ESPN - Reeling Redskins awash in troubles

[mcarey032]

I am surprised and not surprised. Gregg Williams was a good coordinator in Tennessee, but not a very good head coach. When he got offers last year and then was retained at a head coaches salary, I guess he thought that he could do anything that he wanted. The redskins are in trouble. I think that they may have to make a change. I do have to fault Joe Gibbs in this, because he supposedly had more time to see what was going on with the defense. He should have picked up on this whole fiasco. I also fault Williams for thinking that he is better than he thinks he is. The reason he got the boot in Buffalo the first time was because he wasn't as good as he thought he was. Shame on this other coach Jackson for ruining one of the best and upcoming safeties in the league. I owe an apology somewhat to Andre' Carter, if the article is valid. I thought he was a terrible DE when we got him. I will be interested to see what the response to this will be.

[Guest Rafterman]

Todd, I was referring to the points that used as the basis of the other points

The stuff that "I don't know" neither do you or anyone else... people are taking it for granted it's true, despite and real evidence, or logic

Joe Gibbs doesn't allow things to get out of hand, in fact anyone with a little knowledge of Joe Gibbs, and his history, know that no way in hell that most of that could happen, even in a lesser degree

Again, nothing more than kicking a dog when he's down article, based on hear say... and becuase people who where the heart on their sleeves let there emotions believe some stuff, that their brain would laugh about.

If you don't see this as being true, you haven't been paying attention. Have some more Kool Aid and remain in denial if it makes you feel better.

The bottom line is that we're 3-7, that goes a hell of a long way in proving your assertions are wrong.

Wake up to the fact that this isn't the Joe Gibbs of the 80's, the rest of it will fall into place for you.

[BraveWarrior]

That's some article. Interesting to see that Tom says Mr. Snyder is aware of the situation. I wonder what will be done about it.

As for the anonymous player, I'm guessing it was Shawn Springs. I'm not sure I would expect it to be Marcus, because he seems like he's still buying into the program, the way he hops around after every play. Springs' body language seems to tell me he's frustrated.

[Tarhog]

I think maybe its not a question of whether they can coach or not. Yes history says Williams is a great D-coordinator. Yeah, history say's Gibbs is a great coach; Hall of Famer as a matter of fact. However, present day evidence says that maybe Williams ego and belief in his scheme above player abilities, has once again caused him to lose his connection with his claim to fame; his defense. It also says that the before mentioned Hall of Famer, Gibbs, needs to turn off the auto-pilot and grab the wheel of this team, and stop allowing the junior pilots to steer the ship in whatever direction seems good for "his" part of the team.

I don't find anything here to disagree with. I think its been readily apparent that 'more Gibbs' rather than 'less' was called for this season.

Where I part ways is laying the blame at Gregg Williams feet. Williams is (and we've known this all along) a 'do it my way or watch your *** kind of a guy. He's absolutely in control of the defense and some players will love that kind of coaching, others will hate it. When you're not playing well, its going to be the first thing people point to though. Its 2006, on a lot of teams, the players (with their egos and huge salaries) dictate 'whats what'. A coach who sees it differently isn't going to necessarily be popular. When you're winning, players really can't ***** about it. But when times get tough, well, thats a whole 'nother story.

[CGSKINS]

That's some article. Interesting to see that Tom says Mr. Snyder is aware of the situation. I wonder what will be done about it.

As for the anonymous player, I'm guessing it was Shawn Springs. I'm not sure I would expect it to be Marcus, because he seems like he's still buying into the program, the way he hops around after every play. Springs' body language seems to tell me he's frustrated.

How many years does springs have left on his contract.

[Santana Clause]

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/columns/story?id=2672668&lpos=spotlight&lid=tab1pos1

Wow is all I can say. What a soap opera this organization is. Why can't we just be normal? One thing is for sure. Fire Jackson. And Gibbs better get this crap straightened out and I mean fast. This is a joke.

[GSF]

Hey...de ja vu!

[Thirtyfive2seven]

Search > you.

[Dan T.]

Merge. Already posted and the discussion rages on:

http://www.extremeskins.com/forums/showthread.php?t=182118

[#1SkinsFan]

old news is so exciting!

:laugh::laugh::laugh:

[CGSKINS]

Can some one tell me how many years Shawn springs has left on his contract. The reason why I ask is Bram and Dexter Manly was discussing this artical on the friday night football show on xxx radio tonight. Dexter Manly knew this artical was coming out but did not know when. Dexter also stated that him and Tom Friend are very close and he knew who "the player was" . He said that it was someone in the redskins secondary and that he was a starter. on the show Dexter wrote down the number of the player who was interviewed by tom and showed it to bram. Bram response was" This player who was interviewed was a leader in the redskins secondary and is NOT EXPECTED TO BE HERE NEXT YEAR because he is at the end of his contract this year and wants out at the end. Bram and Dexter stated that they would not tell who it was out of respect of the player. HMMM! Sound like it ma y be Shawn Springs. Who ever it is,, I think is wrong for going to a reporter and complaining. As a man if you have a problem with someone or the team, you go to them with that problem, not to repoter. I think this is some ***** ass! ****. Girls do this not men. Dont go outside of the chain of command. I'm in the Navy and we live and die by that. He should have went to Joe gibbs with this insted of a punk ass reporter.:feedback:

[NoVaSkins21]

This article illustrates how badly fractured this team is. There are so many egos everywhere that nobody is working unisin. Everybody wants so much control that is it is coming at the cost of the team's perfomance. Williams, espcially, comes off looking like a complete jerk; thinking that he can let anybody go and it won't matter. This team is seriously messed up and it doesn't look like it's going to change any time soon.

[GSF]

It will be interesting to see how the team responds to this article. Gibbs hates this kind of stuff.

[Mooka]

We signed Shawn to a 6 year contract, but *in the next 2 years his salary sky rockets so he's either going to restructure or we're releasing him.

http://redskins.scout.com/3/capinfo.html

[BleedBNG]

Earlier in the year I blamed Jerry Gray, and I didnt know how close I was to the truth. The reality is it's Steven Jackson. Apparently this moron doesn't know what the hell he is doing with the safeties and has single handed caused the entire secondary to be on the wrong page.

They both suck. I want them BOTH gone.

[CGSKINS]

We signed Shawn to a 6 year contract, but next year his salary sky rockets so he's either going to restructure or we're releasing him.

Thanks man. Read my other response up a little ways and I will tell you why I asked.

[isle-hawg]

Jeff,

Thanks for the post. This may be the most insightfull (and most depressing) post I have read, and explains allot.

This to me is the worst part of the article:

Wichard says that Jackson and Williams haven't spoken to Archuleta since the Redskins' bye four weeks ago, and that rookie Reed Doughty, who's been mostly inactive this year, is getting reps ahead of him in practice this week. That means Archuleta, who signed for a $10 million bonus last spring, is on the scout team, which baffles plenty of NFL executives.

"If" true GW must go, AA will get his money regardless, WTF did we (GW) sign him for to sit on the bench as the higest paid safety in the history of the NFL and not even speak to him to "coach him up":doh:

[mistertim]

Can some one tell me how many years Shawn springs has left on his contract. The reason why I ask is Bram and Dexter Manly was discussing this artical on the friday night football show on xxx radio tonight. Dexter Manly knew this artical was coming out but did not know when. Dexter also stated that him and Tom Friend are very close and he knew who "the player was" . He said that it was someone in the redskins secondary and that he was a starter. on the show Dexter wrote down the number of the player who was interviewed by tom and showed it to bram. Bram response was" This player who was interviewed was a leader in the redskins secondary and is NOT EXPECTED TO BE HERE NEXT YEAR because he is at the end of his contract this year and wants out at the end. Bram and Dexter stated that they would not tell who it was out of respect of the player. HMMM! Sound like it ma y be Shawn Springs. Who ever it is,, I think is wrong for going to a reporter and complaining. As a man if you have a problem with someone or the team, you go to them with that problem, not to repoter. I think this is some ***** ass! ****. Girls do this not men. Dont go outside of the chain of command. I'm in the Navy and we live and die by that. He should have went to Joe gibbs with this insted of a punk ass reporter.:feedback:

I can understand your point, CG, and it is valid. However, there comes a point where something else has to be done if one thing is not working. I'm not saying that is the case here, just that it is sometimes; this could be one of those or not. To be honest it all depends on things we are not privy to. For example: the player in question's (probably SS) motive for doing this, as well as the situation inside the organization. What if he has gone to people but is brushed off? GW does not seem like the kind of coach who would tolerate any players going above him to complain about how things are being run. Anyone wanting to do so would probably be afraid of being benched or worse. But what if this person or others have gone over his head and complained and it hasn't done much at all? Obviously Snyder knows about this stuff somehow. Frustration eventually will take it's toll and while it might not be very honorable or "manly" to quote another poster, for a person to talk about this stuff in an interview perhaps it was one of the only ways he thought he could vent his frustrations in a way that would be heard and possibly acted upon. If this was SS we know he isn't a vindictive or grandstanding kind of guy. He is intelligent, thoughtful, but honest. He also doesn't have much of an axe to grind; he is getting paid well and isn't on the bench. I just hope that, if what is in the article is true, something good can come from it.

[stwasm]

I just about got sick after reading that article. It clearly explains why the defense is underachieving. Granted, the players have to make plays and they have to tackle. But, when there's so much bickering, so much in the way of animosity towards those whom you're supposed to respect and expect to put you in position to make plays, I see why the defense has been playing with no emotion lately. That side of the ball has become cancerous. It's really sad it's come down to this and maybe Mr. Williams needs to take his ego elsewhere!

[WVUforREDSKINS]

This scares me. Just think how many of our players are going to want out. I don't care who goes. Just keep ST, MW, CP, and Moss.

God, we sure know how to **** things up don't we.

[six4g]

Dont go outside of the chain of command. I'm in the Navy and we live and die by that. He should have went to Joe gibbs with this insted of a punk ass reporter.:feedback:

So being in the Navy you've never been at odds with the decision making process of your Chain of Command?

I understand your point here though; in the military when you swear that oath you basically sign away alot of the "freedoms" that the civilian sector loves to crow about (expression, speech, etc.).

I personally don't think it matters who it was; if there's truth to it, and obviously there is, then it needs to be addressed. I give you this analogy:

Do yoou go after the person who leaked that there really weren't any Weapons of Mass Distruction in Iraq or do you do you grill the Administration for using that as a reason for going to war?

methinks that you don't kill the messenger; you get to the root of the problem.

[stwasm]

This scares me. Just think how many of our players are going to want out. I don't care who goes. Just keep ST, MW, CP, and Moss.

God, we sure know how to **** things up don't we.

And this was the thing I was worried about. With all the power struggles and hissing contests that are taking place right now, not only will free agents NOT want to come here, but the decent players we do have won't want to stay. I have this horrible feeling that Jason Campbell could be the second coming of Sammy Baugh, but because dysfunction rules this organization, he won't be able to wait to get out of here!

[CGSKINS]

I can understand your point, CG, and it is valid. However, there comes a point where something else has to be done if one thing is not working. I'm not saying that is the case here, just that it is sometimes; this could be one of those or not. To be honest it all depends on things we are not privy to. For example: the player in question's (probably SS) motive for doing this, as well as the situation inside the organization. What if he has gone to people but is brushed off? GW does not seem like the kind of coach who would tolerate any players going above him to complain about how things are being run. Anyone wanting to do so would probably be afraid of being benched or worse. But what if this person or others have gone over his head and complained and it hasn't done much at all? Obviously Snyder knows about this stuff somehow. Frustration eventually will take it's toll and while it might not be very honorable or "manly" to quote another poster, for a person to talk about this stuff in an interview perhaps it was one of the only ways he thought he could vent his frustrations in a way that would be heard and possibly acted upon. If this was SS we know he isn't a vindictive or grandstanding kind of guy. He is intelligent, thoughtful, but honest. He also doesn't have much of an axe to grind; he is getting paid well and isn't on the bench. I just hope that, if what is in the article is true, something good can come from it.

I feel you. I too hope something good comes from all of this. Maybe the whole team and oganization needs to have a big POW WOW. ***** session! or whatever. Hay sometimes when you air frustrations among each other and get stuff off your chest, things get corrected and fixed. The team has to be like a family.

[Lead Blocker]

Not to oversimplify this but this sounds like the 2005 offensive struggles. The offense was pathetic, players felt the coaches were heading in the wrong direction, players made it known they wanted to limit the gameplan to a power run scheme, the coaches gave in, and production inproved.

Here's the defense, looking pathetic, player saying coaches are using the wrong scheme, wanting to go back to attacking, ... well let's see what happens from here out.

[CGSKINS]

So being in the Navy you've never been at odds with the decision making process of your Chain of Command?

I understand your point here though; in the military when you swear that oath you basically sign away alot of the "freedoms" that the civilian sector loves to crow about (expression, speech, etc.).

I personally don't think it matters who it was; if there's truth to it, and obviously there is, then it needs to be addressed. I give you this analogy:

Do yoou go after the person who leaked that there really weren't any Weapons of Mass Distruction in Iraq or do you do you grill the Administration for using that as a reason for going to war?

methinks that you don't kill the messenger; you get to the root of the problem.

:laugh: Man I understand what you saying. You right football is not the Military. Man things are really bad at redskins park