Warhead36 Posted December 15, 2015 Share Posted December 15, 2015 Why are we even talking about RG3? He is a complete non factor at this point. He'll be out of the league totally in 2-3 years tops. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fergasun Posted December 15, 2015 Share Posted December 15, 2015 Ryan Fitzpatrick signed a 6 year, $59M contract in 2011. Indexed for the salary cap inflation, that's ~ 6 years, $80M in 2015. Cousins has outperformed Fitzpatrick this year (compared to Fitzpatrick's 2011), and had a similar arc - going from bad, unreliable QB to average QB (Cousins actually has been top 12 to 13 QB this year). The other end of the spectrum is Jay Cutler's 7 year, $126M contract. ousins has been playing at about the same level as Cutler (an up year for Jay Cutler). Cousins has been playing similar to Alex Smith, who got a 4 year, $68M contract. Or the Redskins could do what the Chargers did to Drew Brees and franchise him. Part of me says, "He needs to do it one more year..." before I commit long term. Another part of me says, "Just settle and improve the talent around him." He's going to get around $17.5M a year - and I think I'd rather watch him continue to develop / improve than any other option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Singlemalt Posted December 15, 2015 Share Posted December 15, 2015 If he can handle it, what difference does it make if Robert is the #2 or #3? You are totally contradicting your yourself on one hand taking someone to task for calling him mentally weak (which they did not) saying he can obviously handle the pressure, then out of the other side you are saying that keeping Robert here is unfair pressure on Cousins. If he is tough enough like you said in the first post, it should not matter, which I actually agree with. Robert needs to be cut ASAP. His time in DC is finished. The only way he has a prayer of resurrecting his career is in a new city with a new team. I won't associate his name with the notable QB busts of NFL past but I don't see him in the NFL beyond 2, 3 years max. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recent Vintage Posted December 15, 2015 Share Posted December 15, 2015 I normally wouldn't bring this up in a Cousins thread, but you guys have to be kidding if you think RGIII isn't at least a backup in the NFL for the next 5-6 years if he wants to be. Stats to ponder:RGIII's 13 games in 2013: 3203 yds, 16 TD, 12 INT, 7.0 Y/A, 489 rushing yds, 0 TD KC's 13 games in 2015: 3306 yds, 18 TD, 11 INT, 7.3 Y/A 41 rushing yds, 4 TDs There's a lot going on here, clearly you'd rather have KC's stats (and record), but RGIII's "terrible" year that ended with this benching really doesn't look all that terrible when you consider the rest of the NFL is starting such luminaries as Johnny Football, Blaine Gabbert, Brian Hoyer, AJ McCarron, Jimmy Clausen/Matt Schaub, Matt Cassel, and Case Keenum. I mean honestly there are reports of FIVE different teams trying to lure Jason Campbell out of retirement! Looking at those stats (I know the records were much different) its crazy to me that one guy is due to get out of the NFL in 2-3 years, and the other is getting 35mil guaranteed on a 5 year contract. All that said, please realize that I hope Cousins finishes the year out strong, the Redskins resign him and release RGIII. I also just believe that RGIII could have a solid career in the NFL under a coach on a solid team that can find a way to take advantage of his talents. (Andy Reid maybe?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clskinsfan Posted December 15, 2015 Share Posted December 15, 2015 I see that angle, that's why I'd be more comfortable with a contract that's not so high but loaded with incentives. The drawback to that is, whoever is calling plays basically controls his salary, unless he has more freedom to audible and they get some help in the offseason. The real drawback to that is his agent isnt gonna let him sign a heavy incentive laden deal. He can and will get better on the open market. As much as it sucks. I think the franchise tag is heading Kirks way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clskinsfan Posted December 15, 2015 Share Posted December 15, 2015 I normally wouldn't bring this up in a Cousins thread, but you guys have to be kidding if you think RGIII isn't at least a backup in the NFL for the next 5-6 years if he wants to be. Stats to ponder: RGIII's 13 games in 2013: 3203 yds, 16 TD, 12 INT, 7.0 Y/A, 489 rushing yds, 0 TD KC's 13 games in 2015: 3306 yds, 18 TD, 11 INT, 7.3 Y/A 41 rushing yds, 4 TDs There's a lot going on here, clearly you'd rather have KC's stats (and record), but RGIII's "terrible" year that ended with this benching really doesn't look all that terrible when you consider the rest of the NFL is starting such luminaries as Johnny Football, Blaine Gabbert, Brian Hoyer, AJ McCarron, Jimmy Clausen/Matt Schaub, Matt Cassel, and Case Keenum. I mean honestly there are reports of FIVE different teams trying to lure Jason Campbell out of retirement! Looking at those stats (I know the records were much different) its crazy to me that one guy is due to get out of the NFL in 2-3 years, and the other is getting 35mil guaranteed on a 5 year contract. All that said, please realize that I hope Cousins finishes the year out strong, the Redskins resign him and release RGIII. I also just believe that RGIII could have a solid career in the NFL under a coach on a solid team that can find a way to take advantage of his talents. (Andy Reid maybe?) RG3 "could". But RG3 cant stay healthy, read defenses and he has absolutely no pocket awareness. The stats you leave out from 2013 are that he had a 82.3 rating, was sacked 38 times and fumbled 5 times. The only team I could see him really succeeding with would be the Seahags. they run the perfect offense for him. But RG3 cant protect himself and gets battered on just about every snap. I love the guy and what he did in 2012 for us. But he is done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinssRvA Posted December 15, 2015 Share Posted December 15, 2015 I normally wouldn't bring this up in a Cousins thread, but you guys have to be kidding if you think RGIII isn't at least a backup in the NFL for the next 5-6 years if he wants to be. Stats to ponder: RGIII's 13 games in 2013: 3203 yds, 16 TD, 12 INT, 7.0 Y/A, 489 rushing yds, 0 TD KC's 13 games in 2015: 3306 yds, 18 TD, 11 INT, 7.3 Y/A 41 rushing yds, 4 TDs There's a lot going on here, clearly you'd rather have KC's stats (and record), but RGIII's "terrible" year that ended with this benching really doesn't look all that terrible when you consider the rest of the NFL is starting such luminaries as Johnny Football, Blaine Gabbert, Brian Hoyer, AJ McCarron, Jimmy Clausen/Matt Schaub, Matt Cassel, and Case Keenum. I mean honestly there are reports of FIVE different teams trying to lure Jason Campbell out of retirement! Looking at those stats (I know the records were much different) its crazy to me that one guy is due to get out of the NFL in 2-3 years, and the other is getting 35mil guaranteed on a 5 year contract. All that said, please realize that I hope Cousins finishes the year out strong, the Redskins resign him and release RGIII. I also just believe that RGIII could have a solid career in the NFL under a coach on a solid team that can find a way to take advantage of his talents. (Andy Reid maybe?) Stats, as usual, do not tell the entire story. That 2013 season is one I would like to forget. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BatteredFanSyndrome Posted December 15, 2015 Share Posted December 15, 2015 I would agree with stats not telling the entire story, however I've been seeing a lot of stats lately in relation to Kirk by this very board. Typically all to the tune of why those stats mean he's to be the face of our franchise for the next decade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tsailand Posted December 15, 2015 Share Posted December 15, 2015 I would agree with stats not telling the entire story, however I've been seeing a lot of stats lately in relation to Kirk by this very board. Typically all to the tune of why those stats mean he's to be the face of our franchise for the next decade. Then how about you use real stats instead of bull**** like looking total passing yards without adjusting for sacks? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goskins10 Posted December 15, 2015 Share Posted December 15, 2015 Robert needs to be cut ASAP. His time in DC is finished. The only way he has a prayer of resurrecting his career is in a new city with a new team. I won't associate his name with the notable QB busts of NFL past but I don't see him in the NFL beyond 2, 3 years max. You and veryoldschool are missing context. I was making a point that IMO someone had contradicted themselves. I am not nor was I ever advocating we keep Robert. It would serve no purpose. It may be good to look at what I was responding to before commenting on a specific comment. At no time did I say anything about keeping Robert. You both just jumped to that conclusion based on a completely difference response to another poster. :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExoDus84 Posted December 15, 2015 Share Posted December 15, 2015 The basic stats between RG3 and Kirk look the same if you compare 2013 to 2015, but that only tells half the story. You really need to look at sack % and fumble percentage to see the real impact of how much better Kirk has been. Fumble Percentage (Career numbers) Kirk: 27 GP, 14 Total Fumbles = 0.52 fumbles/gm RG3: 37 GP, 32 Total Fumbles = 0.86 fumbles/gm Sack Percentage (Career Numbers) Kirk: 861 ATT, 39 Sacks = 4.53% sack rate RG3: 1,063 ATT,101 Sacks = 9.50% sack rate Cousins takes less than half the sacks RG3 does, and fumbles like 40% less. This is why RG3 was benched. Taking that many sacks, and giving the ball away that much means you lose games constantly, and put your team in awful down and distance situations. Last year, RG3 was sacked 33 times on only 214 attempts. Talk about awful! This being said, I'm not anti RG3, or hyper pro-Kirk. Just stating facts. Anyway, my only RG3 post since there are threads for that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duckus Posted December 15, 2015 Share Posted December 15, 2015 I normally wouldn't bring this up in a Cousins thread, but you guys have to be kidding if you think RGIII isn't at least a backup in the NFL for the next 5-6 years if he wants to be. If I am RG3, I am going straight to the Cowboys in FA. Taking a minimum deal if necessary. - Get to go back home - Dallas desperately needs a back-up QB - Top 5 WR - Young Oline - Tony romoSUCKS is 35 years old and is always injured No idea if he would be successful there, but if I was him that is where I would roll the dice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinssRvA Posted December 15, 2015 Share Posted December 15, 2015 The basic stats between RG3 and Kirk look the same if you compare 2013 to 2015, but that only tells half the story. You really need to look at sack % and fumble percentage to see the real impact of how much better Kirk has been. Fumble Percentage (Career numbers) Kirk: 27 GP, 14 Total Fumbles = 0.52 fumbles/gm RG3: 37 GP, 32 Total Fumbles = 0.86 fumbles/gm Sack Percentage (Career Numbers) Kirk: 861 ATT, 39 Sacks = 4.53% sack rate RG3: 1,063 ATT,101 Sacks = 9.50% sack rate Cousins takes less than half the sacks RG3 does, and fumbles like 40% less. This is why RG3 was benched. Taking that many sacks, and giving the ball away that much means you lose games constantly, and put your team in awful down and distance situations. Last year, RG3 was sacked 33 times on only 214 attempts. Talk about awful! This being said, I'm not anti RG3, or hyper pro-Kirk. Just stating facts. Anyway, my only RG3 post since there are threads for that. The sacks are the end result of a much larger problem for NFL QBs. It generally means you are lacking in one or all of the following areas: 1. Pocket presence 2. Ability to read the defense 3. Pre-snap adjustments 4. Confidence I hope RG3 does well elsewhere, just not in our division. The learning curve for a QB with his skillset I fear was/is far greater than I anticipated it would be. Back to Kirk. I would pay him good money to stick around. Much smarter minds than mine are dutifully going through that thought process now, I am sure. They may not like the money they will have to pay him to stay with the Skins, but the alternatives to such a payout may be far riskier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SemperFi Skins Posted December 15, 2015 Share Posted December 15, 2015 If I am RG3, I am going straight to the Cowboys in FA. Taking a minimum deal if necessary. - Get to go back home - Dallas desperately needs a back-up QB - Top 5 WR - Young Oline - Tony romoSUCKS is 35 years old and is always injured No idea if he would be successful there, but if I was him that is where I would roll the dice. I understand the sentiment and reasoning, but at some point Dallas will need to look for someone who is actually durable. RG3 is oft-injured as well. Having Romo and RG3 would be a disaster on gameday when they need to suit up 4 QB's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BatteredFanSyndrome Posted December 15, 2015 Share Posted December 15, 2015 Then how about you use real stats instead of bull**** like looking total passing yards without adjusting for sacks? Because I didn't use any to begin with. Rg3 vs Cousins is so 3 months ago, get with the times. It's just funny when folks welcome or dismiss things like stats that do or don't support their mindset. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted December 16, 2015 Share Posted December 16, 2015 Threads about contracts, specifically Kirk Cousins, so if you'd like to discuss RG3 the major obstacle with him is his contract. He isn't worth what he's set to be paid so unless something amazing happens, he's going to get cut. Odds are good he's going to want to go to a team that lets him at least complete for a starting spot on a relatively short deal. I'm thinking Texans, Eagles, or Rams are the most likely to take a flyer. If he goes to the rams the circle of humiliation is complete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goskins10 Posted December 16, 2015 Share Posted December 16, 2015 Maybe I kept the first yr too low. Lets say we do this? It's a 5 yr, $80M contract with $35M Guaranteed. He gets paid up front but it's team friendly on the back end. We get to decide when he is at 30 what we want to do. Year Age Base Signing Roster Workout Salary Bonus Bonus Bonus Cap Hit Dead Cap 2016 28 $10,000,000 $2,000,000 $1,000,000 $400,000 $13,400,000 2017 29 $11,000,000 $2,000,000 $1,000,000 $400,000 $14,400,000 $23,000,000 2018 30 $12,000,000 $2,000,000 $1,000,000 $400,000 $15,400,000 $10,000,000 2019 31 $13,800,000 $2,000,000 $1,000,000 $400,000 $17,200,000 $4,000,000 2020 32 $17,000,000 $2,000,000 $1,000,000 $400,000 $20,400,000 $2,000,000 $63,800,000 $10,000,000 $5,000,000 $2,000,000 $80,800,000 If you leave everything else the same - $35M guaranteed - Then only $4M of 2018 is Guaranteed. It also evens out the cap hit. After reading this article. I think my proposed contract above will not be too far off, maybe yrs/guaranteed money being a little different. http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/eye-on-football/25415377/agents-take-what-will-kirk-cousins-next-contract-look-like Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pjfootballer Posted December 16, 2015 Share Posted December 16, 2015 If I am RG3, I am going straight to the Cowboys in FA. Taking a minimum deal if necessary. - Get to go back home - Dallas desperately needs a back-up QB - Top 5 WR - Young Oline - Tony romoSUCKS is 35 years old and is always injured No idea if he would be successful there, but if I was him that is where I would roll the dice. I was thinking Houston. An ex-college coach as head coach with no tangible starter there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJHJR86 Posted December 16, 2015 Share Posted December 16, 2015 If he goes to the rams the circle of humiliation is complete. Wow, I was thinking he'd head to the Texans...but this would be poetic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimmySmith Posted December 16, 2015 Share Posted December 16, 2015 Cousins will get offers in the area of 90mil. 6/90, 30-40 guaranteed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stefanskins Posted December 16, 2015 Share Posted December 16, 2015 pay the man...especially if this team wins the next three..and wins a playoff game Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
endzone_dave Posted December 16, 2015 Share Posted December 16, 2015 If you were Kirk, would you re-sign with the Skins while RG3 is still on the roster or would you tell the Skins to cut him first? Something tells me Snyder is still an RG3 fanboy. I'd want him out of here before I re-sign with the Skins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wildbunny Posted December 16, 2015 Share Posted December 16, 2015 Cousins will get offers in the area of 90mil. 6/90, 30-40 guaranteed. I could see something along the lines of thiss with those salaries nowadays. Still, that bugs me if I put it in comparison with Tom Brady's numbers... (3 years/27M$)... I would feel bad for him. If you were Kirk, would you re-sign with the Skins while RG3 is still on the roster or would you tell the Skins to cut him first? Something tells me Snyder is still an RG3 fanboy. I'd want him out of here before I re-sign with the Skins. I wouldn't care. Dan's a fan of the team, no matter what, he'll be a fan of Kirk if Kirk can take him into the playoff. Let's think we host a game, and somehow beat the Hawks in the first round (just like the Panthers beat the Cards like year). Dan will be a fan of whoever makes the Redskins win. Simple as that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimmySmith Posted December 16, 2015 Share Posted December 16, 2015 If you were Kirk, would you re-sign with the Skins while RG3 is still on the roster or would you tell the Skins to cut him first? Something tells me Snyder is still an RG3 fanboy. I'd want him out of here before I re-sign with the Skins. If nothing earth shattering happens between now and the end of the season, Griffin will be released the day the season ends. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tsailand Posted December 16, 2015 Share Posted December 16, 2015 I wouldn't care. Dan's a fan of the team, no matter what, he'll be a fan of Kirk if Kirk can take him into the playoff. Let's think we host a game, and somehow beat the Hawks in the first round (just like the Panthers beat the Cards like year). Dan will be a fan of whoever makes the Redskins win. Simple as that. Dan fired Marty after one season, a season where he went 8-8 and finished on an 8-3 run. Dan is a fan of Dan being involved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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