Larry Brown #43 Posted November 25, 2006 Share Posted November 25, 2006 While Williams did oversee a top-10 defense for us two years in a row, he seems to have zero aptitude for personnel decisions. And I think those poor personnel decisions have led to the crumbling of the defense. Players who have been here a while have watched Antonio Pierce, Ryan Clark, and others walk out the door, only to see them get replaced by more expensive, less effective players. That has to be demoralizing. I think players can handle a hard-*** coach if the results are there, but when the unit is struggling, and key cogs of the unit have been ushered out the door, I can see how things could fall apart so quickly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vicjagger Posted November 25, 2006 Share Posted November 25, 2006 I am not a Redskin fan, but I sincerely hope this mess gets cleaned up fast. The Redskins are a proud franchise, rich in tradition and you all deserve better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jethrodsp Posted November 25, 2006 Share Posted November 25, 2006 You guys are just all lathered up and looking for an easy answer to our defensive woes. Destino - Gregg Williams HAS been successful, highly successful as a defensive coordinator. We're obviously having a horrible year, but as the article itself acknowledged, we started off the year without 2 key secondary players. You also need to look at the fact that the defense doesn't operate in a vacuum - when you're constantly seeing your offense go 3 and out, and aren't getting extended breaks, you're generally going to see your defense suffer. I think its fair to say that letting Ryan Clark go was a mistake. And I do hold Gregg Williams accountable for the defense's performance. But you can't take a coach who's had a top 10 defense (or better) every year prior to this and say he doesn't know what he's doing. I don't doubt those quotes are legitimate - what comes through in the article is that everyone on this team is frustrated, and likely shocked, that they have fallen so far after a promising playoff year. What I doubt is that the article represents the comprehensive truth about whats going on. And I think its silly to call for a coaches head on a stick because of an article voicing an anonymous player's perspective. I'll bet if you take a little roadtrip around the league and visit all of the other teams that are sucking it up this season, you'd find plenty of players willing to tell who how it is and who's to blame for it. Ultimately I agree that Williams has got to get his players to play for him. If that means putting the fear of God into them, I'm okay with that. If it means giving them all hugs and sending them chocolate, thats cool too. I don't like what this article represents though - because I think the one sin you can't commit as a Redskin is to take things out of house. If you have a problem with a coach, be a damn man and knock on his door and express it. Or if you don't feel you can do that, take it to the next level. I'm pretty sure Joe Gibbs door is always open. This kind of public cry for help is not going to help this team. Even more troubling than our players not keeping things "in-house" is that Greg Williams seems to have learned nothing in his failures as a head coach in Buffalo. It seems obvious to me, and has for the last two seasons, that Greg Williams certainly knows football. What he lacks, and what caused him to fail in Buffalo (we all knew this before he came here) is the ability to hold players' attention through tough times because of his arrogance (or swagger as we call it when things are going well). Sean Taylor is lost. The highest paid defensive coordinator cant find a way to get the highest paid safety on the field. We continually lose players that could have made a difference the next season every year. Assistant coaches are pouting. The secondary doesnt meet together. The SECONDARY DOESNT MEET TOGETHER!?!?!?!?! The defensive staff is broken. They have lost the players. The only area that Dan needs to throw money at this offseason is the defensive staff...and it doesnt need to be a gang of cash either. Maybe the answer is already on staff? Greg Blanche should get a shot. Either way, Greg is not going to change. The players no longer respond to him and that is sad because when he is on he is indeed one of the most creative defensive minds in the game. I think he would be better off coaching a college team where scheme alone really can carry you to a lot of wins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lavarleap56 Posted November 25, 2006 Share Posted November 25, 2006 Well i was holding off on respondindg to this article but i have been told this is 100% factual and is what has been occuring all season on the defensive side of the ball by someone with strong ties to the organization. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skins4eva Posted November 25, 2006 Share Posted November 25, 2006 how many of these type articles have been proved to be bogus or exaggerated at bestcommon sense people, Yeah Bubba--you should consider using it :doh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skins4eva Posted November 25, 2006 Share Posted November 25, 2006 Bro I'm not changing my story. You posted a response to my post. you had a link attached to yor post. I looked a Springs contract and thats what I stated when I said. " Shawn was signed to a 6 year deal. In few years his pay sky rockets. The redskins have to restructure his deal or they can release him" Thats what I said. Now! What Bram said was this player was at the end of his contract and wants out. Now maybe Bram did not know the details of Springs contract. But he said tha this guy is a "STARTER AND A LEADER" Key word being( STARTER AND LEADER In the redskins secondary). Who do you think it is? It could be springs or whoever. Like I said. I'm just telling you what I heard on the show. If you dont believe me than thats on you. I have No reason to lie. You don't need to defend your position--anyone who knows this team and knows how articulate certain players are can almost positively say the source is SPRINGS...it really has to be, when you think about it. Someone who has been in GW's system, someone who has really seen him destroy the confidence of this defense and replace marquee guys with c grade starters...someone who has been a leader and a stud for this defense, someone who is completely sick of being delt with by an arrogant coaching staff who thinks they invented football...and this is a serious sports journalist, not some putz...it's SPRINGS... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SMOSS89 Posted November 25, 2006 Share Posted November 25, 2006 Im just PRAYING its not Sean Taylor. If ST is the guy who talked the we're sooooo screwed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jethrodsp Posted November 25, 2006 Share Posted November 25, 2006 Its not Taylor, theres no way. He is too demoralized and out of it this season. Someone has sapped all of the passion from him this season. He simply is not the same player he was last year or the year before. I thought it was the refs, because he seems to have a target on his back these days but now I think the disfunction among the defensive coaching staff has a lot to do with it. THE SECONDARY DOES NOT MEET TOGETHER!?!?!?! This is symptomatic people... Regardless of whether you still support GW and the defensive coaches or not, I think we can all agree that something drastic needs to happen on the defensive side of the ball. These guys just arent responding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lugos Posted November 25, 2006 Share Posted November 25, 2006 This article is very concerning. Hopefully this article brings Williams back to earth. What in the world would make this guy believe that you can stick any guy in his scheme and the defense would be great?!?! Is he really that stupid!?!? Every scheme needs skilled players. You can't just stick a Wright or a Rumph in there and expect the defense to excel! I look at what the angry player says, I look at what the coaches say, and I look at how the defense is playing. I can only come to the conclusion that what the angry player is saying is right. How else does Sean Taylor go from a rising star to just another dwindling DB? I look at what Sean Taylor did his first two years and what he has done this year and I am baffled. We can only look to the coaches for an explanation; and poor tackling won't be enough for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JetSkins Posted November 25, 2006 Share Posted November 25, 2006 great article Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RiggoReincarnated Posted November 25, 2006 Share Posted November 25, 2006 I wonder if Gibbs is going to have a meeting and ask the anonymous player to raise their hand...like the article suggested he do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
method man Posted November 25, 2006 Share Posted November 25, 2006 Maybe some of you will finally realize that because Williams is so arrogant, he isn't playing Rocky. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasimpson Posted November 25, 2006 Share Posted November 25, 2006 The truth hurts, bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RiggoReincarnated Posted November 25, 2006 Share Posted November 25, 2006 "There is no more room in this league for a Buddy Ryan." It's often mentioned that Williams is a Buddy Ryan disciple, and I always do a double-take when I hear that, because frankly I can't think of a worse 'marraige' between coaching styles than Gibbs and a Buddy-Ryan disciple. Somehow it worked last season (barely) but overall, I think we've seen enough ON THE RECORD comments from former players that point to Williams being an arrogant taskmaster, and I just get this overall feeling that the defense feels like it's not treated in the same way as the offense on this team. The ironic thing is that Buddy Ryan was fired after the Redskins beat the Eagles down at the Vet in the 1990 playoffs, and he was never able to build a serious contender after that. You have to wonder if Gregg Williams career is also going to go down at the hands of Gibbs and the Redskins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drowland Posted November 25, 2006 Share Posted November 25, 2006 While Williams did oversee a top-10 defense for us two years in a row, he seems to have zero aptitude for personnel decisions. And I think those poor personnel decisions have led to the crumbling of the defense. Players who have been here a while have watched Antonio Pierce, Ryan Clark, and others walk out the door, only to see them get replaced by more expensive, less effective players. That has to be demoralizing. I think players can handle a hard-*** coach if the results are there, but when the unit is struggling, and key cogs of the unit have been ushered out the door, I can see how things could fall apart so quickly. Yeah, I think you hit it. GW has proven to be a good defensive coach in this league. However, I think the personnel power he's been given is what's been his downfall this year. Players see that and eventually an arrogant attitude towards personnel will lead to players tuning him out. GW didn't have this type of control in Tenn or Buffalo. Heck no DC in this league has full say on what players he has. He had strong GMs (as well as Jeff Fisher) putting the talent in place for him in the other places. This is something Gibbs has to re-evaluate and fix this offseason. And I think the only way to do it is to bring in someone with a strong personnel background to work in the FO with him, as well as stream lining this coaching staff. Cerrato ain't that guy. If Williams doesn't like it, then see-ya. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RiggoReincarnated Posted November 25, 2006 Share Posted November 25, 2006 Did anybody else take note that when the Giants were 1-2 this year and people were ****ing at Coughlins coaching and the chemistry of the team, Coughlin had a meeting with the players where everyone just aired it out? I think Gibbs may have to have a meeting with the defensive coaches AND players...and let them all air it out because its obvious that there have been communication breakdowns and there is alot of pent up anger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaMuller7 Posted November 25, 2006 Share Posted November 25, 2006 Wow, all I can say is "Wow." This sounds like the most screwed up organization in the league and the most screwed up this organization has been ever. It all starts with the coaches and to me it sounds like Jackson should just get the hell out and Williams needs to reevaluate himself dramatically......... Man do I feel bad the way this team is going........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redskinsk47 Posted November 25, 2006 Share Posted November 25, 2006 One year, the punt team couldn't cover a kick, so he hired a second special teams coach. One year, a player anonymously ripped his methods in the press, so he called a team meeting and ordered the mystery player to raise his hand. Nobody did. He might've been cut. Click the link for the rest:http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/columns/story?id=2672668 You guys are tryin to guess who this player is i think this was back in the 80s not the present...:dallasuck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RiggoReincarnated Posted November 25, 2006 Share Posted November 25, 2006 You guys are tryin to guess who this player is i think this was back in the 80s not the present...:dallasuck It was probably Jay Schroeder after Gibbs kept him on the bench in 1987 for the stretch playoff run. Or, it could have been the loose cannons of Dexter and Riggo...but they both loved Gibbs so I don't think so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uno Mas Posted November 25, 2006 Share Posted November 25, 2006 um, maybe its just me, but it sounds like this player should be wearing a skirt. this quote was a red flag for me:"And Gregg Williams says all the time, it's not my money. If Gregg was the one writing the checks, I don't know if he'd handle it that way. But he says it in meetings. He gives us speeches about, 'If you don't know what to do, you're going to be standing next to me on the sideline, I don't give a f---. That's where you're going to be. I need to be able to trust you. Hey, it's not my money. I don't care how much you make, I don't care who you are, I'm not the one writing the check, you need to know your assignments, know what to do.' That's what Gregg says. I wonder how Snyder would feel if he heard that one." Is something wrong with this? I dont see this quotw as arrogant on the part of williams but maybe the player who thinks they can play like **** with no consequence of being replaced by someone who can handle it. Parcells does the same thing all time. You start making mistakes and he is in your face and you are on the sidelines. Look at their D now. Agreed, I thought the same thing when I read that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hkHog Posted November 25, 2006 Share Posted November 25, 2006 This article reaffirmed everything I have seen this year. The fact is the problem with the team has never been Brunell and the o-line but the pathetic, confused, and inept defense. I always wondered how we could have so many breakdowsn in coverage, well how about having seperate meetings for safeties and corners. BTW, the anonymous player is definately part of the secondary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capt'n Obvious Posted November 25, 2006 Share Posted November 25, 2006 The separate meetings for corners and safeties is the dumbest thing I have ever heard. That is ridiculous and needs to be fixed immediately. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kwitt Posted November 25, 2006 Share Posted November 25, 2006 No more of the "associate head coach" terminology used around here I say. Joe Gibbs is the head coach and Williams, Saunders, and the rest of the bunch are assistant coaches. Simple as that. Seems to be a big part of the problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spaceman Spiff Posted November 25, 2006 Share Posted November 25, 2006 Can't say anything that hasn't been said. Unreal and unacceptable. On another note, how'd Tom Friend do a better job than the Skins own beat reporter? LaCanfora and Co could only dream to write something like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BleedBNG Posted November 25, 2006 Share Posted November 25, 2006 http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/discussion/2006/11/16/DI2006111600778.html Fairfax, Va.: Will Andre Carter, Phillip Daniels, Warrick Holdman, Lemar Marshall, Carlos Rogers, Joe Salave'a and Shawn Springs be on this team next season? Howard Bryant: One player told me after yesterday's game, "Get your notebook out and take inventory, 'cause a lot of cats won't be here next year." :whoknows: maybe some figure this won't happen if they can divert the attention on GW and have him let go instead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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