KDawg

The Offensive Line Thread

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3 hours ago, RandyHolt said:

I hope Jay keeps the playbook simple for the noobs. Grade the road, and quick passing. 

 

Almost can't imagine how it could get any simpler

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2 hours ago, method man said:

 

No way. Ty is not a good guard...too tall

I forgot Bergstrom. My new line-up 

 

Moses-Cooper-Roulier-Bergy-Nseke. 

 

 

HTTR 

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3 hours ago, markmills67 said:

I forgot Bergstrom. My new line-up 

 

Moses-Cooper-Roulier-Bergy-Nseke. 

 

 

HTTR 

 

I take it you're going right to left there?

 

Also... that line scares the **** out of me.

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1 hour ago, KDawg said:

 

I take it you're going right to left there?

 

Also... that line scares the **** out of me.

 

He has to be, yes... and that is indeed ugly. I'm not even convinced Moses is the best of the 5, considering his play this season. 

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Agree Sandy Monk.  I have a soft spot for Moses being a UVa fan but he has not looked good at all this year.  Don't know if it is health, if he peaked or short comings were masked by strength of line when healthy.  I do appreciate his warrior mentality though. 

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5 minutes ago, RFK Lives said:

Agree Sandy Monk.  I have a soft spot for Moses being a UVa fan but he has not looked good at all this year.  Don't know if it is health, if he peaked or short comings were masked by strength of line when healthy.  I do appreciate his warrior mentality though. 

 

Truth told, I have not been overwhelmed by either of the star OTs.

 

Often looks to me like they have been battling through injuries/recovery all season long, granted, but still. 

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Nsekhe - Bergy - Chase - New Guy - Moses

 

Oh dear. Let's just hope that the Bucs forget to stunt. 

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Let's hope Jay doesn't hang happy feet out to dry with long slow play calls.  I get the sense that every week our OL is abused, it sets Alex back a week or 2 towards becoming confident in the pocket. Lots of rollout or boots should help.

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1 minute ago, RandyHolt said:

Let's hope Jay doesn't hang happy feet out to dry with long slow play calls.  I get the sense that every week our OL is abused, it sets Alex back a week or 2 towards becoming confident in the pocket. Lots of rollout or boots should help.

 

The sense in this one, is strong. 

 

PTSD quarterback like Alex has to be comfortable and trusting of his protection. Add in some receiver routes not where they should be, and you get happy feet and hesitation on the throws we are seeing. I think the size of Jay's playbook might be too big and confusing for many of the scrub/rusty targets. 

 

It's all just about the perfect storm of crap unfolding before our eyes. The penalties, drops, miscues from ALL. It really is like watching SF's offense in 2011.. or KC's offense in 2013... eerie reiterations of an offense in the infancy stages. Got time to carry to term or not? Opinions may vary on that. 

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12 minutes ago, Sandy Monk said:

 

The sense in this one, is strong.  

....

 

I will speculate that Jay has requested Alex to run less than he has in past years.  Sure Cousins finally realized that scrambling when the pattern was full was the gateway to cutting back on the INTs, but Alex presumed had already figured that out. 

 

Alex just looks.... uncomfortable. How a 33 year old vet can be that -  I think he must be being asked to do something that doesn't come naturally to him. Or Jay is requesting he force balls to wideouts, and he is just not comfortable doing that usually well covered, etc. It's not him. 

 

Again - all speculation, but I really expected to see Alex running a lot more than we have seen, on broken plays, or rolls outs. NOT, college options to Mo Harris.

Edited by RandyHolt

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A combination of inexperienced/poor oline play and a lack of offensive skill players...what could go wrong?  

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2 hours ago, London Kev said:

Nsekhe - Bergy - Chase - New Guy - Moses

 

Oh dear. Let's just hope that the Bucs forget to stunt. 

 

Coach em up!!

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16 minutes ago, RandyHolt said:

 

I will speculate that Jay has requested Alex to run less than he has in past years.  Sure Cousins finally realized that scrambling when the pattern was full was the gateway to cutting back on the INTs, but Alex presumed had already figured that out. 

 

Alex just looks.... uncomfortable. How a 33 year old vet can be that -  I think he must be being asked to do something that doesn't come naturally to him. Or Jay is requesting he force balls to wideouts, and he is just not comfortable doing that usually well covered, etc. It's not him. 

 

Again - all speculation, but I really expected to see Alex running a lot more than we have seen, on broken plays, or rolls outs. NOT, college options to Mo Harris.

 

I don't know. I don't have the answers, and I don't think anyone not inside Washington HQ has the solution locked down either.

 

There are so many possibilities.. all leaving no one blameless.. and all mixed in just enough to cause this level of ineffective offense. 

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1 hour ago, RandyHolt said:

Let's hope Jay doesn't hang happy feet out to dry with long slow play calls.  I get the sense that every week our OL is abused, it sets Alex back a week or 2 towards becoming confident in the pocket. Lots of rollout or boots should help.

 

Part of the issue with the Oline is the vanilla easy to predict play calling being utilized by the offense. 

 

Examples - AP running on nearly every first down. Last game they did that 8 times and got 6 yards total from it. When your offensive line is doing this and being put in bad spots like that it only makes it easy to shutdown and get people injured.

 

The passing game is not creative at all. Watch this from last weekend compared to the boring vanilla offense that we are using for an example of what an offense is supposed to look like. We don't have any of that here and there is nothing stopping them from trying to shake it up more but we've been saying that since McVay left. If your offense can't be creative passing the ball then it's gonna make things harder for the offensive linemen

 

 

 

 

 

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The best ability for any player is availability.  Before the season started, many fans knew that LG was the biggest weakness on the Line.  Lauvao was playing pretty well but inevitability most knew he would get injured.  I love the Payne and Guice picks but I still feel that the Redskins should've traded back into the 2nd round and got an interior offensive linemen.  Offensive Line will keep being a weakness, if we don't draft within the first 2 rounds.  I don't care about how good coaching is, if the players don't have the physical talent to play the line, we'll keep having these weakness.

 

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When a raw OT is drafted, how many years are allotted for them to not be starter worthy e.g. how many years should we expect to wait for Christian to be ready?

 

I say it again, drafting a raw OT with our injury history is a very questionable pick in a win now year (evidenced by bring in Alex Smith).

 

 

Edited by RandyHolt
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1 minute ago, RandyHolt said:

When a raw OT is drafted, how many years are allotted for them to not be starter worthy e.g. how many years should we expect to wait for Christian to be ready?

 

I say it again, drafting a raw OT with our injury history is a very questionable pick in a win now year (evidenced by bring in Alex Smith).

 

 

 

I disagree. The big mistake was not going after a upgrade to LG in FA. And not finding more depth there.

Christian is a developmental pick. Just like Moses was. Moses has turned out to be pretty decent (he's not great) and Christian likely needs a year or 2 to get coached up and to be in a NFL weight room to be where we need him.

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8 minutes ago, RandyHolt said:

When a raw OT is drafted,

how many years are allotted for them to not be starter worthy e.g. how many years should we expect to wait for Christian to be ready?

 

Not sure he ever will be. No idea why we drafted him, especially so high. Think it was a wasted pick tbh. He looks like a deer in headlights every time the ball is snapped.

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1 hour ago, RandyHolt said:

 

I will speculate that Jay has requested Alex to run less than he has in past years.  Sure Cousins finally realized that scrambling when the pattern was full was the gateway to cutting back on the INTs, but Alex presumed had already figured that out. 

 

Alex just looks.... uncomfortable. How a 33 year old vet can be that -  I think he must be being asked to do something that doesn't come naturally to him. Or Jay is requesting he force balls to wideouts, and he is just not comfortable doing that usually well covered, etc. It's not him. 

 

Again - all speculation, but I really expected to see Alex running a lot more than we have seen, on broken plays, or rolls outs. NOT, college options to Mo Harris.

Honestly,  wish Alex would break out of the pocket more.  I feel like he does better off schedule.  

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9 minutes ago, Morneblade said:

 

I disagree. The big mistake was not going after a upgrade to LG in FA. And not finding more depth there.

Christian is a developmental pick. Just like Moses was. Moses has turned out to be pretty decent (he's not great) and Christian likely needs a year or 2 to get coached up and to be in a NFL weight room to be where we need him.

 

But we need an OT.... now.   Despite your fine rebuttal I am not sold that the 3rd round is a place to take a developmental pick in a year we are expected to compete, at a position of recurring injuries.  And, I think its easier for a tackle to move inside, than a guard out.  Assuming the tackle is not a kid on the active roster and not expected to be ready for a year plus. I hope he pans out, but will Cally and Jay even still be here?   I am not a draftnik but think we could have drafted someone that could help our team this year, with that 3rd. Perhaps a kid with speed that seems needed to make best use of Alex.

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3 minutes ago, NeverSurrender said:

Honestly,  wish Alex would break out of the pocket more.  I feel like he does better off schedule.  

 

Personally I'd really like to see more boot action where Alex has a run/pass option. We used to run this a lot more in the past, but hardly see it now. The one issue is that, from what I've seen and heard, Alex is not that accurate on the move. He's good getting out of the pocket, resetting and then throwing, but not so much on the run.

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1 minute ago, RandyHolt said:

 

But we need an OT.... now.   Despite your fine rebuttal I am not sold that the 3rd round is a place to take a developmental pick in a year we are expected to compete, at a position of recurring injuries.  And, I think its easier for a tackle to move inside, than a guard out.  Assuming the tackle is not a kid on the active roster and not expected to be ready for a year plus. I hope he pans out, but will Cally and Jay still be here?   I am not a draftnik but think we could have drafted someone that could help our team this year, with that 3rd.

 

Well, we have Ty, so that's the primary back up. Then you have Christian, who is developmental. From here you have to answer some questions:

1. How high do you draft a developmental pick that isn't expected to play this year? 2nd or 1st is VERY high IMO. That's not a developmental pick, that's a starter. That means no Payne, or Guice.

2. How many tackles do you play to carry on the active roster?

3. Many tackles DONT do well at guard. Carrying 4 T and then having a G that you know is going to go down with no backup doesn't seem very smart.

 

Honestly, T is behind G for me right now as far as need. Lauvao is more injured than Williams or Morgan, and he's the worst guy on the OL. Let's get that fixed first. Williams and Morgan are also both injury prone, and Williams is getting older, so I agree we need to start looking at replacements.

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1 hour ago, Morneblade said:

Honestly, T is behind G for me right now as far as need. Lauvao is more injured than Williams or Morgan, and he's the worst guy on the OL. Let's get that fixed first. Williams and Morgan are also both injury prone, and Williams is getting older, so I agree we need to start looking at replacements.

I always saw Christian as a developmental picks to eventually replace either Moses or Williams. At least I think that was the theory from our FO behind the pick.

 

But G has been neglected too much for years and that was blatant this offseason. We didn't even seem to look for one which was disturbing.

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3 hours ago, bobandweave said:

 

The passing game is not creative at all. Watch this from last weekend compared to the boring vanilla offense that we are using for an example of what an offense is supposed to look like.

 

Totally agree, although they would probably **** it up if they tried anything too complex.  To be honest I'd just like to see some more pulling lineman and more play action, at least that would be a start.

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