2023 Offseason Mini Camp, OTA’s, Training Camp Discussion Thread: Hallelujah, Josh Harris & Co. Era Edition

[COWBOY-KILLA-]

7 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

I like Bieniemy, jazzed about that.  But if i am hiring a new chef, I am loading them up with great ingredients to make it easier versus going dude i am not giving you much -- we are going to load up on what we already do well and add to that.   But we will put your unit on your shoulders without giving you much of a lift from us.  Lets help Del Rio instead even more.

 

Hyperbole on my end to make a point -- instead of going here's some fiour, some cocoa, some sugar -- its not much but hey you are a geniuses make a delicious cake anyway.  Instead, I'd be loading the chef up with whatever I could so they could make that meal with ease and do something cool -- versus lets say if you can make something out of nothing.  

 

I like Howell's potential.  i like the Wrs.  I like the Rbs.  But IMO they saddled him with a tough job because an O line can unravel a unit.  The TE is typically a lifeline for a QB -- they did nothing on that front either.  Instead they went to town on the unit that was already strong to make it stronger.  Feels like a lot of pressure on Bieinemy to make lemonade out of lemons.

 

5 out of their last 7 first round picks are defense.  5 out of their last 7 next pick after that first was defense.  Shockingly our defense has been pretty good and our offense has mostly sucked for years.  . How can that be?

 

Granted its a big hurdle for Bieniemy to turn that around and I bet that's a fun challenge.  But its a bit annoying to me that instead of helping Bieiniemy in the draft they doubled down on the idea that the defense comes first even this year when the unit was top 5 and the offense was garbage last year.

 

All of those are a fair set of assumptions.  But, we don't know that EB didn't get a lot of what he wanted this offseason. Maybe that was what was on his wish list. A mild upgrade to the Online with a couple guys he respects highly and an athlete who can play both guard and tackle. The weapons in the run and pass game are 100% legit. You have a backup plan in case injury at qb. idk, it could be worse.  

 

I don't get the impression that he would just sit back and accept a situation which he felt he had one hand tied behind his back.  

Maybe he's 100% on board with what they did and even led it to a degree, we really don't know.  Just a thought.

[method man]

4 hours ago, Koolblue13 said:

This was mu point that I made before. The IOL who went in the early 2nd were the ones that everyone (except you) thought were the day one starters. That's why 5 or 6 players went in the 2nd, mostly the upper part of the round and then 35 picks went by before the next (Strom) was picked. He's the best of the rest and might be a starter in a few years.

 

Crazy that going into the 23 season, we didn't use the draft to address OL, LBer or TE. Our 3 biggest problems.

In regards to the TE post, Thomas might as well be Bostic. Bates? Holcomb ish(I know is off the team, but we got another one)? Davis, if healthy, is better at LBer than any TE we have.

I'd have considered Mayer at 16. Scoon and Strange were pretty good options in the second. I liked Musgrave a lot, but he went right before 47.

 

Day 3 had about 5 or 6 guys that I really really liked. 

 

Ehh disagree with you on Mayer at #16. Would have been pissed if that happened. Given how things went down, the one that would have been close for me is if Washington had made it to their comp pick. I wasn't a big Washington fan but, if he had fallen there, I would've been a bit pissed if they had passed on him. I didn't love the Day 3 guys either and think they would've been marginal upgrades, at best, over the guys already on the roster. However, I respect your opinion and perspective!

 

 

[Skinsinparadise]

32 minutes ago, COWBOY-KILLA- said:

All of those are a fair set of assumptions.  But, we don't know that EB didn't get a lot of what he wanted this offseason. Maybe that was what was on his wish list. A mild upgrade to the Online with a couple guys he respects highly and an athlete who can play both guard and tackle. The weapons in the run and pass game are 100% legit. You have a backup plan in case injury at qb. idk, it could be worse.  

 

I don't get the impression that he would just sit back and accept a situation which he felt he had one hand tied behind his back.  

Maybe he's 100% on board with what they did and even led it to a degree, we really don't know.  Just a thought.

 

Keim gave the vibe that they wanted specific weapons in the draft -- according to him they loved J. Gibbs, had some interest in D. Achane.  And they entertained some of the TEs.  And O line was hot on their to do list in rounds 1-2.  But the board played out where defense ended up king. 

 

So I think Ron would likely just say, hey that's where the cards fell.  it felt a bit striking to me that Mayhew mentioned post draft that in retrospect he wondered if he should have been more aggressive.  He came off to me almost revealing like hey in retrospect it didn't quite go as planned.  Then we got Ron not long ago coming off a bit defeatest where he suggested he's leaving someone else with a good roster if he's out. 

 

Maybe I am reading a bit to much into it -- but it comes off to me like the FO might see the draft a bit like I did which is the picks were fine -- but the totallity of it from a roster construction was subpar.  More specifically they had and have had one of the worst offenses in the league under Ron while having a really good defense.  The dude that got more Christmas presents on draft day was oddly Jack Del Rio.  but I get the impression that wasn't their intention and deep down realize it might end up costing them the season,  but will see.

Edited May 26, 2023 by Skinsinparadise

[COWBOY-KILLA-]

59 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Keim gave the vibe that they wanted specific weapons in the draft -- according to him they loved J. Gibbs, had some interest in D. Achane.  And they entertained some of the TEs.  And O line was hot on their to do list in rounds 1-2.  But the board played out where defense ended up king. 

 

So I think Ron would likely just say, hey that's where the cards fell.  it felt a bit striking to me that Mayhew mentioned post draft that in retrospect he wondered if he should have been more aggressive.  He came off to me almost revealing like hey in retrospect it didn't quite go as planned.  Then we got Ron not long ago coming off a bit defeatest where he suggested he's leaving someone else with a good roster if he's out. 

 

Maybe I am reading a bit to much into it -- but it comes off to me like the FO might see the draft a bit like I did which is the picks were fine -- but the totallity of it from a roster construction was subpar.  More specifically they had and have had one of the worst offenses in the league under Ron while having a really good defense.  The dude that got more Christmas presents on draft day was oddly Jack Del Rio.  but I get the impression that wasn't their intention and deep down realize it might end up costing them the season,  but will see.

 

I don't disagree with a lot of what you assume here except your bottomline....

 

but I get the impression that wasn't their intention and deep down realize it might end up costing them the season,  but will see.

 

I don't agree with this assumption at all, in the slightest. I don't believe they are going into this year thinking their moves in the offseason, may cost them the season. 

There is a big leap between not getting exactly what you want and how you want it........ to........we are screwed. 🤷‍♂️

 

[mhd24]

1 hour ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Keim gave the vibe that they wanted specific weapons in the draft -- according to him they loved J. Gibbs, had some interest in D. Achane.  And they entertained some of the TEs.  And O line was hot on their to do list in rounds 1-2.  But the board played out where defense ended up king. 

 

So I think Ron would likely just say, hey that's where the cards fell.  it felt a bit striking to me that Mayhew mentioned post draft that in retrospect he wondered if he should have been more aggressive.  He came off to me almost revealing like hey in retrospect it didn't quite go as planned.  Then we got Ron not long ago coming off a bit defeatest where he suggested he's leaving someone else with a good roster if he's out. 

 

Maybe I am reading a bit to much into it -- but it comes off to me like the FO might see the draft a bit like I did which is the picks were fine -- but the totallity of it from a roster construction was subpar.  More specifically they had and have had one of the worst offenses in the league under Ron while having a really good defense.  The dude that got more Christmas presents on draft day was oddly Jack Del Rio.  but I get the impression that wasn't their intention and deep down realize it might end up costing them the season,  but will see.

 

I don't think they were taking TE at 16 (in retrospect a good move considering TE1 didn't go till Buffalo at 25).  It was either CB or OL.  I think they would have taken Johnson, Wright, or Skoronski if they fell to 16 but those 3 were long gone.  B. Jones probably not.   

 

The issue is we didn't have the draft capital to move up for someone like Avila for example.  Our late 3rd and our mid 2nd doesn't get it done to go up and get him.  Through back-channels, I figure new ownership told them no future picks were to be traded.  So, their hands were tied.  Could they have moved up a bit in R2 sacrificing the late 3rd?  Yeah, they could have gotten Bergeron for example.  

 

So, it is Quan Martin+Stromberg vs Bergeron.   

[Skinsinparadise]

55 minutes ago, COWBOY-KILLA- said:

 

I don't disagree with a lot of what you assume here except your bottomline....

 

but I get the impression that wasn't their intention and deep down realize it might end up costing them the season,  but will see.

 

I don't agree with this assumption at all, in the slightest. I don't believe they are going into this year thinking their moves in the offseason, may cost them the season. 

There is a big leap between not getting exactly what you want and how you want it........ to........we are screwed. 🤷‍♂️

 

 

I don't mean it in a dramatic way.  By "deep down" I mean not at the surface.  Sort of like when you are taking on something that you think-hope would work out but have some disclaimers in your head that maybe it won't. But of course you try to bury those doubts and press on optimistically.

 

Feels like Ron has some lingering doubts in the midst of his typical sunny outlook on things.  That's a guess on my end.  Where I am coming from on that point is he's now suggested in multiple interviews that he feels like if he's gone he will leave the next regime with a good roster.  And the way he said it came off a bit defensive to me.

 

I haven't heard any yet rhetoric like we expect to have a really good season and if-when we do I hope new ownership would consider the job we did.    If he was feeling good about this season, I'd expect stronger rhetoric from him versus rationales of how to look at the job he's done if they move on that don't pertain to his actual record. 

 

I'd add Ron based on what's come out in interviews from him over the years seems very aware of what the national media thinks of him and the team.   And I doubt its lost on him that most of the national media --Vegas, draft geeks -- anayltics guys are somewhere in the range of they will either have a losing season or will stink.  The NFL collectvely yawned at this team as to giving them prime time games -- no Sunday Night or Monday Night games unlike the other teams in his division.

 

Yeah I am guessing but I don't get the typical optimisitc vibe from Ron just yet.  Maybe its coming.  But I wonder if he has some lingering doubts about what happens this season.

Edited May 26, 2023 by Skinsinparadise

[COWBOY-KILLA-]

14 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

I don't mean it in a dramatic way.  By "deep down" I mean not at the surface.  Sort of like when you are taking on something that you think-hope would work out but have some disclaimers in your head that maybe it won't. But of course you try to bury those doubts and press on optimistically.

 

Feels like Ron has some lingering doubts in the midst of his typical sunny outlook on things.  That's a guess on my end.  Where I am coming from on that point is he's now suggested in multiple interviews that he feels like if he's gone he will leave the next regime with a good roster.  And the way he said it came off a bit defensive to me.

 

I haven't heard any yet rhetoric like we expect to have a really good season and if-when we do I hope new ownership would consider the job we did.  

 

I'd add Ron based on what's come out in interviews from him over the years seems very aware of what the national media thinks of him and the team.   And I doubt its lost on him that most of the national media --Vegas, draft geeks -- anayltics guys are somewhere in the range of they will either have a losing season or will stink.  The NFL collectvely yawned at this team as to giving them prime time games -- no Sunday Night or Monday Night games unlike the other teams in his division.

 

Yeah I am guessing but I don't get the typical optimisitc vibe from Ron just yet.  Maybe its coming.  But I wonder if he has some lingering doubts about what happens this season.

 

So yeah this is all just guess work and there are always lingering doubts.  

Do I feel great about our Oline? No. Have we surprised before with having a more than serviceable Oline with not a lot of resources? Yes

Do I feel really excited about what EB can mean for our offense, despite question 1? Absolutely. 

 

I think what we may be seeing with this possible "uncertainty" regarding Ron and how he's feeling may be a number of things : the whole ownership thing, his job status, how the draft went, 2nd guessing, what the future holds, his health, gas, del rio...

 

What I like about what I'm hearing, is that EB isn't sitting around sulking about what he has. He's getting down to it and working with what he has.

The Obstacle is the Only way Through, so lets go.  That is the right way to go about it. Coaching matters in this league and I like what I'm hearing and seeing regarding our O.

It won't be perfect but I do think it will way better than people imagine today.

Edited May 26, 2023 by COWBOY-KILLA-

[Skinsinparadise]

23 minutes ago, mhd24 said:

 

I don't think they were taking TE at 16 (in retrospect a good move considering TE1 didn't go till Buffalo at 25).  It was either CB or OL.  I think they would have taken Johnson, Wright, or Skoronski if they fell to 16 but those 3 were long gone.  B. Jones probably not.   

 

The issue is we didn't have the draft capital to move up for someone like Avila for example.  Our late 3rd and our mid 2nd doesn't get it done to go up and get him.  Through back-channels, I figure new ownership told them no future picks were to be traded.  So, their hands were tied.  Could they have moved up a bit in R2 sacrificing the late 3rd?  Yeah, they could have gotten Bergeron for example.  

 

So, it is Quan Martin+Stromberg vs Bergeron.   

 

Guessing using Keim's podcasts as my guide.  He was vague on some of this but most of it he was specific.

 

In the first I gathered they really wanted Darnell Wright but he went before their pick. 

 

TE not in play in the first.  In the 2nd -- they liked Musgrave and Laporta.  They both went before their pick.

 

I don't think though they were married to TE in the 2nd but it was under consideration.  Bram said he heard they were hot for Avila.  Keim mentioned Martin but also didn't dispute Bram on Avila.  Keim also said they liked Bergeron.  He also went before their pick.

 

Keim said later they loved J. Gibbs.  But he went before both of their top 2 picks, don't know though if they would have taken him in the first, am guessing they were hoping the 2nd round?  He also heard Achane.  I gather they hoped he'd fall to their third but he ended up going before their pick.

 

Just piecing some of Keim's narratives together alone -- I can almost feel Mayhew's pain when he revealed some regrets in his post draft presser about maybe he should have been more aggressive. 

 

For me where I'd have gone TE.  5th round -- Josh Whyle or Will Mallory.  6th round Zach Kuntz.

 

 

Edited May 26, 2023 by Skinsinparadise

[Skinsinparadise]

5 minutes ago, COWBOY-KILLA- said:

 

So yeah this is all just guess work and there are always lingering doubts.  

Do I feel great about our Oline? No. Have we surprised before with having a more than serviceable Oline with not a lot of resources? Yes

Do I feel really excited about what EB can mean for our offense, despite question 1? Absolutely. 

 

I think what we may be seeing with this possible "uncertainty" regarding Ron and how he's feeling may be a number of things : the whole ownership thing, his job status, how the draft went, 2nd guessing, what the future holds, his health, gas, del rio...

 

What I like about what I'm hearing, is that EB isn't sitting around sulking about what he has. He's getting down to it and working with what he has.

The Obstacle is the Only way Through, so lets go.  That is the right way to go about it. Coaching matters in this league and I like what I'm hearing and seeing regarding our O.

It won't be perfect but I do think it will way better than people imagine today.

 

I agree its likely a combination of things.  Also the report from the off season that a group chasing buying the team already spoke to Sean Payton.  Adding up those narratives, I'd say 90% chance or so that was Harris.  So Ron might be feeling a bit like a dude who will not be for long as to staying in this spot.

 

As for Bieinemy, yeah agree, he is not the sulking type.  Go a million miles an hour.  Love everything I hear thus far about him.  Part of my frustration about this is I think Ron could have done more to help Bieiniemy look better.  But agree play the hand and whereever it goes it goes. 

[DWinzit]

10 hours ago, KDawg said:

I've always liked Hudson. His issue is he went from playing a hybrid role (Viper @ Michigan) where he was a slot guy/safety/LB hybrid to being a pure ILB.

 

That's one hell of a transition.

 

I think Hudson is capable and I'm really excited to see. But there is a giant question mark at ILB right now. Massive. I think it's the most questionable position on the team. And if Davis has a lingering injury (we'll see, who knows) then even if Hudson hits we're still wading in Bostic territory. 

Oh I was pleased when I heard his name on draft day. Figured they had some big plans for Hudson at a similar role to his college role but they tried changing him. I don't get it. It is siilar to what they did with Gibson...

I think both guys can be good in more of his college role with us now, lets use them proper!

8 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

He went in on it more in this morning podcast with no mention of FA.  I assume that’s what you are referring to. It would be on brand for them to forgo outside solutions and believe their answers are in house. So who knows maybe they do nothing at LB and assume they already got the horses including Hudson.

 

The other note from him is don’t expect Stromberg to play let alone start this season 

Yes, the morning podcast was what I was referring to, sorry for not clarifying.  I get the intrigue in Hudson, and I think he will be a contributor this season. At this point, just want a solid semi mobile good tackling experienced LB not named Bostic, lol

 

I do not understand the OL draftee's if they have no intention of playing them....crazy talk to me

[Skinsinparadise]

1 hour ago, DWinzit said:

 

Yes, the morning podcast was what I was referring to, sorry for not clarifying.  I get the intrigue in Hudson, and I think he will be a contributor this season. At this point, just want a solid semi mobile good tackling experienced LB not named Bostic, lol

 

I do not understand the OL draftee's if they have no intention of playing them....crazy talk to me

 

I liked Hudson's Michigan role, Harbaugh called it the viper but it was basically a lot of big nickel.   I am surprised he hasn't been utilized much in that role here.  Been a long time since I watched his college games but my main memory wise he was a ball of energy on the field and was billed as a big time leader.

 

Nothing about his leadership though here.   But I've heard he's a good dude.  Short arms for a LB -- 29 inches.   But good athlete. 

[DWinzit]

4 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Guessing using Keim's podcasts as my guide.  He was vague on some of this but most of it he was specific.

 

In the first I gathered they really wanted Darnell Wright but he went before their pick. 

 

TE not in play in the first.  In the 2nd -- they liked Musgrave and Laporta.  They both went before their pick.

 

I don't think though they were married to TE in the 2nd but it was under consideration.  Bram said he heard they were hot for Avila.  Keim mentioned Martin but also didn't dispute Bram on Avila.  Keim also said they liked Bergeron.  He also went before their pick.

 

Keim said later they loved J. Gibbs.  But he went before both of their top 2 picks, don't know though if they would have taken him in the first, am guessing they were hoping the 2nd round?  He also heard Achane.  I gather they hoped he'd fall to their third but he ended up going before their pick.

 

Just piecing some of Keim's narratives together alone -- I can almost feel Mayhew's pain when he revealed some regrets in his post draft presser about maybe he should have been more aggressive. 

 

For me where I'd have gone TE.  5th round -- Josh Whyle or Will Mallory.  6th round Zach Kuntz.

 

 

They'd have ticked a lot of people off if they'd traded up to the top of the 2nd and taken Avila. Funny thing is most of the other players at the top of the 2nd would have been fine other than him and a few others.  Porter, Levis, Laporta, Mayer, Hall, Berg, and so on. While Laporta is a favorite of the lot, Berg might have been the best choice. Lots of decent TE's later on.

 

If we didn't have so many needs we were drafting for, would have been great to be able just pick the one you like the best. Someday soon maybe!  

 

Next year the draft and FA will focus heavily on the offense with weapons, OL and probably at least a backup QB

[FootballZombie]

Did they do any kick return drills?

 

I gotta figure out if I gotta put all my hope in that Daz guy to bump off Dax.

[Chris 44]

1 hour ago, FootballZombie said:

Did they do any kick return drills?

 

I gotta figure out if I gotta put all my hope in that Daz guy to bump off Dax.

With the new rules I'm wondering if it even matters anymore. Lol

[Conn]

 

[Simmsy]

23 hours ago, FootballZombie said:

Did they do any kick return drills?

 

I gotta figure out if I gotta put all my hope in that Daz guy to bump off Dax.

 

Haha! We're trading a Dax for a Daz?

[Skinsinparadise]

The McCloughan stuff is good, I talked about it in more detail on another thread on Saturday.

 

I just caught up with Logans Paulsen's series of podcasts about OTAs, which has gotten some mention, as usual he was really good.  Many details and he is blunt.

 

A.  Howell looked sharp. So did Brissett so did Fromm.  But he cautioned it is just one practice.  Howell came off confident and in control.  The QBs mostly played out of the gun, similar to what KC does.

 

B. Practices moved more briskly than the past.   Bieiniemy is very hands on as to coaching on the field compared to the past.  He will for example watch where the WR's break-stem their routes to see if they are running the proper depth, etc.

 

C. Practiced screens and short passes, quick game a lot.  Only ran the ball twice. 

 

D.  He thinks the short game, quick game, motion, moving the QB in the pocket more should help this O line pass protect better.  For example, he said Wylie isn't clearly the most talented RT but he should be good enough to hold his own in an offensive line friendly system like this. 

 

E.  Cited the plays run around ther league are similar from scheme to scheme.  The difference is often in the details.  He mentioned a mesh round where the receivers cross over each other but one time a receivers broke off and went vertical instead of going horizontally which you typically do on that route -- which confused a defender

 

F.  Forbes looked good but plays a bit out of control.    Cited a play where Cole Turner and Forbes collided and Forbes got the worst end of that collision so he's going to pay attention to collusions with Forbes

 

G. Quan Martin looked sharp in the slot.  Derrick Forrest was playing strong. Percy Butler played post.  Both looked fast and he's jazzed at the potential of the safeties.  Cited how much range Butler displayed paying FS.

 

H.  S. Charlies didn't look hot, has some concerns about him at LG.  The other O linemen looked fine.

 

I.   Had high hopes for Armani Rogers.   He has receiver traits as a TE.  Thinks they are likely fine with the 4 they have but believes they need to bring in another guy now. 

 

J.  I know he likes Curtis Hodges but this was the 2nd jab I've heard him take at him, wondered if he practices as hard as he can.  The other jab was when he was grabbed as a UDFA a year ago, Paulsen was high on him but also said he heard about work ethic concerns with him.   But thinks he's good as TE #4.  He sees him as Bates backup, as Y TE.

 

K.  Cole Turner looks good, just like last off season.  He is sudden and makes a contested catches.

 

L. Logan Thomas looks good but you can see him trying to figure out this new offense. 

 

M. John Bates was lined up wide on a play which surprised him.  

 

N.  Doesn't think its a good look for Chase Young to skip OTAs.  He said the team made it clear they want him here.  And yet he didn't come.  Talked about how Kam Curl in a contract year still said he wants to be around his teammates.  Does Chase?

[KDawg]

Cole Turner colliding with 160 pound Forbes didn’t go well for Forbes? Paint me shocked.

[AlvinWaltonIsMyBoy]

7 minutes ago, KDawg said:

Cole Turner colliding with 160 pound Forbes didn’t go well for Forbes? Paint me shocked.

Forbes needs to learn that leg whip technique that I was forced to use on my much bigger brother. 😆

[Chump Bailey]

47 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

G. Percy Butler played post.  Both looked fast and he's jazzed at the potential of the safeties.  Cited how much range Butler displayed paying FS.

N.  Doesn't think its a good look for Chase Young to skip OTAs.  He said the team made it clear they want him here.  And yet he didn't come.  Talked about how Kam Curl in a contract year still said he wants to be around his teammates.  Does Chase?

 

Forgot we have Butler. Nice surprise. I wish we would have traded Young and signed Samson Ebukam. 

[Conn]

12 minutes ago, KDawg said:

Cole Turner colliding with 160 pound Forbes didn’t go well for Forbes? Paint me shocked.

Still, some people (even smaller ones) know how to take contact and protect their bodies and some don’t and go down like a gangly newborn colt. We used to say it about RG3. So I took that comment as Forbes being reckless with his body and not protecting himself rather than just predictably losing in a collision with a huge TE. But I didn’t see it so idk, I could have interpreted the comment wrong. 

[KDawg]

3 minutes ago, Conn said:

Still, some people (even smaller ones) know how to take contact and protect their bodies and some don’t and go down like a gangly newborn colt. We used to say it about RG3. So I took that comment as Forbes being reckless with his body and not protecting himself rather than just predictably losing in a collision with a huge TE. But I didn’t see it so idk, I could have interpreted the comment wrong. 

All true. But there is only so much you can do to protect yourself from a collision with a 250+ player. At some point it’s going to happen. Which has been my point on Forbes all along.

 

He sticks his nose in. He isn’t  afraid. But he’s small. He’s also durable. But I’d prefer we didn’t find out how durable.

[UK Skins]

And the few video clips I watched of him were him doing just that. Sticking his nose in and getting clattered, not "tackling" the player as such.

[bowhunter]

On 5/26/2023 at 5:45 PM, COWBOY-KILLA- said:

 

So yeah this is all just guess work and there are always lingering doubts.  

Do I feel great about our Oline? No. Have we surprised before with having a more than serviceable Oline with not a lot of resources? Yes

Do I feel really excited about what EB can mean for our offense, despite question 1? Absolutely.

Yep! I think the key to any success (or lack thereof) will be having our O in control. Something where we can keep the D guessing. If we're down by a score in the waning moments, I don't think our line is designed to withstand taking on blitzes and D-linemen with their ears pinned back. Nor do I think we can run the clock out with a bunch of back to back 5 yard runs. It's those situations that limit an  OC.

But..if our D can keep us in the game enough that EB can make a DC have to guess what's coming we should be OK. We just don't have the line to play one dimensional ball.

[DWinzit]

2 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

The McCloughan stuff is good, I talked about it in more detail on another thread on Saturday.

 

I just caught up with Logans Paulsen's series of podcasts about OTAs, which has gotten some mention, as usual he was really good.  Many details and he is blunt.

 

A.  Howell looked sharp. So did Brissett so did Fromm.  But he cautioned it is just one practice.  Howell came off confident and in control.  The QBs mostly played out of the gun, similar to what KC does.

 

B. Practices moved more briskly than the past.   Bieiniemy is very hands on as to coaching on the field compared to the past.  He will for example watch where the WR's break-stem their routes to see if they are running the proper depth, etc.

 

C. Practiced screens and short passes, quick game a lot.  Only ran the ball twice. 

 

D.  He thinks the short game, quick game, motion, moving the QB in the pocket more should help this O line pass protect better.  For example, he said Wylie isn't clearly the most talented RT but he should be good enough to hold his own in an offensive line friendly system like this. 

 

E.  Cited the plays run around ther league are similar from scheme to scheme.  The difference is often in the details.  He mentioned a mesh round where the receivers cross over each other but one time a receivers broke off and went vertical instead of going horizontally which you typically do on that route -- which confused a defender

 

F.  Forbes looked good but plays a bit out of control.    Cited a play where Cole Turner and Forbes collided and Forbes got the worst end of that collision so he's going to pay attention to collusions with Forbes

 

G. Quan Martin looked sharp in the slot.  Derrick Forrest was playing strong. Percy Butler played post.  Both looked fast and he's jazzed at the potential of the safeties.  Cited how much range Butler displayed paying FS.

 

H.  S. Charlies didn't look hot, has some concerns about him at LG.  The other O linemen looked fine.

 

I.   Had high hopes for Armani Rogers.   He has receiver traits as a TE.  Thinks they are likely fine with the 4 they have but believes they need to bring in another guy now. 

 

J.  I know he likes Curtis Hodges but this was the 2nd jab I've heard him take at him, wondered if he practices as hard as he can.  The other jab was when he was grabbed as a UDFA a year ago, Paulsen was high on him but also said he heard about work ethic concerns with him.   But thinks he's good as TE #4.  He sees him as Bates backup, as Y TE.

 

K.  Cole Turner looks good, just like last off season.  He is sudden and makes a contested catches.

 

M. John Bates was lined up wide on a play which surprised him.  

 

N.  Doesn't think its a good look for Chase Young to skip OTAs.  He said the team made it clear they want him here.  And yet he didn't come.  Talked about how Kam Curl in a contract year still said he wants to be around his teammates.  Does Chase?

Bates is going to be seeing a ton of time this year and really looking forward to see Turner in action.

 

Does Charles not looking hot shock anyone????

 

I am becoming so sick of Chase....he better light come in on fire this year

 

Did he mean Wylie isn't the best RT on the team or in general?

 

Interesting that the vet TE is the one he talks about trying to figure out the scheme.