Presidential Election: 11/3/20 ---Now the President Elect Joe Biden Thread

[PleaseBlitz]

1 hour ago, goskins10 said:

know this is the prevailing thought here. On the issues there is no way Biden loses to trump on the merits of their pans and approach. However, trumps entire plan will be to make Biden look weak, both mentally and physically. He will bully him the entire time, taking cheap shots with lies and making personal attacks. In most cases I would say bring it on. But we know Biden has a tendency to misspeak. I agree ti's generally a big deal  nor should it be in most circles. But one gaff, one misstep, one time he says the State of Chicago, or 140M have died from Covid or any other mistake and he will be portrayed as weak mentally. That will be in every Republican ad moving forward. Worse, no matter how many times trump does the same thing, it will always be, well that's just who he is. One advantage is that there will not be anyone in the audience to break rules and give trump the applause he so yearns for. That will also keep Biden on path. 

 

The difference between Biden and Trump is that Biden occasionally misspeaks and Trump always sounds like a moron.  There is a much better chance of Trump looking bad than Biden, because Trump is a confused idiot trying to fake his way through it.  Trump has only ever had one good debate moment (when he defended "NY values" in a 2016 GOP primary debate).  Biden is more than equipped to deal with cheap shots and lies and personal attacks, and they'll backfire on Trump. 

[88Comrade2000]

Honestly, there's no need for 3 debates.  You can't get a real debate vs. Trump because Trump is mentally a 7 year old child.  He's incapable of discussing the real issues.  Why he feels his view on tackling the nations problems would be better than Biden's view on tackling the nations problems.  Donald doesn't have the mental capacity to do that.

 

So, all the debate would serve for Trump is to get Joe to mess up. Make Joe look like a weak candidate.

 

All Joe needs is one debate, to show how he looks like a real president vs the manchild idiot.

 

Other than one debate, I'd rather see Joe do virtual town halls by himself where he explains his vision, plans for tackling all the problems we face.  He really won't be able to do that in a debate vs an idiot.

[PleaseBlitz]

I don't think Trump will agree to 3 debates because he and his team know that he can't stand up to real questions.  I doubt Biden will agree to let Hannity or Tucker Carlson moderate, and Trump just proved that Fox News' Chris Wallace will make him look like a moron.  So Trump will claim that it's "rigged" and pretend to be upset, but he'll take the cowards way out like he always does (all the while pretending/blustering like he really wants 5+ debates).  

[88Comrade2000]

12 minutes ago, PleaseBlitz said:

I don't think Trump will agree to 3 debates because he and his team know that he can't stand up to real questions.  I doubt Biden will agree to let Hannity or Tucker Carlson moderate, and Trump just proved that Fox News' Chris Wallace will make him look like a moron.  So Trump will claim that it's "rigged" and pretend to be upset, but he'll take the cowards way out like he always does (all the while pretending/blustering like he really wants 5+ debates).  

This could be like 1980, where there was only one debate between Carter-Reagan and that was the week before the election.

[88Comrade2000]

 

 

Speaking of debates, here's the current debate schedule:

 

9/29- Case Western University- Cleveland.  This switch happened yesterday.

10/15- Adrienne Arsht Center for the Performing Arts- Miami.  Moved from original site.

10/22- Belmont University- Nashville.

 

Interesting that the first debates had to switch their sites.  Why are the debates starting so late?  With Early Voting/Mail-in Voting starting right after Labor Day:9/7 in many places; a significant amount of votes could've been cast before the first debate.  That first debate should be earlier.  Say either 9/10 or 9/15, within the first week after Labor Day.

[PleaseBlitz]

I mean, if you haven't made up your mind, which is ridiculous as @Springfield accurately noted, and you actually need to see the debates to decide, then early voting isn't for you.  

[goskins10]

45 minutes ago, PleaseBlitz said:

 

The difference between Biden and Trump is that Biden occasionally misspeaks and Trump always sounds like a moron.  There is a much better chance of Trump looking bad than Biden, because Trump is a confused idiot trying to fake his way through it.  Trump has only ever had one good debate moment (when he defended "NY values" in a 2016 GOP primary debate).  Biden is more than equipped to deal with cheap shots and lies and personal attacks, and they'll backfire on Trump. 

 

I get that and agree that Biden is more than capable, no doubt. And he is less likely to get intimidated.

 

My concern is that it is apparent that independents (the ones who will decide the election) and his base people have decided that trump misspeaking is OK. It's just who he is becasue he is not a career politician. So he somehow gets a pass where Biden does not. There are those soft trump voters who call themselves independents from 2016 who still hate democrats and are looking for a reason to not vote for Biden even as much as they dislike trump. At least for them trump hits the 3 key issues - anti-abortion, pro 2nd amendment and anti-immigration. So one major misstep could be enough to move them to trump over biden. 

 

In the end, it's probably moot since they will be debating. So I will not repeat my concerns after this. More importantly, I truly hope you are all right. I hope that Biden completely embarrasses trump. I hope he makes him look the complete fool that he is. He should. The last thing I want is for trump to win. So maybe I am overthinking it. I hope so. We will see. 

[NoCalMike]

The problem with debating Trump is that he has shown that he has zero regard for the real world and reality in general.  He is just going to rattle off pretend things he has accomplished and go on and on about how great everything has been, which instantly puts any debate opponent in the position of playing defense trying to explain why Trump is full of nonsense instead of really being able to offer their own ideas on things.  If anything, Trump should be instantly fact-checked on his garbage before Biden even responds. (and vice versa).  

[@DCGoldPants]

9 minutes ago, NoCalMike said:

The problem with debating Trump is that he has shown that he has zero regard for the real world and reality in general.  He is just going to rattle off pretend things he has accomplished and go on and on about how great everything has been, which instantly puts any debate opponent in the position of playing defense trying to explain why Trump is full of nonsense instead of really being able to offer their own ideas on things.  If anything, Trump should be instantly fact-checked on his garbage before Biden even responds. (and vice versa).  

 

Right. You can be 100% truthful and he would be 100% lying. How do you debate that? Call him out with facts and proof, then he'll reply those are all fake? So, either Biden gets up there and opens with 'Most things you hear from Trump tonight will be lies. He'll like about anything and everything. Call it fake news or a hoax like he did when COVID was beginning.....". Then what? Proceed to not respond to Trump's bull****? How do you debate a temper tantrum? 

[PleaseBlitz]

2 minutes ago, @SkinsGoldPants said:

How do you debate a temper tantrum?

 

By acting presidential. 

[@DCGoldPants]

3 minutes ago, PleaseBlitz said:

 

By acting presidential. 

 

So, you stand there. Speak calmly and clearly....and don't engage?

[88Comrade2000]

48 minutes ago, goskins10 said:

 

I get that and agree that Biden is more than capable, no doubt. And he is less likely to get intimidated.

 

My concern is that it is apparent that independents (the ones who will decide the election) and his base people have decided that trump misspeaking is OK. It's just who he is becasue he is not a career politician. So he somehow gets a pass where Biden does not. There are those soft trump voters who call themselves independents from 2016 who still hate democrats and are looking for a reason to not vote for Biden even as much as they dislike trump. At least for them trump hits the 3 key issues - anti-abortion, pro 2nd amendment and anti-immigration. So one major misstep could be enough to move them to trump over biden. 

 

In the end, it's probably moot since they will be debating. So I will not repeat my concerns after this. More importantly, I truly hope you are all right. I hope that Biden completely embarrasses trump. I hope he makes him look the complete fool that he is. He should. The last thing I want is for trump to win. So maybe I am overthinking it. I hope so. We will see. 

If you voted for Trump in 2016, you are voting for again.  If you are wavering now, you will be convinced to fall back in line.  I wouldn't count on those voters.

If are inclined to vote for Trump now, you probably will end up voting for him.

 

The only way Trump wins is if his turnout is greater than Biden's in key electoral states.  It could happen.  The GOP will do everything in their power to make it happen.

 

Remember Trump hasn't gained any new voters.  Biden has to retain Hillary's voters and get more voters than her to come out, in the key states.   If everyone is able to vote, that should happen. They key is for Biden to get his voters out.

[tshile]

What’s everyone’s gut feel on what % of actual voters will be swayed by the debate?

 

and when I say swayed I mean either

- they haven’t decided who to vote for

- the debate outcome may not change their mind to vote for the other, but it could convince them to stay home (or not) or vote third party in protest (or not)

 

 

[goskins10]

10 minutes ago, Rdskns2000 said:

If you voted for Trump in 2016, you are voting for again.  If you are wavering now, you will be convinced to fall back in line.  I wouldn't count on those voters.

If are inclined to vote for Trump now, you probably will end up voting for him.

 

The only way Trump wins is if his turnout is greater than Biden's in key electoral states.  It could happen.  The GOP will do everything in their power to make it happen.

 

Remember Trump hasn't gained any new voters.  Biden has to retain Hillary's voters and get more voters than her to come out, in the key states.   If everyone is able to vote, that should happen. They key is for Biden to get his voters out.

 

I do not believe that the first statement that if you voted for him in 2016 you are voting fro him again. There is a base that that is true for. But there are many others that I don't think so. Granted, it's anecdotal but I know too many people who voted for trump who will not vote for him in 2020 no matter who the dem candidate is. They may not all be voting biden but they are NOT voting trump. Living in GA I have a pretty good pool to draw from. I also have seen some polls that suggest way more than normal have decided who they are voting for and that majority is for Biden. But we will see. 

 

The second statement I do agree with. I just don't want Joe to give them any help. But fair enough they are probably falling in line. If they can't find enough reason to dump trump now then they will not find it moving forward. 

 

I 100% agree with the last statement about getting voters out. I just think trump is doing a good enough job convincing dem voters to come out without risking Joe sending them back. But it is what it is. On a positive note, a sound debate win by Biden could also be the death toll for trumps election chances and put it all to rest. That of course is my hope. 

 

On a side note I saw the first debate has been moved from Notre Dame to a college in Cleveland (never heard of it myself). They said it was not going to provide enough educational value. Sounds like an excuse to not be part of a circus. Totally guessing as I have no proof, but I thinking the trumps team was making crazy demands. I would not be surprised. 

 

 

[TheDoyler23]

22 minutes ago, tshile said:

What’s everyone’s gut feel on what % of actual voters will be swayed by the debate?

 

and when I say swayed I mean either

- they haven’t decided who to vote for

- the debate outcome may not change their mind to vote for the other, but it could convince them to stay home (or not) or vote third party in protest (or not)

 

 

 

I don't think debates do much and it's more like theater/sports for people into politics. 

[Mr. Sinister]

In todays day and age, if you're waiting on a Presidential debate to determine who you're going to vote for, you're just not paying attention.

 

It's pretty useless, and now only serves to reinforce/ cast doubt on your own spotty perceptions, some largely based on propaganda 

[Cooked Crack]

 

 

[Die Hard]

30 minutes ago, @SkinsGoldPants said:

 

So, you stand there. Speak calmly and clearly....and don't engage?

Do we really think Trump is going to let Biden talk?! 
 

Biden needs to speak to the American people. He needs to answers their questions. And he’s already executing that.

 

We already know Trump’s platform for his re-election. We also know his narrative of the US under Biden. 
 

Nothing to debate. Or even discuss for that matter. It’s just nothing more than an opportunity for mudslinging. With no rules.

 

And I don’t think anyone truly wins in that situation.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Mooka]

4 minutes ago, Mr. Sinister said:

It's pretty useless, and now only serves to reinforce/ cast doubt on your own spotty perceptions, some largely based on propaganda 

 

That doesn't sound useless, that sounds exactly how you win elections in this country.

[NoCalMike]

I am just over all the positive Biden polling.  We know he is the more popular of the two nationally.  We know he is winning the popular vote.  All that aside, it seems like those midwest swing states are still close and indicate the election is still very much a toss up, and I'd expect the polls in those states to get even more close as we get closer to election day.  

[PleaseBlitz]

1 hour ago, @SkinsGoldPants said:

 

So, you stand there. Speak calmly and clearly....and don't engage?

 

Soft of, yea.  You present your own message, and you do it presidentially.  That is, you don't name call, you don't complain about being a victim, you note that you, as President, are responsible for the state of the country, and you have a firm grasp of the issues and can articulate a plan for how to address those issues.  

 

Trump will do his best to make a debate about anything but the current important issues.  Even if a moderator specifically asks you to respond to something Trump said, you respond by saying "Trump says a lot of crazy stuff" and then talk about how you will make the country stronger and safer and work better for the working and middle classes (which has been Biden's message for 50 years) rather than the ultra rich. 

[DCranon21]

29 minutes ago, Cooked Crack said:

 

 

 

The fact that Montana, Georgia, Iowa and Alaska are in play right now is a telling sign right now. But it's still early and polls change.

[PleaseBlitz]

39 minutes ago, NoCalMike said:

I am just over all the positive Biden polling.  We know he is the more popular of the two nationally.  We know he is winning the popular vote.  All that aside, it seems like those midwest swing states are still close and indicate the election is still very much a toss up, and I'd expect the polls in those states to get even more close as we get closer to election day.  

 

I mean, PTSD aside, an objective look at the current state shows Biden has a solid and significant lead.  The RCP polling averages show him up by 8 in Michigan, 7.5 in PA, 6.5 in WI and 11 in Minnesota. Biden is also up 8 in FL.  If you start with Trumps winning 2016 map and flip only those states in which the current polls show Biden up by 6 or more then that give Biden 307 electoral votes.  If you just give him the 3 where he is up by at least 8, Biden still wins.  

 

If you give Biden only the states where a consensus of the major independent political analysts agree that Biden is favored to win and none of the toss ups (FL is currently a toss up), Biden is at 278.  Of those analysts by themselves:

 

Sabato Crystal Ball:  Biden 268/Trump 204

Cook Political Report:  Biden 308/Trump 187

Inside Elections:  Biden 319/Trump 187

Politico:  Biden 368/Trump 203

[goskins10]

3 hours ago, Hersh said:

 

 

This is a great example of why Democrats lose. We create the dumbest **** to be upset about and nitpick to death. In the meantime the GOP has a super racist POTUS, with a abuse of power AG and a fake ass Christian VP. 

 

So-called progressives seeking perfection are wearing thin with me. 

 

How about let's take the drama down a notch. You jumped straight off some cliff without any real information makes some false assumptions and accusations. I am not sure what you think i am "upset" about or what I am nitpicking about, or seeking perfection from? All three of those are not true - not even close. I thought we were having a conversation and i was explaining my points. All you said was - respectfully you are wrong -0 could have used some context but whatever. I can do that too but thought it more productive to provide why I believe what I believe. You are free to disagree with them but the rest is not necessary. 

 

I never labeled myself but thanks for doing that for me. I purposely do not consider myself anything but free to make up my own mind so your description verifies I am where I want to be - having my own mind. 

 

Finally, the reason Democrats lose is because they are so sure they are right, they arrogantly assume people just have to see it their way. They should not have to make their case - it's obvious! That's where they are wrong and is exactly how we got trump. You have to make the case for why you should vote for the democrats and not rely on why you should not vote for republicans.

 

I am done with this. Moving on. 

[Riggo-toni]