Will Cousins Play For The Skins In 2018

[Tay]

Imo, it's on the team that a deal didn't get done the first off-season. It was on Kirk this past off-season. 

 

I'm not mad at either for their decision. We will see how it works out fairly shortly.

 

Kirk has options. The team has options. 

 

I think the best option for both is continuity. Hopefully they can work it out. 

[Stefanskins]

1 hour ago, wit33 said:

 

Eli Manning passed Elway in passing yards today. 

passed him? wow

[SkinsFTW]

6 minutes ago, Stefanskins said:

passed him? wow

 

Eil has missed 1 game in 14 years. Yards in this current league is almost meaningless.

[Rufus T Firefly]

11 minutes ago, Stefanskins said:

passed him? wow

It's all about the arm strength.

[veteranskinsfan]

I hope he stays with Skins but if he does not I can see Denver making a big salary offer to get him.  If I was KC and did not want to resign with the Skins, then I would go to Steelers if Big Ben retires.

[mistertim]

6 hours ago, TouchdownSkin said:

 

That wasn't my point.  He was saying Kirk should leave the Redskins because they'll never be good and Kirk deserves better.  Not really fan talk.

 

 

I think one of the problems here is that most teams who may be willing to offer him that much money are going to be bottom dwellers and likely have far worse talent than us. Cleveland, SF (though they just gave up a high 2nd rounder for Jimmy G. so I'm guessing they'll stick with him for now and draft for talent around him since they basically have zero), maybe the Jets but their talent sucks as well. Only ones I could possibly see would be Denver or Jax.

 

In Denver, they're going to have a top 5-7 pick in a deep QB class so I have a feeling Elway may want to draft his own young (and cheap) guy to develop instead of giving up a king's ransom for Cousins, but I suppose it's possible. Even so, they really don't have many decent players on offense in general right now so there's no guarantee that Kirk could just be plugged in and they'd suddenly be playoff contenders again.

 

Jax could be a possibility. They have a decent team but need a QB. I don't think NYG are in the mix. They'll probably draft a new QB...I think they realize they're rebuilding now so not all that much sense in paying a 30 year old QB the most money in the NFL in that case. Their defense is still ok but they have some huge money invested in it so if they pay Kirk what he wants they're eventually going to have to have cap casualties on some of their top defensive talent.

 

Anyway, I'm thinking there will be 3 QBs taken in the top 10 this coming draft. 

[NoCalMike]

Step 1: The front office has to confirm that Cousins wants to be here.  Behind closed-doors, pull no punches. Both sides need to be straight with each other ASAP. 

 

The other reality we all have to deal with is that there are going to be other teams who are in a better financial situation to offer Cousins everything he wants & more, and if Cousins is looking for the richest contract offer out there, he is likely as good as gone.  If Cousins's #1 objective is to be the QB in Washington for his entire career or at least for all of his prime playing years, he likely is not going to be taking the biggest amount of money thrown his way.  It doesn't mean he isn't going to get paid a ton though.

[Mania]

3 hours ago, wit33 said:

 

Eli Manning passed Elway in passing yards today. 

To me this means nothing considering Elway did it in the 80s and 90s, not 2004 to present.

[Skinsinparadise]

Boswell column

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/kirk-cousins-has-a-bright-future-but-its-likely-not-with-the-redskins/2017/12/24/d0da3e28-e8e9-11e7-9f92-10a2203f6c8d_story.html?utm_term=.f4524a09eaea

...Everybody in the NFL knows what Cousins is — except the owner and team president of his own team. And a faction of this city’s fans, too. Familiarity really does breed contempt for quarterbacks. Their worst or unluckiest plays are scrutinized, but their statistics — even a staggering 47-straight-game résumé in Cousins’s case — can be twisted, misinterpreted or ignored.

 

This is who Cousins is. And this is the quarterback Washington is probably about to lose. In the last three years, out of all quarterbacks with 250 pass attempts, Cousins ranks third in the NFL in yards and fourth in quarterback rating.

 

In that time, Cousins is also fourth in adjusted net yards per attempt, an excellent all-around statistic that includes ratio of touchdown-to-interceptions, as well as frequency of being sacked. Ahead of him are only Tom Brady, 2016 MVP Matt Ryan and future Hall of Famer Drew Brees.

When you consider that Cousins is only 29, while several of the NFL’s best quarterbacks, such as Ben Roethlisberger, Carson Palmer, Brees, Eli Manning and Brady, are near the end of their careers, his future in the league looks ever better.

 

“We set a standard here with the veteran guys we’re going to have next year . . . no matter what the circumstances,” Washington Coach Jay Gruden said. “As for Kirk, we’re going to coach him one more game here, and when the season is over we’ll deal with all that stuff.” Most NFL coaches lie either by nature or nurture. Gruden’s different. For Jay, “Coach him one more game here” is just sad.

[SkinsHokieFan]

Division Records

 

2015: 4-2 

2016: 3-3

2017: 1-4 (with one more game remaining) 

 

I am fine if he stays, fine if he goes. 

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

Yeah, it's a real shame Cousins can't play defense or special teams to boost that division record up.  

[Momma There Goes That Man]

True but he also played a large part in handing away a few Dallas and NYg games 

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

2 minutes ago, Momma There Goes That Man said:

True but he also played a large part in handing away a few Dallas and NYg games 

 

Yeah, he's not perfect.

 

By the quotes in the Boswell article, it would appear Von Miller is willing to kill for a not so perfect QB like Cousins.

[zoony]

9 minutes ago, SkinsHokieFan said:

Division Records

 

2015: 4-2 

2016: 3-3

2017: 1-4 (with one more game remaining) 

 

I am fine if he stays, fine if he goes. 

 

Now pull drew brees 2014 thru 2016.  Put those numbers up and tell everyone youre also indifferent about him.

 

And dont forget phillip rivers.  Pull 2014 thru 2016 for him, too.

 

Guess youre indifferent about great QBs

 

 

[SkinsHokieFan]

4 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

Yeah, it's a real shame Cousins can't play defense or special teams to boost that division record up.  

 

8-9 in a 3 year period. And the division hasn't exactly been great either with the Cowboys and Eagles being disasters in '15, the Eagles sucking in '16 and the Giants being awful in '17

 

And I do pin a big part of the mediocrity on Cousins, in particular the Cowboys games at FedEx in '15 and '16; the first Eagles game this year and the disaster of an INT to end the game vs the Giants in '16 and blow the playoffs

Just now, zoony said:

 

Now pull drew brees 2014 thru 2016.  Put those numbers up and tell everyone youre also indifferent about him.

 

And dont forget phillip rivers.  Pull 2014 thru 2016 for him, too.

 

Guess youre indifferent about great QBs

 

 

 

By '14 both Brees and Rivers had multiple division titles plus a few nice playoff runs (with Brees winning a Superbowl)

 

I am just starting small here. A playoff win would be nice. 10 wins in a season isn't too much to ask for is it? 

[zoony]

2 minutes ago, SkinsHokieFan said:

 

 

 

By '14 both Brees and Rivers had multiple division titles plus a few nice playoff runs (with Brees winning a Superbowl)

 

I am just starting small here. A playoff win would be nice. 10 wins in a season isn't too much to ask for is it? 

 

 

Ah i see.  

 

I suppose you think flacco is awesome then.  I think we are done here

[SkinsHokieFan]

Just now, zoony said:

 

 

Ah i see.  

 

I suppose you think flacco is awesome then.  I think we are done here

 

Kirk puts up incredible numbers and knows this offense inside and out. 

 

For whatever reason it hasn't translated into wins, and big wins.

 

There was no excuse for the offense to put up a measly 10 points against a resting Giants team at the end of '16 with Garcon, DJax and Jordan Reed playing in that game.

 

Its games like the one vs the Giants that give me pause on Kirk. I actually think he has done quite well this year considering the circumstances, I just don't think he has the ability to elevate a team without tremendous help.

 

The Flacco comparison is actually apt in this case

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

1 minute ago, SkinsHokieFan said:

 

8-9 in a 3 year period. And the division hasn't exactly been great either with the Cowboys and Eagles being disasters in '15, the Eagles sucking in '16 and the Giants being awful in '17

 

And I do pin a big part of the mediocrity on Cousins, in particular the Cowboys games at FedEx in '15 and '16; the first Eagles game this year and the disaster of an INT to end the game vs the Giants in '16 and blow the playoffs

 

Yeah, its a shame he's played aome

bad games.  

 

...or maybe it's a shame that the team has never won a game in spite of Kirk, and that their margin for error is so minimal that Kirk has to play lights out to win.

[SkinsHokieFan]

Just now, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

 

Yeah, its a shame he's played aome

bad games.  

 

...or maybe it's a shame that the team has never won a game in spite of Kirk, and that their margin for error is so minimal that Kirk has to play lights out to win.

 

It is when those bad games are. Like an elimination game at home vs a resting opponent and your team is healthy.

 

I guess its unfair to expect a QB to lead more then 1 TD drive in that game. 

 

I got no problem if the FO pays him 100M+. None whatsoever. I also won't expect much better then 9 wins as long as he is here with an occasional playoff appearance here and there when the division sucks

[bla bla bla]

3 hours ago, Rufus T Firefly said:

No one's paying 34.5 mil per year on a multi-year deal, as was clearly my point in the first place.

 

I had a feeling responding to you might be a waste of my time and so far you're making me feel prophetic. 

I think he means if Kirk is Franchised by the Redskins he will sign the tag and then not negotiate the LTD. Why would he want to negotiate a deal if he can play on the tag for 1 year and sign a massive deal in 2019. He's not suggesting someone pays him a yearly average at the price of a tag. He plays the most protected position in the NFL it would be silly for him to negotiate a long term deal with limited options when he can opt to play out the one year and get the big deal next year with any team he wants.

 

This is why the Redskins won't tag him. They'd basically be handing him a 1 year guaranteed contract without a LTD since it would be silly for him to sign a deal with the tag being such a high number.

4 hours ago, Warhead36 said:

The Jets need a QB but I don't think Cousins would want to play there. Weak weapons and having to face the Pats twice a year? I think he'd prefer to take his chances in Denver or Arizona.

Kirk would be signing a 5 or 6 year deal, I know Brady is super human but father time is still bound to cause a drop off at some point. Even though the Pats are good now I think the Chiefs/Chargers/Raiders or Rams/Seahawks/49ers is a tougher schedule consistently than Dolphins/Bills/Patriots.

 

If you've watched the Jets you'd know ASJ (lost 3 TDs due to questionable calls) and Roddy Anderson are legit weapons, Kearse has been a really reliable target as well. We were playing without Enunwa this year too, he looked poised to potentially be a big time weapon after a really good season with a terrible Fitz. I think the Jets will be just fine in the weapons department. You can argue we need to draft a RB in the top 3 rounds to compliment Powell and McGuire but the Jets will have 4 picks in the top 3 rounds to address that.

[mistertim]

1 hour ago, SkinsHokieFan said:

 

Kirk puts up incredible numbers and knows this offense inside and out. 

 

For whatever reason it hasn't translated into wins, and big wins.

 

There was no excuse for the offense to put up a measly 10 points against a resting Giants team at the end of '16 with Garcon, DJax and Jordan Reed playing in that game.

 

Its games like the one vs the Giants that give me pause on Kirk. I actually think he has done quite well this year considering the circumstances, I just don't think he has the ability to elevate a team without tremendous help.

 

The Flacco comparison is actually apt in this case

 

I think another problem is that his eye popping yards and top notch QB rating and completion percentage (except in the RZ....see below) also hasn't translated into TDs nearly enough (which does correlate to your point about wins, especially big ones). He still has problems in the red zone. Now that certainly isn't 100% on him, but he's definitely a factor. IIRC last year when he threw for close to 5,000 yards he was #2 in the NFL in yards but something like #13 in TDs. That's a pretty poor yards to TD ratio. Brees (since people keep bringing him up to compare) was #1 in yards and #2 in TDs IIRC. Just look at their red zone stats from 2016 (when the Saints were a pretty crappy team overall). Opponent's 19-goal Brees was at 69.2% completion with 28 TDs. Opponent's 10-goal he was at 64.5% completion with 24 TDs. Opponent's 19-goal Kirk was at 47.5% completion with 14 TDs. Opponent's 10-goal he was at 37.5% completion with 7 TDs. This year they're at 69.1% and 70% for Brees and 57.4% and 33.3% for Kirk. So it seems he's improved some in 19-goal but is still terrible at 10-goal. 

 

Since 2008 Brees hasn't had a single season where he's put up over 4,000 yards and hasn't had over 30 TDs, usually well over 30. Same with Rodgers, and except for 2 years, same with Brady. I only bring those guys up because others here seem to do so when discussing Kirk's stats with theirs for comparison (but usually only QB rating and yards). Kirk has had 3 straight 4,000+ yard seasons and has never thrown for 30 TDs (this is assuming he throws for over 65 yards next game).

 

It's an issue that keeps dogging us and him. Maybe he can solve it, Maybe it is playcalling. But he's been bad there two years in a row and I don't think that's something you can blame on the entire rest of the team. No clue what happened because he was very good in 2015 but that may have been at least partially due to having a healthy Reed all season who was a red zone nightmare. 

 

Now, I'm not saying I don't want him here. I'd like for him to come back, though I'd be pretty hesitant about making him the highest paid player in the league. But looking at his yards, QB rating, etc without taking into account how many points he accounts for is being selective and ignoring what is, IMO, the most important stat for a QB.

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

Cousins has been better in the RZ this year with a scab squad.  He's improved in utilizing his legs to make plays.  The two things everyone hated on him for this past offseason.  Imagine that, he's improving year over year, even in very adverse circumstances personnel wise.

 

Do those of you that dig deep to discredit Kirk, realize that most every professional opinion on the guy is much more positive than your own novice opinion?  I don't say that as if I'm holier than thou and smarter than you, my opinions are novice as well particularly in comparison to professionals.  But I feel more confident in my opinions when they align with folks that actually know what they are talking about.

[mistertim]

6 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

Cousins has been better in the RZ this year with a scab squad.  He's improved in utilizing his legs to make plays.  The two things everyone hated on him for this past offseason.  Imagine that, he's improving year over year, even in very adverse circumstances personnel wise.

 

Do those of you that dig deep to discredit Kirk, realize that most every professional opinion on the guy is much more positive than your own novice opinion?  I don't say that as if I'm holier than thou and smarter than you, my opinions are novice as well particularly in comparison to professionals.  But I feel more confident in my opinions when they align with folks that actually know what they are talking about.

 

Most "professional" opinions we don't know, if you're talking about football professionals like coaches, GMs, etc. As far as opinion people yes there are some that believe he's elite, but there are also plenty who think, like I do, that he's a good QB but isn't upper echelon.

 

And the reason I brought up those stats is because when people compare his stats to Brees, Brady, Rodgers, whoever, they always seem to miss the TDs and RZ issues and just talk about yards, overall comp %, and QB rating. Like it or not the red zone thing and low yards to TD numbers is an issue. You can blame it on other things all you want, but it doesn't change the fact that those numbers suck. 

 

Yes he has improved on utilizing his legs to make plays. Doesn't change the numbers.

[Paul Cumberland]

Taken from https://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/2017/redzone-passing.htm

 

Looks like Kirk is 8th here, if I'm not mistaken... (sorted by # TDs inside the 20).  He was 18th in 2016

 

2017 Red Zone Passing Stats

		Inside 20						Inside 10
Player	Tm	Cmp	Att	Cmp%	Yds	TD	Int	Cmp	Att	Cmp%	Yds	TD	Int	Link
Carson Wentz	PHI	39	60	63.93	297	24	0	16	25	64.00	71	13	0	All Carson Wentz red zone passing plays
Tom Brady	NWE	47	79	56.63	289	22	0	19	33	52.78	66	15	0	All Tom Brady red zone passing plays
Jared Goff	LAR	43	77	54.43	307	20	0	19	31	61.29	66	12	0	All Jared Goff red zone passing plays
Russell Wilson	SEA	38	70	52.78	271	20	2	20	39	51.28	90	15	0	All Russell Wilson red zone passing plays
Ben Roethlisberger	PIT	44	83	51.76	287	19	1	21	42	47.73	87	15	1	All Ben Roethlisberger red zone passing plays
Blake Bortles	JAX	27	52	49.09	197	16	0	17	28	60.71	98	13	0	All Blake Bortles red zone passing plays
Drew Brees	NOR	51	76	65.38	281	16	2	21	30	65.63	85	11	0	All Drew Brees red zone passing plays
Kirk Cousins	WAS	33	58	53.23	236	16	2	9	22	39.13	32	7	0	All Kirk Cousins red zone passing plays
Case Keenum	MIN	32	52	59.26	218	16	0	15	26	53.57	58	11	0	All Case Keenum red zone passing plays
Jay Cutler	MIA	30	50	56.60	197	15	2	14	25	51.85	74	13	2	All Jay Cutler red zone passing plays
Andy Dalton	CIN	23	44	47.92	162	15	1	13	22	54.17	71	11	1	All Andy Dalton red zone passing plays
Dak Prescott	DAL	29	55	46.77	209	15	3	12	27	42.86	62	10	1	All Dak Prescott red zone passing plays
Matthew Stafford	DET	37	71	49.33	218	15	0	16	28	51.61	68	12	0	All Matthew Stafford red zone passing plays
Eli Manning	NYG	27	43	60.00	193	13	0	15	21	65.22	73	10	0	All Eli Manning red zone passing plays
Philip Rivers	LAC	32	64	48.48	214	13	1	19	41	46.34	88	12	0	All Philip Rivers red zone passing plays
Matt Ryan	ATL	33	68	46.48	232	13	2	17	33	50.00	76	12	1	All Matt Ryan red zone passing plays
Deshaun Watson	HOU	15	27	55.56	110	13	2	10	12	83.33	52	10	0	All Deshaun Watson red zone passing plays
Derek Carr	OAK	24	44	54.55	127	12	1	12	26	46.15	56	11	0	All Derek Carr red zone passin

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

I really don't have any reason to play the blame game for his shortcomings or desire to dig any deeper into Kirks game than what I see every Sunday.  

 

I'll simply disagree that the majority of professionals opinions align with yours. To me there is a line drawn between good QBs and upper echelon QBs.  Cousins is widely considered more than just good.