guy is a cancer then YES

 

Our FO and staff are a cancer and they get to stay.

[repo_4]

I don't understand why so many here are so negative. We now have THREE 1st round picks at WR, THREE! Nobody else can boast that kind of talent. I don't think you guys understand what 3 first round picks can do to one position group. THREE! They will run free and can't be covered. Smith is going to throw for 8,000 yards now.

 

CHAMPIONSHIP!!

[CPAllTheWay012]

2 hours ago, RichmondRedskin88 said:

Seriously would it really hurt to give Dez a shot?

Yeah, bare minimum... why not work him out?  There’s almost no risk. 

[Voice_of_Reason]

1 hour ago, carex said:

 

well Gruden never tried to make him a first or second option, so I think he did see that.  If you're refering to the times he was listed as starting, I point out that Jordan Reed and Jamison Crowder were also starting, so I'd say WR1 is option 1, with Reed and Crowder options 2 and 3 and WR2 as option 4

That's actually a factually incorrect statement.  Grant was the primary WR opposite Doctson for much of the season in 2 WR sets.  And there were plenty of 3rd downs where Grant was the primary WR.  If you're a WR for 60% of snaps, clearly they expect you to produce, not just be a decoy ad block safeties in the run game. 

 

Grant played on 60% of offensive snaps in 2017.  Doctson played on 74% and Crowder 66%

 

It started where Crowder would pay outside opposite Doctson, but flipped pretty early in the year where Grant would play outside opposite Doctson in 2 and 3 WR sets.  If you discount the first few games before the roles flipped a bit, I'm pretty sure Grant would have had more snaps than Crowder.

 

[carex]

43 minutes ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

That's actually a factually incorrect statement.  Grant was the primary WR opposite Doctson for much of the season in 2 WR sets.  And there were plenty of 3rd downs where Grant was the primary WR.  If you're a WR for 60% of snaps, clearly they expect you to produce, not just be a decoy ad block safeties in the run game. 

 

Grant played on 60% of offensive snaps in 2017.  Doctson played on 74% and Crowder 66%

 

It started where Crowder would pay outside opposite Doctson, but flipped pretty early in the year where Grant would play outside opposite Doctson in 2 and 3 WR sets.  If you discount the first few games before the roles flipped a bit, I'm pretty sure Grant would have had more snaps than Crowder.

 

 

 I'm saying being WR2 doesn't make you the second most likely target

[Voice_of_Reason]

1 minute ago, carex said:

 

 I'm saying being WR2 doesn't make you the second most likely target

He was 4th on the team on targets:

1. Crowder - 103

2. Doctson - 78

3. V. Davis - 69

4. Grant - 65

 

That's a lot of targets.  I'll give you, Reed and CT would have probably gotten some targets from everywhere if they were healthy.  But that's still a lot of targets.

 

And IF the WR who's playing outside isn't a primary threat to do something, that's a problem in it's own right.  If he's just out there because you need somebody to be out there, that's a tough look in and of itself. 

[dswerdlw]

I know we waived Chesson to make room for Perriman.  But who else did we waive or put on injured reserve to make room for Floyd?    

[Chachie]

Are we just seeing the effects of a new QB still building his relationship with young WRs? I'm almost ready to declare Docston a bust but Richardson is brand new here and Crowder is a slot WR who isn't exactly used to Alex Smith's arm yet.

 

Thoughts?

[RFK Lives]

I hope that is part of it. 

 

Given the game Moses and Williams had and the predictable snap count, Smith did not have a lot of time to locate Doctson, Richardson or Crowder.

 

I did not get to go to Training Camp this year to see what the chemistry was or wasn't with the wideouts.  Going to chalk it up to a bad game all around and I can't judge the AZ game as we really didn't throw to WR's that game.  I think to have a puncher's chance against GB, we will have to incorporate the WR's and take some shots but the line better block better and the Rhino Rhino crap better be changed up or Clay Matthews will have some career resurgence game with 4 sacks.

 

[Sandy Monk]

29 minutes ago, dswerdlw said:

I know we waived Chesson to make room for Perriman.  But who else did we waive or put on injured reserve to make room for Floyd?    

 

Kelley was put in I.R. 

[bobandweave]

It’s so Bruce Allen and Dan Snyder to see the Patriots get Josh Gordon for a low round pick while the Redskins get a guy with a DUI and a first round bust. 

[carex]

12 minutes ago, bobandweave said:

It’s so Bruce Allen and Dan Snyder to see the Patriots get Josh Gordon for a low round pick while the Redskins get a guy with a DUI and a first round bust. 

 

Floyd has 146 receptions and 2256 yards while Gordon has 43 and 655 since 2014.  Floyd is one violation towards losing a year, Gordon is one violation from losing his career

 

The Patriots occasionally take risks like this.  They picked up Albert Haynesworth from us.  And we all know how he resurrected his career there.... oh wait.  Not all the risks work out

Edited September 18, 2018 by carex

[bobandweave]

Stats like those don’t tell the real story

 

Josh Gordon exceptional playmaker receiver with a drug problem. When he’s on the field he is a difference maker

 

Perriman is a first round bust receiver who is still on his first NFL guaranteed contract. Meaning the Ravens who owed him guaranteed money cut him regardless. This is rare in the NFL

 

Floyd on the other hand is now on his fifth NFL team after being drafted in 2012. One of those teams was the Patriots so while your discussing not all Patriot moves working out for them include his name. The last time he played well was in 2016. 

 

Point is that neither of these guys are any good and neither has any upside to be hopeful for. It is a mistake to think that four other teams got it wrong with Floyd and the Redskins will get something out of him. It’s also wrong to think the Redskins can get anything out of Perriman because they have never shown they can draft a receiver and get him to play up to potential or exceed potential.

 

What has worked before for the Redskins is when they get players who show they can play in this league on other teams. There are/were other choices like that they could have gone with today like Gordon but choose the wrong path. Again

Edited September 18, 2018 by bobandweave

[Sandy Monk]

I'm not too concerned or overjoyed about the new WRs brought in, but really, they should be barely noticeable behind the 4 wideouts above them on the depth chart anyway. (and yeah, I figure by now, Mo will be 4th)

[bobandweave]

It’s the lack of attention to detail that bugs me about this and It’s the forgetting the past that bugs me with the teams management.

 

I am expecting nothing at all from these signings and this just being more lip service then anything. Someone can say they did something about this issue when in reality they could have signed two guys from the local 7-11 and gotten the same results. 

 

To me the reason some teams turn it around is they take risks and those risks pay off. This is not risky at all and it’s a safe way out. The management has no idea if these two can play anymore or even how to use them. But hey management did something. That’s the point with moves like this. It’s the Bruce Allen way